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yeast ranching question

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  • *
    i posted this in New Distillers but thought maybe the old pros might be better suited to answer. i need to stretch a envelope of whiskey yeast. i ll tell you
    Message 1 of 5 , Oct 8, 2009
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      i posted this in New Distillers but thought maybe the old pros might
      be better suited to answer.

      i need to stretch a envelope of whiskey yeast. i'll tell you what i was thinking
      , and maybe you can let me know some quantities or if im going to do something
      wrong.

      was thinking a small sugar wash (sg ?)about 1 gal,1-2 tbls of the yeast, with
      some nutrients ? vitamins? epsom salt? or just go to LHBS for yeast nutrients ,
      and an
      air stone. let the air stone run the entire time. few days ? or untill
      i had enough to pitch in a 6 gal mash . not sure how much that would have to be
      . is fresh the same as dry?

      will this work and or will i change the caricature of the yeast?

      thank you in advance
    • jamesonbeam1
      Welp Goodneighbor, Harry Jackson, the old pro that owns both this group and New Distiller s answered your question there an hour and 16 minutes after you
      Message 2 of 5 , Oct 9, 2009
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        Welp Goodneighbor,

        Harry Jackson, the "old pro" that owns both this group and New Distiller's answered your question there an hour and 16 minutes after you posted it, while meself (a relatively newbie semi-pro in relation to his knowlege) added on to it this morning....   See:  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/new_distillers/message/37005

        Vino es Veritas,

        Jim aka Waldo.


        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "*" <goodneighbor69@...> wrote:
        >
        > i posted this in New Distillers but thought maybe the old pros might
        > be better suited to answer.
        >
        > i need to stretch a envelope of whiskey yeast. i'll tell you what i was thinking
        > , and maybe you can let me know some quantities or if im going to do something
        > wrong.
        >
        > was thinking a small sugar wash (sg ?)about 1 gal,1-2 tbls of the yeast, with
        > some nutrients ? vitamins? epsom salt? or just go to LHBS for yeast nutrients ,
        > and an
        > air stone. let the air stone run the entire time. few days ? or untill
        > i had enough to pitch in a 6 gal mash . not sure how much that would have to be
        > . is fresh the same as dry?
        >
        > will this work and or will i change the caricature of the yeast?
        >
        > thank you in advance
        >

      • jamesonbeam1
        Sidenote: Some simple answers, to your other questions are in-line below. JB. ... was thinking ... something ... Your main problem is going to be that you
        Message 3 of 5 , Oct 9, 2009
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          Sidenote:

          Some simple answers, to your other questions are in-line below.

          JB.


          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "*" <goodneighbor69@...> wrote:
          >
          > i posted this in New Distillers but thought maybe the old pros might
          > be better suited to answer.
          >
          > i need to stretch a envelope of whiskey yeast. i'll tell you what i was thinking
          > , and maybe you can let me know some quantities or if im going to do something
          > wrong.

          Your main problem is going to be that you cannot "ranch" the amylase enzymes in your whiskey yeast....  You will probably have to buy some more BA and GA enzymes at Mile High distillers.  They will become diluted the more you "ranch" your yeast.
          >
          > was thinking a small sugar wash (sg ?)about 1 gal,1-2 tbls of the yeast, with
          > some nutrients ? vitamins? epsom salt? or just go to LHBS for yeast nutrients ,

          Yeast nutrients from your LHBS will work fine.


          > and an
          > air stone. let the air stone run the entire time. few days ? or untill
          > i had enough to pitch in a 6 gal mash .

          Make a starter per MB Raines, (try about a gallon per her instructions) you need to run the air stone to keep oxygen flowing till fermentation stops so no ethanol (as Harry stated in New Distillers)  is produced...  You can then keep that as your "master starter" in the refrige for a year or so.

           not sure how much that would have to be

          See above.

          > . is fresh the same as dry?

          Dried yeast is fresh yeast that has been dehydrated (again read MB Raines on how to dehydrate yeast) and can last a year or more if kept in the refridg or freezer.
          >
          > will this work and or will i change the caricature of the yeast?

          Yes it will work, and will not change the "caricature" of the yeast.  Yeast trub or "barm" (lees in wine making)may be re-fermented over 10 to 12 times (I have done it over 20 times with no problems or changing the yeast "caricature").  This is the basis for making sour mashes for corn whiskey (Bourbon)  and using "Dunder" for making rums....
          >
          > thank you in advance
          >

          YVW.

          Vino es Veritas,

          Jim aka Waldo.

        • *
          (I have done it over 20 times with no problems or changing the yeast caricature ). Jim, could you elaborate please. do you ferment on the grain? do you
          Message 4 of 5 , Oct 10, 2009
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            (I have done it over 20 times with no problems or changing the yeast "caricature").
            Jim,
            could you elaborate please. do you ferment on the grain? do you ferment full term or stop short. if you stop early how do you stop fermentation and let yeast settle out? and if you ferment on the grain do you sparge to harvest yeast.


            thanx again
          • jamesonbeam1
            Well Good, When doing sour mashing for corn whiskey, I usually use corn meal - not cracked corn, but its the same principle. After the fermentation clears and
            Message 5 of 5 , Oct 10, 2009
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              Well Good,

              When doing sour mashing for corn whiskey, I usually use corn meal - not
              cracked corn, but its the same principle. After the fermentation clears
              and the yeast settles (I use EC-1118 which flocculates very well to the
              bottom), you can strain off (sparge) the liquid off from this barm/trub
              at the bottom and re-use that.

              Personally, I usually just take 1/2 out after each fermentation and use
              the rest to restart the fermentation. I also take some of this and boil
              it up for the nutrients and yeast hulls in it.

              People have suggested you only do this 10 to 12 times before changing to
              new yeast and barm, but have done it over 20 times with no difference in
              flavors.

              Making rum and using the backset (dunder) and barm, is also the same
              concept. Again, i will take out about 1/2 of it and use the rest to
              restart the fermentation.

              Vino es Veritas,

              Jim aka Waldo.


              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "*" <goodneighbor69@...> wrote:
              >
              > (I have done it over 20 times with no problems or changing the yeast
              "caricature").
              > Jim,
              > could you elaborate please. do you ferment on the grain? do you
              ferment full term or stop short. if you stop early how do you stop
              fermentation and let yeast settle out? and if you ferment on the grain
              do you sparge to harvest yeast.
              >
              >
              > thanx again
              >
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