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RE: [Distillers] Whats happinin

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  • Tony & Elle Ackland
    Pilch, ... I think its just different - but still good. We ve seen heaps of stills constructed, of different styles. Wal has done a huge job on the
    Message 1 of 9 , Oct 29, 2001
    • 0 Attachment
      Pilch,

      > Tony, what is wrong with our group?
      > Over the past couple of months I have noticed a massive change and it is
      > not for the good as I see it.

      I think its just different - but still good. We've seen heaps of stills
      constructed, of different styles. Wal has done a huge job on the
      flavouring side of things. Sure - theres less of the fundamental questions
      being asked - like how should i pitch the yeast, or how do I build a reflux
      still, but I'd say thats because the newbies are checking the old posts &
      web sites. The use of the "new distillers" group for these questions has
      grown heaps, and is doing well.

      > It appears that all the old ( as in original) members have either quit
      > or are sitting on the side line and I must say I don't blame them.
      > Lately all we seem to be getting is quotes from this book or that book
      > and it has nothing to do with getting the still to run perfectly or how
      > to build one. Don't get me wrong, I have gained a couple of valuable
      > bits of info out of all this but believe me, it was only a couple.
      > I have decided to join the rest of the old folk and sit on the side line
      > for a while until things start to turn around again.

      You'll get out of this group only what you put into it ....

      * describe all your experiments - good and bad, for others to learn from.
      What have you done differently in the last month ? Any new flavours
      you've tried ? Different aging techniques ? Run the still at a different
      reflux ratio ? Tried powering it off turtle dung ?

      * dream a little - and see if bouncing the ideas off the group can help it
      happen. Suggest something "out of the box" and see what comments it starts
      off

      * answer the "simple" questions that come along, so that any question has a
      miriad of replies, from all perspectives, not just a sole one

      * ask questions - is there nothing left you want to learn ? You might have
      to ask a couple of times, phrased different ways, until it clicks off an
      answer by someone. Often, no one here knows the answer (eg we don't seem
      too strong on basic chemistry of the fusels ...), but thats life.

      If you start the ball rolling yourself, others will keep it happening.

      There is no "panel of experts" on this site, or hidden wisdom. No ones
      going to come forward with the single, correct version on "how to do it"
      and instruct from above. But theres a collective wisdom, of which we've
      each got a small corner that we may be good at, or have stumbled over
      during the self-teaching that takes place. But its only going to come out
      if everyone takes the effort to share their own part of it.

      I'm no expert on distilling. I'd only distill about 4-6 times a year.
      Doesn't say much for my experience level does it ? But I figure I've got
      an edge in helping explain the heat transfer / equilibrium / numbers side
      of things. So thats where I try to reply. The rest is just stuff that
      I've collected, and pasted into my site. But why am I often the only
      person bothering to answer the questions ? How many times have you not
      replied to something you could have helped shed some light on ? Ever seen
      a reply or explanation that you didn't agree with, but said nothing about ?

      So - if you want discussions on running a still, ask many questions on the
      subject.
      Describe what you do yourself, and why.
      Probe the theories / stories / explanations until you're happy with them.
      Check out whats happening in the "New Distillers" group too ...

      What did you want to know about running a still ? Graeme is asking in the
      "new distillers" about how to run a Nixon-Stone column.

      Any specifc questions about the construction ? Hal in the "new distillers"
      group has just asked all about sealing a lid to a pot - with the troubles
      he's been having - can you help him out ?

      Tony
    • G&N
      Tony ...or anybody else in this group i would like to try to make some bourbon using my reflux still out of the corn... barley and rye ingredients ....i havent
      Message 2 of 9 , Oct 29, 2001
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        Tony ...or anybody else in this group i would like to try to make some
        bourbon using my reflux still out of the corn... barley and rye ingredients
        ....i havent got a pot still so i want to no if it can be done using my
        reflux still? ...and how do i prepare the wash ingredients..i guess some
        questions would be

        what yeast can i use ..ie turbo extra ?
        do i need to carbon treat the spirit when i have distilled it or will it
        take out all of the flavour?
        are the jack daniels soaker chips enough to age and colour the spirit?
        will it taste anything like the real thing?? ...anybody that can steer me in
        the right direction ..i would be greatly appreciated......

