Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Timing the cut

Expand Messages
  • Ackland, Tony (CALNZAS)
    What technique do you use for knowing when to make the cut between the middle run (drinkable) and tails ? (and what sort of still is it - pot or reflux & what
    Message 1 of 6 , Aug 2, 2000
    • 0 Attachment
      What technique do you use for knowing when to make the cut between the
      middle run (drinkable) and tails ? (and what sort of still is it - pot or
      reflux & what are you trying to make ?)

      * When you can first smell them (the tails) ?
      * When it feels oily or you can see an oil glint/sheen ?
      * Measure the volume you've collected ?
      * Measure the % alcohol & stop when below XX % ?
      * Stop when it won't burn anymore ?

      Any advice on what's best / what doesn't work ?
      What's the trick for getting it right for whisky via a pot still ?

      I'm running a small/poor reflux still & am after neutral alcohol; I measure
      the % alcohol. I stop collecting for consumption when it gets below about
      50%, but continue to collect until at about 25% & keep these "almost tails"
      to add back in to the next wash.

      Tony
      http://www.geocities.com/kiwi_distiller
    • Pete Sayers
      Hi Tony Pete here, havnt seen you guys for a while. The general rule of thumb to quit distilling ( with any still ) is when the temp reaches approx 92- 93c.
      Message 2 of 6 , Aug 2, 2000
      • 0 Attachment
        Hi Tony Pete here, havnt seen you guys for a while. The general rule of
        thumb to quit distilling ( with any still ) is when the temp reaches approx
        92- 93c. Usually by this stage you have dragged most of the available
        alcohol from the wash. Some of you guys with the degrees will have a formula
        to asertain how much to take off for a given volume of wash at a given %age.
        Also, the tails have a distinctive smell, and it is best to stop collecting
        your drinking alcohol at this stage, and yes you can collect more tails, but
        rather than putting them in the next brew, the latest i have is that it is
        best to keep the tails until you have sufficient to fill your still again,
        and do a brew of tails. You will have to measure the strength of the tails,
        and work on taking a %age of that content by volume, usually about 70% of
        the available alcohol.Hope this is helpful.
        Regards Pete

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Ackland, Tony (CALNZAS)
        [mailto:Tony.Ackland@...]
        Sent: Thursday, 3 August 2000 08:20
        To: Distillers@egroups.com
        Subject: [Distillers] Timing the cut


        What technique do you use for knowing when to make the cut between the
        middle run (drinkable) and tails ? (and what sort of still is it - pot or
        reflux & what are you trying to make ?)

        * When you can first smell them (the tails) ?
        * When it feels oily or you can see an oil glint/sheen ?
        * Measure the volume you've collected ?
        * Measure the % alcohol & stop when below XX % ?
        * Stop when it won't burn anymore ?

        Any advice on what's best / what doesn't work ?
        What's the trick for getting it right for whisky via a pot still ?

        I'm running a small/poor reflux still & am after neutral alcohol; I measure
        the % alcohol. I stop collecting for consumption when it gets below about
        50%, but continue to collect until at about 25% & keep these "almost tails"
        to add back in to the next wash.

        Tony
        http://www.geocities.com/kiwi_distiller
      • tarvus
        Tony - with my Stillmaker type reflux still, I notice that the temperature holds steady until near the end of a cut. I should note that I use a digital
        Message 3 of 6 , Aug 2, 2000
        • 0 Attachment
          Tony - with my Stillmaker type reflux still, I notice that the
          temperature holds steady until near the end of a cut. I should note
          that I use a digital thermometer that registers to the nearest 1/10th
          of a degree fahrenheit and refreshes itself every 10 seconds.

