Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: 100 mm (4") Diam. Column

Expand Messages
  • fred_onion <sambucca@nzoomail.com>
    Hi Robert, If you get the extended column that is available with your still, it will increase the performance and alc%. Mikes comment regarding the path of the
    Message 1 of 10 , Jan 3, 2003
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi Robert,

      If you get the extended column that is available with your still, it
      will increase the performance and alc%.

      Mikes comment regarding the path of the vapour condensing back into
      the boiler is quite correct from my observations.

      To help overcome this when teasing out the scrubbers, I take
      particular care to ensure there are no gaps in the SS media at the
      sides of the column. I also use scrubbers in tandum with the marbles,
      which allows pockets of vapour up the still to develop, and seems to
      assist the still performance. (A layering effect)

      Fred

      --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Robert Stam <Robert.Stam@b...>
      wrote:
      > Hi Mike, greetings for the new year.
      >
      > I have a few ideas for plates. That reminds me of the viewing ports
      in those
      > German stills we got documentation on. I believe that they would be
      for
      > checking the condensate fluid levels in each tray, since the level
      is
      > adjustable with an overflow pipe.
      >
      > Cheers, Rob
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: Mike Nixon [mailto:mike@s...]
      > Sent: Friday, 3 January 2003 9:15 a.m.
      > To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: Re: [Distillers] 100 mm (4") Diam. Column
      >
      >
      > Robert Stam wrote:
      > Subject: [Distillers] 100 mm (4") Diam. Column
      >
      > Mike Nixon/Mike McCaw mention channelling in wide diameter columns
      and the
      > need for spreaders. Do you mean like plates with perforations for
      vapour to
      > come up and reflux to drip down, placed at intervals?
      > ===================================
      > Hi Rob. A very happy New Year to you too!
      >
      > We have noticed that the wider a column, the greater the tendency
      is for
      > liquid reflux to form 'preferred' paths back down through the
      packing. Once
      > these are established, the reflux zips down rapidly back to the
      boiler and
      > therefore takes no part in the reboiling that we want. It seems to
      be a bit
      > like 'choking', but without the blockage that 'choking'
      produces ... in
      > fact, quite the opposite.
      >
      > Shaped packing is apparently designed in all its wierd and
      wonderful shapes
      > to try and counter this, and I'm sure they have managed to overcome
      it to
      > some degree. However, once a column gets too big, trays become the
      norm in
      > order to manage the reflux flow. Perforated plates set in the
      packing at
      > intervals might help a bit to discourage this 'channelling', but
      the snag is
      > that they might also introduce greater impedance to vapor flow if
      the holes
      > are too small. However, this is something you might like to
      explore, as
      > that is just an 'uneducated guess'. If you do try some
      experiments, I'm
      > sure we would all be eager to learn what you find.
      >
      > Cheers!
      > Mike N
      >
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
      >
      > ADVERTISEMENT
      >
      >
      <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupweb/S=17
      050416
      >
      94:HM/A=1327985/R=0/*http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;4870024;7586687;x?
      http://
      > www.ameriquestmortgage.com/welcome.html?ad=Yahoo01>
      >
      > <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?
      M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupmai
      > l/S=:HM/A=1327985/rand=181977903>
      >
      > To unsubscribe from this group send an email to
      > distillers-unsubscribe@onelist.com
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
      > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Service.
      >
      >
      > Notice of Legal Status and Confidential Information: This
      electronic mail
      > message and any accompanying attachments may contain information
      that is
      > privileged and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the intended recipient
      you are
      > advised that any use, review, dissemination, distribution or
      reproduction of
      > the information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you
      have
      > received this document in error, please notify the sender
      immediately and
      > destroy the message.
    • BOKAKOB
      Hey, Rob! I think if you extend the column a little more, making the total height of at least 3.5 feet (or 1.067 meters), the spirit will come out close to
      Message 2 of 10 , Jan 3, 2003
      • 0 Attachment

        Hey, Rob! I think if you extend the column a little more, making the total height of at least 3.5 feet (or 1.067 meters), the spirit will come out close to 92-95% depending how "fast" you run your still. I am not sure about the width though. It seems 4inches (10 cm) diameter is a little disproportional judging all data available. I think it will still work fine, but it would constitute to waste of material in my opinion.

