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Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill

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  • Lew Wolkoff
    The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit list. There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought that people would want to
    Message 1 of 16 , Aug 1 12:53 AM
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      The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit list.

      There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought that people
      would want to know. Poul is one of the founders of our Society and a legend
      within it.

      >This came to the RFF list from Greg Bear, SF writer and and Poul
      > >Anderson's son-in-law.

      >Poul Anderson has left Alta Bates hospital in Berkeley and is in >hospice
      >care at the Anderson home in Orinda. His daughter, Astrid, his >brother,
      >John, and his niece, Janet, are flying in today to be with >him. When I
      >spoke with Poul the day before yesterday, he was weak but >lucid; both Poul
      >and Karen welcome email messages. Their email is

      > trigonier@....
      >
      >Karen has supported Poul with courage and creativity during his month->long
      >stay at Alta Bates. She has prepared meals of many small and >tasty morsels
      >that would tempt him when he was not inclined to eat; >she has tuned her
      >menus to his dietary restrictions, and provided >constant companionship and
      >relief from the discomfort and strain of >hospitalization. Poul, not
      >unexpectedly, has shown courage in the face >of what was not, at the
      >beginning, inevitable, but extremely >difficult. Now the inevitable has
      >arrived, and it is likely a matter >of days.
      >
      >My own loss is made difficult by the fact that I cannot be with them at
      >this time, and that I stand to lose not just a grand father in law, >but
      >one of my favorite writers. Both Poul and Karen have provided >immense
      >inspiration over the decades to me and to hundreds of >thousands, perhaps
      >millions, of others.

      >Please pass this letter to others not on the list, who might wish to
      >express their love and appreciation.
      >
      > Greg Bear


      _________________________________________________________________
      Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
    • Joe Irvine
      That s nice.. but what does this have to do with the SCA? ... From: Lew Wolkoff [mailto:lwolkoff@hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:53 AM To:
      Message 2 of 16 , Aug 1 4:27 AM
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        That’s nice.. but what does this have to do with the SCA?

         

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Lew Wolkoff [mailto:lwolkoff@...]
        Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:53 AM
        To: EKSouth@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill

         

        The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit list.

        There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought that people
        would want to know.  Poul is one of the founders of our Society and a legend
        within it.


         

         
      • Philip W. Troy & Susan Troy
        ... No, it s not nice. It affects SCA members in a similar way to, say, the way the death of Marion Zimmer Bradley did, or if grave illness should strike
        Message 3 of 16 , Aug 1 4:42 AM
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          Joe Irvine wrote:

          > That’s nice.. but what does this have to do with the SCA?
          >
          >
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: Lew Wolkoff [mailto:lwolkoff@...]
          > Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:53 AM
          > To: EKSouth@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
          >
          >
          >
          > The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit list.
          >
          > There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought that people
          > would want to know. Poul is one of the founders of our Society and a legend
          > within it.

          No, it's not nice. It affects SCA members in a similar way to, say, the
          way the death of Marion Zimmer Bradley did, or if grave illness should
          strike Katherine Kurtz. As stated above, Mr. Anderson is one of our
          founders, and even if this means nothing to you, I suspect you're in a
          distinct minority on that point.

          Adamantius
          --
          Phil Troy

          troy@...

          "It was so blatant that Roger threw at him. Clemens gets away with
          things that get other people thrown out of games. As long as they
          let him get away with it, it's going to continue." -- Joe Torre, 9/98
        • Robin Carroll-Mann
          ... As the original message said, Poul is one of the founders of the Society. He is known in the SCA as Sir Bela of Eastmarch, and was knighted in A.S. II.
          Message 4 of 16 , Aug 1 4:45 AM
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            On 1 Aug 2001, at 7:27, Joe Irvine wrote:

            > That's nice.. but what does this have to do with the SCA?

            As the original message said, Poul is one of the founders of the
            Society. He is known in the SCA as Sir Bela of Eastmarch, and
            was knighted in A.S. II.

            May he go in peace, and his family find comfort.


            Brighid ni Chiarain *** mka Robin Carroll-Mann
            Barony of Settmour Swamp, East Kingdom
            rcmann4@...
          • Jean Elizabeth Krevor
            ... Eh wot? What s nice about it? Even if the person mentioned had NOTHING to do with the SCA, how callous to say That s nice to a post that someone s dying.
            Message 5 of 16 , Aug 2 10:07 PM
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              --- Joe Irvine <graewulf@...> wrote:
              > That's nice..

