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Re: [Distillers] Re: RUM

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  • Trid
    ... If I recall correctly, in the context of whisky, diacetyl is desirable. Doesn t this correspond with using butter as an anti-foaming agent in terms of
    Message 1 of 23 , Apr 1, 2007
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      --- Harry <gnikomson2000@...> wrote:

      > 2) The beer gets a Diacetyl rest (look it up). Beneficial to final
      > taste & quality of spirits.

      If I recall correctly, in the context of whisky, diacetyl is desirable.
      Doesn't this correspond with using butter as an anti-foaming agent in terms of
      flavor profile? Then again, in the context of rum, it could all be different.

      Either way, I figured I'd at least raise the question.

      Trid
    • Harry
      ... final ... desirable. ... in terms of ... be different. ... And a good question to raise, Trid. Diacetyl is the scourge of brewers. Some yeast strains
      Message 2 of 23 , Apr 1, 2007
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        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, Trid <triddlywinks@...> wrote:
        >
        > --- Harry <gnikomson2000@...> wrote:
        >
        > > 2) The beer gets a Diacetyl rest (look it up). Beneficial to
        final
        > > taste & quality of spirits.
        >
        > If I recall correctly, in the context of whisky, diacetyl is
        desirable.
        > Doesn't this correspond with using butter as an anti-foaming agent
        in terms of
        > flavor profile? Then again, in the context of rum, it could all
        be different.
        >
        > Either way, I figured I'd at least raise the question.
        >
        > Trid
        >


        And a good question to raise, Trid.
        Diacetyl is the scourge of brewers. Some yeast strains produce
        copious amounts of it. However a LITTLE in whisky is not so bad.
        It provides a slight butterscotch flavour (which is why they use
        butter to kill foaming; it's flavour is compatible).

        But butterscotch notes in rums, vodkas, or really anything else bar
        whisky is not part of those spirits' flavour & aroma profiles.


        Slainte!
        regards Harry
      • Thomas Smith
        Acording to Smileys book you should never let the wash set but distill right away to avoid off flavors. is this just his opinion or have you found this not
        Message 3 of 23 , Apr 2, 2007
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          Acording to Smileys book you should never let the wash set  but distill  right away to avoid off flavors.  is this just his opinion or have you found this not to be true?
           
          Tom
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Harry
          Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 7:53 PM
          Subject: [Distillers] Re: RUM

          --- In Distillers@yahoogro ups.com, "Thomas Smith"
          <smiththomas9263@ ...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi Harry,
          >
          > I have been monitoring these emails and it seems you have a lot of
          knowledge. I have a question. I make straight corn washes and the
          end product comes up bitter. I think I am not clearing the wash well
          enough. after straining through a nylon stocking and letting settle
          over night in 20 degree weather the top half is somewhat clear but
          the bottom half has the consistency of pancake batter. does any
          body have any ideas on filtering this. perhaps a sand swimming pool
          filter or a centrifugal filter to clarifiy this for stripping. any
          information you could provide would be greatly appreciated.
          >
          > youngblood

          Centrifuges work...expensive.
          Sand filters work........ .messy, time-consuming.
          Decanting into 20 lt pails & freezing works...I often do this, but
          then I've got the facilities.
          Time works....probably the best option of all for amateur stillers.

          If you don't open the fermenter, you avoid the possibility of
          infections. Then you can just leave it sit for a week or so before
          distilling. Two benefits of this...
          1) The yeast will go dormant & drop out (which is what you want).
          2) The beer gets a Diacetyl rest (look it up). Beneficial to final
          taste & quality of spirits.

          Slainte!
          regards Harry

        • Harry
          ... distill right away to avoid off flavors. is this just his opinion or have you found this not to be true? ... It depends on what you re making, and what
          Message 4 of 23 , Apr 2, 2007
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            --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas Smith"
            <smiththomas9263@...> wrote:
            >
            > Acording to Smileys book you should never let the wash set but
            distill right away to avoid off flavors. is this just his opinion
            or have you found this not to be true?
            >
            > Tom


            It depends on what you're making, and what you're using as a
            substrate (sugar source). For most grain-based whiskys, it's normal
            to distil off as soon as the ferment is done. This is to avoid
            spoilage as it is common for grains to carry large colonies of
            bacteria. When the ferment is nearly complete, the more hardy (pH
            tolerant) of these can then have a chance to multiply. Sometimes
            this is actually desirable, most often not. Lactobacillus is one
            that is desirable for whisky, yet is a known producer of Diacetyl
            among other things.