         Robert Stam <Robert.Stam@...> wrote:

        Hi all... happy new year!
        I have a Duplast still with a 330 mm (1') high, 100 mm (4") wide column. I have replaced the marbles that it came with, with SS scrubbers, added a triac controlled power regulator for the 1500W element. The output is still pretty marginal at 65% abv. I figure the next thing to do is extend the column by another 1m (3'),
        giving 1.3m (4') overall. How does that sound? Does the column need to be longer since it is so wide?
        Mike Nixon/Mike McCaw mention channelling in wide diameter columns and the need for spreaders. Do you mean like plates with perforations for vapour to
        come up and reflux to drip down, placed at intervals?
        Cheers, Rob


        I can be wrong I must say.
        Cheers, Alex...



        Do you Yahoo!?
        New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!

      • Robert Stam
        Thanks for your reply Fred. I take it that you have one of these Duplast stills? What sort of %abv do you get out of it with the extended column? Cheers, Rob
        Message 3 of 10 , Jan 5, 2003
        • 0 Attachment
          Thanks for your reply Fred. I take it that you have one of these Duplast stills? What sort of %abv do you get out of it with the extended column?
           
          Cheers, Rob
          -----Original Message-----
          From: fred_onion <sambucca@...> [mailto:sambucca@...]
          Sent: Saturday, 4 January 2003 12:02 a.m.
          To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [Distillers] Re: 100 mm (4") Diam. Column

          Hi Robert,

          If you get the extended column that is available with your still, it
          will increase the performance and alc%.

          Mikes comment regarding the path of the vapour condensing back into
          the boiler is quite correct from my observations.

          To help overcome this when teasing out the scrubbers, I take
          particular care to ensure there are no gaps in the SS media at the
          sides of the column. I also use scrubbers in tandum with the marbles,
          which allows pockets of vapour up the still to develop, and seems to
          assist the still performance. (A layering effect)

          Fred

          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Robert Stam <Robert.Stam@b...>
          wrote:
          > Hi Mike, greetings for the new year.

          > I have a few ideas for plates. That reminds me of the viewing ports
          in those
          > German stills we got documentation on. I believe that they would be
          for
          > checking the condensate fluid levels in each tray, since the level
          is
          > adjustable with an overflow pipe.

          > Cheers, Rob
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: Mike Nixon [mailto:mike@s...]
          > Sent: Friday, 3 January 2003 9:15 a.m.
          > To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [Distillers] 100 mm (4") Diam. Column
          >
          >
          > Robert Stam wrote:
          > Subject: [Distillers] 100 mm (4") Diam. Column
          >
          > Mike Nixon/Mike McCaw mention channelling in wide diameter columns
          and the
          > need for spreaders. Do you mean like plates with perforations for
          vapour to
          > come up and reflux to drip down, placed at intervals?
          > ===================================
          > Hi Rob.  A very happy New Year to you too!

          > We have noticed that the wider a column, the greater the tendency
          is for
          > liquid reflux to form 'preferred' paths back down through the
          packing.  Once
          > these are established, the reflux zips down rapidly back to the
          boiler and
          > therefore takes no part in the reboiling that we want.  It seems to
          be a bit
          > like 'choking', but without the blockage that 'choking'
          produces ... in
          > fact, quite the opposite.

          > Shaped packing is apparently designed in all its wierd and
          wonderful shapes
          > to try and counter this, and I'm sure they have managed to overcome
          it to
          > some degree.  However, once a column gets too big, trays become the
          norm in
          > order to manage the reflux flow.  Perforated plates set in the
          packing at
          > intervals might help a bit to discourage this 'channelling', but
          the snag is
          > that they might also introduce greater impedance to vapor flow if
          the holes
          > are too small.  However, this is something you might like to
          explore, as
          > that is just an 'uneducated guess'.  If you do try some
          experiments, I'm
          > sure we would all be eager to learn what you find.

