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RE: Thumper

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  • Tony & Elle Ackland
    Do you think that with a 20 liter boiler that a 1 liter thumper, half filled with mash would be capable of getting 75-85% alcohol, or would a larger volume in
    Message 1 of 15 , Jul 13, 2000
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      Do you think that with a 20 liter boiler that a 1 liter thumper, half
      filled
      with mash would be capable of getting 75-85% alcohol, or would a larger
      volume in the thumper be needed? (the initial mash in the thumper and
      boiler
      would be 15%, and an electric stove the heat source). Another idea I came
      up with (at least, I don't remember ever seeing it anywhere else) would be
      to
      fill the thumper with copper scouring pads. Would this work as well as
      mash?

      > What the thumper is trying to do is act like a distillation plate or
      section of packed column, eg provide a place where the vapour and liquid
      hang around together long enough to reach equilibrium and swap a bit of
      water & alcohol between themselves. So things to enhance this mixing or
      residence time, and area that its happening over will improve how well the
      thumper runs.

      >This is what makes sizing a thumper hard - it depends (as always) on heaps
      of things, and would run from the realm of being really small with little
      liquid in it (eg 100 mL?) if you can get fantastic mixing, through to
      something quite large (gallons ?) if just simply lettling big bubbles loose
      in it & it were shallow. But you simplyify it down to the basic concept
      that heaps of bubble surface area, and keeping the bubbles in the liquid
      for longer, will help.

      >So just thinking this through aloud ...smaller bubbles would be better
      than large ones - but don't want to create too much pressure in the system
      say by going to a silly small tube diameter or trying to put a jetting
      nozzel onto it..... but maybe some sort of distributor could help - eg
      release the vapour under a plate with a whole lot of little holes drilled
      in it ? Wide isn't going to be an advantage unless the bubbles are coming
      up through the whole width / cross-section - but making the liquid level
      in it deeper might cause the pressure back to the still to increase again
      (not desired). So in theory, scouring pads don't seem too silly, as they
      will help break up the bubbles and retain them for a little longer. Great
      solution !

      Could it be possible to run a bit of tubing off the top of a boiler bring
      it
      over and down, connect it to the bottom of a tall column that is sitting
      off
      to the side, and use that for a reflux column? Or would the water
      collecting
      at the bottom of the column prevent this? Any ideas?

      >Yes, this is a technique often used in commercial distillation columns.
      Sometimes a couple of columns will end up getting connected in series.
      Robert Warren has done this too with his "Charles 803" still - see
      http://www.geocities.com/kiwi_distiller/others.htm or
      http://journeytoforever.org/ethanol_robert1.html for photos and a diagram.
      He gets around the problem of water collection by having a wee tube off
      the side of base of the column, so that the liquid level will never rise
      above this particular level. Just note that this liquid will be about 40%
      alcohol, so you might want to collect it to redistil, rather than tossing
      it.

      Tony
    • Chris Alexander
      gary, my thumper was 25% of the still size. it worked great. in fact, i removed it as it stripped most of the fruit flavor out of the wash. liquor come out at
      Message 2 of 15 , Apr 23, 2003
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        gary,

        my thumper was 25% of the still size. it worked great. in fact, i
        removed it as it stripped most of the fruit flavor out of the wash.
        liquor come out at 80%ABV. if going for flavor, plain pot still is
        the way to go, otherwise, a little extra effort and you can build a
        much more efficient reflux still.

        .....................................................Gringo Chris
      • tigger bear
        thank u chris ,im only using a sugar wash at the moment, and just flavoring my alcohol with comercail flavors ,so stripping flavors out is not a problem for me
        Message 3 of 15 , Apr 23, 2003
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          thank u chris ,im only using a sugar wash at the moment, and just flavoring my alcohol with comercail flavors ,so stripping flavors out is not a problem for me ,yet,so i might give a thumper a go i think,, thanks for your time chris
           
          garry

          Chris Alexander <tripcityusa@...> wrote:

          gary,

          my thumper was 25% of the still size. it worked great. in fact, i
          removed it as it stripped most of the fruit flavor out of the wash.
          liquor come out at 80%ABV. if going for flavor, plain pot still is
          the way to go, otherwise, a little extra effort and you can build a
          much more efficient reflux still.

