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Re: China into the Asian Cup final

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  • Alessandro Ranieri
    Ah Jieming, When you say the newspaper has article, what newspaper you talk about? I don t care who wins Asian Cup. I care that soccer is free of politics and
    Message 1 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
      Ah Jieming,
      When you say the newspaper has article, what newspaper you talk about?

      I don't care who wins Asian Cup. I care that soccer is free of politics and corruption. China has shown the world that it can handle major sporting event. Some games have been very exciting with lot of goals. And most of stadiums are packed. Only black mark is China has not done enough to control the fans. If Chinese government warn the fans that it will arrest any who threaten Japanese players, it would send a strong message that China will not allow politics to get in way of football.

      If I were Japan player, I would want to lose in the final. Why? Because the final is no longer about football anymore. It's about one country wanting to get revenge. Japan does not want to trigger any more anger from the Chinese fans. If I were Japanese fan, I would avoid this game, since Chinese fans will become violent and attack Japanese if they lose.

      Alex.

      Jieming wrote:

      Today's paper carries an article about the bad sportsmanship of the
      Chinese fans. According to the article, Japan has complained
      officially 3 times in the last 10 days and it's becoming very
      embarrassing.

      Jieming


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    • kitmengleong
      Ah Alex, the article is; Japan to China: Stop the jeers . Thursday, August 5, 2004 Streats, Page 4 Jieming ... about? ... politics and corruption. China has
      Message 2 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
        Ah Alex, the article is;

        "Japan to China: Stop the jeers".
        Thursday, August 5, 2004
        Streats, Page 4

        Jieming



        --- In DragonSeedLegacy@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro Ranieri
        <alexcranieri@y...> wrote:
        > Ah Jieming,
        > When you say the newspaper has article, what newspaper you talk
        about?
        >
        > I don't care who wins Asian Cup. I care that soccer is free of
        politics and corruption. China has shown the world that it can handle
        major sporting event. Some games have been very exciting with lot of
        goals. And most of stadiums are packed. Only black mark is China has
        not done enough to control the fans. If Chinese government warn the
        fans that it will arrest any who threaten Japanese players, it would
        send a strong message that China will not allow politics to get in
        way of football.
        >
        > If I were Japan player, I would want to lose in the final. Why?
        Because the final is no longer about football anymore. It's about one
        country wanting to get revenge. Japan does not want to trigger any
        more anger from the Chinese fans. If I were Japanese fan, I would
        avoid this game, since Chinese fans will become violent and attack
        Japanese if they lose.
        >
        > Alex.
        >
        > Jieming wrote:
        >
        > Today's paper carries an article about the bad sportsmanship of the
        > Chinese fans. According to the article, Japan has complained
        > officially 3 times in the last 10 days and it's becoming very
        > embarrassing.
        >
        > Jieming
        >
        >
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        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Alessandro Ranieri
        My friend in Hong Kong tell me that in 1985, China played Hong Kong in important match, and China was upset. The Chinese fans were so angry that there were
        Message 3 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
          My friend in Hong Kong tell me that in 1985, China played Hong Kong in important match, and China was upset. The Chinese fans were so angry that there were riots in many Chinese cities. Part of the reason for their anger was Hong Kong was so small compared to China. But main reason was because Hong Kong was British colony and China at the time did not get along with British.

          I think China hate Japan 100 times more. So if Japan beat China in final, I think Japanese players may not get out of stadium alive. Japan players must know this. Politics need to take main role over football this time. Japan committed many atrocities against Chinese people, and if China get some revenge, in whatever way, Japan need to accept the reality. Let the Chinese fans have their party and Japanese players and fans can leave China unharmed.

          Alex.


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        • qpwoeiru134679
          Let the Chinese fans have their party and Japanese players and fans can leave China unharmed. yeah... let your 5-year-old scream all he wants (like a real
          Message 4 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
            "Let the Chinese fans have their party and Japanese players and
            fans can leave China unharmed."

            yeah... let your 5-year-old scream all he wants (like a real child)
            because another kid has taken his toy. if the other kid will not let
            him scream, your kid will beat him up.

            i'd like to say that most chinese (in china) are mature and
            educated... but no, many ARE like children!

            tony

            --- In DragonSeedLegacy@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro
            Ranieri <alexcranieri@y...> wrote:
            > My friend in Hong Kong tell me that in 1985, China played
            Hong Kong in important match, and China was upset. The
            Chinese fans were so angry that there were riots in many
            Chinese cities. Part of the reason for their anger was Hong Kong
            was so small compared to China. But main reason was
            because Hong Kong was British colony and China at the time
            did not get along with British.
            >
            > I think China hate Japan 100 times more. So if Japan beat
            China in final, I think Japanese players may not get out of
            stadium alive. Japan players must know this. Politics need to
            take main role over football this time. Japan committed many
            atrocities against Chinese people, and if China get some
            revenge, in whatever way, Japan need to accept the reality. Let
            the Chinese fans have their party and Japanese players and
            fans can leave China unharmed.
            >
            > Alex.
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more
            fun!
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            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Alessandro Ranieri
            Ah, I think Japanese players and referee will try their best to help China win the Asian Cup. I hope the Chinese players will take advantage of the easy
            Message 5 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
              Ah, I think Japanese players and referee will try their best to help China win the Asian Cup. I hope the Chinese players will take advantage of the easy chances given to them.

