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  • c2h5oh_x
    Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. I had plenty of reading for tonight. Molecular Sieve is definitely the easiest way to get that last bit of
    Message 1 of 6 , Dec 4, 2002
      Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. I had plenty of
      reading for tonight.

      Molecular Sieve is definitely the easiest way to get that last bit of
      water out of regularly distilled ethanol. The process, for those
      unfamiliar with it, is similar to carbon treating. Just throw the
      molecular sieve material, which is in the form of small 3-5mm
      pellets, into the ethanol and let it soak. Molecular Sieve can absorb
      up to about 20% of its weight in water. Strain the ethanol to get the
      pellets out. The Molecular Sieve can be reused just like activated
      carbon. Place the Sieve material in the oven to drive the water out.
      Very low tech. The high tech is in the material, but as end-users, we
      don't have to worry about all that.

      Regarding ethanol as motor fuel, I'm sure that converting a fuel
      injected car would be pretty straight forward. My question really had
      to do with experience. Is there anyone here who is actually doing it?
      Running a car on ethanol? I want more anecdotal input on the
      experience. The performance potential of ethanol fuel is even more
      compelling to me then the already compelling renewability and other
      benefits.

      Oversized injectors and pumps are quite common for hot-rodding most
      cars. Getting the fuel flow up to the "20-30 percent more" required
      for ethanol should be a simple matter. It occurred to me that one
      could also turbo or supercharge an ethanol converted car to take
      advantage of ethanol's higher octane and lower combustion
      temperatures. Running 180 proof is like water injection, but with the
      water built right into the fuel!

      -CX
    • BOKAKOB
      Is this your cover in case you get picked up? c2h5oh_x wrote:Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. I had plenty of reading for
      Message 2 of 6 , Dec 4, 2002

        Is this your cover in case you get picked up?

         c2h5oh_x <c2h5oh_x@...> wrote:

        Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. I had plenty of
        reading for tonight.

        Molecular Sieve is definitely the easiest way to get that last bit of
        water out of regularly distilled ethanol. The process, for those
        unfamiliar with it, is similar to carbon treating. Just throw the
        molecular sieve material, which is in the form of small 3-5mm
        pellets, into the ethanol and let it soak. Molecular Sieve can absorb
        up to about 20% of its weight in water. Strain the ethanol to get the
        pellets out. The Molecular Sieve can be reused just like activated
        carbon. Place the Sieve material in the oven to drive the water out.
        Very low tech. The high tech is in the material, but as end-users, we
        don't have to worry about all that.

        Regarding ethanol as motor fuel, I'm sure that converting a fuel
        injected car would be pretty straight forward. My question really had
        to do with experience. Is there anyone here who is actually doing it?
        Running a car on ethanol? I want more anecdotal input on the
        experience. The performance potential of ethanol fuel is even more
        compelling to me then the already compelling renewability and other
        benefits.

        Oversized injectors and pumps are quite common for hot-rodding most
        cars. Getting the fuel flow up to the "20-30 percent more" required
        for ethanol should be a simple matter. It occurred to me that one
        could also turbo or supercharge an ethanol converted car to take
        advantage of ethanol's higher octane and lower combustion
        temperatures. Running 180 proof is like water injection, but with the
        water built right into the fuel!

        -CX



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        Cheers, Alex...



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      • Keith Addison
        How To Modify Your Car To Run On Alcohol Fuel: Guidelines for converting gasoline engines (With Specific Instructions for Air-Cooled Volkswagens) by Roger
        Message 3 of 6 , Dec 4, 2002
          How To Modify Your Car To Run On Alcohol Fuel: "Guidelines for
          converting gasoline engines (With Specific Instructions for
          Air-Cooled Volkswagens)" by Roger Lippman, April 1982 -- Five-chapter
          online book:
          http://terrasol.home.igc.org/alky/alky.htm

          How to modify an injection system: It's Toyota-specific, but applies
          to most electronic fuel injection systems.
          http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Pit/9975/dataBySubject/EFImods.html