          > Cheers!
          > Mike N

          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor     
          >
          > ADVERTISEMENT

          >
          <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupweb/S=17
          050416
          >
          94:HM/A=1327985/R=0/*http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;4870024;7586687;x?
          http://
          > www.ameriquestmortgage.com/welcome.html?ad=Yahoo01>      

          > <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?
          M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupmai
          > l/S=:HM/A=1327985/rand=181977903>      
          >
          > To unsubscribe from this group send an email to
          > distillers-unsubscribe@onelist.com
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
          > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Service.
          >
          >
          > Notice of Legal Status and Confidential Information: This
          electronic mail
          > message and any accompanying attachments may contain information
          that is
          > privileged and CONFIDENTIAL.  If you are not the intended recipient
          you are
          > advised that any use, review, dissemination, distribution or
          reproduction of
          > the information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you
          have
          > received this document in error, please notify the sender
          immediately and
          > destroy the message.



          To unsubscribe from this group send an email to  distillers-unsubscribe@onelist.com

          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

          Notice of Legal Status and Confidential Information: This electronic mail message and any accompanying attachments may contain information that is privileged and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the intended recipient you are advised that any use, review, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of the information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this document in error, please notify the sender immediately and destroy the message.

        • Robert Stam
          Hi Alex... the original column is 100mm, so I thought to just extend it at the same diam. I could put a reducer on it down to 50/75mm. Cheers, Rob ... From:
          Message 4 of 10 , Jan 5, 2003
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi Alex...
             
            the original column is 100mm, so I thought to just extend it at the same diam. I could put a reducer on it down to 50/75mm.
             
            Cheers, Rob
            -----Original Message-----
            From: BOKAKOB [mailto:bokakob@...]
            Sent: Saturday, 4 January 2003 2:11 a.m.
            To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [Distillers] 100 mm (4") Diam. Column

            Hey, Rob! I think if you extend the column a little more, making the total height of at least 3.5 feet (or 1.067 meters), the spirit will come out close to 92-95% depending how "fast" you run your still. I am not sure about the width though. It seems 4inches (10 cm) diameter is a little disproportional judging all data available. I think it will still work fine, but it would constitute to waste of material in my opinion.

             Robert Stam <Robert.Stam@...> wrote:

            Hi all... happy new year!
            I have a Duplast still with a 330 mm (1') high, 100 mm (4") wide column. I have replaced the marbles that it came with, with SS scrubbers, added a triac controlled power regulator for the 1500W element. The output is still pretty marginal at 65% abv. I figure the next thing to do is extend the column by another 1m (3'),
            giving 1.3m (4') overall. How does that sound? Does the column need to be longer since it is so wide?
            Mike Nixon/Mike McCaw mention channelling in wide diameter columns and the need for spreaders. Do you mean like plates with perforations for vapour to
            come up and reflux to drip down, placed at intervals?
            Cheers, Rob


            I can be wrong I must say.
            Cheers, Alex...



            Do you Yahoo!?
            New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!

            To unsubscribe from this group send an email to  distillers-unsubscribe@onelist.com

            Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

            Notice of Legal Status and Confidential Information: This electronic mail message and any accompanying attachments may contain information that is privileged and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the intended recipient you are advised that any use, review, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of the information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this document in error, please notify the sender immediately and destroy the message.

          • Ackland, Tony (CALNZAS)
            ... You ll need to keep it at 100mm if you are going to keep the marbles in there. Marbles only have about 33% voidage around them, so in order to give enough
            Message 5 of 10 , Jan 5, 2003
            • 0 Attachment
              > the original column is 100mm, so I thought to just extend it at the same diam. I could put a reducer on it down to 50/75mm.

              You'll need to keep it at 100mm if you are going to keep the marbles in there. Marbles only have about 33% voidage around them, so in order to give enough area for the vapour & liquid to get past, you need a wider diameter than if only using scrubbers (which have about 95% voidage). A narrow column filled with marbles is a recipe for column flooding.

              Tony
            • Robert Stam
              Hi Tony... I have replaced the marbles with SS scrubbers in the current (330mm x 100mm) column. Cheers, Rob ... From: Ackland, Tony (CALNZAS)
              Message 6 of 10 , Jan 5, 2003
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi Tony...
                 