        My best bourbon that i recon i have had to drink is 1.75 litres of Wild
        Turkey mixed with 1 litre if still spirits kentucky Bourbon mix at
        40%.......mix the spirit with Pepsi Max out of the plastic bottles ..dont
        use aluminium cans because the metal leaves a bad taste in the drink if the
        cola has been in the can for a while ...Tastes just like mothers milk i
        recon...all i need to do is make a spirit like Wild Turkey::))


        Glenn





        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Tony & Elle Ackland" <Tony.Ackland@...>
        To: "'Distillers newsgroup'" <Distillers@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2001 1:24 PM
        Subject: RE: [Distillers] Whats happinin


        > Pilch,
        >
        > > Tony, what is wrong with our group?
        > > Over the past couple of months I have noticed a massive change and it is
        > > not for the good as I see it.
        >
        > I think its just different - but still good. We've seen heaps of stills
        > constructed, of different styles. Wal has done a huge job on the
        > flavouring side of things. Sure - theres less of the fundamental
        questions
        > being asked - like how should i pitch the yeast, or how do I build a
        reflux
        > still, but I'd say thats because the newbies are checking the old posts &
        > web sites. The use of the "new distillers" group for these questions has
        > grown heaps, and is doing well.
        >
        > > It appears that all the old ( as in original) members have either quit
        > > or are sitting on the side line and I must say I don't blame them.
        > > Lately all we seem to be getting is quotes from this book or that book
        > > and it has nothing to do with getting the still to run perfectly or how
        > > to build one. Don't get me wrong, I have gained a couple of valuable
        > > bits of info out of all this but believe me, it was only a couple.
        > > I have decided to join the rest of the old folk and sit on the side line
        > > for a while until things start to turn around again.
        >
        > You'll get out of this group only what you put into it ....
        >
        > * describe all your experiments - good and bad, for others to learn from.
        > What have you done differently in the last month ? Any new flavours
        > you've tried ? Different aging techniques ? Run the still at a different
        > reflux ratio ? Tried powering it off turtle dung ?
        >
        > * dream a little - and see if bouncing the ideas off the group can help it
        > happen. Suggest something "out of the box" and see what comments it
        starts
        > off
        >
        > * answer the "simple" questions that come along, so that any question has
        a
        > miriad of replies, from all perspectives, not just a sole one
        >
        > * ask questions - is there nothing left you want to learn ? You might
        have
        > to ask a couple of times, phrased different ways, until it clicks off an
        > answer by someone. Often, no one here knows the answer (eg we don't seem
        > too strong on basic chemistry of the fusels ...), but thats life.
        >
        > If you start the ball rolling yourself, others will keep it happening.
        >
        > There is no "panel of experts" on this site, or hidden wisdom. No ones
        > going to come forward with the single, correct version on "how to do it"
        > and instruct from above. But theres a collective wisdom, of which we've
        > each got a small corner that we may be good at, or have stumbled over
        > during the self-teaching that takes place. But its only going to come out
        > if everyone takes the effort to share their own part of it.
        >
        > I'm no expert on distilling. I'd only distill about 4-6 times a year.
        > Doesn't say much for my experience level does it ? But I figure I've got
        > an edge in helping explain the heat transfer / equilibrium / numbers side
        > of things. So thats where I try to reply. The rest is just stuff that
        > I've collected, and pasted into my site. But why am I often the only
        > person bothering to answer the questions ? How many times have you not
        > replied to something you could have helped shed some light on ? Ever seen
        > a reply or explanation that you didn't agree with, but said nothing about
        ?
        >
        > So - if you want discussions on running a still, ask many questions on the
        > subject.
        > Describe what you do yourself, and why.
        > Probe the theories / stories / explanations until you're happy with them.
        > Check out whats happening in the "New Distillers" group too ...
        >
        > What did you want to know about running a still ? Graeme is asking in the
        > "new distillers" about how to run a Nixon-Stone column.
        >
        > Any specifc questions about the construction ? Hal in the "new
        distillers"
        > group has just asked all about sealing a lid to a pot - with the troubles
        > he's been having - can you help him out ?
        >
        > Tony
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        >
        >
      • AuntyEthyl
        Glenn So far, with my lmited experience, I have found that 1 teaspoon of plain american white oak (chips/shavings/dust) in 1 litre of 40% for about 2 weeks
        Message 3 of 9 , Oct 30, 2001
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          Glenn