              Eh wot? What's nice about it? Even if the person mentioned had NOTHING
              to do with the SCA, how callous to say "That's nice" to a post that
              someone's dying. *You* might not know the gentle in question, but I'm
              sure someone else might.

              You also said:

              > but what does this have to do with the SCA?

              If you'd read the part of the post you left attached below you'd see
              *exactly* what this has to do with the SCA. Poul Anderson was one of
              the founding members of the SCA, known as Sir Bela of Eastmarch. And he
              wasn't a dinosaur relegated to legend either -- he remained active
              throughout all these years of the Society.

              I think it's a testament to how well loved Poul was that the news of
              his illness and now his passing has been disseminated so far and wide.
              I've received such messages on just about every mailing list I'm on,
              and some of them have NOTHING to do with each other in the least bit.

              A bit of sensitivity to others might do you well, milord. Just because
              something has nothing to do with you doesn't mean it doesn't to others.
              If you don't like it, hit "d" now.

              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: Lew Wolkoff [mailto:lwolkoff@...]
              > Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:53 AM
              > To: EKSouth@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
              >
              > The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit list.
              >
              > There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought that
              > people
              > would want to know. Poul is one of the founders of our Society and a
              > legend
              > within it.

              Slainte'--

              Jean E. Krevor/Elizabeth nicIan


              __________________________________________________
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              Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger
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            • Joe Irvine
              I should apologize, but you should understand where I come from... When you get the large masses of e-mail that I get, you get in the habit of scanning them
              Message 6 of 16 , Aug 3 4:33 AM
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                I should apologize, but you should understand where I come from.…. When you get the large masses of e-mail that I get, you get in the habit of scanning them for content rather than reading them all in detail. When I see a message that obviously quotes from an editorial or other such source (which the message in question did), I immediately see it as SPAM, and I get a lot of that from mailing lists every day (I see an average of 100 messages a day from 3 lists). I have been doing this for far longer than most and have read millions of messages, most off-topic, in my years on-line. A personal account would have been different, but posts by someone who only heard of a person don’t have the same meaning. I had already heard this news previously from sci-fi sources, so seeing it posted to an SCA list was just a tad bit out of place, sort of like the flashlight SPAM going around on the SCA lists…..

                 

                 

                 

                -----Original Message-----
                From: Jean Elizabeth Krevor [mailto:elizabeth_nician@...]
                Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 1:08 AM
                To: EKSouth@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill

                 


                --- Joe Irvine <graewulf@...> wrote:

                > That's nice..

                Eh wot? What's nice about it? Even if the person mentioned had NOTHING
                to do with the SCA, how callous to say "That's nice" to a post that
                someone's dying. *You* might not know the gentle in question, but I'm
                sure someone else might.

                You also said:

                > but what does this have to do with the SCA?

                If you'd read the part of the post you left attached below you'd see
                *exactly* what this has to do with the SCA. Poul Anderson was one of
                the founding members of the SCA, known as Sir Bela of Eastmarch. And he
                wasn't a dinosaur relegated to legend either -- he remained active
                throughout all these years of the Society.

                I think it's a testament to how well loved Poul was that the news of
                his illness and now his passing has been disseminated so far and wide.
                I've received such messages on just about every mailing list I'm on,
                and some of them have NOTHING to do with each other in the least bit.

                A bit of sensitivity to others might do you well, milord. Just because
                something has nothing to do with you doesn't mean it doesn't to others.
                If you don't like it, hit "d" now.

                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: Lew Wolkoff [mailto:lwolkoff@...]
                > Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:53 AM
                > To: EKSouth@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
                >
                > The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit list.
                >
                > There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought that
                > people
                > would want to know.  Poul is one of the founders of our Society
                and a
                > legend
                > within it.

                Slainte'--

                Jean E. Krevor/Elizabeth nicIan


                __________________________________________________
                Do You Yahoo!?
                Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger
                http://phonecard.yahoo.com/


                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
              • lady_lark_azure@yahoo.com
                M Lord, Forgive me for pointing this out but, though you say you should apologize, you never actually did. It was not the fault of the poster that it is your
                Message 7 of 16 , Aug 3 7:55 AM
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                  M'Lord,

                  Forgive me for pointing this out but, though you say you should
                  apologize, you never actually did. It was not the fault of the
                  poster that it is your habit not to fully read messages. Even if it
                  seems to have nothing to do with you or the SCA, the ideals of
                  courtesy that we strive for would dictate a less flippant response
                  when the subject is such a serious one.

