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Rye question...

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  • Slingshot
    ***posting for a friend*** in doing a rye run, my friend cooked his rye and pre gelatinized corn at 100 degrees for 30 min, then 180 for 90 min. He let it sit
    Message 1 of 4 , Aug 4, 2013
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      ***posting for a friend***

      in doing a rye run, my friend cooked his rye and pre gelatinized corn at 100 degrees for 30 min, then 180 for 90 min. He let it sit overnight to cool, then pitched in the morning. OG 1.055 FG 1.025. not a great final gravity, but was anxious to run it. It bubbled well for 5 days. during the run, only at 200c did he get a product, and it was only 20% abv...

      lost on this one. Any ideas what went wrong?
    • Fredrick Lee
      Your gravity measurements suggest a 4% alcohol by volume. The obvious answer is that your starch conversion was low, I suspect your yield was for the follow
      Message 2 of 4 , Aug 4, 2013
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        Your gravity measurements suggest a 4% alcohol by volume. 
        The obvious answer is that your starch conversion was low, I suspect your yield was for the follow reasons:

        1) Low diastatic power (DP) of the malts. You must have enough enzymes to make the conversion. Although rye malt has plenty of alpha amylase, it has much lower conversion ability than barley. Check your DP math. 

        2) Low conversion temperature. 
        The enzymes need to be in the correct temperature and pH range to perform conversion. Check your temps and pH. 

        3) 200°C is pretty impressive temp for water. If you meant 200°F instead, I think that's a good temp, but at 200°C however, the solubility of organic compounds, including diols and ethanol is nearly 5 orders of magnitude higher. It might just still be in there. Of course, at that kind of pressure, everything is still in there. 


        On Aug 4, 2013, at 13:14, "Slingshot" <slange22@...> wrote:

         

        ***posting for a friend***

        in doing a rye run, my friend cooked his rye and pre gelatinized corn at 100 degrees for 30 min, then 180 for 90 min. He let it sit overnight to cool, then pitched in the morning. OG 1.055 FG 1.025. not a great final gravity, but was anxious to run it. It bubbled well for 5 days. during the run, only at 200c did he get a product, and it was only 20% abv...

        lost on this one. Any ideas what went wrong?

      • Eddie Hoskin
        Simply put, your grains never converted.  You state a temp of 100ºF and 180ºF for your steps; at 100º you re too low to convert starch (as you state, it s
        Message 3 of 4 , Aug 4, 2013
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          Simply put, your grains never converted.  You state a temp of 100ºF and 180ºF for your steps; at 100º you're too low to convert starch (as you state, it's the gelatinizing step) and at 180º you've totally denatured the enzymes.

          You need to keep the mash at ~150ºF for about an hour to fully convert starches.

          Also, unless you had some malt (i.e., rye malt, barely malt) in there, you're entirely short of the enzymes necessary to convert the starches.  'Regular' rye and corn won't cut it on their own.

          HTH,
          Radicaled



          From: Slingshot <slange22@...>
          To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Sunday, August 4, 2013 1:14 PM
          Subject: [Distillers] Rye question...

           
          ***posting for a friend***

          in doing a rye run, my friend cooked his rye and pre gelatinized corn at 100 degrees for 30 min, then 180 for 90 min. He let it sit overnight to cool, then pitched in the morning. OG 1.055 FG 1.025. not a great final gravity, but was anxious to run it. It bubbled well for 5 days. during the run, only at 200c did he get a product, and it was only 20% abv...

          lost on this one. Any ideas what went wrong?



        • Steve Lange
          He used a Heat-Stable Liquid Bacterial Alpha-Amylase and went to 180* as per the manufacturer.... definitively an issue with starch, just can t pin it
          Message 4 of 4 , Aug 4, 2013
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            He used a "Heat-Stable Liquid Bacterial Alpha-Amylase" and went to 180* as per the manufacturer....

            definitively an issue with starch, just can't pin it down....
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