                I have replaced the marbles with SS scrubbers in the current (330mm x 100mm)  column.
                 
                Cheers, Rob
                -----Original Message-----
                From: Ackland, Tony (CALNZAS) [mailto:Tony.Ackland@...]
                Sent: Monday, 6 January 2003 10:36 a.m.
                To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [Distillers] 100 mm (4") Diam. Column

                > the original column is 100mm, so I thought to just extend it at the same diam. I could put a reducer on it down to 50/75mm.

                You'll need to keep it at 100mm if you are going to keep the marbles in there.  Marbles only have about 33% voidage around them, so in order to give enough area for the vapour & liquid to get past, you need a wider diameter than if only using scrubbers (which have about 95% voidage).  A narrow column filled with marbles is a recipe for column flooding.

                Tony


                To unsubscribe from this group send an email to  distillers-unsubscribe@onelist.com

                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

                Notice of Legal Status and Confidential Information: This electronic mail message and any accompanying attachments may contain information that is privileged and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the intended recipient you are advised that any use, review, dissemination, distribution or reproduction of the information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this document in error, please notify the sender immediately and destroy the message.

              • williejohnc <wpcarlton@xtra.co.nz>
                ... ...
                Message 7 of 10 , Jan 5, 2003
                • 0 Attachment
                  --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Robert Stam <Robert.Stam@b...> wrote:
                  > Thanks for your reply Fred. I take it that you have one of these Duplast
                  > stills? What sort of %abv do you get out of it with the extended column?
                  >
                  > Cheers, Rob
                  >
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: fred_onion <sambucca@n...> [mailto:sambucca@n...]
                  > Sent: Saturday, 4 January 2003 12:02 a.m.
                  > To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: [Distillers] Re: 100 mm (4") Diam. Column
                  >
                  >
                  > Hi Robert,
                  >
                  > If you get the extended column that is available with your still, it
                  > will increase the performance and alc%.
                  >
                  > Mikes comment regarding the path of the vapour condensing back into
                  > the boiler is quite correct from my observations.
                  >
                  > To help overcome this when teasing out the scrubbers, I take
                  > particular care to ensure there are no gaps in the SS media at the
                  > sides of the column. I also use scrubbers in tandum with the marbles,
                  > which allows pockets of vapour up the still to develop, and seems to
                  > assist the still performance. (A layering effect)
                  >
                  > Fred
                  >
                  > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Robert Stam <Robert.Stam@b...>
                  > wrote:
                  > > Hi Mike, greetings for the new year.
                  > >
                  > > I have a few ideas for plates. That reminds me of the viewing ports
                  > in those
                  > > German stills we got documentation on. I believe that they would be
                  > for
                  > > checking the condensate fluid levels in each tray, since the level
                  > is
                  > > adjustable with an overflow pipe.
                  > >
                  > > Cheers, Rob
                  > >
                  > > -----Original Message-----
                  > > From: Mike Nixon [mailto:mike@s...]
                  > > Sent: Friday, 3 January 2003 9:15 a.m.
                  > > To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                  > > Subject: Re: [Distillers] 100 mm (4") Diam. Column
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Robert Stam wrote:
                  > > Subject: [Distillers] 100 mm (4") Diam. Column
                  > >
                  > > Mike Nixon/Mike McCaw mention channelling in wide diameter columns
                  > and the
                  > > need for spreaders. Do you mean like plates with perforations for
                  > vapour to
                  > > come up and reflux to drip down, placed at intervals?
                  > > ===================================
                  > > Hi Rob. A very happy New Year to you too!
                  > >
                  > > We have noticed that the wider a column, the greater the tendency
                  > is for
                  > > liquid reflux to form 'preferred' paths back down through the
                  > packing. Once
                  > > these are established, the reflux zips down rapidly back to the
                  > boiler and
                  > > therefore takes no part in the reboiling that we want. It seems to
                  > be a bit
                  > > like 'choking', but without the blockage that 'choking'
                  > produces ... in
                  > > fact, quite the opposite.
                  > >
                  > > Shaped packing is apparently designed in all its wierd and
                  > wonderful shapes
                  > > to try and counter this, and I'm sure they have managed to overcome
                  > it to
                  > > some degree. However, once a column gets too big, trays become the
                  > norm in
                  > > order to manage the reflux flow. Perforated plates set in the
                  > packing at
                  > > intervals might help a bit to discourage this 'channelling', but
                  > the snag is
                  > > that they might also introduce greater impedance to vapor flow if
                  > the holes
                  > > are too small. However, this is something you might like to
                  > explore, as
                  > > that is just an 'uneducated guess'. If you do try some
                  > experiments, I'm
                  > > sure we would all be eager to learn what you find.
                  > >
                  > > Cheers!
                  > > Mike N
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  > >
                  > > ADVERTISEMENT
                  > >
                  > >
                  > < http://rd.yahoo.com/M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupweb/S=17
                  > <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupweb/S=17>
                  > 050416
                  > >
                  > 94:HM/A=1327985/R=0/* http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;4870024;7586687;x?
                  > <http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;4870024;7586687;x?>
                  > http:// <http://>
                  > > www.ameriquestmortgage.com/welcome.html?ad=Yahoo01>
                  > >
                  > > < http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l? <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?>
                  > M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupmai
                  > > l/S=:HM/A=1327985/rand=181977903>
                  > >
                  > > To unsubscribe from this group send an email to
                  > > distillers-unsubscribe@onelist.com
                  > >
                  > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                  > > < http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> >
                  > Service.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Notice of Legal Status and Confidential Information: This
                  > electronic mail
                  > > message and any accompanying attachments may contain information
                  > that is
                  > > privileged and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the intended recipient
                  > you are
                  > > advised that any use, review, dissemination, distribution or
                  > reproduction of
                  > > the information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you
                  > have
                  > > received this document in error, please notify the sender
                  > immediately and
                  > > destroy the message.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  >
                  > ADVERTISEMENT
                  >
                  >
                  <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupweb/S=17050416
                  >
                  94:HM/A=1327985/R=0/*http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;4870024;7586687;x?http://
                  > www.ameriquestmortgage.com/welcome.html?ad=Yahoo01>
                  >
                  >
                  <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?M=234081.2814790.4175286.1925585/D=egroupmai
                  > l/S=:HM/A=1327985/rand=608465514>
                  >
                  > To unsubscribe from this group send an email to
                  > distillers-unsubscribe@onelist.com
                  >
                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                  > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Service.
                  >
                  >
                  > Notice of Legal Status and Confidential Information: This electronic
                  mail
                  > message and any accompanying attachments may contain information that is
                  > privileged and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the intended recipient
                  you are
                  > advised that any use, review, dissemination, distribution or
                  reproduction of
                  > the information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have
                  > received this document in error, please notify the sender
                  immediately and
                  > destroy the message.