          For example, near the end of the time the foreshots are exhausted and
          the ethanol begins running, the temp will fluctuate dramatically
          after having held rock steady until then. The same seems to happen
          at the end of the ethanol run. When I see the temp starting to get
          squirrely, I stop the run. Maybe I leave a bit of usable ethanol in
          the wash, but it's worth knowing the stuff I collect is pure! :)
          Regards!
          Tar
          --- In Distillers@egroups.com, "Ackland, Tony (CALNZAS)"
          <Tony.Ackland@c...> wrote:
          > What technique do you use for knowing when to make the cut between
          the
          > middle run (drinkable) and tails ? (and what sort of still is it -
          pot or
          > reflux & what are you trying to make ?)
          >
          > * When you can first smell them (the tails) ?
          > * When it feels oily or you can see an oil glint/sheen ?
          > * Measure the volume you've collected ?
          > * Measure the % alcohol & stop when below XX % ?
          > * Stop when it won't burn anymore ?
          >
          > Any advice on what's best / what doesn't work ?
          > What's the trick for getting it right for whisky via a pot still ?
          >
          > I'm running a small/poor reflux still & am after neutral alcohol; I
          measure
          > the % alcohol. I stop collecting for consumption when it gets
          below about
          > 50%, but continue to collect until at about 25% & keep
          these "almost tails"
          > to add back in to the next wash.
          >
          > Tony
          > http://www.geocities.com/kiwi_distiller
        • Rob van Leuven
          ... Van: Ackland, Tony (CALNZAS) [mailto:Tony.Ackland@comalco.riotinto.com.au] Verzonden: woensdag 2 augustus 2000 22:20 Aan: Distillers@egroups.com Onderwerp:
          Message 4 of 6 , Aug 4, 2000
          • 0 Attachment

             

             

            -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
            Van: Ackland, Tony (CALNZAS) [mailto:Tony.Ackland@...]
            Verzonden: woensdag 2 augustus 2000 22:20
            Aan: Distillers@egroups.com
            Onderwerp: [Distillers] Timing the cut

             

            What technique do you use for knowing when to make the cut between the
            middle run (drinkable) and tails ? (and what sort of still is it - pot or
            reflux & what are you trying to make ?)

            * When you can first smell them (the tails) ?
            * When it feels oily or you can see an oil glint/sheen ?
            * Measure the volume you've collected ?
            * Measure the % alcohol & stop when below XX % ?
            * Stop when it won't burn anymore ?

            Any advice on what's best / what doesn't work ?
            What's the trick for getting it right for whisky via a pot still ?

            I'm running a small/poor reflux still & am after neutral alcohol; I measure
            the % alcohol.  I stop collecting for consumption when it gets below about
            50%, but continue to collect until at about 25% & keep these "almost tails"
            to add back in to the next wash.

            Tony
            http://www.geocities.com/kiwi_distiller

             



            Hi, Tony and other members of the n.g.,

             

                        At the moment I’m trying to make wodka with a modified stillmaker still. I have just returned from the Czech Republic, where I have bought a bottle of Jelinek wodka which I am using as a reference w.r.t. taste and smell.

            To make it easier to achieve maximum purity I strip the beer first and I remove the first 100 ml to be sure the methanol is out. I stop distilling when the temperature reaches 95 Celsius regardless of the %.

                        The low wines I have now are approx. 55% and I dilute this to 40% max. for the fractioning distillation. I slowly bring the low wines to the boil and keep the cooling water running at a high rate for maximum reflux at the top of the column. After a while I tune the cooling water until I get a steady drip from the condenser outlet; I keep the boiler at the lowest boiling rate possible.

            Every 100 ml I check the % and I put a few ml in a noser (glass) and I add the same amount of water; as soon as I detect a distinct smell of wet cardboard, I know I have to stop collecting the middle cut; the alcohol that comes after this point (not much if the fractioning was going well)  is collected, and after a series of distillations I fill the boiler with these faints to collect the remaining ethanol. When checking the alcohol for wet cardboard smell, it is important to dilute the alcohol first to 30-40%, because the undiluted alcohol will not release the smell, and you will notice it too late when you are preparing your wodka, liqueur etc...

                        You will notice, that the off smell will start to occur as soon as the temperature in the top of the column starts tending to rise above 78,5 celsius or the drip from the outlet starts to diminish and you need to increase the heat to keep the boiler going. Also the % goes down to less than say 92%. Don’t waste your wodka now by trying to collect that little bit more !!! After a few runs, you’ll get the hang of it; there is nothing better than experience.

             

                        Hope this is useful to you,

             

                        Regards, Rob

          • Dick
            Hi to the group, I m currently trying out the Alcotec 8 turbo yeast (supplied by Ray@Moonshine Supplies) for the 1st time to ferment 2 x 25l of wash but have
            Message 5 of 6 , Aug 10, 2000
            • 0 Attachment
              Hi to the group,
              I'm currently trying out the Alcotec 8 turbo yeast (supplied by
              Ray@Moonshine Supplies) for the 1st time to ferment 2 x 25l of wash but
              have hit a couple of (I hope) minor problems:

              1) Following instructions the 1st batch fermented down from a starting gravity
              of 1130 to 992 in about 5 days but seemed very reluctant to clear. I
              decanted into 1 gal demi-johns and after some experimentation got most of
              them to clear to crystal clarity using bentonite (montmorillonite clay) but a
              couple have remained hazy despite the bentonite clearing down a lot of
              rubbish & dead yeast.

