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RE: [Distillers] Re: Rice Mash

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  • bruce cook
    This implies that the only way to convert rice starch to sugar for fermenting is the use of Koji . Then, we will end up with Sake . Are there any other
    Message 1 of 17 , Sep 25, 2010
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      This implies that the only way to convert rice starch to sugar for fermenting is the use of "Koji".  Then, we will end up with "Sake".  Are there any other methods, i.e. the use of enzymes, malting the rice, malted barley, etc. which would convert the rice starch to sugar?  I am interested in using rice to make alcholol fuel, not "Sake".

      Thanks,
      Bruce


      To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
      From: waljaco@...
      Date: Sat, 25 Sep 2010 06:08:59 +0000
      Subject: [Distillers] Re: Rice Mash

       


      --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@...> wrote:
      >
      > Koji is a pure strain of Aspergillus oryzae. Yeast needs to be added for fermentation But once the Japanese did use saliva enzymes! This practice is restricted to the Amazon Basin now. Most Asian countries use a mixed starter of wild fungi, bacteria and yeasts which gives more flavour complexity. The Koreans still use to some extent malted barley also.
      > Most grains contain about 60% starch, so rice has a certain advantage. For sake, the Japanese use a highly polished rice that has 85% starch.
      > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Distillers/message/17499
      >
      > wal
      > wal
      >
      > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, sigrune@ wrote:
      > >
      > > Un-sprouted rice has no appreciable enzymes to convert sugar to starch.
      > >
      > > In the traditional method Wal lists usually there is the addition of Koji, a mold that breaks the starch into sugar.
      > > Of course you can always have Asian girls chew the rice to start the enzyme process...
      > >
      > >
      > > ----Original Message-----
      > > From: made_it_myself <doctorlawrencebrown@>
      > > To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
      > > Sent: Thu, Sep 23, 2010 10:31 am
      > > Subject: [Distillers] Re: Rice Mash
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > >Sorry to sound a little dim, but does this mean the starch is converted to sugars during the extra
      > > >cooking cycle or does the yeast do the job?
      > >
      >


    • jamesonbeam1
      Hi Bruce, You may use enzymes, malt or Koji to convert starches to sugars in rice. However, your in the wrong group here. We distill for taste and drinking,
      Message 2 of 17 , Oct 2, 2010
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        Hi Bruce,

        You may use enzymes, malt or Koji to convert starches to sugars in rice.  However, your in the wrong group here.  We distill for taste and drinking, not making fuel.  You should join our friends at http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/alcoholfuel/ to discuss the most cost effective way of converting rice to make E-85.

        JB.


        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, bruce cook <bcook0407@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > This implies that the only way to convert rice starch to sugar for fermenting is the use of "Koji". Then, we will end up with "Sake". Are there any other methods, i.e. the use of enzymes, malting the rice, malted barley, etc. which would convert the rice starch to sugar? I am interested in using rice to make alcholol fuel, not "Sake".
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Bruce

      • bruce cook
        JB, Thanks for the reply. As a matter of fact, I am a member of the Alcohol Fuel group. However, this thread was started here and I was just following the
        Message 3 of 17 , Oct 2, 2010
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          JB,

          Thanks for the reply.  As a matter of fact, I am a member of the "Alcohol Fuel" group.  However, this thread was started here and I was just following the thread.  I'll see if there is any information in the other group about what enzymes to use.

          Thanks again,
          Bruce


          To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
          From: jamesonbeam1@...
          Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2010 14:50:37 +0000
          Subject: [Distillers] Re: Rice Mash

           

          Hi Bruce,
          You may use enzymes, malt or Koji to convert starches to sugars in rice.  However, your in the wrong group here.  We distill for taste and drinking, not making fuel.  You should join our friends at http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/alcoholfuel/ to discuss the most cost effective way of converting rice to make E-85.
          JB.

