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Re: [DragonCon] Re: What in the world?/Homosexuality?

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  • Gwarpig
    Demmie, I love and respect you too. Our different views on this issue won t change that. :-) I read your response with great interest. Not only are you
    Message 1 of 76 , Apr 1, 2004
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      Demmie,
      I love and respect you too. Our different views on this issue won't change that. :-)
      I read your response with great interest. Not only are you beautiful, but you're quite articulate. Your arguement is well presented, but I still dissagree that homosexuality is as "normal" as heterosexuality.
      But we would all agree that there are many wonderful people that happen to practice homosexuality. Homosexuals should be treated with kindness and respect, just like everyone else should be.

      Sorry Jesse, but we're going to have to disagree on this one. :-(

      Gwarpy









      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Dementia
      To: DragonCon@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 3:58 PM
      Subject: RE: [DragonCon] Re: What in the world?/Homosexuality?


      No Piggy, you didn't hurt my feelings. Actually, it just makes me very
      sad that you feel so strongly this way.

      I would never imagine "sheltering" my children from homosexuality. I
      don't believe it to be any different from heterosexuality. So because
      heterosexuality is more "widely accepted" that means that's what we
      should give to our children as well? Children treat homosexuality
      different when they see WE treat it differently. Let me give you another
      example.

      I am adopted. In 1989 I met my birthmother's family, and in 1999 I met
      my birthfather's. I still maintain a relationship with members of my
      adopted family. My children know everyone involved. I also have a
      birthson, who will be 7 in July. Now keep in mind, I am mixed, my
      birthmother's family is white, my birthfather's family is black. My
      ADOPTED family is white. My birthson is biracial, so he is much darker
      than my girls. Now while this scenario may confuse you, my girls are
      extremely comfortable with it all. They know my son has another mother
      and father raising him, like my adopted parents raised me. They are
      aware of who was what relationship with who, and the dynamic of it. They
      don't feel strange or uncomfortable with any of it. Hell, my
      four-year-old can tell you who is who and what relationship everyone is.
      My point is this: children are only as confused as you make them. My
      children know full well what is going on because I don't hide it from
      them, and I feel they are better for it.

      In that same vein, when I was married, my husband's brother was gay. He
      came to visit with his boyfriend. I do not believe I should have to
      shield my children's eyes from that. Homosexuality is not some evil
      disease, and I'm not going to treat it as such. It's just as natural as
      heterosexuality, and I would never dream of asking my brother-in-law, or
      my many gay friends to shield that "ugly" part of them from my
      children's eyes. It's part of who they are. My children see the love
      expressed between my boyfriend and I, so I don't see why it would be
      different with anyone else, just because they're of the same sex.

      Homosexuals ARE normal. Homosexuality has ALWAYS existed, and
      homosexuals are not evil people. They are not aliens. They are not some
      genetic mutant race. They are flesh and blood. They are not some monster
      that our children need to be protected from. If we treat the subject
      like the boogeyman, our children will learn to fear this alien thing. I
      know because that's how I was until adulthood.

      I doubt homosexuals have any sort of underhanded conspiracy to "turn
      young minds to the dark side". That's just silly. They are campaigning
      against persecution and ignorance. They are campaigning against fear. I
      liken it to the Civil Rights campaign for blacks. Did they campaign to
      try to turn people into blacks? No. They are making people aware that
      it's not BAD to be gay. I don't believe anyone has "become" gay because
      of it, because you don't "become" gay. You either are or you aren't.
      It's not a choice. I don't believe people would CHOOSE to be something
      that is so vehemently hated and persecuted. It's not like some religion
      where they are trying to brainwash people into being cult members. They
      are simply making it easier for those who have been in the closet to not
      be ashamed of who they are, but to be proud, and not feel shunned as
      society has made them feel.

      I used to live on Miami Beach, which as most people know is probably one
      of the most flamboyant cities in America today. My two older daughters
      were born and spent the first years of their life there. I'd venture to
      say that 85% of my friends were gay. Many of them with children. NONE of
      the children turned out "gay", and my children aren't. My parents were
      Baptist. That doesn't necessarily mean because I was exposed to that
      growing up, that that's what I'm going to be.

      And as far as BlackSabbath: Knowing the rep carried there, I'll just
      make a few, short and brief statements:
      << , is that children
      shouldn't really be exposed to homosexuality until they are old
      enough to understand it... >>

      Well then they shouldn't be exposed to heterosexuality either until they
      are old enough to understand it.