              Q. As I intend to strip the wash in a pot still configuration and then reflux am I
              worrying unnecessarily about the remaining light haze ?

              2) The 2nd 25l batch was again made up following instructions but has
              seemed far more slower a fermentation. It has taken over 10 days to ferment
              down from 1130 to 1020 and has now virtually stopped. (Due to vagaries of
              the Scottish summer - don't believe everything you saw during the recent
              Open Golf - I've been using heating pads to keep both fermenting washes
              @ 23°C.)

              Q. How far down do turbo yeasts usually ferment ? Has my fermentation
              stuck and/or run out of nutrient ? If it was beer or wine I would kick it back
              into action by adding some more nutrient & a strongly fermenting yeast
              solution but turbo yeast is already a strong, alcohol tolerant yeast.

              Anyone any suggestions or experience of similar problems ?
              --
              Dick
            • Pete Sayers
              Hi Dick, Pete here from NZ. I have been using the turbo 8 and its cousins for several years now and yes you problems are only minor. Firstly, the cloudiness
              Message 6 of 6 , Aug 10, 2000
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi Dick, Pete here from NZ. I have been using the turbo 8 and its cousins
                for several years now and yes you problems are only minor. Firstly, the
                cloudiness will settle out given enough time, the simplest way to clear the
                wash is to decant( rack) it off into a suitable sized container, and leave
                it to get cold. It may take a few days, depending on the ambient temp, but
                it will clear quite well. It never seems to clear completely, however this
                is not as critical, as most of the cloudiness will dissappear during
                distilation, and carbon filtering. Secondly, the most common mistake people
                make when using the turbo 8, is to add the yeast/nutrients when the temp of
                the sugar/ water solution is too high. Because the turbo 8 is so active it
                tends to add anything upto 5-8C degrees of it's own temp. So if you always
                remember to add the yeast when the temp is only about 20-22C.What happens is
                the temp rises to over 28-30C and the yeast races, gets "tired" and sinks to
                the bottom believeing it's job is done, leaving less yeast to complete the
                job, consequently fermentation will take much longer.Lastly most of the time
                a turbo will ferment down to 985-990 quite readily. Keep at it Dick.
                regards Pete at Brewers Barn

                -----Original Message-----
                From: Dick [mailto:dick@...]
                Sent: Thursday, 10 August 2000 21:19
                To: Distillers@egroups.com
                Subject: [Distillers] Turbo yeast


                Hi to the group,
                I'm currently trying out the Alcotec 8 turbo yeast (supplied by
                Ray@Moonshine Supplies) for the 1st time to ferment 2 x 25l of wash but
                have hit a couple of (I hope) minor problems:

                1) Following instructions the 1st batch fermented down from a starting
                gravity
                of 1130 to 992 in about 5 days but seemed very reluctant to clear. I
                decanted into 1 gal demi-johns and after some experimentation got most of
                them to clear to crystal clarity using bentonite (montmorillonite clay) but
                a
                couple have remained hazy despite the bentonite clearing down a lot of
                rubbish & dead yeast.

                Q. As I intend to strip the wash in a pot still configuration and then
                reflux am I
                worrying unnecessarily about the remaining light haze ?

                2) The 2nd 25l batch was again made up following instructions but has
                seemed far more slower a fermentation. It has taken over 10 days to ferment
                down from 1130 to 1020 and has now virtually stopped. (Due to vagaries of
                the Scottish summer - don't believe everything you saw during the recent
                Open Golf - I've been using heating pads to keep both fermenting washes
                @ 23°C.)

                Q. How far down do turbo yeasts usually ferment ? Has my fermentation
                stuck and/or run out of nutrient ? If it was beer or wine I would kick it
                back
                into action by adding some more nutrient & a strongly fermenting yeast
                solution but turbo yeast is already a strong, alcohol tolerant yeast.

                Anyone any suggestions or experience of similar problems ?
                --
                Dick
              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.