            It depends on what style you're after. Remember there's well over
            4,000 different Scotch Malts & blends alone, not to mention the
            American & Irish contributions. This early distilling of whisky
            beers also accounts for the small amount of diacetyl commonly
            present (and tolerated) in the distillate, as there has been no
            diacetyl rest.

            The situation is different for molasses or sugar beers (used for
            rums & sometimes vodkas). Clarified molasses has almost no bacteria
            left in it. In fact a culture of bacteria obtained from cane
            bagasse (processed fibre) is often ADDED to the ferment to enhance
            the product flavours. Refined sugar has no bacteria. Both of these
            will produce beers (ferments) that can stand several weeks of
            settling or storage, PROVIDED the container seal has not been
            breached or opened to atmosphere as this WILL allow bacteria in and
            the result will be spoilt beer.

            In all cases, even your whiskys, if you find that your strain of
            yeast is producing a decidedly butterscotch overtone in your
            finished spirits, then you have to decide if this is what you want
            in your style of product. If you like it, then just continue as you
            normally do. If not, then you need to give your finished beer a
            diacetyl rest, which will reduce the amount via yeast reabsorption.

            For a very good description on Diacetyl, its formation & how to
            remove it, go here...
            http://beerme.com/diacetyl.shtml


            HTH
            Slainte!
            regards Harry
          • morganfield1
            I know you were trying to keep this a secret, but I guess the cat is out of the bag (you are the Orical, after all). Tip one, Morgan ... knowledge.
            Message 5 of 23 , Apr 2, 2007
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              I know you were trying to keep this a secret, but I guess the cat is
              out of the bag (you are the Orical, after all).
              Tip one, Morgan

              >Hi Harry,
              > I have been monitoring these emails and it seems you have a lot of
              knowledge.
            • juliet kent
              Would you mind forwarding that picture to me too Ian. Am thinking of having a crack at making one and it sounds simple enough even for me. Cheers , Juliet
              Message 6 of 23 , Apr 3, 2007
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                Would you mind forwarding that picture to me too Ian. Am thinking of having
                a crack at making one and it sounds simple enough even for me. Cheers ,
                Juliet


                >From: "Ian" <ian@...>
                >Reply-To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                >To: <Distillers@yahoogroups.com>
                >Subject: Re: [Distillers] Re: RUM
                >Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2007 08:40:30 +1000
                >
                >Gidday once again :)
                >
                >A PDA-1 is exactly what you don't want too be making rum, or any flavoured
                >sprit,
                >Unless you want too make rum that tastes like cheep vodka :)
                >
                >It'll make an almost flavourless sprit, at a high %,
                >
                >You want a simple pot still, Ive forwarded you a picture of mine,
                >Pot stills are super easy too make,
                >
                >
                >
                > ----- Original Message -----
                > From: Anthony Athawes
                > To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                > Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 2:07 AM
                > Subject: RE: [Distillers] Re: RUM
                >
                >
                >
                > Hi Rob,
                >
                >
                >
                > I admire your imagination and constructiveness. However, it stands for
                >"World Class Still". I've always thought it a rather high-blown title but
                >would like to know the name of its inventor. Whatever, this reflux model
                >seems to be well thought of. You might make one for �50 though mine cost
                >double that having to get some of the more skilled work done outside. I'd
                >like to have a PDA1.
                >
                >
                >
                > Tony A
                >
                >
                >
                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: Distillers@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Distillers@yahoogroups.com]On
                >Behalf Of Robert Thomas
                > Sent: 31 March 2007 16:41
                > To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: Re: [Distillers] Re: RUM
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > --- anthony547357 <Anthony.Athawes@...> wrote:
                >
                > <snip>
                > > 60 cc per minute! Mine is a WCStill.
                >
                > Now that i'd like to see! A WC still! I guess you have to be fairly
                > quick before it is needed for other duties? Is it continuous, fed from
                > the cistern? Or just batch mode with a flush for each new charge of
                > wash?
                >
                > Rob.
                >
                > Cheers,
                > Rob.
                >
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