      << And let's face it, it is Abnormal, both culturally (which can shift)

      and anatomically (which will not change, sorry.) >>

      Why is it abnormal anatomically? Because the "parts don't fit"? That's
      just silly. Because it's not what you were taught? So the only reason
      men and women are together is to reproduce? What about infertile
      couples? By that token, they should not be together. Nor should those
      couples be who decide not to reproduce. And culturally? It's not
      "abnormal" just has been under the surface. It's been going on for ages,
      and just because it's not in the spotlight, doesn't mean it's not going
      on. Well culturally its not any different than not allowing a white
      person to marry a black person. Just, its a little easier to hide your
      sexuality than your skin color. But its just as intolerant.

      << Bottom line, gay fucking doesn't produce children, and therefore
      isn't technically reproduction, and therefore isn't technically
      sexual intercourse, and therefore has no place being taught in the
      classroom...>>

      So gay fucking isn't sex? What is it then? And last I checked, sexual
      intercourse wasn't being taught in the classroom, sex EDUCATION is the
      issue. Since gay relationships, just like hetero ones, can be sexual in
      nature, children should be EDUCATED, and INFORMED.

      I'm just very surprised that more than one person still in this day and
      age believes in such a manner. My apologies if I sound riled. Given
      this.. Piggy, I do respect your opinion, you know me. Even if I avidly
      disagree, I still adore you. I'm not going to be goaded into a flame war
      with Black Sabbath or anything (we've been down that road before), and
      this is the last I'm going to say on the subject. I just felt compelled
      to respond and make my feelings known. I hope I'm not in the minority on
      this issue.


      Carpe Noctem,
      Dementia
      »ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«
      "Ye have enemies? Good good, means ye've stood up for something sometime
      in thy life..."
      ... Elminster of Shadowdale
      »ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«
      -----Original Message-----
      From: Gwarpig [mailto:gwarpig@...]
      Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 3:44 PM
      To: DragonCon@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [DragonCon] Re: What in the world?/Homosexuality?

      That's exactly what I'm saying.
      Homosexuality is not the norm.
      Sorry if my opinion hurt your feelings. That's not my intention. No
      flames coming from me, but I would welcome your arguement to the
      contrary.
      I should also add that I'm in no way a homophobe. I really don't care
      what a person's sexual preference is. But most people would agree that
      homosexuals are openly campaigning to be recognized as "normal" and
      encouraging young people to explore the homosexual lifestyle. Sadly,
      it's working.

      Gwarpig





      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Dementia
      To: DragonCon@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 2:02 PM
      Subject: RE: [DragonCon] Re: What in the world?/Homosexuality?


      Whoa whoa whoa.

      Piggy, I adore you deeply, and you know this (ut oh).. but I read what I
      read below and my jaw dropped. I'm HOPING I misunderstood.
      I'm HOPING you're not referring to homosexuality as "abnormal" since you
      referred to heterosexuality as "normal". I have no desire to get into a
      flame war, but are you telling me that kids shouldn't be "exposed" to
      homosexuality, and are you comparing it to gore in and violence as it's
      something that could "warp a child's young and impressionable mind"???

      Carpe Noctem,
      Dementia
      »ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«
      "Ye have enemies? Good good, means ye've stood up for something sometime
      in thy life..."
      ... Elminster of Shadowdale
      »ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«,¸¸,»ïÏï«
      <<However... since we're being bombarded and saturated by homosexuality
      in the media, it might not be so terribly bad to expose kids to normal
      heterosexuality in some form or another. But how and in what
      moderation, I'm not sure of.

      Just my opinions. (but you know I'm right ;-) )

      Gwarpy>>






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    • DarkHost
      ... It s a romantic comedy, so I wouldn t consider it a chick flick. However, I ll concede that s a grey area and some might have a different opinion. -DH
      Message 76 of 76 , Apr 3, 2004
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        At 09:46 PM 3/31/2004, you wrote:
        >On Sun, 28 Mar 2004 16:17:35 -0800, you wrote:
        >
        > >Just went to see "Jersey Girl". Excellent flix; a real tear-jerker but not
        > >overly sappy -- IMO. And the crowd was well-behaved to boot.
        > >
        > >-DH
        >Is this some Kind od Chick Flick?
        >
        >Achbar

        It's a romantic comedy, so I wouldn't consider it a chick flick. However,
        I'll concede that's a grey area and some might have a different opinion.

        -DH



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