                  Robert,
                  I run a Duplast Still with extended column (700mm) and have put
                  approx. 250litres of wash thru it in 25 litre batches. Boiler is
                  supplied 25litre plastic barrel with element fitted. (power unknown,
                  suspect 800 watts)
                  Column currently has the supplied marbles (plastic balls) but I am
                  going to try some layered SS scrubbers within the balls. I suspect
                  there may be some tracking.
                  Pleased with results to date however.
                  From switch on at wall, 5 hours to complete the run.
                  Dispose of first 100 mls of distillate to the lawnmower (it's now got
                  a mind of its own. )
                  I run the still and maintain 79.5 - 90.0 C in the head, by contolling
                  the water flow to the reflux coil.
                  No control is needed in the boiler.
                  I collect until I can no longer hold 81 - 82 C in the head.
                  Results vary between 89 - 91% ABV.
                  Spirit is good but I think I can improve. Some runs produce a spirit
                  with a nail polish odour which I don't care for. This is removed
                  mostly by carbon over 3 days. Suspect I am collecting too much tails
                  or tracking in the column.
                  As I produce this for flavouring with a rum essence, it is not
                  noticeable. However when I give the broken down spirit to my son who
                  is a vodka fanatic, he takes a sip and says "keep trying".
                  Looking forward to making one of Alex's designs for comparison.
                  Hope this helps.
                  Bill C.
                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.