          Alcohol as an Engine Fuel -- Mother Earth Alcohol Fuel Manual. Biofuels Library
          http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_motherearth/me1.html

          How To Adapt Your Automobile Engine For Ethyl Alcohol Use -- Mother
          Earth Alcohol Fuel Manual. Biofuels Library
          http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_motherearth/me2.html

          Ron Novak's Do-It-Yourself Water Injection System -- Mother Earth
          Alcohol Fuel Manual. Biofuels Library
          http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_motherearth/me3.html

          The Manual for the Home and Farm Production of Alcohol Fuel
          http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_manual/manual_ToC.html

          Chapter 1 AN OVERVIEW
          Alcohol Fuel
          Uses of Alcohol Fuel
          Other Alternative Fuels
          http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_manual/manual1-2.html

          Chapter 2 BASIC FUEL THEORY
          Chemical Composition
          Combustion Properties
          Volatility
          Octane Ratings
          Water Injection
          Exhaust Composition
          Engine Performance - Straight Alcohol
          Engine Performance - Alcohol Blends
          http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_manual/manual1-2.html#ch2

          Chapter 3 UTILIZATION OF ALCOHOL FUELS
          Methods of Utilization
          Alcohol Blends
          Pure Alcohol
          Diesel Engines
          Engine Modification
          Alcohol Injection
          http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_manual/manual3.html


          >Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. I had plenty of
          >reading for tonight.
          >
          >Molecular Sieve is definitely the easiest way to get that last bit of
          >water out of regularly distilled ethanol. The process, for those
          >unfamiliar with it, is similar to carbon treating. Just throw the
          >molecular sieve material, which is in the form of small 3-5mm
          >pellets, into the ethanol and let it soak. Molecular Sieve can absorb
          >up to about 20% of its weight in water. Strain the ethanol to get the
          >pellets out. The Molecular Sieve can be reused just like activated
          >carbon. Place the Sieve material in the oven to drive the water out.
          >Very low tech. The high tech is in the material, but as end-users, we
          >don't have to worry about all that.
          >
          >Regarding ethanol as motor fuel, I'm sure that converting a fuel
          >injected car would be pretty straight forward. My question really had
          >to do with experience. Is there anyone here who is actually doing it?
          >Running a car on ethanol? I want more anecdotal input on the
          >experience. The performance potential of ethanol fuel is even more
          >compelling to me then the already compelling renewability and other
          >benefits.
          >
          >Oversized injectors and pumps are quite common for hot-rodding most
          >cars. Getting the fuel flow up to the "20-30 percent more" required
          >for ethanol should be a simple matter. It occurred to me that one
          >could also turbo or supercharge an ethanol converted car to take
          >advantage of ethanol's higher octane and lower combustion
          >temperatures. Running 180 proof is like water injection, but with the
          >water built right into the fuel!
          >
          >-CX
        • travellerwiz
          Just a question.... I too fly model airplanes and have thought about running one of them on Ethanol.. I have always been told that Methanol has a higher
          Message 4 of 6 , Dec 4, 2002
            Just a question.... I too fly model airplanes and have thought about
            running one of them on Ethanol.. I have always been told that
            Methanol has a higher potential energy then Ethanol and that is why
            it is used in RC fuel and Race car fuel! Do you know if this is true?