          .....................................................Gringo Chris



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        • Ken Grady
          Gday Garry, If you are keen to go with the thumper you can get an idea of a cheap way to start with one at the photo s section of this group at
          Message 4 of 15 , Apr 24, 2003
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            Gday Garry,
            If you are keen to go with the thumper you can get an idea of a cheap way to start with one at the photo's section of this group at http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/new_distillers/lst 
             
            Ken
            thank u chris ,im only using a sugar wash at the moment, and just flavoring my alcohol with comercail flavors ,so stripping flavors out is not a problem for me ,yet,so i might give a thumper a go i think,, thanks for your time chris
             
            garry

            Chris Alexander <tripcityusa@...> wrote:

            gary,

            my thumper was 25% of the still size. it worked great. in fact, i
            removed it as it stripped most of the fruit flavor out of the wash.
            liquor come out at 80%ABV. if going for flavor, plain pot still is
            the way to go, otherwise, a little extra effort and you can build a
            much more efficient reflux still.

            .....................................................Gringo Chris



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          • tigger bear
            Ken Grady wrote: Gday Garry,If you are keen to go with the thumper you can get an idea of a cheap way to start with one at the photo s
            Message 5 of 15 , Apr 24, 2003
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              Ken Grady <kengrady@...> wrote:
               
              Gday Garry,
              If you are keen to go with the thumper you can get an idea of a cheap way to start with one at the photo's section of this group at http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/new_distillers/lst 
               
              Ken
              thank u chris ,im only using a sugar wash at the moment, and just flavoring my alcohol with comercail flavors ,so stripping flavors out is not a problem for me ,yet,so i might give a thumper a go i think,, thanks for your time chris
               
              garry

              Chris Alexander <tripcityusa@...> wrote:

              gary,

              my thumper was 25% of the still size. it worked great. in fact, i
              removed it as it stripped most of the fruit flavor out of the wash.
              liquor come out at 80%ABV. if going for flavor, plain pot still is
              the way to go, otherwise, a little extra effort and you can build a
              much more efficient reflux still.

              .....................................................Gringo Chris



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            • Brandon Lee
              Just ran off the first batch of spirits using Alex s EL unit-- 2.5 copper column 48 high--uninsulated-- 15 gals. of wash-- electric heating-5500 and
              Message 6 of 15 , Apr 27, 2003
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                Just ran off the first batch of spirits using Alex's EL unit-- 2.5" copper column 48"high--uninsulated-- 15 gals. of wash-- electric heating-5500 and 1500watt-- both used until temp is raised then large one shut off-- instead of scrubbers- i cut small copper disk with with 13 quater inch holes each spaced approx 7.25 " apart with 7 used total-- to my supsrise the first batch came out at about 92%--output is about 1 quart per hour--
                this is the best ever--
                your brother in the  spirits
                Blueflame456

                Ken Grady <kengrady@...> wrote:
                 
                Gday Garry,
                If you are keen to go with the thumper you can get an idea of a cheap way to start with one at the photo's section of this group at http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/new_distillers/lst 
                 
                Ken
                thank u chris ,im only using a sugar wash at the moment, and just flavoring my alcohol with comercail flavors ,so stripping flavors out is not a problem for me ,yet,so i might give a thumper a go i think,, thanks for your time chris
                 
                garry

                Chris Alexander <tripcityusa@...> wrote:

                gary,

                my thumper was 25% of the still size. it worked great. in fact, i
                removed it as it stripped most of the fruit flavor out of the wash.
                liquor come out at 80%ABV. if going for flavor, plain pot still is
                the way to go, otherwise, a little extra effort and you can build a
                much more efficient reflux still.

                .....................................................Gringo Chris



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              • Harry
                Thumper Saturday, 4 July, 2009 4:43 PM From: treakle100 To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com Hello, I Have a pot still running with a
                Message 7 of 15 , Jul 4, 2009
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                  Thumper

                  Saturday, 4 July, 2009 4:43 PM
                  From:
                  "treakle100" <leehawkins44@...>
                  To:
                  Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                  Hello,

                  I Have a pot still running with a Thumper,the thumper was made of Glass, but disaster struck other day, when I went out to the shed I found the thumper jar/container was broken, cracked in several places,I wasn't running the still, I just had a mix of cleaning fluid I made up, couple liters of Vinegar and lemon juice, I don't know why it broke, all I can think of is the temperature in my shed, outside it was 85 degrees 'fahrenheit' that day, in my shed would of been quite a bit Higher, I don't really know what happened, the lid was on loosely no pressure at all in the jar,
                  So now I need to decide if it's worth using a thumper at all, does it make that much difference not running one, any thoughts on this would be appreciated, I know it get you a better concentration of Alcohol on a run, I dont know what to decide really.

