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Oaking (was) Re: Adding hydrogen peroxide to aging liquors

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  • waljaco
    Don t know. But rum can contain caramel which is quite dominant. wal
    Message 1 of 30 , Dec 3, 2010
      Don't know. But rum can contain caramel which is quite dominant.
      wal

      --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "*" <goodneighbor69@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Experiments show that about 60%abv is best to extract water and alcohol soluble components in oak.
      > > wal
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > what about rums? there are plenty of high ABV rums mainly the 151's
      >
      > are these oaked at lower abvs or at bottle strength?
      >
    • jamesonbeam1
      Good, Almost all rums are aged, mostly in used oak barrels. Depending on the country of origin, they are aged for a year or more. You need to specify which
      Message 2 of 30 , Dec 4, 2010
        Good,

        Almost all rums are aged, mostly in used oak barrels. Depending on the
        country of origin, they are aged for a year or more. You need to
        specify which 151 your talking about.

        JB.


        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "*" <goodneighbor69@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" waljaco@ wrote:
        > >
        > > Experiments show that about 60%abv is best to extract water and
        alcohol soluble components in oak.
        > > wal
        > >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > what about rums? there are plenty of high ABV rums mainly the 151's
        >
        > are these oaked at lower abvs or at bottle strength?
        >
      • *
        ... for the sake of discussion ill say Black Seal Bermuda i know most rums are aged on oak. question is if you have a 151 proof rum what proof is it aged? we
        Message 3 of 30 , Dec 4, 2010
          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "jamesonbeam1" <jamesonbeam1@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > Good,
          >
          > Almost all rums are aged, mostly in used oak barrels. Depending on the
          > country of origin, they are aged for a year or more. You need to
          > specify which 151 your talking about.
          >
          > JB.
          >
          >

          for the sake of discussion ill say
          Black Seal
          Bermuda

          i know most rums are aged on oak. question is if you have a 151 proof rum what proof is it aged? we know whisky is best aged at 130 proof
          is it better to age rum at higher abv?
        • Harry
          ... Define better . Different is the word I think. The balance is yours to explore... Most rum producers age their rum at 70% to 80% alcohol. A few dilute
          Message 4 of 30 , Dec 4, 2010
            --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "*" <goodneighbor69@...> wrote:
            >
            > for the sake of discussion ill say
            > Black Seal
            > Bermuda
            >
            > i know most rums are aged on oak. question is if you have a 151 proof rum what proof is it aged? we know whisky is best aged at 130 proof
            > is it better to age rum at higher abv?
            >


            Define "better". Different is the word I think. The balance is yours to explore...

            "Most rum producers age their rum at 70% to 80% alcohol. A few dilute their spirits to nearly bottle-strength, 40 to 45% alcohol by volume, before putting the barrels away for aging. A lower alcohol content during aging tends to leech slightly lighter esters and phenols from the wooden barrels while a higher alcohol content will attract heavier compounds and associated flavors."

            Source: http://www.ministryofrum.com/article_age_matters.php


            Slainte!
            regards Harry
          • Pete H
            This pic of an oak stave from a wine barrel: http://tinyurl.com/38abjgg seems to indicate that wine (say 12% abv average) penetrates far deeper than spirits as
            Message 5 of 30 , Dec 5, 2010
              This pic of an oak stave from a wine barrel:

              http://tinyurl.com/38abjgg

              seems to indicate that wine (say 12% abv average) penetrates far deeper than spirits as quoted by wal. In fact 10 times deeper at 10mm.

              Would not 95% or even 60% abv spirit be stronger than wine and thus penetrate deeper?

