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Re: [Distillers] Re: Does anyone have the chemical data on the Bi-carb treatment?

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  • Robert Thomas
    Yikes, I m a resource! (btw Harry: Happy New Year and all the very best to you and yours). GWN: I think my thinking out loud rationale for bicarb is in the
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 2, 2007
      Yikes,
      I'm a resource! (btw Harry: Happy New Year and all the very best to you
      and yours).
      GWN: I think my "thinking out loud" rationale for bicarb is in the
      homedistillers site (I hope so, as I have lost it here).
      It could easily be very beneficial for your friend the "legal
      distiller", providing he is making neutral alcohol - which I guess he
      is because he is using carbon treatment.

      I have a pretty exclusive spam filter here, but do send me an email if
      you can't find answers in the archives (I suggest searching whosbrewing
      and bicarb).
      Cheers
      Rob.

      --- Harry <gnikomson2000@...> wrote:

      > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Great White North"
      > <GrtWhiteNorth56@...> wrote:
      > >
      > > Good Morning everyone.
      > >
      > > I have a friend who owns a small distillery in my home state here
      > in the US.
      > > All licensed by both the State and the Feds by the way...
      > >
      > > I have been telling him about the bi-carb treatment used to help
      > remove the
      > > Ethyl Acetate from his first round distillations and he is really
      > interested
      > > in just how this process works. He is currently using a lot of
      > carbon to
      > > clean up his output and I think this process could be used to save
      > him a lot
      > > of money.
      > >
      > > He would like to read about what chemical reaction takes place
      > with the
      > > bi-carb and I have been unable to locate any documentation on
      > this. I have
      > > looked on the Homedistiller web pages...
      > >
      > > I know folks will say to just have him try a batch and see but
      > with all the
      > > rules and regs from both the state and federal government he is
      > unwilling to
      > > experiment with that. I don't blame him, the paperwork would kill
      > him if he
      > > had to write off a batch...
      > >
      > > Would someone on the group be able to point me to a source that
      > would
      > > explain the chemistry that is taking place??
      > >
      > > Thanks
      > >
      > > GWN
      > >
      >
      >
      > Rob Thomas would be our resident bicarb resource. Read this msg,
      > then email him...
      > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Distillers/message/37479
      >
      > Slainte!
      > regards Harry
      >
      >


      Cheers,
      Rob.

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    • surya9375
      Hey Everyone I was going homedistillerand came across this http://homedistiller.org/photos-reflux.htm In this page if you look at the last pic The Ultra Pure
      Message 2 of 7 , Jan 4, 2007
        Hey Everyone
        I was going homedistillerand came across this
        http://homedistiller.org/photos-reflux.htm

        In this page if you look at the last pic "The Ultra Pure Still" it is
        said to be 25cm tall and produces 95%.

        I also saw that its of 5liter capacity and they say its capable of
        producing 2 bottles, but do not mention how big (or small) those
        bottles are. :-) I mean I can take that bit of marketing gimic. but
        can anyone tell me how these short stills produce such high %???

        This still is just an example. There are many more short stills that
        produce high %. Any ideas??? thoughts, know hows. I'm dying of curiosity.

        Regards
        Surya.
      • abbababbaccc
        I d be very sceptical about those promises they make. If you read it carefully and think it over things are not as good as they seem. Amphora society was the
        Message 3 of 7 , Jan 4, 2007
          I'd be very sceptical about those promises they make. If you read it
          carefully and think it over things are not as good as they seem.

          Amphora society was the first to manufacture a short still after years
          of research, they settled for 30cm packed height and relatively slow
          running to get out 95.6% neutral alcohol.

          Somehow I doubt that these ultra pure guys have invented something
          better. The still has no product condenser so it must be LM. The valve
          looks to be ball valve, not something suited for finetuning a LM type
          distillation apparatus. The bottle size is not mentioned. Now typical
          mash of 5 liters contains ~0.75 liters alcohol. If we assume typical
          cuts of 20-60-20 (in fact quite unlikely due to speed and column
          height) we'll get 0.45 liters of neutral alcohol. Out of that we get a
          little over one liter at 0.40% so those bottles are 0.5 liters at
          best. I also very much doubt that one could process that 5 liters of
          mash in one hour while equilibrating the still and bleeding off heads
          slowly. Also 2.2 kW and 2" column that it seems to have are not a good
          match for purity.