                  Thanks       



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                • jamesonbeam1
                  Hello Treakle, Yes, glass is pretty fragile when used in distilling. I ve played with thumpers, but was put off by the back pressures generated. However,
                  Message 8 of 15 , Jul 5, 2009
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                    Hello Treakle,

                    Yes, glass is pretty fragile when used in distilling.  I've played with thumpers, but was put off by the back pressures generated.  However, they are a good idea since they add an additional theoretical plate to your pot still and can save an additional run.  These may also be used to put your flavorings in for gins or flavored rums, etc.

                    Instead of glass, you can try using a small stock pot, or even a small SS paint can (new of course).  Heres a pict of a metal thumper:

                    Thumper/Doubler - 10 L (21/2gal) paint container, with rubber grommets for copper tubing.

                     

                    Some good info is  in Tony's Homedistiller site at: http://homedistiller.org/designs.htm#thumper
                     
                    Vino es Veritas,
                    Jim aka Waldo.
                     
                    --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Harry <gnikomson2000@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hello,
                    >
                    > I Have a pot still running with a Thumper,the thumper was made of Glass, but disaster struck other day, when I went out to the shed I found the thumper jar/container was broken, cracked in several places,I wasn't running the still, I just had a mix of cleaning fluid I made up, couple liters of Vinegar and lemon juice, I don't know why it broke, all I can think of is the temperature in my shed, outside it was 85 degrees 'fahrenheit' that day, in my shed would of been quite a bit Higher, I don't really know what happened, the lid was on loosely no pressure at all in the jar,
                    > So now I need to decide if it's worth using a thumper at all, does it make that much difference not running one, any thoughts on this would be appreciated, I know it get you a better concentration of Alcohol on a run, I dont know what to decide really.
                    >
                    > Thanks       
                  • Robert Hubble
                    Jim, I don t think I ve ever seen a stainless paint can. How does one come by one? Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com From:
                    Message 9 of 15 , Jul 5, 2009
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                      Jim,

                      I don't think I've ever seen a stainless paint can. How does one come by one?

                      Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller




                      To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                      From: jamesonbeam1@...
                      Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 22:33:15 +0000
                      Subject: [Distillers] Re: Thumper




                      Hello Treakle,
                      Yes, glass is pretty fragile when used in distilling.  I've played with thumpers, but was put off by the back pressures generated.  However, they are a good idea since they add an additional theoretical plate to your pot still and can save an additional run.  These may also be used to put your flavorings in for gins or flavored rums, etc.
                      Instead of glass, you can try using a small stock pot, or even a small SS paint can (new of course).  Heres a pict of a metal thumper.
                      -----snip------


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                    • jamesonbeam1
                      Hey ZB, You can get them in speciality paint stores or many places on the internet - heres one:
                      Message 10 of 15 , Jul 5, 2009
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                        Hey ZB,

                        You can get them in speciality paint stores or many places on the internet - heres one: http://www.thecarycompany.com/containers/main/metal_containers.html

                        Vino es Veritas,

                        Jim aka Waldo.

                        The Cary Company - Packaging & Equipment DivisionHOMEPRODUCTSORDERSAMPLESPRICINGContact Us


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                        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Robert Hubble <zymurgybob@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > Jim,
                        >
                        > I don't think I've ever seen a stainless paint can. How does one come by one?
                        >
                        > Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller

                      • tykjaw
                        Horses for courses, yes they are worth using or else people wouldn t use them, it s a case of what suits your needs the best, they increase the strength of the
                        Message 11 of 15 , Jul 5, 2009
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                          Horses for courses, yes they are worth using or else people wouldn't use them, it's a case of what suits your needs the best, they increase the strength of the output but if you are chasing ultimate purity then you have to be looking at reflux

                          Thumpers are also known as doublers, the overall effect on a run is effectively the same as starting with a wash of double the strength

                          There is an excellent program for download on homedistiller.org called thumper.xls by Tony Ackland whereby you can vary the size of the thumper and strength of the wash and thumper content and see the effect on output

                          A short simple column, uninsulated with a few scrubbers for packing will also give the same effect with less hassle, 300mm or so with 2 or 3 scrubbers is going to be somewhere in the ball park of a thumper, experiment



