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RE: [E_Rapier] Rapier Peerage

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  • Eve Harris & David Stamper
    Yes, it means trademark, pardon the attempt at witticism. In terms of ideals, no, I haven t gone looking for them. It would be an interesting exercise in inter
    Message 1 of 3 , Feb 17, 2012
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      Yes, it means trademark, pardon the attempt at witticism. In terms of
      ideals, no, I haven't gone looking for them. It would be an interesting
      exercise in inter Kingdom anthropology, and when I find a spare minute, I'll
      see what I can find.

      Albrecht


      -----Original Message-----
      From: E_Rapier@yahoogroups.com [mailto:E_Rapier@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
      Of Aaron Miedema
      Sent: February 17, 2012 8:28 AM
      To: E_Rapier@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [E_Rapier] Rapier Peerage

      OK.... Two questions. The first is because I'm a luddite... what does
      this "(tm)" thing mean? Or is this some sort of trademark thing? =)

      The second is the from the Ansteorran WS charter. Have you in your travels
      come across any document stating the "ideals" of Ansteorra?

      On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 11:50 AM, EVE HARRIS <evedave1@...> wrote:

      > **
      >
      >
      > Greetings!
      >
      > Let us say, for the sake of discussion, that the Society does decide to
      > institute a Rapier Peerage. I know that some people think that this is a
      > Bad Idea(tm) and that other people think that there should be one peerage
      > for all the other martial arts and some people think rapier should be
      > incorporated into the existing peerages etc. But for now, I was hoping we
      > could examine what a Rapier Peer would look like: what would their
      > qualities be; what would be the expectations of them; what would they be
      > called?
      >
      > Here are the three current bestowed Peerages and their descriptions as
      > taken from the Kingdom website:
      >
      > Pelican:
      >
      > Members of this Order have offered their service to the Society in such a
      > way that they have had far-reaching, positive impact on the quality of the
      > game for others. They have also shown themselves to be conversant with the
      > arts and sciences, and courteous and chivalrous to all.
      > This is a polling Order. For their great service, these gentles may wear
      > the medallion of a pelican feeding its young with its own blood, and, if
      > they wish, a cap of maintenance of scarlet and ermine. These peers may be
      > addressed as "Master" or "Mistress".
      >
      > Laurel:
      >
      > The Laurels of the Realm have shown mastery in areas of the medieval arts
      > and sciences. As with other Peers of the Realm, they have shown themselves
      > to be courteous and chivalrous.
      >
      > This is a polling order, and its members offer counsel to the Crown on
      > prospective members. To recognize their position, they may wear a Laurel
      > wreath as a medallion, upon their head, or in other diverse ways, and they
      > are styled "Master" or "Mistress".
      >
      > Knight/Masters-at Arms:
      >
      > Given to individuals for mastery in armoured combat. Upon entering this
      > order, recipients must choose to be part of one of two branches within
      this
      > order. Those who choose to become Knights may style themselves as 'Sir'.
      > Those who choose to become Masters-at-Arms may style themselves as
      'Master'
      > or 'Mistress'. This is a polling Order.
      >
      > These definitions don't provide a lot to go on. The common themes seem to
      > be mastery in a paticular discipline and being courteous and chivalrous.
      > Seems simple enough but from what I've heard it's actually a lot more
      > complex. Even people's defintions of what courtesy and chivalry are seem
      to
      > vary. There's the whole concept of "peer-like" qualities, which from my
      > quick search on the net seem pretty nebulous and not well defined. Earlier
      > in the discussion someone mentioned that a person being considered for a
      > peerage should be well known outside their own Kingdom, though the above
      > definitions don't address that. Is it important?
      >
      > Oddly enough, the definition of the Grant level martial award actually
      > gives a better understanding of what is called for in a member of that
      > order:
      >
      > Order of Thorbjorn's Hammer
      > Given to individuals who have exhibited excellence in a martial activity
      > approved in Ealdormere; who demonstrate a knowledge of related skills
      > and/or of other martial disciplines; who demonstrate a leadership role in
      a
      > martial activity, including a willingness to teach; who present a
      > reasonably authentic appearance; and who provide an example of courtesy
      and
      > chivalry worthy of emulation. Recipients who do not already have a Grant
      of
      > Arms receive one automatically with this award. Recipients may style
      > themselves 'The Honourable Lord' or 'The Honourable Lady' and may be
      > addressed as 'Your Ladyship' or 'Your Lordship'.
      >
      > So, I'm thinking a rapier peer should be like the above, only more so. The
      > question is what constitutes "more so". As Lady Jocelyn pointed out
      > earlier, prowess is already a high requirement for a Grant level award.
      How
      > much more prowess would be required for a Peer? The Grant level mentions
      > the willingness to teach, something not mentioned in the Peer definitions,
      > but is often implied.
      >
      > Also, there is the White Scarf (WS), another Grant level award used by a
      > number of Kingdoms to specifically recognize fencers. Here are the
      > requirements of the WS, as defined in Ansteorra where it started:
      >
      > I. Establishment of the Order
      >
      > A. There shall exist in Ansteorra an Order
      > which may be given at the pleasure of the Crown to members of the populace
      > of
      > Ansteorra who have demonstrated all of the following qualities:
      >
      > 1.
      > Exceptional skill and chivalry in combat with the weapons of the duello.
      > 2.
      > Service to Ansteorra and its people.
      > 3. Knowledge of the courtly
      > graces.
      > 4. Obedience to the laws and ideals of the Kingdom of Ansteorra and
      > of the Society for Creative Anachronism.
      >
      > This Order shall be known as the
      > Order of the White Scarf of Ansteorra, and shall hereinafter be referred
      > to as
      > the Order.
      >
      > B. Holders of the Order shall be entitled to place after their
      > names the letters "W.S.A." to designate their membership in the Order, and
      > shall
      > be styled and announced in procession as "Holders of the White Scarf of
      > Ansteorra."
      >
      > So, we have a similar set of requirements to the OTH. Again, the
      > questions, how much more can these be upped for a Peerage, as the
      > requirements are already pretty high.
      >
      > There is an interesting series of essays on peerages by Master Hector that
      > can be found here:
      >
      > http://nicolaa5.tripod.com/articles/Hector/soc/HPeerind.htm
      >
      > I haven't had a chance to read them all, but I think they might prove
      > interesting food for thought.
      >
      > If a Rapier Peerage was to be created, I think that the term Master or
      > Mistress of Defence has a nice ring to it. It has some
      > historical precedence, is consistent with the current titles, and doesn't
      > specifically refer to rapier, which is one out many weapons that we use.
      > I'm not sure what the order itself would be called. One idea that popped
      > into my head was the Order of Defenders, which is sort of ironic as the
      > whole concept may need a bit of defence.
      >
      > These are some of my thoughts, I hope you can share some of yours. Please
      > make sure you also share your thoughts with the Board of Directors of the
      > SCA and the committee that will be formed to examine the possibility of a
      > rapier peerage. I know I will.
      >
      > Yours in Service
      >
      > Albrecht
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >



      --
      Aaron Miedema, B.F.A., B.A., M.A.
      Historian
      Author of *Bayonets and Blobsticks, The Canadian Experience of Close Combat
      1915-1918*, available from Legacy Books Press.
      http://www.legacybookspress.com/books.html#Bayonet


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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