              ------------------------------

              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@...> wrote:
              >
              > The penetration in a barrel is about 1mm. Note that commercial whisky/whiskey distilleries store/age at 60%abv.
              > wal
              >
              > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Pete H" <thursty2@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Not being aware of the experiments, I took the approach that the purer the alcohol, the better it is able to penetrate the oak and leach its desirable properties.
              > >
              > > ------------------------------
              > >
              > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Experiments show that about 60%abv is best to extract water and alcohol soluble components in oak.
              > > > wal
              > > >
              > > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Pete H" <thursty2@> wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > My hardly scientific approach - first time round, was to soak oak chips in 95%abv vodka. The qty's are approx. I half filled a 1.75 ltr bottle with oak chips cut to fit through the neck. A Jack D bottle was ideal for this with its wide neck.
              > > > >
              > > > > When bottling a dark rum, (vodka & essence) I add 25 ml of the oaked 95% to 2.25 ltrs of the rum. I also have a vanilla quill sitting in 95% vodka. I add 5ml of this liquid to the rum.
              > > > >
              > > > > So far, I'm liking the taste.
              > > > >
              > > > > In this thread it has been mentioned that 5gm per ltr should be used. Is that 5gm of chips?
              > > > >
              > > > > ------------------------------
              > > > >
              > > > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "atticpc" <atticpc@> wrote:
              > > > > >
              > > > > > Hi Wal
              > > > > >
              > > > > > I will try that - much easier than going back to the start all over again.
              > > > > >
              > > > > > Harry - just looked back on my notes. I was actually using nearly 10gms per litre - so way over oaked.
              > > > > >
              > > > > > One of my plans at this stage is to fire up a new batch of UJSM and do a few stripping runs. Then on one spirit run add in some of the over oaked batch and then oak again.
              > > > > >
              > > > > > The second approach is going to be to do the spirit run and cuts. Then do up a batch of 50% over oaked and 50% new and oak again on a very small quantity of oak. Will probably use pre used oak.
              > > > > >
              > > > > > All a part of the fun of the craft.
              > > > > >
              > > > >
              > > >
              > >
              >
            • waljaco
              I have been corrected. A penetration of 6mm is not unusual. wal
              Message 6 of 30 , Dec 5, 2010
                I have been corrected. A penetration of 6mm is not unusual.
                wal

                --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@...> wrote:
                >
                > The penetration in a barrel is about 1mm. Note that commercial whisky/whiskey distilleries store/age at 60%abv.
                > wal
                >
                > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Pete H" <thursty2@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Not being aware of the experiments, I took the approach that the purer the alcohol, the better it is able to penetrate the oak and leach its desirable properties.
                > >
                > > ------------------------------
                > >
                > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > Experiments show that about 60%abv is best to extract water and alcohol soluble components in oak.
                > > > wal
                > > >
                > > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Pete H" <thursty2@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > My hardly scientific approach - first time round, was to soak oak chips in 95%abv vodka. The qty's are approx. I half filled a 1.75 ltr bottle with oak chips cut to fit through the neck. A Jack D bottle was ideal for this with its wide neck.
                > > > >
                > > > > When bottling a dark rum, (vodka & essence) I add 25 ml of the oaked 95% to 2.25 ltrs of the rum. I also have a vanilla quill sitting in 95% vodka. I add 5ml of this liquid to the rum.
                > > > >
                > > > > So far, I'm liking the taste.
                > > > >
                > > > > In this thread it has been mentioned that 5gm per ltr should be used. Is that 5gm of chips?
                > > > >
                > > > > ------------------------------
                > > > >
                > > > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "atticpc" <atticpc@> wrote:
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Hi Wal
                > > > > >
                > > > > > I will try that - much easier than going back to the start all over again.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Harry - just looked back on my notes. I was actually using nearly 10gms per litre - so way over oaked.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > One of my plans at this stage is to fire up a new batch of UJSM and do a few stripping runs. Then on one spirit run add in some of the over oaked batch and then oak again.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > The second approach is going to be to do the spirit run and cuts. Then do up a batch of 50% over oaked and 50% new and oak again on a very small quantity of oak. Will probably use pre used oak.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > All a part of the fun of the craft.
                > > > > >
                > > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >
              • Paul Williams
                I like the boomerang keg closure in your other pics - neat idea
                Message 7 of 30 , Dec 5, 2010
                  I like the "boomerang" keg closure in your other pics - neat idea


                  On 2010-12-05, at 7:56 AM, Pete H wrote:

                   



                  This pic of an oak stave from a wine barrel:

                  http://tinyurl.com/38abjgg

                  seems to indicate that wine (say 12% abv average) penetrates far deeper than spirits as quoted by wal. In fact 10 times deeper at 10mm.