                          >
                          > Hello,
                          >
                          > I Have a pot still running with a Thumper,the thumper was made of Glass, but disaster struck other day, when I went out to the shed I found the thumper jar/container was broken, cracked in several places,I wasn't running the still, I just had a mix of cleaning fluid I made up, couple liters of Vinegar and lemon juice, I don't know why it broke, all I can think of is the temperature in my shed, outside it was 85 degrees 'fahrenheit' that day, in my shed would of been quite a bit Higher, I don't really know what happened, the lid was on loosely no pressure at all in the jar,
                          > So now I need to decide if it's worth using a thumper at all, does it make that much difference not running one, any thoughts on this would be appreciated, I know it get you a better concentration of Alcohol on a run, I dont know what to decide really.
                          >
                          > Thanks       
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > ____________________________________________________________________________________
                          > Access Yahoo!7 Mail on your mobile. Anytime. Anywhere.
                          > Show me how: http://au.mobile.yahoo.com/mail
                          >
                        • Robert Hubble
                          Thanks a bunch, Jim Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com From: jamesonbeam1@yahoo.com Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 00:44:26 +0000 Subject:
                          Message 12 of 15 , Jul 5, 2009
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                            Thanks a bunch, Jim

                            Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller




                            To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                            From: jamesonbeam1@...
                            Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 00:44:26 +0000
                            Subject: [Distillers] Re: Thumper

                            Hey ZB,
                            You can get them in speciality paint stores or many places on the internet - heres one: http://www.thecaryc ompany.com/ containers/ main/metal_ containers. html
                            Vino es Veritas,
                            Jim aka Waldo.





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                          • treakle100
                            Hello James That s a nice little set up you have there, I know other people use Glass for their thumpers, with no trouble,or I haven t heard anybody say that
                            Message 13 of 15 , Jul 9, 2009
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                              Hello James

                              That's a nice little set up you have there, I know other people use Glass for their thumpers, with no trouble,or I haven't heard anybody say that they have, I don't think that I will be using glass again, I think I will go with your Idea of the paint tin, I think they are paint Mixing containers, I will have to have alook around see whats out there.
                              Thanks




                              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "jamesonbeam1" <jamesonbeam1@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > Hello Treakle,
                              >
                              > Yes, glass is pretty fragile when used in distilling. I've played with
                              > thumpers, but was put off by the back pressures generated. However,
                              > they are a good idea since they add an additional theoretical plate to
                              > your pot still and can save an additional run. These may also be used
                              > to put your flavorings in for gins or flavored rums, etc.
                              >
                              > Instead of glass, you can try using a small stock pot, or even a small
                              > SS paint can (new of course). Heres a pict of a metal thumper:
                              >
                              > Thumper/Doubler - 10 L (21/2gal) paint container, with rubber grommets
                              > for copper tubing.
                              >
                              > Some good info is in Tony's Homedistiller site at:
                              > http://homedistiller.org/designs.htm#thumper
                              > <http://homedistiller.org/designs.htm#thumper> Vino es Veritas, Jim
                              > aka Waldo. --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Harry
                              > <gnikomson2000@> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > Hello,
                              > >
                              > > I Have a pot still running with a Thumper,the thumper was made of
                              > Glass, but disaster struck other day, when I went out to the shed I
                              > found the thumper jar/container was broken, cracked in several places,I
                              > wasn't running the still, I just had a mix of cleaning fluid I made up,
                              > couple liters of Vinegar and lemon juice, I don't know why it broke, all
                              > I can think of is the temperature in my shed, outside it was 85 degrees
                              > 'fahrenheit' that day, in my shed would of been quite a bit Higher, I
                              > don't really know what happened, the lid was on loosely no pressure at
                              > all in the jar,
                              > > So now I need to decide if it's worth using a thumper at all, does it
                              > make that much difference not running one, any thoughts on this would be
                              > appreciated, I know it get you a better concentration of Alcohol on a
                              > run, I dont know what to decide really.
                              > >
                              > > Thanks
                              >
                            • treakle100
                              Hello Tykjaw Thanks for the Reply, I am quite experienced in column distillation (you can check out my old column still if you like, in photos under lee s
                              Message 14 of 15 , Jul 9, 2009
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                                Hello Tykjaw

                                Thanks for the Reply,

                                I am quite experienced in column distillation (you can check out my old column still if you like, in photos under lee's copper still, second page in) but I do not have much experience with pot stills and the use of thumpers, column stills IMO is not the way to do pot still spirits, like Brandy whisky or say heavy rum, proper rum that is, I asked for the advice regarding using thumpers or not, because on the HD forum there are experienced distillers on there that don't use thumpers on their pot stills, so thought I would gauge opinions on here, I have decided I will use a thumper, but definitely not Glass, no, recon too dangerous.
                                Thanks