          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, bruce cook <bcook0407@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > This implies that the only way to convert rice starch to sugar for fermenting is the use of "Koji". Then, we will end up with "Sake". Are there any other methods, i.e. the use of enzymes, malting the rice, malted barley, etc. which would convert the rice starch to sugar? I am interested in using rice to make alcholol fuel, not "Sake".
          >
          > Thanks,
          > Bruce


        • jamesonbeam1
          YVW Bruce, Not knowing much about distilling E-85 i would say using enzymes like the BA and GA-100 from Mile High Distllers is way more cost efficient then
          Message 4 of 17 , Oct 2, 2010
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            YVW Bruce,

            Not knowing much about distilling E-85 i would say using enzymes like the BA and GA-100 from Mile High Distllers is way more cost efficient then other means.  1 pound of each can break down 1000 lbs. of grains. 

            JB.  http://www.milehidistilling.com/Alcohol_fuel_still_Parts_Ethanol_stills_Supplies_s/1.htm

            Alpha-Amylase Enzyme - 1 Pound
            Our Price: $14.99

            BA-100 is a bacterial alpha-amylse enzyme. It is a food-grade enzyme product produced by fermentation of a non-GMO strain of Bacillus. This enzyme is Kosher-certified, not-synthetic and can be used in the production of certified-organic foods. BA-100, endo-amylase, randomly hydrolyzes 1.4-alpha-glucosidic bonds in starch. The prolonged action of BA-100 reduces the viscosity of gelatinized starch and produces large amounts of low molecular weight oligosaccharides. This process will turn the starch into long chain sugars but unfortunately yeast cannot utilize this sugar yet.

            BA-100 and GA-100 enzymes are the exact same enzymes used by both the beverage alcohol and fuel alcohol industries. These are very concentrated and just 1/10 pound of each of these enzymes will break down 100 pounds of grain or starch into fermentable glucose.

            Please store these enzymes refrigerated in zip lock bags.
            Gluco-Amylase Enzyme - 1 Pound
            Gluco-Amylase Enzyme - 1 Pound
            Our Price: $14.99

            GA-100 is a Glucoamylase enzyme produced by controlled fermentation of a non-GMO strain of Rhizopus; (much stronger action than glucoamylase produced by Aspergillus Niger) this enzyme is food-grade, Kosher-certified, Non-synthetic and can be used to produce certified-organic beverages. GA-100, an exo-alpha-amylase, hydrolyses 1.4 alpha-glucosidic bonds of liquefied starch. The prolonged action of GA-100 produces large amounts of glucose. This means that this process converts all the long chain sugars produced by BA-100 into short chain sugars that the yeast will love.

            BA-100 and GA-100 enzymes are the exact same enzymes used by both the beverage alcohol and fuel alcohol industries. These are very concentrated and just 1/10 pound of each of these enzymes will break down 100 pounds of grain or starch into fermentable glucose.

            Please store these enzymes refrigerated in zip lock bags.

            --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, bruce cook <bcook0407@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > JB,
            >
            > Thanks for the reply. As a matter of fact, I am a member of the "Alcohol Fuel" group. However, this thread was started here and I was just following the thread. I'll see if there is any information in the other group about what enzymes to use.
            >
            > Thanks again,
            > Bruce
            >
            > To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
            > From: jamesonbeam1@...
            > Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2010 14:50:37 +0000
            > Subject: [Distillers] Re: Rice Mash
            >
            > Hi Bruce,
            > You may use enzymes, malt or Koji to convert starches to sugars in rice. However, your in the wrong group here. We distill for taste and drinking, not making fuel. You should join our friends at http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/alcoholfuel/ to discuss the most cost effective way of converting rice to make E-85.
            > JB.
            >
            > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, bruce cook bcook0407@ wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > This implies that the only way to convert rice starch to sugar for fermenting is the use of "Koji". Then, we will end up with "Sake". Are there any other methods, i.e. the use of enzymes, malting the rice, malted barley, etc. which would convert the rice starch to sugar? I am interested in using rice to make alcholol fuel, not "Sake".
            > >
            > > Thanks,
            > > Bruce
            >

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