            --- In Distillers@y..., "c2h5oh_x" <c2h5oh_x@y...> wrote:
            > Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. I had plenty of
            > reading for tonight.
            >
            > Molecular Sieve is definitely the easiest way to get that last bit
            of
            > water out of regularly distilled ethanol. The process, for those
            > unfamiliar with it, is similar to carbon treating. Just throw the
            > molecular sieve material, which is in the form of small 3-5mm
            > pellets, into the ethanol and let it soak. Molecular Sieve can
            absorb
            > up to about 20% of its weight in water. Strain the ethanol to get
            the
            > pellets out. The Molecular Sieve can be reused just like activated
            > carbon. Place the Sieve material in the oven to drive the water
            out.
            > Very low tech. The high tech is in the material, but as end-users,
            we
            > don't have to worry about all that.
            >
            > Regarding ethanol as motor fuel, I'm sure that converting a fuel
            > injected car would be pretty straight forward. My question really
            had
            > to do with experience. Is there anyone here who is actually doing
            it?
            > Running a car on ethanol? I want more anecdotal input on the
            > experience. The performance potential of ethanol fuel is even more
            > compelling to me then the already compelling renewability and other
            > benefits.
            >
            > Oversized injectors and pumps are quite common for hot-rodding most
            > cars. Getting the fuel flow up to the "20-30 percent more" required
            > for ethanol should be a simple matter. It occurred to me that one
            > could also turbo or supercharge an ethanol converted car to take
            > advantage of ethanol's higher octane and lower combustion
            > temperatures. Running 180 proof is like water injection, but with
            the
            > water built right into the fuel!
            >
            > -CX
          • c2h5oh_x
            Methanol has a bit of andvantage power-wise because it has more oxygen it it alreay. The side effect being that the jets or injectors need to be even LARGER
            Message 5 of 6 , Dec 4, 2002
              Methanol has a bit of andvantage power-wise because it has more
              oxygen it it alreay. The side effect being that the jets or injectors
              need to be even LARGER than with ethanol. That also means that you
              get worse "milage". Methanol is also highly poisonous. It's possible
              to get enough of it through your skin or lungs for it to be a
              problem. You also can't make it yourself.

              So, yeah, for top fuel racing and stuff, Methanol is the fuel of
              choice. But ethanol has only slightly less performance in terms of
              power. You can make it yourself. It's not (too) poisonous. The flow
              rate is lower which means better milage.

              Is that everything?

              BTW, there are a few racers who are using ethanol now.

              -CX

              --- In Distillers@y..., "travellerwiz" <travellerw@u...> wrote:
              > Just a question.... I too fly model airplanes and have thought
              about
              > running one of them on Ethanol.. I have always been told that
              > Methanol has a higher potential energy then Ethanol and that is why
              > it is used in RC fuel and Race car fuel! Do you know if this is
              true?
              >
              > --- In Distillers@y..., "c2h5oh_x" <c2h5oh_x@y...> wrote:
              > > Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. I had plenty of
              > > reading for tonight.
              > >
              > > Molecular Sieve is definitely the easiest way to get that last
              bit
              > of
              > > water out of regularly distilled ethanol. The process, for those
              > > unfamiliar with it, is similar to carbon treating. Just throw the
              > > molecular sieve material, which is in the form of small 3-5mm
              > > pellets, into the ethanol and let it soak. Molecular Sieve can
              > absorb
              > > up to about 20% of its weight in water. Strain the ethanol to get
              > the
              > > pellets out. The Molecular Sieve can be reused just like
              activated
              > > carbon. Place the Sieve material in the oven to drive the water
              > out.
              > > Very low tech. The high tech is in the material, but as end-
              users,
              > we
              > > don't have to worry about all that.
              > >
              > > Regarding ethanol as motor fuel, I'm sure that converting a fuel
              > > injected car would be pretty straight forward. My question really
              > had
              > > to do with experience. Is there anyone here who is actually doing
              > it?
              > > Running a car on ethanol? I want more anecdotal input on the
              > > experience. The performance potential of ethanol fuel is even
              more
              > > compelling to me then the already compelling renewability and
              other
              > > benefits.
              > >
              > > Oversized injectors and pumps are quite common for hot-rodding
              most
              > > cars. Getting the fuel flow up to the "20-30 percent more"
              required
              > > for ethanol should be a simple matter. It occurred to me that one
              > > could also turbo or supercharge an ethanol converted car to take
              > > advantage of ethanol's higher octane and lower combustion
              > > temperatures. Running 180 proof is like water injection, but with
              > the
              > > water built right into the fuel!
              > >
              > > -CX
            • travellerwiz
              Thanks for the info.. Seems to make sense to me.. I have actually heard of people making Methanol at home so they can brew their own RC fuel. So it is
              Message 6 of 6 , Dec 4, 2002
                Thanks for the info.. Seems to make sense to me.. I have actually
                heard of people making Methanol at home so they can brew their own RC
                fuel. So it is possible, but you are right about the poisonous part.