              Alex.


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            • kitmengleong
              Ok, Ok, this is getting out of hand. Passions will always get aflamed in any competition. I admit Chinese fans are not acting very maturely and I too would
              Message 6 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
                Ok, Ok, this is getting out of hand.

                Passions will always get aflamed in any competition. I admit Chinese
                fans are not acting very maturely and I too would like to see more
                sporting attitudes especially coming from a culture that's supposed
                to have achieved civilisation 2000+ years ago, but remember that
                soccer hooliganism isn't merely confined to China-Japan matches. One
                just has to look at European matches (especially English fans) to see
                that immaturity is found everywhere.

                They are only a handful of people and don't represent the population
                at all. Please be careful.

                Jieming


                --- In DragonSeedLegacy@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro Ranieri
                <alexcranieri@y...> wrote:
                > Ah, I think Japanese players and referee will try their best to
                help China win the Asian Cup. I hope the Chinese players will take
                advantage of the easy chances given to them.
                >
                > Alex.
                >
                >
                > ---------------------------------
                > ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun!
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • xinmin yan
                i don t understand this. There are thousands of fans at that game, how could someone use just one sterotype to describe the behaviors of thousands of people
                Message 7 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
                  i don't understand this. There are thousands of fans at that game, how could someone use just one sterotype to describe the behaviors of thousands of people and reach the conclusion that eveone was thinking that way: i.e. because we hated English and their occupation in HK then we hated HK team.

                  there are far more complicated reasons to explain the riots that happened afte the game(in china it is referred as 5'19 incident). i would use a simple one: chinese fans had been disappointed at chinese football and the CFA's management they finally found an"exit" to let out their emotion. unfortunately that game happened at the "right" time and "right: place and triggered the blow-off of fans' anger at CFA.

                  if i really want to explain it i would put it in a bigger picture or refer you to read a book written by a chinese writer who analysed the incident and said there are far more social, e.g. political economical, issues involved at the time.

                  if some one used the UK thing to explain the 5'19 incident in 1995, i would say it is "xiao ti da zuo" exaggerated it.

                  i would never expect someone to be sitting there cool and not behaving emotionally when watching a hot football game on spot. plis, sports is not purly a game or entertainment. we all know that.

                  xinmin

                  Alessandro Ranieri <alexcranieri@...> wrote:
                  My friend in Hong Kong tell me that in 1985, China played Hong Kong in important match, and China was upset. The Chinese fans were so angry that there were riots in many Chinese cities. Part of the reason for their anger was Hong Kong was so small compared to China. But main reason was because Hong Kong was British colony and China at the time did not get along with British.

                  I think China hate Japan 100 times more. So if Japan beat China in final, I think Japanese players may not get out of stadium alive. Japan players must know this. Politics need to take main role over football this time. Japan committed many atrocities against Chinese people, and if China get some revenge, in whatever way, Japan need to accept the reality. Let the Chinese fans have their party and Japanese players and fans can leave China unharmed.

                  Alex.


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                • xinmin yan
                  i want to ask this: if some English or American hold a banner bearing some political words and show up at a sports event, would British government or American
                  Message 8 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
                    i want to ask this:

                    if some English or American hold a banner bearing some political words and show up at a sports event, would British government or American government intervene the thing? would this be a big deal considering this is just an individual act?

                    is it because the incident in si chuan happened in China, people from outside are more sensitive and interested to see how Chines government respond to it and handle it?

                    also, should government "control"(very interesting word) the behavior of fans if there is no threat to the social security or criminal behaviors involved?

                    xinmin
                    kitmengleong <kmleong@...> wrote:
                    Ok, Ok, this is getting out of hand.

                    Passions will always get aflamed in any competition. I admit Chinese
                    fans are not acting very maturely and I too would like to see more
                    sporting attitudes especially coming from a culture that's supposed
                    to have achieved civilisation 2000+ years ago, but remember that
                    soccer hooliganism isn't merely confined to China-Japan matches. One
                    just has to look at European matches (especially English fans) to see
                    that immaturity is found everywhere.

                    They are only a handful of people and don't represent the population
                    at all. Please be careful.

                    Jieming


                    --- In DragonSeedLegacy@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro Ranieri
                    <alexcranieri@y...> wrote:
                    > Ah, I think Japanese players and referee will try their best to
                    help China win the Asian Cup. I hope the Chinese players will take
                    advantage of the easy chances given to them.
                    >
                    > Alex.
                    >
                    >
                    > ---------------------------------
                    > ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun!
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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                  • Jane
                    All good points indeed! I am not a football fan at all. But speaking of the immaturity of the football watchers/fans, although I don t deliberately follow the
                    Message 9 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
                      All good points indeed!