                  I do not mean to pick on you, but your response hit on something of a
                  pet-peeve for me. In the immediacy of the medium of email, we all
                  need to remember that courtesy is still supposed to be at the core of
                  what we do. How humbling it was for me to read from one of his
                  friends that even as Sir Bela was dying, he maintained the "deep-
                  seated gentlemanliness that Poul always had, and which was, I think,
                  built into his whole body and being." Remembering to practice such
                  courtesy ourselves is perhaps one of the best memorials we can offer
                  him.

                  In service,
                  Isabeau d'Orleans




                  --- In EKSouth@y..., "Joe Irvine" <graewulf@y...> wrote:
                  > I should apologize, but you should understand where I come from...
                  When you
                  > get the large masses of e-mail that I get, you get in the habit of
                  scanning
                  > them for content rather than reading them all in detail. When I see
                  a
                  > message that obviously quotes from an editorial or other such
                  source (which
                  > the message in question did), I immediately see it as SPAM, and I
                  get a lot
                  > of that from mailing lists every day (I see an average of 100
                  messages a day
                  > from 3 lists). I have been doing this for far longer than most and
                  have read
                  > millions of messages, most off-topic, in my years on-line. A
                  personal
                  > account would have been different, but posts by someone who only
                  heard of a
                  > person don't have the same meaning. I had already heard this news
                  previously
                  > from sci-fi sources, so seeing it posted to an SCA list was just a
                  tad bit
                  > out of place, sort of like the flashlight SPAM going around on the
                  SCA
                  > lists...
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: Jean Elizabeth Krevor [mailto:elizabeth_nician@y...]
                  > Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 1:08 AM
                  > To: EKSouth@y...
                  > Subject: RE: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
                  >
                  >
                  > --- Joe Irvine <graewulf@y...> wrote:
                  > > That's nice..
                  >
                  > Eh wot? What's nice about it? Even if the person mentioned had
                  NOTHING
                  > to do with the SCA, how callous to say "That's nice" to a post that
                  > someone's dying. *You* might not know the gentle in question, but
                  I'm
                  > sure someone else might.
                  >
                  > You also said:
                  >
                  > > but what does this have to do with the SCA?
                  >
                  > If you'd read the part of the post you left attached below you'd see
                  > *exactly* what this has to do with the SCA. Poul Anderson was one of
                  > the founding members of the SCA, known as Sir Bela of Eastmarch.
                  And he
                  > wasn't a dinosaur relegated to legend either -- he remained active
                  > throughout all these years of the Society.
                  >
                  > I think it's a testament to how well loved Poul was that the news of
                  > his illness and now his passing has been disseminated so far and
                  wide.
                  > I've received such messages on just about every mailing list I'm on,
                  > and some of them have NOTHING to do with each other in the least
                  bit.
                  >
                  > A bit of sensitivity to others might do you well, milord. Just
                  because
                  > something has nothing to do with you doesn't mean it doesn't to
                  others.
                  > If you don't like it, hit "d" now.
                  >
                  > > -----Original Message-----
                  > > From: Lew Wolkoff [mailto:lwolkoff@h...]
                  > > Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:53 AM
                  > > To: EKSouth@y...
                  > > Subject: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
                  > >
                  > > The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit
                  list.
                  > >
                  > > There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought
                  that
                  > > people
                  > > would want to know. Poul is one of the founders of our Society
                  and a
                  > > legend
                  > > within it.
                  >
                  > Slainte'--
                  >
                  > Jean E. Krevor/Elizabeth nicIan
                  >
                  >
                  > __________________________________________________
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                • Jenne Heise
                  ... Wow! you must miss out on a whole bunch of good stuff, such as the messages about web sites of interest. One way to limit the amount of junk in mailing
                  Message 8 of 16 , Aug 3 8:00 AM
                  • 0 Attachment
                    >When I see a
                    > message that obviously quotes from an editorial or other such source (which
                    > the message in question did), I immediately see it as SPAM,

                    Wow! you must miss out on a whole bunch of good stuff, such as the
                    messages about web sites of interest.