                If you are thinking about converting a RC engine to run on Ethanol
                then let me know. I have some good recipes for RC fuel, you would
                just have to substitute the Methanol for Ethanol. I think it would
                work fine. You may have to increase the amount of Nitro you use as I
                don't think Ethanol will cause a reaction with the glow plug. You
                might try posting the question on.

                http://www.rcwatch.com or http://www.rcuniverse.com

                Those guys have done some pretty weird stuff with RC engines. One of
                them may have experience with this.

                --- In Distillers@y..., "c2h5oh_x" <c2h5oh_x@y...> wrote:
                > Methanol has a bit of andvantage power-wise because it has more
                > oxygen it it alreay. The side effect being that the jets or
                injectors
                > need to be even LARGER than with ethanol. That also means that you
                > get worse "milage". Methanol is also highly poisonous. It's
                possible
                > to get enough of it through your skin or lungs for it to be a
                > problem. You also can't make it yourself.
                >
                > So, yeah, for top fuel racing and stuff, Methanol is the fuel of
                > choice. But ethanol has only slightly less performance in terms of
                > power. You can make it yourself. It's not (too) poisonous. The flow
                > rate is lower which means better milage.
                >
                > Is that everything?
                >
                > BTW, there are a few racers who are using ethanol now.
                >
                > -CX
                >
                > --- In Distillers@y..., "travellerwiz" <travellerw@u...> wrote:
                > > Just a question.... I too fly model airplanes and have thought
                > about
                > > running one of them on Ethanol.. I have always been told that
                > > Methanol has a higher potential energy then Ethanol and that is
                why
                > > it is used in RC fuel and Race car fuel! Do you know if this is
                > true?
                > >
                > > --- In Distillers@y..., "c2h5oh_x" <c2h5oh_x@y...> wrote:
                > > > Thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. I had plenty
                of
                > > > reading for tonight.
                > > >
                > > > Molecular Sieve is definitely the easiest way to get that last
                > bit
                > > of
                > > > water out of regularly distilled ethanol. The process, for
                those
                > > > unfamiliar with it, is similar to carbon treating. Just throw
                the
                > > > molecular sieve material, which is in the form of small 3-5mm
                > > > pellets, into the ethanol and let it soak. Molecular Sieve can
                > > absorb
                > > > up to about 20% of its weight in water. Strain the ethanol to
                get
                > > the
                > > > pellets out. The Molecular Sieve can be reused just like
                > activated
                > > > carbon. Place the Sieve material in the oven to drive the water
                > > out.
                > > > Very low tech. The high tech is in the material, but as end-
                > users,
                > > we
                > > > don't have to worry about all that.
                > > >
                > > > Regarding ethanol as motor fuel, I'm sure that converting a
                fuel
                > > > injected car would be pretty straight forward. My question
                really
                > > had
                > > > to do with experience. Is there anyone here who is actually
                doing
                > > it?
                > > > Running a car on ethanol? I want more anecdotal input on the
                > > > experience. The performance potential of ethanol fuel is even
                > more
                > > > compelling to me then the already compelling renewability and
                > other
                > > > benefits.
                > > >
                > > > Oversized injectors and pumps are quite common for hot-rodding
                > most
                > > > cars. Getting the fuel flow up to the "20-30 percent more"
                > required
                > > > for ethanol should be a simple matter. It occurred to me that
                one
                > > > could also turbo or supercharge an ethanol converted car to
                take
                > > > advantage of ethanol's higher octane and lower combustion
                > > > temperatures. Running 180 proof is like water injection, but
                with
                > > the
                > > > water built right into the fuel!
                > > >
                > > > -CX
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