          So far, with my lmited experience, I have found that 1
          teaspoon of plain american white oak
          (chips/shavings/dust) in 1 litre of 40% for about 2
          weeks adds, for me, just about the right amount of oak
          flavour. It colors the spirit a fair amount, but you
          would need to add some distillers caramel to give you
          that Bourbon color.

          I use the Still Spirits Top Shelf Classic American
          Bourbon, as this one seems to have the right smell and
          almost the right taste of a good bourbon. Used at the
          recommended ratios.

          From some of Wals and others' excellent posts, it
          appears that different flavors are extracted from the
          oak at different % of spirit. Also different flavours
          will come out of the oak depending on how much it has
          been toasted.

          My next experiments will be to try oak at diff % and
          test the results ;-)

          I'm keen to hear about yours, and others, Corn mash
          experiments.

          Enjoy
          AuntyEthyl



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        • goyeast@yahoo.com
          Well, here s what I know from my experience: 1) Cabin treatment will definitely remove flavors from your whiskey. I didn t use it for the whiskey I made about
          Message 4 of 9 , Oct 30, 2001
          • 0 Attachment
            Well, here's what I know from my experience:

            1) Cabin treatment will definitely remove flavors from your whiskey.
            I didn't use it for the whiskey I made about three months ago (a rye,
            corn and barley mix described in a few posts here). Instead, I
            divided my distillate into very small, labeled batches and only used
            the middle ones.

            2) I pulled the pot scrubbers out of my reflux still and ran at a
            temperature range that gave me an average of 80% alcohol. Before my
            next whiskey run, I'm getting the "corn whiskey" book that others
            have talked about at this site. That's definitely what I'll do next
            time. However, you could do like me and just use your own informed
            judgment and nose. FYI, I took a taste of my whiskey tonight,
            at "barrel strength" (63% alc. by volume), and it tasted good. The
            rye flavor was especially noticeable (hot damn!). However, I think
            that learning when to make the cuts from an experienced person would
            have made my hillbilly pop even better, so I'm going to buy that book
            soon. Maybe you should too.

            3) Use a brewers yeast, not a wine or turbo yeast, and aim for about
            8% alcohol yield, give or take a few percent. That's all you're
            going to get unless you're an experienced barley wine brewer. Even
            then, you'd be lucky to get 11 or 12 percent. The yeast has an
            important effect on the flavor of your brew. Different strains
            produce different byproducts, so don't try to use champagne yeast to
            ferment something like barley malt unless you're just experimenting.

            4) Best advice for repairing the wash: get a beer-making book. I've
            read of many different ways to prepare the wash, but here's what I
            did in a nutshell to produce an 8% extract: I softened up my polenta
            (corn) and rye berries in a huge pot of filtered water. I brought
            the gruel to a boil, turned off the heat, stirred it up, wrapped it
            in a sleeping bag and let it sit for an hour. I then let the mash
            cool. When the temp had dropped to about 125F, I mixed in the malted
            barley. If I remember correctly, you need at least 10 or 12 percent
            of malted barley to have enough enzymes to break down the starch
            chains in your unmalted ingredients. I think I used about 14 percent.
            Anyhow, I kept the mash at about 125F for about twenty minutes, and
            then I added boiled, filtered water until the temp. increased to
            about 150F. I kept it there for about an hour or so until the starch
            had converted according to the iodine test (in all of the beer books).
            At this point, some people "mash out" (i.e. shut off enzyme activity)
            by bringing the temp. up to nearly boiling, but I didn't do that.
            People also say that this kills bacteria, but I didn't have any
            problems.

