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AW: [Distillers] refractometer for distalate?

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  • walli may
    Hi! I am shure you may help at www.wikipedia.org : http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grad_Oechsle kind reg ... Von: unarobert Betreff:
    Message 1 of 9 , Mar 2, 2009
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      Hi!
      I am shure you may help at www.wikipedia.org :
      http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grad_Oechsle

      kind reg


      --- unarobert <hodgespeed@...> schrieb am Mo, 2.3.2009:
      Von: unarobert <hodgespeed@...>
      Betreff: [Distillers] refractometer for distalate?
      An: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
      Datum: Montag, 2. März 2009, 7:11

      i just got a refractomiter to help in my wash brewing and got an idea-

      does anyone have a translation chart to convert from brix to % Alcohol
      in distalate? the one drop sample size seems perfect for distillate
      testing.


    • Trid
      ... You can t do it. Brix is a measure of sugar content, not alcohol. Two separate things; apples and oranges so to speak. In brewing, measuring Brix (the
      Message 2 of 9 , Mar 2, 2009
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        --- On Sun, 3/1/09, unarobert <hodgespeed@...> wrote:
        >
        > i just got a refractomiter to help in my wash brewing and
        > got an idea-
        >
        > does anyone have a translation chart to convert from brix
        > to % Alcohol in distalate? the one drop sample size seems perfect for
        > distillate testing.

        You can't do it. Brix is a measure of sugar content, not alcohol. Two separate things; "apples and oranges" so to speak.

        In brewing, measuring Brix (the sugar concentration of your wort/must/wash) will tell you how much *potential* alcohol it will yield. The alcohol content (after fermentation) is directly proportional to the sugar content before fermentation. However, once your brew is completed, there's no longer any sugar (ideally) and while your refractometer will show you that (and thus verify conversion and therefore alcohol content) it does so by showing you the change in sugar, not alcohol.
        So, in the context of distillate, where there is no sugar, it just doesn't apply.

        Trid
        -that's where alcoholmeters/spirit hydrometers apply
      • unarobert
        a refractometer doesn t measure sugar directly- it measures the refraction index of the liquid, andthe sugar content caneb infered from that. when using a
        Message 3 of 9 , Mar 4, 2009
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          a refractometer doesn't measure sugar directly- it measures the refraction index of the liquid, andthe sugar content caneb infered from that.

          when using a refractometer during a fermentation, you need to use a complicated formula involving what the mixture started with because once you introduce alcohol the refraction index get skewed by it. my thought is,if alcohol can influence thedevice,why can't it be measured by it? granted, you'd need one that is properly calibrated, andneed to know theproperties of alcohol...



          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Trid <triddlywinks@...> wrote:
          >
          > --- On Sun, 3/1/09, unarobert <hodgespeed@...> wrote:
          > >
          > > i just got a refractomiter to help in my wash brewing and
          > > got an idea-
          > >
          > > does anyone have a translation chart to convert from brix
          > > to % Alcohol in distalate? the one drop sample size seems perfect for
          > > distillate testing.
          >
          > You can't do it. Brix is a measure of sugar content, not alcohol. Two separate things; "apples and oranges" so to speak.
          >
          > In brewing, measuring Brix (the sugar concentration of your wort/must/wash) will tell you how much *potential* alcohol it will yield. The alcohol content (after fermentation) is directly proportional to the sugar content before fermentation. However, once your brew is completed, there's no longer any sugar (ideally) and while your refractometer will show you that (and thus verify conversion and therefore alcohol content) it does so by showing you the change in sugar, not alcohol.
          > So, in the context of distillate, where there is no sugar, it just doesn't apply.
          >
          > Trid
          > -that's where alcoholmeters/spirit hydrometers apply
          >
        • Harry
          ... ...Or just use an appropriate spirit hydrometer. Commercials do. So do excise gaugers. Cheap, and accurate enough. Slainte! regards Harry
          Message 4 of 9 , Mar 4, 2009
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            --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "unarobert" <hodgespeed@...> wrote:
            >
            > a refractometer doesn't measure sugar directly- it measures the refraction index of the liquid, andthe sugar content caneb infered from that.
            >
            > when using a refractometer during a fermentation, you need to use a complicated formula involving what the mixture started with because once you introduce alcohol the refraction index get skewed by it. my thought is,if alcohol can influence thedevice,why can't it be measured by it? granted, you'd need one that is properly calibrated, andneed to know theproperties of alcohol...