                                --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "tykjaw" <tykjaw@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Horses for courses, yes they are worth using or else people wouldn't use them, it's a case of what suits your needs the best, they increase the strength of the output but if you are chasing ultimate purity then you have to be looking at reflux
                                >
                                > Thumpers are also known as doublers, the overall effect on a run is effectively the same as starting with a wash of double the strength
                                >
                                > There is an excellent program for download on homedistiller.org called thumper.xls by Tony Ackland whereby you can vary the size of the thumper and strength of the wash and thumper content and see the effect on output
                                >
                                > A short simple column, uninsulated with a few scrubbers for packing will also give the same effect with less hassle, 300mm or so with 2 or 3 scrubbers is going to be somewhere in the ball park of a thumper, experiment
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > >
                                > > Hello,
                                > >
                                > > I Have a pot still running with a Thumper,the thumper was made of Glass, but disaster struck other day, when I went out to the shed I found the thumper jar/container was broken, cracked in several places,I wasn't running the still, I just had a mix of cleaning fluid I made up, couple liters of Vinegar and lemon juice, I don't know why it broke, all I can think of is the temperature in my shed, outside it was 85 degrees 'fahrenheit' that day, in my shed would of been quite a bit Higher, I don't really know what happened, the lid was on loosely no pressure at all in the jar,
                                > > So now I need to decide if it's worth using a thumper at all, does it make that much difference not running one, any thoughts on this would be appreciated, I know it get you a better concentration of Alcohol on a run, I dont know what to decide really.
                                > >
                                > > Thanks       
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > ____________________________________________________________________________________
                                > > Access Yahoo!7 Mail on your mobile. Anytime. Anywhere.
                                > > Show me how: http://au.mobile.yahoo.com/mail
                                > >
                                >
                              • tykjaw
                                hi treakle well if you are after fuller flavours then pot still with no thumper would be my preference also, its less messing and you are not going to lose any
                                Message 15 of 15 , Jul 9, 2009
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                                  hi treakle

                                  well if you are after fuller flavours then pot still with no thumper would be my preference also, its less messing and you are not going to lose any flavour

                                  cheers
                                  tyk

                                  --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "treakle100" <leehawkins44@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Hello Tykjaw
                                  >
                                  > Thanks for the Reply,
                                  >
                                  > I am quite experienced in column distillation (you can check out my old column still if you like, in photos under lee's copper still, second page in) but I do not have much experience with pot stills and the use of thumpers, column stills IMO is not the way to do pot still spirits, like Brandy whisky or say heavy rum, proper rum that is, I asked for the advice regarding using thumpers or not, because on the HD forum there are experienced distillers on there that don't use thumpers on their pot stills, so thought I would gauge opinions on here, I have decided I will use a thumper, but definitely not Glass, no, recon too dangerous.
                                  > Thanks
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "tykjaw" <tykjaw@> wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > Horses for courses, yes they are worth using or else people wouldn't use them, it's a case of what suits your needs the best, they increase the strength of the output but if you are chasing ultimate purity then you have to be looking at reflux
                                  > >
                                  > > Thumpers are also known as doublers, the overall effect on a run is effectively the same as starting with a wash of double the strength
                                  > >
                                  > > There is an excellent program for download on homedistiller.org called thumper.xls by Tony Ackland whereby you can vary the size of the thumper and strength of the wash and thumper content and see the effect on output
                                  > >
                                  > > A short simple column, uninsulated with a few scrubbers for packing will also give the same effect with less hassle, 300mm or so with 2 or 3 scrubbers is going to be somewhere in the ball park of a thumper, experiment
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > Hello,
                                  > > >
                                  > > > I Have a pot still running with a Thumper,the thumper was made of Glass, but disaster struck other day, when I went out to the shed I found the thumper jar/container was broken, cracked in several places,I wasn't running the still, I just had a mix of cleaning fluid I made up, couple liters of Vinegar and lemon juice, I don't know why it broke, all I can think of is the temperature in my shed, outside it was 85 degrees 'fahrenheit' that day, in my shed would of been quite a bit Higher, I don't really know what happened, the lid was on loosely no pressure at all in the jar,
                                  > > > So now I need to decide if it's worth using a thumper at all, does it make that much difference not running one, any thoughts on this would be appreciated, I know it get you a better concentration of Alcohol on a run, I dont know what to decide really.
                                  > > >
                                  > > > Thanks       
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
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                                  > > >
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