            5) The next step is "sparging." Essentially, you're just removing
            the good stuff from the garbage you don't want in your fermenter.
            Some whiskey brewers keep the grains in their fermenters, but hell, I
            don't want any methanol or other nasties in my brew. I don't know of
            any benefit from keeping the grains in the fermentor, but it
            definitely seems cheaper, so maybe that's the reason why. I don't
            really know for sure. Anyhow, I just ladled off the liquid, and then
            I put small batches of grain in a cheesecloth covered fermentation
            bucket which I poured 170 degree water over. I waited until the
            water filtered through, which still took a long time because the corn
            and barley was a thick, glutinous meal. But I managed. Next time,
            however, I will use the method where you successively pour hot water
            into the mash pot, wait awhile until you get a sweet liquid, and then
            decant.

            6) Jack Daniels chips -- no experience here.



            --- In Distillers@y..., "G&N" <glennnat@s...> wrote:
            > Tony ...or anybody else in this group i would like to try to make
            some
            > bourbon using my reflux still out of the corn... barley and rye
            ingredients
            > ....i havent got a pot still so i want to no if it can be done
            using my
            > reflux still? ...and how do i prepare the wash ingredients..i guess
            some
            > questions would be
            >
            > what yeast can i use ..ie turbo extra ?
            > do i need to carbon treat the spirit when i have distilled it or
            will it
            > take out all of the flavour?
            > are the jack daniels soaker chips enough to age and colour the
            spirit?
            > will it taste anything like the real thing?? ...anybody that can
            steer me in
            > the right direction ..i would be greatly appreciated......
            >
            > My best bourbon that i recon i have had to drink is 1.75 litres of
            Wild
            > Turkey mixed with 1 litre if still spirits kentucky Bourbon mix at
            > 40%.......mix the spirit with Pepsi Max out of the plastic
            bottles ..dont
            > use aluminium cans because the metal leaves a bad taste in the
            drink if the
            > cola has been in the can for a while ...Tastes just like mothers
            milk i
            > recon...all i need to do is make a spirit like Wild Turkey::))
            >
            >
            > Glenn
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: "Tony & Elle Ackland" <Tony.Ackland@c...>
            > To: "'Distillers newsgroup'" <Distillers@y...>
            > Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2001 1:24 PM
            > Subject: RE: [Distillers] Whats happinin
            >
            >
            > > Pilch,
            > >
            > > > Tony, what is wrong with our group?
            > > > Over the past couple of months I have noticed a massive change
            and it is
            > > > not for the good as I see it.
            > >
            > > I think its just different - but still good. We've seen heaps of
            stills
            > > constructed, of different styles. Wal has done a huge job on the
            > > flavouring side of things. Sure - theres less of the fundamental
            > questions
            > > being asked - like how should i pitch the yeast, or how do I
            build a
            > reflux
            > > still, but I'd say thats because the newbies are checking the old
            posts &
            > > web sites. The use of the "new distillers" group for these
            questions has
            > > grown heaps, and is doing well.
            > >
            > > > It appears that all the old ( as in original) members have
            either quit
            > > > or are sitting on the side line and I must say I don't blame
            them.
            > > > Lately all we seem to be getting is quotes from this book or
            that book
            > > > and it has nothing to do with getting the still to run
            perfectly or how
            > > > to build one. Don't get me wrong, I have gained a couple of
            valuable
            > > > bits of info out of all this but believe me, it was only a
            couple.