            ...Or just use an appropriate spirit hydrometer. Commercials do. So do excise gaugers. Cheap, and accurate enough.


            Slainte!
            regards Harry
          • unarobert
            ... that s my current practice. but if i could accuratly tell what is coming out of a still using a sample size of one drop,and have automatic temerature
            Message 5 of 9 , Mar 4, 2009
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              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > ...Or just use an appropriate spirit hydrometer. Commercials do. So do excise gaugers. Cheap, and accurate enough.
              >
              >
              > Slainte!
              > regards Harry
              >

              that's my current practice. but if i could accuratly tell what is coming out of a still using a sample size of one drop,and have automatic temerature correction, i'd think i could make cuts more accuratly.
            • unarobert
              ... http://www.industrial-needs.com/technical-data/refractometer-PCE-ALK.htm here s exactly what i m talking about,but it is only calibrated from 0-80% ABV
              Message 6 of 9 , Mar 4, 2009
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                --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "unarobert" <hodgespeed@...> wrote:
                >
                > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@> wrote:
                > >
                > >
                > > ...Or just use an appropriate spirit hydrometer. Commercials do. So do excise gaugers. Cheap, and accurate enough.
                > >
                > >
                > > Slainte!
                > > regards Harry
                > >
                >
                > that's my current practice. but if i could accuratly tell what is coming out of a still using a sample size of one drop,and have automatic temerature correction, i'd think i could make cuts more accuratly.
                >

                http://www.industrial-needs.com/technical-data/refractometer-PCE-ALK.htm

                here's exactly what i'm talking about,but it is only calibrated from 0-80% ABV
              • Zapata Vive
                I agree they would be great. Not great enough for me to outlay he $400-$1000 a true alcohol refractometer would cost. Are you using a parrot s beak? I know
                Message 7 of 9 , Mar 4, 2009
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                  I agree they would be great.  Not great enough for me to outlay he $400-$1000 a true alcohol refractometer would cost.
                   
                  Are you using a parrot's beak?  I know there isn't automatic temperature correction with them, but it provides a real time reading that is even more convenient to me than a refractometer would be because it is continuously monitoring the output vs. having to take samples, even if only a few drops. 
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: unarobert
                  Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 12:17 PM
                  Subject: [Distillers] Re: refractometer for distalate?

                  --- In Distillers@yahoogro ups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@ ...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > ...Or just use an appropriate spirit hydrometer. Commercials do. So do excise gaugers. Cheap, and accurate enough.
                  >
                  >
                  > Slainte!
                  > regards Harry
                  >

                  that's my current practice. but if i could accuratly tell what is coming out of a still using a sample size of one drop,and have automatic temerature correction, i'd think i could make cuts more accuratly.

                • Harry
                  ... Yes a parrot inline is continuous monitoring. Further to that....these are the type of instruments I m talking about. NIST calibrated, accurate to 3
                  Message 8 of 9 , Mar 4, 2009
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                    --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Zapata Vive" <zapatavive@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > I agree they would be great. Not great enough for me to outlay he $400-$1000 a true alcohol refractometer would cost.
                    >
                    > Are you using a parrot's beak? I know there isn't automatic temperature correction with them, but it provides a real time reading that is even more convenient to me than a refractometer would be because it is continuously monitoring the output vs. having to take samples, even if only a few drops.



                    Yes a parrot inline is continuous monitoring. Further to that....these are the type of instruments I'm talking about. NIST calibrated, accurate to 3 decimal points of a percent. Under $40 ea.
                    http://tinyurl.com/aqw6vp

                    No refractometer alive is that accurate. The one previously linked to is +or- 1%

                    Slainte!
                    regards Harry
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