                  Would not 95% or even 60% abv spirit be stronger than wine and thus penetrate deeper?

                  ------------------------------

                  --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > The penetration in a barrel is about 1mm. Note that commercial whisky/whiskey distilleries store/age at 60%abv.
                  > wal
                  >
                  > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Pete H" <thursty2@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Not being aware of the experiments, I took the approach that the purer the alcohol, the better it is able to penetrate the oak and leach its desirable properties.
                  > >
                  > > ------------------------------
                  > >
                  > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > Experiments show that about 60%abv is best to extract water and alcohol soluble components in oak.
                  > > > wal
                  > > >
                  > > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Pete H" <thursty2@> wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > My hardly scientific approach - first time round, was to soak oak chips in 95%abv vodka. The qty's are approx. I half filled a 1.75 ltr bottle with oak chips cut to fit through the neck. A Jack D bottle was ideal for this with its wide neck.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > When bottling a dark rum, (vodka & essence) I add 25 ml of the oaked 95% to 2.25 ltrs of the rum. I also have a vanilla quill sitting in 95% vodka. I add 5ml of this liquid to the rum.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > So far, I'm liking the taste.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > In this thread it has been mentioned that 5gm per ltr should be used. Is that 5gm of chips?
                  > > > >
                  > > > > ------------------------------
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "atticpc" <atticpc@> wrote:
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Hi Wal
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > I will try that - much easier than going back to the start all over again.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Harry - just looked back on my notes. I was actually using nearly 10gms per litre - so way over oaked.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > One of my plans at this stage is to fire up a new batch of UJSM and do a few stripping runs. Then on one spirit run add in some of the over oaked batch and then oak again.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > The second approach is going to be to do the spirit run and cuts. Then do up a batch of 50% over oaked and 50% new and oak again on a very small quantity of oak. Will probably use pre used oak.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > All a part of the fun of the craft.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >


                • Pete H
                  Thanks Paul, I wanted a simple to operate closure, and because the column is open to the air - ie., no pressure build up - this method works fine. I do have to
                  Message 8 of 30 , Dec 5, 2010
                    Thanks Paul,

                    I wanted a simple to operate closure, and because the column is open to the air - ie., no pressure build up - this method works fine.

                    I do have to investigate a better gasket material. The foam I have eventually collapses with the weight and heat, and then I have to cut a replacement.

                    A form of silicon sheet is probably my best bet, but finding it is proving difficult.

                    -------------------------

                    --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Paul Williams <paul.stewart.williams@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > I like the "boomerang" keg closure in your other pics - neat idea
                    >
                    >
                    > On 2010-12-05, at 7:56 AM, Pete H wrote:
                    >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > This pic of an oak stave from a wine barrel:
                    > >
                    > > http://tinyurl.com/38abjgg
                  • *
                    ... how about a silicone cooking sheet or silicone cake pan
                    Message 9 of 30 , Dec 5, 2010
                      > A form of silicon sheet is probably my best bet, but finding it is proving difficult.


                      how about a silicone cooking sheet or silicone cake pan
                    • Pete H
                      Hadn t thought of the cake pan. I need material about 3mm thick. Will check it out. Thanks *
                      Message 10 of 30 , Dec 5, 2010
                        Hadn't thought of the cake pan. I need material about 3mm thick. Will check it out.

                        Thanks *

                        -------------------------

                        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "*" <goodneighbor69@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > > A form of silicon sheet is probably my best bet, but finding it is proving difficult.
                        >
                        >
                        > how about a silicone cooking sheet or silicone cake pan
                        >
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