            > > > I have decided to join the rest of the old folk and sit on the
            side line
            > > > for a while until things start to turn around again.
            > >
            > > You'll get out of this group only what you put into it ....
            > >
            > > * describe all your experiments - good and bad, for others to
            learn from.
            > > What have you done differently in the last month ? Any new
            flavours
            > > you've tried ? Different aging techniques ? Run the still at a
            different
            > > reflux ratio ? Tried powering it off turtle dung ?
            > >
            > > * dream a little - and see if bouncing the ideas off the group
            can help it
            > > happen. Suggest something "out of the box" and see what comments
            it
            > starts
            > > off
            > >
            > > * answer the "simple" questions that come along, so that any
            question has
            > a
            > > miriad of replies, from all perspectives, not just a sole one
            > >
            > > * ask questions - is there nothing left you want to learn ? You
            might
            > have
            > > to ask a couple of times, phrased different ways, until it clicks
            off an
            > > answer by someone. Often, no one here knows the answer (eg we
            don't seem
            > > too strong on basic chemistry of the fusels ...), but thats life.
            > >
            > > If you start the ball rolling yourself, others will keep it
            happening.
            > >
            > > There is no "panel of experts" on this site, or hidden wisdom.
            No ones
            > > going to come forward with the single, correct version on "how to
            do it"
            > > and instruct from above. But theres a collective wisdom, of
            which we've
            > > each got a small corner that we may be good at, or have stumbled
            over
            > > during the self-teaching that takes place. But its only going to
            come out
            > > if everyone takes the effort to share their own part of it.
            > >
            > > I'm no expert on distilling. I'd only distill about 4-6 times a
            year.
            > > Doesn't say much for my experience level does it ? But I figure
            I've got
            > > an edge in helping explain the heat transfer / equilibrium /
            numbers side
            > > of things. So thats where I try to reply. The rest is just
            stuff that
            > > I've collected, and pasted into my site. But why am I often
            the only
            > > person bothering to answer the questions ? How many times have
            you not
            > > replied to something you could have helped shed some light on ?
            Ever seen
            > > a reply or explanation that you didn't agree with, but said
            nothing about
            > ?
            > >
            > > So - if you want discussions on running a still, ask many
            questions on the
            > > subject.
            > > Describe what you do yourself, and why.
            > > Probe the theories / stories / explanations until you're happy
            with them.
            > > Check out whats happening in the "New Distillers" group too ...
            > >
            > > What did you want to know about running a still ? Graeme is
            asking in the
            > > "new distillers" about how to run a Nixon-Stone column.
            > >
            > > Any specifc questions about the construction ? Hal in the "new
            > distillers"
            > > group has just asked all about sealing a lid to a pot - with the
            troubles
            > > he's been having - can you help him out ?
            > >
            > > Tony
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
            http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            > >
            > >
          • goyeast@yahoo.com
            Gad dumbit, that s CARBON TREATMENT, not CABIN TREATMENT. Yeah, that was my JFK Boston accent. Yeah, that s the ticket. Yeah, cabin treatment. ... some
            Message 5 of 9 , Oct 30, 2001
            • 0 Attachment
              Gad dumbit, that's CARBON TREATMENT, not CABIN TREATMENT. Yeah, that
              was my JFK Boston accent. Yeah, that's the ticket. Yeah, "cabin
              treatment."