                    One way to limit the amount of junk in mailing lists is to TRIM YOUR POSTS
                    and TURN OFF 'Send as HTML AND Plain Text' before sending.

                    --
                    Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise jenne@...
                    disclaimer: i speak for no-one and no-one speaks for me.
                    "It's no use trying to be clever-- we are all clever here; just try
                    to be kind -- a little kind." F.J. Foakes-Jackson
                  • Joe Irvine
                    You are right, I do apologize… you see that post is also one of my pet peeves… it seems that whenever a famous person gets sick, dies, etc.. Someone feels
                    Message 9 of 16 , Aug 3 2:49 PM
                    • 0 Attachment

                      You are right, I do apologize…  you see that post is also one of my pet peeves… it seems that whenever a famous person gets sick, dies, etc.. Someone feels compelled to post this to the list every time. While someone who is not so famous or well-known, someone in the SCA that we actually see on a somewhat regular basis (and might actually recognize if we pass on the street),  gets sick or dies, nothing gets mentioned to the lists (or cross-posted to multiple lists as that post was). Are these people any less important to the SCA than one of its founding members? I think not… Yet we don’t make announcements for these people. What’s wrong with this picture? Where is the courtesy in that?

                       

                       

                       

                       

                      Dierk zem Grauen Wolf

                       

                       

                       

                       

                       

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: lady_lark_azure@... [mailto:lady_lark_azure@...]
                      Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 10:55 AM
                      To: EKSouth@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [EKSouth] Re: Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill

                       

                      M'Lord,

                      Forgive me for pointing this out but, though you say you should
                      apologize, you never actually did.  It was not the fault of the
                      poster that it is your habit not to fully read messages.  Even if it
                      seems to have nothing to do with you or the SCA, the ideals of
                      courtesy that we strive for would dictate a less flippant response
                      when the subject is such a serious one. 

                      I do not mean to pick on you, but your response hit on something of a
                      pet-peeve for me.  In the immediacy of the medium of email, we all
                      need to remember that courtesy is still supposed to be at the core of
                      what we do.  How humbling it was for me to read from one of his
                      friends that even as Sir Bela was dying, he maintained the "deep-
                      seated gentlemanliness that Poul always had, and which was, I think,
                      built into his whole body and being."  Remembering to practice such
                      courtesy ourselves is perhaps one of the best memorials we can offer
                      him. 

                      In service,
                      Isabeau d'Orleans




                      --- In EKSouth@y..., "Joe Irvine" <graewulf@y...> wrote:
                      > I should apologize, but you should understand where I come from...
                      When you
                      > get the large masses of e-mail that I get, you get in the habit of
                      scanning
                      > them for content rather than reading them all in detail. When I see
                      a
                      > message that obviously quotes from an editorial or other such
                      source (which
                      > the message in question did), I immediately see it as SPAM, and I
                      get a lot
                      > of that from mailing lists every day (I see an average of 100
                      messages a day
                      > from 3 lists). I have been doing this for far longer than most and
                      have read
                      > millions of messages, most off-topic, in my years on-line. A
                      personal
                      > account would have been different, but posts by someone who only
                      heard of a
                      > person don't have the same meaning. I had already heard this news
                      previously
                      > from sci-fi sources, so seeing it posted to an SCA list was just a
                      tad bit
                      > out of place, sort of like the flashlight SPAM going around on the
                      SCA
                      > lists...
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: Jean Elizabeth Krevor [mailto:elizabeth_nician@y...]
                      > Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 1:08 AM
                      > To: EKSouth@y...
                      > Subject: RE: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
                      >
                      >
                      > --- Joe Irvine <graewulf@y...> wrote:
                      > > That's nice..
                      >
                      > Eh wot? What's nice about it? Even if the person mentioned had
                      NOTHING
                      > to do with the SCA, how callous to say "That's nice" to a post that
                      > someone's dying. *You* might not know the gentle in question, but
                      I'm
                      > sure someone else might.
                      >
                      > You also said:
                      >
                      > > but what does this have to do with the SCA?
                      >
                      > If you'd read the part of the post you left attached below you'd see
                      > *exactly* what this has to do with the SCA. Poul Anderson was one of
                      > the founding members of the SCA, known as Sir Bela of Eastmarch.
                      And he
                      > wasn't a dinosaur relegated to legend either -- he remained active
                      > throughout all these years of the Society.
                      >
                      > I think it's a testament to how well loved Poul was that the news of
                      > his illness and now his passing has been disseminated so far and
                      wide.
                      > I've received such messages on just about every mailing list I'm on,
                      > and some of them have NOTHING to do with each other in the least
                      bit.
                      >
                      > A bit of sensitivity to others might do you well, milord. Just
                      because
                      > something has nothing to do with you doesn't mean it doesn't to
                      others.
                      > If you don't like it, hit "d" now.
                      >
                      > > -----Original Message-----
                      > > From: Lew Wolkoff [mailto:lwolkoff@h...]
                      > > Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:53 AM
                      > > To: EKSouth@y...
                      > > Subject: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
                      > >
                      > > The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit
                      list.
                      > >
                      > > There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought
                      that
                      > > people
                      > > would want to know.  Poul is one of the founders of our Society
                      and a
                      > > legend
                      > > within it.
                      >
                      > Slainte'--
                      >
                      > Jean E. Krevor/Elizabeth nicIan
                      >
                      >
                      > __________________________________________________
                      > Do You Yahoo!?
                      > Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo!
                      Messenger
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                      >
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                    • Anne Adamczyk
                      It is really quite a shame that we fail to honor our founders. They are growing older, as we all are. Inevitably we will lose them all, as we have lost
                      Message 10 of 16 , Aug 3 3:15 PM
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                        It is really quite a shame that we fail to honor our founders. They
                        are growing older, as we all are. Inevitably we will lose them all,
                        as we have lost Marion Zimmer Bradley and will lose Poul Anderson.
                        Their dream has brought us closer to finding and creating our own.
                        Is it really such an annoyance to be asked to take a moment to
                        quietly honor them?

