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367Re: Klemp Distorts ......

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  • prometheus_973
    Aug 9 10:28 PM
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      Hi Ingrid,
      We are having some fun here aren't we! I thought I'd comment some
      more.

      Prometheus wrote:
      > > >Yes, I know Eckists who have even read Confessions of a God
      Seeker by Ford Johnson, and still remain as members! Actually, many
      of those Eckists did Not really "read" the book... they just did a
      Twitchell like skim!

      Ingrid wrote:
      > The character assessment I heard about Ford Johnson was always the
      same: "He wanted more ... he had this big ego ... Well, I didn't
      like him anyway ... He was angry ..." yada yada yada. I just wonder
      why he was good enough to be used as a speaker at many international
      seminars during such a long time ...?? And why nobody spoke up if it
      was true what Eckists keep saying about him? I guess people were
      blinded by his "high status"!

      ***Yes, if Ford was so bland or egocentric or whatever the neo nay-
      sayers claim then why did Klemp (the Mahanta) have him front and
      center as an International representative for Eckankar!



      > > >It was more difficult for me to leave.

      > Understandable! It's quite a shock at first! But, as you say, if
      you want to remain true to yourself, then you have to make a
      decision. There are many Eckists who develop cancer or other severe
      diseases, which, in my opinion, shouldn't be the case if it really
      was "the one and only true way"! Of course this is because the
      master himself has a severe disease (physically and mentally)and his
      followers just copy him because they think that makes them more like
      him (which it does, by the way, but not as they think! :-) ).

      ***One other disservice Klemp does for Eckists is to put down
      traditional medicine. He even encouraged his one older brother to go
      to Mexico for Layatril (sic) treatments for cancer. HK's brother,
      however, was lucky in that he didn't listen to the advice of
      the "Prophet!"


      > But I strongly suspect that there is another reason as well: they
      don't remain true to themselves. I think that one of the reasons why
      diseases develop is by not being authentic and true to ourselves any
      more. Eckists who know that by remaining in Eckankar, they are going
      in the wrong direction but do nothing about it, are prone to such
      things in my opinion.

      ***Yes, and I'm sure that psycho-somatic illnesses have increased as
      a result of self-fulling prophecies due to the fear induced mass
      hypnosis of trying to be Co-Workers through the "as if" thinking
      that they are taking on Karma for the Mahanta!



      > > > Strange, though, that Spirit guided me to Eckankar in the
      first place. I guess I needed the "eckperience" in order to learn
      the difference between truth and deception, and to meet certain
      individuals for karmic reasons as well... or not!

      > We have become a lot wiser since for sure!

      ***And, we continue our learning through Our freedom!



      > > >My doubts started long ago, but I always rationalized by
      thinking that I didn't know as much as the H.I.s, and that
      eventually I would have a break through in higher awareness.

      > Sounds VERY familiar to me! :-) I was the same way!

      ***Sometimes I now look back and see how "irrational" I was! I had
      to talk myself into thinking I was doing the right thing at times. I
      was very stubborn even with mySelf!



      > > >It was the "just Be" concept and those like it that always gave
      me hope. Of course those Higher Initiations were awfully enticing
      too! They really impressed me for quite awhile.

      > When my husband became HI, he kept telling me that there was
      nothing new - just more rules and guidelines! He was thinking that
      by being an HI, one should have realized a lot of principles within
      oneself, so that there was no need for so many outer rules any more!

      ***Yes, this is true! Some of the illnesses that H.I.s have comes
      from the stress of being in a leadership position and the
      expectations of the hierarchy! More and more is expected if there
      are to be more initiations!



      > > >However, the more that I watched and listened to
      these "leaders" the more that I noticed strange behavior. I even
      heard the same words and jargon repeated over and over, but saw no
      true substance behind the facade and attempts at real caring or
      friendliness. Of course, there were always exceptions to the rule
      and this gave me hope.

      > Me, too! But I think it's just that there are some great people
      out there - so there must be some in Eckankar, too!

      ***Yes, if one is too trusting (naive) they will be fooled more
      easily. But, even the best of us can be conned at any given time!
      There are just too many scams to keep track of it would seem.



      > > >Some of my wilder experiences were before I joined Eckankar,
      but I have had even more "interesting" experiences since leaving
      Eckankar!

      > Yes, exactly!

      ***Spiritual experiences now just seem more real and explainable
      without a mahanta to second guess Me!



      > > >I had a friend that only had experiences of knowingness, and I
      sometimes envied her. However, since she is still in Eckankar and is
      even afraid to read "Confessions" (too Kal for the Mahanta to
      protect her?) I now see that her "knowingness" is limited by her
      fears!

      > That is true - of what use is knowingness if you don't know to
      expand it accordingly and ask yourself the "right" questions?!

      ***Yes, and this fear that Eckists have of Ford's book is rather
      strange and contradicts the dogma of Mahanta protection. Or, do they
      see the reading of this book in the same way as smoking or drinking
      is seen? However, I don't believe that reading it would be in
      violation of the Four Zoas!



      > > >And, why throw all that away along with all of those years of
      service, and initiations for the sake of truth?

      > I know a great guy, an HI which I appreciated (and still
      appreciate, in spite of everything) who told me in earnest that the
      difference between Eckankar and Christianity was that Eckists all
      are standing in line to become the next mahanta and LEM! I could not
      believe it! I asked him if he knew how many years each Eckist would
      have to wait for that, and that spiritual development for each of us
      was much faster than that! He stopped writing me after that one. :-))

      ***Actually, women can't become the LEM/Mahanta and it looks like
      only a few males can within a normal lifetime! So, in a way this is
      like the Catholic Church and the Pope while the Cardinals would be
      those (male) 7th and 8th initiates positioning themselves like the
      Klumpster did! I think that most Eckists are more concerned with
      achieving God Realization, if they can only act nutty enough!



      > > >Yes, some of these people were into other weird things as
      Eckists! I heard an Eckist talk of using Rune stones, in a rountable
      Discussion

      > The new topic is sun gazing, and it's even promoted by former
      Eckists! Well, you can do that if you are interested in it, and I'm
      sure that there will be some results if you try hard enough, but
      that's not my personal favorite pastime. :-))

      ***Yes, some people are extremely gullible and foolish! I wonder if
      this person has tried this technique? Perhaps it would increase
      their brain activity and capacity to equal Twitch's... their hero!
      If this method is valid then those starving to death in sunny
      countries can be taught this technique and survive! But, it hasn't
      been promoted and taught there has it? That's because it's a scam
      and NASA states that they aren't involved with this as advertised on
      the scam site. So, what can I say... except that some people will
      never learn. Anyone who follows them is as blind as they are! And,
      if one does do this sun gazing they might literally become blind!
      Why should I believe a con-man that sun gazing is safe!


      > > >I even wrote to Klemp, many years ago, telling him of the
      need for more guidelines and leadership trainings. I was amazed to
      finally see the H.I. Leadership book come out in 2001. It only took
      Klump 20 years to write the first complete book!

      > But as far as I know that book was compiled from letters to the
      resas over a long time! I couldn't figure out why the heck somebody
      wanted to train lowly initiates by using letters to resas!! I guess
      he just couldn't get together a whole new book, and as we well know
      all of the most recent books are a rehash of things that were
      written before.

      ***True, much of it was from RESA talks, meetings, and letters. Yes
      Klemp does drag his feet and for a "prophet" he can't see the hand
      writing on the wall! He just wasn't getting info to the chelas in an
      organized "same page" like manner through his RESAs. The whole "Eck"
      organization is screwed up and will just get worse as more demands
      and controls are exerted.

      Prometheus
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