          So, IMO it's a marketing ploy. Personally I wouldn't buy something
          with such suspicious advert.

          Cheers, Riku

          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "surya9375" <surya9375@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hey Everyone
          > I was going homedistillerand came across this
          > http://homedistiller.org/photos-reflux.htm
          >
          > In this page if you look at the last pic "The Ultra Pure Still" it is
          > said to be 25cm tall and produces 95%.
          >
          > I also saw that its of 5liter capacity and they say its capable of
          > producing 2 bottles, but do not mention how big (or small) those
          > bottles are. :-) I mean I can take that bit of marketing gimic. but
          > can anyone tell me how these short stills produce such high %???
          >
          > This still is just an example. There are many more short stills that
          > produce high %. Any ideas??? thoughts, know hows. I'm dying of
          curiosity.
          >
          > Regards
          > Surya.
          >
        • Link D'Antoni
          Surya, One of my stills is a 24 H x 2 D stainless column that I got from Mi-High. I used to use it from reflux. The drawback is that it took 10 - 12 hrs
          Message 4 of 7 , Jan 4, 2007
            Surya,

            One of my stills is a 24"H x 2"D stainless column
            that I got from Mi-High. I used to use it from
            reflux. The drawback is that it took 10 - 12 hrs
            (including heat up) to run 5 gallons (19 ltrs). I did
            get 96% but it took allll daaaaay loooong... it was
            drip...drip...drip...to get the purity. (5-8 ml/minute
            Oh, I used SS scrubbers packing.

            Link

            --- surya9375 <surya9375@...> wrote:

            > Hey Everyone
            > I was going homedistillerand came across this
            > http://homedistiller.org/photos-reflux.htm
            >
            > In this page if you look at the last pic "The Ultra
            > Pure Still" it is
            > said to be 25cm tall and produces 95%.
            >
            > I also saw that its of 5liter capacity and they say
            > its capable of
            > producing 2 bottles, but do not mention how big (or
            > small) those
            > bottles are. :-) I mean I can take that bit of
            > marketing gimic. but
            > can anyone tell me how these short stills produce
            > such high %???
            >
            > This still is just an example. There are many more
            > short stills that
            > produce high %. Any ideas??? thoughts, know hows.
            > I'm dying of curiosity.
            >
            > Regards
            > Surya.
            >
            >


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          • Sven Pfitt
            Great marketing. If he were running an 18% wash and actually got to use 4.5L of the capacity for liquid it would yield 0.81L of alcohol. So you could get two
            Message 5 of 7 , Jan 4, 2007
              Great marketing.

              If he were running an 18% wash and actually got to use 4.5L of the
              capacity for liquid it would yield 0.81L of alcohol. So you could get
              two 1L bottles at 41% abv.

              If it were 100% efficient.

              Which it is not because those are the theoretical limits.

              I'm not going to do the math on heat up time, foreshots, tails, etc
              because they would show the same claims of ideal working conditions.

              It won't work the way it is claimed. Marketing license.

              Just remember, if it sounds too good to be true, its not.

              Sven
              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "surya9375" <surya9375@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hey Everyone
              > I was going homedistillerand came across this
              > http://homedistiller.org/photos-reflux.htm
              >
              > In this page if you look at the last pic "The Ultra Pure Still" it
              is
              > said to be 25cm tall and produces 95%.
              >
              > I also saw that its of 5liter capacity and they say its capable of
              > producing 2 bottles, but do not mention how big (or small) those
              > bottles are. :-) I mean I can take that bit of marketing gimic. but
              > can anyone tell me how these short stills produce such high %???
              >
              > This still is just an example. There are many more short stills that
              > produce high %. Any ideas??? thoughts, know hows. I'm dying of
              curiosity.
              >
              > Regards
              > Surya.
              >
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