                        On the other hand, everyone has the right to be remembered by their
                        friends and acquaintances. If you wish to be so remembered, be sure
                        to let a friend or family member know to post your passing. I'm sure
                        there are those who would appreciate the information.

                        Truly felt and without sarcasm or malintent, I remain,
                        Grania

                        --- In EKSouth@y..., "Joe Irvine" <graewulf@y...> wrote:
                        > You are right, I do apologize… you see that post is also one of my
                        pet
                        > peeves… it seems that whenever a famous person gets sick, dies,
                        etc..
                        > Someone feels compelled to post this to the list every time. While
                        someone
                        > who is not so famous or well-known, someone in the SCA that we
                        actually see
                        > on a somewhat regular basis (and might actually recognize if we
                        pass on the
                        > street), gets sick or dies, nothing gets mentioned to the lists (or
                        > cross-posted to multiple lists as that post was). Are these people
                        any less
                        > important to the SCA than one of its founding members? I think not…
                        Yet we
                        > don't make announcements for these people. What's wrong with this
                        picture?
                        > Where is the courtesy in that?
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Dierk zem Grauen Wolf
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: lady_lark_azure@y... [mailto:lady_lark_azure@y...]
                        > Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 10:55 AM
                        > To: EKSouth@y...
                        > Subject: [EKSouth] Re: Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
                        >
                        > M'Lord,
                        >
                        > Forgive me for pointing this out but, though you say you should
                        > apologize, you never actually did. It was not the fault of the
                        > poster that it is your habit not to fully read messages. Even if it
                        > seems to have nothing to do with you or the SCA, the ideals of
                        > courtesy that we strive for would dictate a less flippant response
                        > when the subject is such a serious one.
                        >
                        > I do not mean to pick on you, but your response hit on something of
                        a
                        > pet-peeve for me. In the immediacy of the medium of email, we all
                        > need to remember that courtesy is still supposed to be at the core
                        of
                        > what we do. How humbling it was for me to read from one of his
                        > friends that even as Sir Bela was dying, he maintained the "deep-
                        > seated gentlemanliness that Poul always had, and which was, I think,
                        > built into his whole body and being." Remembering to practice such
                        > courtesy ourselves is perhaps one of the best memorials we can offer
                        > him.
                        >
                        > In service,
                        > Isabeau d'Orleans
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > --- In EKSouth@y..., "Joe Irvine" <graewulf@y...> wrote:
                        > > I should apologize, but you should understand where I come from...
                        > When you
                        > > get the large masses of e-mail that I get, you get in the habit of
                        > scanning
                        > > them for content rather than reading them all in detail. When I
                        see
                        > a
                        > > message that obviously quotes from an editorial or other such
                        > source (which
                        > > the message in question did), I immediately see it as SPAM, and I
                        > get a lot
                        > > of that from mailing lists every day (I see an average of 100
                        > messages a day
                        > > from 3 lists). I have been doing this for far longer than most and
                        > have read
                        > > millions of messages, most off-topic, in my years on-line. A
                        > personal
                        > > account would have been different, but posts by someone who only
                        > heard of a
                        > > person don't have the same meaning. I had already heard this news
                        > previously
                        > > from sci-fi sources, so seeing it posted to an SCA list was just a
                        > tad bit
                        > > out of place, sort of like the flashlight SPAM going around on the