                      I am not a football fan at all. But speaking of the immaturity of the football watchers/fans, although I don't deliberately follow the sports news, and just off the top of my head, I think I heard more than 10 times over the past several years football games in Europe ended up with bloody fights between the two opponent players' fans.

                      Jane

                      xinmin yan <xinminyan@...> wrote:
                      i want to ask this:

                      if some English or American hold a banner bearing some political words and show up at a sports event, would British government or American government intervene the thing? would this be a big deal considering this is just an individual act?

                      is it because the incident in si chuan happened in China, people from outside are more sensitive and interested to see how Chines government respond to it and handle it?

                      also, should government "control"(very interesting word) the behavior of fans if there is no threat to the social security or criminal behaviors involved?

                      xinmin
                      kitmengleong <kmleong@...> wrote:
                      Ok, Ok, this is getting out of hand.

                      Passions will always get aflamed in any competition. I admit Chinese
                      fans are not acting very maturely and I too would like to see more
                      sporting attitudes especially coming from a culture that's supposed
                      to have achieved civilisation 2000+ years ago, but remember that
                      soccer hooliganism isn't merely confined to China-Japan matches. One
                      just has to look at European matches (especially English fans) to see
                      that immaturity is found everywhere.

                      They are only a handful of people and don't represent the population
                      at all. Please be careful.

                      Jieming


                      --- In DragonSeedLegacy@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro Ranieri
                      <alexcranieri@y...> wrote:
                      > Ah, I think Japanese players and referee will try their best to
                      help China win the Asian Cup. I hope the Chinese players will take
                      advantage of the easy chances given to them.
                      >
                      > Alex.
                      >
                      >
                      > ---------------------------------
                      > ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun!
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DragonSeedLegacy


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                    • kitmengleong
                      Correct. Bad behaviour happens everywhere and not exclusively in China. However, as a note, remember that just because someone else s fans are behaving badly
                      Message 10 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
                        Correct. Bad behaviour happens everywhere and not exclusively in
                        China. However, as a note, remember that just because someone else's
                        fans are behaving badly doesn't give us the excuse to be just a bad.
                        It is the mark of a civilised society to be able to rise above the
                        raging passions and take the moral high ground.

                        Let them riot. Why should the Chinese fans in the football stadium
                        be like them and follow their example? We should set our own
                        example. Sadly what we are seeing in the China-Japan matches is that
                        some fans are unable to rise above petty squables even in the name of
                        friendly competition. What is next? The Olympics? Will the world
                        again see the "ugly Chinaman" there? They mar the good name of China
                        and I personally would not applaud them. Thankfully the majority of
                        people I know do not cordon the actions of these few who fail to
                        realise that with the the privilage to freedom of expression, comes
                        greater responsibility.

                        Jieming


                        --- In DragonSeedLegacy@yahoogroups.com, Jane <ming18ming2003@y...>
                        wrote:
                        > All good points indeed!
                        >
                        > I am not a football fan at all. But speaking of the immaturity of
                        the football watchers/fans, although I don't deliberately follow the
                        sports news, and just off the top of my head, I think I heard more
                        than 10 times over the past several years football games in Europe
                        ended up with bloody fights between the two opponent players' fans.
                        >
                        > Jane
                        >
                        > xinmin yan <xinminyan@y...> wrote:
                        > i want to ask this:
                        >
                        > if some English or American hold a banner bearing some political
                        words and show up at a sports event, would British government or
                        American government intervene the thing? would this be a big deal
                        considering this is just an individual act?
                        >
                        > is it because the incident in si chuan happened in China, people
                        from outside are more sensitive and interested to see how Chines
                        government respond to it and handle it?
                        >
                        > also, should government "control"(very interesting word) the
                        behavior of fans if there is no threat to the social security or
                        criminal behaviors involved?
                        >
                        > xinmin
                        > kitmengleong <kmleong@a...> wrote:
                        > Ok, Ok, this is getting out of hand.
                        >
                        > Passions will always get aflamed in any competition. I admit
                        Chinese
                        > fans are not acting very maturely and I too would like to see more
                        > sporting attitudes especially coming from a culture that's supposed
                        > to have achieved civilisation 2000+ years ago, but remember that
                        > soccer hooliganism isn't merely confined to China-Japan matches.
                        One
                        > just has to look at European matches (especially English fans) to
                        see
                        > that immaturity is found everywhere.
                        >
                        > They are only a handful of people and don't represent the
                        population
                        > at all. Please be careful.
                        >
                        > Jieming
                        >
                        >
                        > --- In DragonSeedLegacy@yahoogroups.com, Alessandro Ranieri
                        > <alexcranieri@y...> wrote:
                        > > Ah, I think Japanese players and referee will try their best to
                        > help China win the Asian Cup. I hope the Chinese players will take
                        > advantage of the easy chances given to them.
                        > >
                        > > Alex.
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > ---------------------------------
                        > > ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun!
                        > >
                        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DragonSeedLegacy
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