                        > SCA
                        > > lists...
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > -----Original Message-----
                        > > From: Jean Elizabeth Krevor [mailto:elizabeth_nician@y...]
                        > > Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 1:08 AM
                        > > To: EKSouth@y...
                        > > Subject: RE: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- Joe Irvine <graewulf@y...> wrote:
                        > > > That's nice..
                        > >
                        > > Eh wot? What's nice about it? Even if the person mentioned had
                        > NOTHING
                        > > to do with the SCA, how callous to say "That's nice" to a post
                        that
                        > > someone's dying. *You* might not know the gentle in question, but
                        > I'm
                        > > sure someone else might.
                        > >
                        > > You also said:
                        > >
                        > > > but what does this have to do with the SCA?
                        > >
                        > > If you'd read the part of the post you left attached below you'd
                        see
                        > > *exactly* what this has to do with the SCA. Poul Anderson was one
                        of
                        > > the founding members of the SCA, known as Sir Bela of Eastmarch.
                        > And he
                        > > wasn't a dinosaur relegated to legend either -- he remained active
                        > > throughout all these years of the Society.
                        > >
                        > > I think it's a testament to how well loved Poul was that the news
                        of
                        > > his illness and now his passing has been disseminated so far and
                        > wide.
                        > > I've received such messages on just about every mailing list I'm
                        on,
                        > > and some of them have NOTHING to do with each other in the least
                        > bit.
                        > >
                        > > A bit of sensitivity to others might do you well, milord. Just
                        > because
                        > > something has nothing to do with you doesn't mean it doesn't to
                        > others.
                        > > If you don't like it, hit "d" now.
                        > >
                        > > > -----Original Message-----
                        > > > From: Lew Wolkoff [mailto:lwolkoff@h...]
                        > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:53 AM
                        > > > To: EKSouth@y...
                        > > > Subject: [EKSouth] Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill
                        > > >
                        > > > The following is a re-post from the Library of Congress SF-Lit
                        > list.
                        > > >
                        > > > There is no joy in being the bearer of sad news, but I thought
                        > that
                        > > > people
                        > > > would want to know. Poul is one of the founders of our Society
                        > and a
                        > > > legend
                        > > > within it.
                        > >
                        > > Slainte'--
                        > >
                        > > Jean E. Krevor/Elizabeth nicIan
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > __________________________________________________
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                      • Philip W. Troy & Susan Troy
                        ... I dunno, I don t think I ve seen it happen that a SCAdian has passed on without being noted by some friend or friends. Just as a random example, recently
                        Message 11 of 16 , Aug 3 5:50 PM
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                          Joe Irvine wrote:

                          >
                          > You are right, I do apologize… you see that post is also one of my pet peeves… it seems that whenever a famous person gets sick, dies, etc.. Someone feels compelled to post this to the list every time. While
                          > someone who is not so famous or well-known, someone in the SCA that we actually see on a somewhat regular basis (and might actually recognize if we pass on the street), gets sick or dies, nothing gets
                          > mentioned to the lists (or cross-posted to multiple lists as that post was). Are these people any less important to the SCA than one of its founding members? I think not… Yet we don’t make announcements for
                          > these people. What’s wrong with this picture? Where is the courtesy in that?
                          >
                          >
                          > Dierk zem Grauen Wolf

                          I dunno, I don't think I've seen it happen that a SCAdian has passed on
                          without being noted by some friend or friends.

                          Just as a random example, recently the folks over on the cooks' mailing
                          list experienced a sudden loss in the person of a fantastic manuscript
                          researcher, someone whose name would almost certainly be known to
                          anybody who does this type of research. I wouldn't necessarily consider
                          this person a literary luminary outside of this field, but her loss will
                          be keenly felt.

                          My own experience has been that we _do_ make announcements for these
                          people, generally. As long as each of us makes sure no such loss in our
                          sphere of acquaintances and friends goes unnoticed, we're covered. And
                          where the courtesy, or the lack thereof, lies, is in us.

                          Adamantius
                          --
                          Phil & Susan Troy

                          troy@...

                          "It was so blatant that Roger threw at him. Clemens gets away with
                          things that get other people thrown out of games. As long as they
                          let him get away with it, it's going to continue." -- Joe Torre, 9/98
                        • jrosswebb1@webtv.net
                          Hello List, So, Poul Anderson has moved on. I ll bet he s started a chapter of the SCA where ever his is now. Good life. Well done. To live that long into
                          Message 12 of 16 , Aug 3 6:29 PM
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Hello List,
                            So, Poul Anderson has moved on. I'll bet he's started a chapter of
                            the SCA where ever his is now. Good life. Well done. To live that long
                            into adulthood and not lose the childlike sense of wonder and play that
                            keeps us young to the end. A story weaver and an active scadian
                            surrounded by his loved ones and respected by all. Not a bad way to go.
                            Vivat! Look what he's left us to remember him by.
                            And when anyone else in the SCA passes on, we will all feel the
                            same way. A member of our family has left us. I remember too many posts
                            like this the last year. Several years ago when a member of my household
                            passed away, not well known, but loved. The scadian turnout to his
                            funeral and wake was overwhelming. We're a good lot, and we feel deeply
                            when one of us moves on.
                            In this context it makes our little gripes and peves seem small and
                            unimportant.
                            None of us is promised tomorrow.
                            Fondly,
                            -Geoffrei


                            http://community.webtv.net/jrosswebb1/EASTWINDStribal
                          • Justine Pilewski
                            Not so recently, the death of one of our household members was posted to this list, for which we were grateful, as we had lost touch with him. With out that
                            Message 13 of 16 , Aug 3 11:27 PM
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Not so recently, the death of one of our household members was posted to this list, for which we were grateful, as we had lost touch with him. With out that posting, we would not have known, or been able to attend
                              the services. He was not famous, or known for anything special, but he mattered to us.

                              Jenne McGill

                              "Philip W. Troy & Susan Troy" wrote:

                              >
                              > I dunno, I don't think I've seen it happen that a SCAdian has passed on
                              > without being noted by some friend or friends.
                              >
                              > Just as a random example, recently the folks over on the cooks' mailing
                              > list experienced a sudden loss in the person of a fantastic manuscript
                              > researcher, someone whose name would almost certainly be known to
                              > anybody who does this type of research. I wouldn't necessarily consider
                              > this person a literary luminary outside of this field, but her loss will
                              > be keenly felt.
                              >
                              > My own experience has been that we _do_ make announcements for these
                              > people, generally. As long as each of us makes sure no such loss in our
                              > sphere of acquaintances and friends goes unnoticed, we're covered. And
                              > where the courtesy, or the lack thereof, lies, is in us.
                              >
                              > Adamantius
                              > --
                              > Phil & Susan Troy
                              >
                              > troy@...
                            • Jenne Heise
                              ... Oddly enough, I ve seen many, many such postings cross-posted to lists over time. I ve even initiated one recently (though not to this list, someone else
                              Message 14 of 16 , Aug 4 11:12 AM
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                                > Someone feels compelled to post this to the list every time. While someone
                                > who is not so famous or well-known, someone in the SCA that we actually see
                                > on a somewhat regular basis (and might actually recognize if we pass on the
                                > street), gets sick or dies, nothing gets mentioned to the lists (or
                                > cross-posted to multiple lists as that post was). Are these people any less
                                > important to the SCA than one of its founding members? I think not… Yet we
                                > don’t make announcements for these people. What’s wrong with this picture?
                                > Where is the courtesy in that?

                                Oddly enough, I've seen many, many such postings cross-posted to lists
                                over time. I've even initiated one recently (though not to this list,
                                someone else posted it here). It's hard to bring yourself
                                to post to lists the news that someone you knew and loved is dead. Worse
                                still when you have watched similar announcements get derided with 'that's
                                nice' or worse theological discussions about the political correctness of
                                the poster's expression of grief, which have happened on this list. But
                                the announcements do get posted. If you know someone in the SCA who died,
                                you can post that information, then it will be posted, won't it?

                                I believe that semiregularly at events such as Pennsic and 12th night,
                                people set up either walls of memory or similar projects to remember those
                                who we knew in the SCA who have died.

                                --
                                Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise jenne@...
                                disclaimer: i speak for no-one and no-one speaks for me.
                                "It's no use trying to be clever-- we are all clever here; just try
                                to be kind -- a little kind." F.J. Foakes-Jackson
                              • Kevin Dail
                                ... I believe that you are incorrect. I have seen many missives informing us of the sickness/passing of local Scadians. I fear that I may soon have a message
                                Message 15 of 16 , Aug 4 1:04 PM
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  >You are right, I do apologizeŠ you see that post is also one of my
                                  >pet peevesŠ it seems that whenever a famous person gets sick, dies,
                                  >etc.. Someone feels compelled to post this to the list every time.
                                  >While someone who is not so famous or well-known, someone in the SCA
                                  >that we actually see on a somewhat regular basis (and might actually
                                  >recognize if we pass on the street), gets sick or dies, nothing
                                  >gets mentioned to the lists (or cross-posted to multiple lists as
                                  >that post was). Are these people any less important to the SCA than
                                  >one of its founding members? I think notŠ Yet we don't make
                                  >announcements for these people. What's wrong with this picture?
                                  >Where is the courtesy in that?

                                  I believe that you are incorrect. I have seen many missives informing
                                  us of the sickness/passing of local Scadians. I fear that I may soon
                                  have a message of my own to send soon....

                                  Where death is concerned, I have no problem with ANY message. Even if
                                  I do not know the individual involved, I feel it is most appropriate
                                  and welcome information.


                                  Kevin MacDaill GMB, Man at Arms
                                  Cheshire House, House Ethereal

                                  (mka)Kevin John Dail
                                  Art Director, Web Illuminators Inc.,
                                  Web Design, Graphics and Hosting
                                  kdail@...

                                  http://www.webilluminators.com
                                  http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Gallery/7736/archery.html
                                  Join House Ethereal mailing list at:
                                  http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/Ethereal
                                • Joe Irvine
                                  I guess it depends on where you are then… I have seen a couple around here but some I only heard after the fact months later….. ... From: Kevin Dail
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Aug 5 5:35 AM
                                  • 0 Attachment

                                    I guess it depends on where you are then… I have seen a  couple around here but some I only heard after the fact months later…..

                                     

                                    -----Original Message-----
                                    From: Kevin Dail [mailto:kddm@...]
                                    Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2001 4:04 PM
                                    To: EKSouth@yahoogroups.com
                                    Subject: RE: [EKSouth] Re: Greg Bear: Poul Anderson gravely ill

                                     

                                    >You are right, I do apologizeŠ  you see that post is also one of my

                                    >pet peevesŠ it seems that whenever a famous person gets sick, dies,
                                    >etc.. Someone feels compelled to post this to the list every time.
                                    >While someone who is not so famous or well-known, someone in the SCA
                                    >that we actually see on a somewhat regular basis (and might actually
                                    >recognize if we pass on the street),  gets sick or dies, nothing
                                    >gets mentioned to the lists (or cross-posted to multiple lists as
                                    >that post was). Are these people any less important to the SCA than
                                    >one of its founding members? I think notŠ Yet we don't make
                                    >announcements for these people. What's wrong with this picture?
                                    >Where is the courtesy in that?

                                    I believe that you are incorrect. I have seen many missives informing
                                    us of the sickness/passing of local Scadians. I fear that I may soon
                                    have a message of my own to send soon....

                                    Where death is concerned, I have no problem with ANY message. Even if
                                    I do not know the individual involved, I feel it is most appropriate
                                    and welcome information.


                                    Kevin MacDaill GMB, Man at Arms
                                    Cheshire House, House Ethereal

                                    (mka)Kevin John Dail
                                    Art Director, Web Illuminators Inc.,
                                    Web Design, Graphics and Hosting
                                    kdail@...

                                    http://www.webilluminators.com
                                    http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Gallery/7736/archery.html
                                    Join House Ethereal mailing list at:
                                    http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/Ethereal

                                                                        


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