              --- In Distillers@y..., "G&N" <glennnat@s...> wrote:
              > Tony ...or anybody else in this group i would like to try to make
              some
              > bourbon using my reflux still out of the corn... barley and rye
              ingredients
              > ....i havent got a pot still so i want to no if it can be done
              using my
              > reflux still? ...and how do i prepare the wash ingredients..i guess
              some
              > questions would be
              >
              > what yeast can i use ..ie turbo extra ?
              > do i need to carbon treat the spirit when i have distilled it or
              will it
              > take out all of the flavour?
              > are the jack daniels soaker chips enough to age and colour the
              spirit?
              > will it taste anything like the real thing?? ...anybody that can
              steer me in
              > the right direction ..i would be greatly appreciated......
              >
              > My best bourbon that i recon i have had to drink is 1.75 litres of
              Wild
              > Turkey mixed with 1 litre if still spirits kentucky Bourbon mix at
              > 40%.......mix the spirit with Pepsi Max out of the plastic
              bottles ..dont
              > use aluminium cans because the metal leaves a bad taste in the
              drink if the
              > cola has been in the can for a while ...Tastes just like mothers
              milk i
              > recon...all i need to do is make a spirit like Wild Turkey::))
              >
              >
              > Glenn
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: "Tony & Elle Ackland" <Tony.Ackland@c...>
              > To: "'Distillers newsgroup'" <Distillers@y...>
              > Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2001 1:24 PM
              > Subject: RE: [Distillers] Whats happinin
              >
              >
              > > Pilch,
              > >
              > > > Tony, what is wrong with our group?
              > > > Over the past couple of months I have noticed a massive change
              and it is
              > > > not for the good as I see it.
              > >
              > > I think its just different - but still good. We've seen heaps of
              stills
              > > constructed, of different styles. Wal has done a huge job on the
              > > flavouring side of things. Sure - theres less of the fundamental
              > questions
              > > being asked - like how should i pitch the yeast, or how do I
              build a
              > reflux
              > > still, but I'd say thats because the newbies are checking the old
              posts &
              > > web sites. The use of the "new distillers" group for these
              questions has
              > > grown heaps, and is doing well.
              > >
              > > > It appears that all the old ( as in original) members have
              either quit
              > > > or are sitting on the side line and I must say I don't blame
              them.
              > > > Lately all we seem to be getting is quotes from this book or
              that book
              > > > and it has nothing to do with getting the still to run
              perfectly or how
              > > > to build one. Don't get me wrong, I have gained a couple of
              valuable
              > > > bits of info out of all this but believe me, it was only a
              couple.
              > > > I have decided to join the rest of the old folk and sit on the
              side line
              > > > for a while until things start to turn around again.
              > >
              > > You'll get out of this group only what you put into it ....
              > >
              > > * describe all your experiments - good and bad, for others to
              learn from.
              > > What have you done differently in the last month ? Any new
              flavours
              > > you've tried ? Different aging techniques ? Run the still at a
              different
              > > reflux ratio ? Tried powering it off turtle dung ?
              > >
              > > * dream a little - and see if bouncing the ideas off the group
              can help it
              > > happen. Suggest something "out of the box" and see what comments
              it
              > starts
              > > off
              > >
              > > * answer the "simple" questions that come along, so that any
              question has
              > a
              > > miriad of replies, from all perspectives, not just a sole one
              > >
              > > * ask questions - is there nothing left you want to learn ? You
              might
              > have
              > > to ask a couple of times, phrased different ways, until it clicks
              off an
              > > answer by someone. Often, no one here knows the answer (eg we
              don't seem
              > > too strong on basic chemistry of the fusels ...), but thats life.
              > >
              > > If you start the ball rolling yourself, others will keep it
              happening.
              > >
              > > There is no "panel of experts" on this site, or hidden wisdom.
              No ones
              > > going to come forward with the single, correct version on "how to
              do it"
              > > and instruct from above. But theres a collective wisdom, of
              which we've
              > > each got a small corner that we may be good at, or have stumbled
              over
              > > during the self-teaching that takes place. But its only going to
              come out
              > > if everyone takes the effort to share their own part of it.
              > >
              > > I'm no expert on distilling. I'd only distill about 4-6 times a
              year.
              > > Doesn't say much for my experience level does it ? But I figure
              I've got
              > > an edge in helping explain the heat transfer / equilibrium /
              numbers side
              > > of things. So thats where I try to reply. The rest is just
              stuff that
              > > I've collected, and pasted into my site. But why am I often
              the only
              > > person bothering to answer the questions ? How many times have
              you not
              > > replied to something you could have helped shed some light on ?
              Ever seen
              > > a reply or explanation that you didn't agree with, but said
              nothing about
              > ?
              > >
              > > So - if you want discussions on running a still, ask many
              questions on the
              > > subject.
              > > Describe what you do yourself, and why.
              > > Probe the theories / stories / explanations until you're happy
              with them.
              > > Check out whats happening in the "New Distillers" group too ...
              > >
              > > What did you want to know about running a still ? Graeme is
              asking in the
              > > "new distillers" about how to run a Nixon-Stone column.
              > >
              > > Any specifc questions about the construction ? Hal in the "new
              > distillers"
              > > group has just asked all about sealing a lid to a pot - with the
              troubles
              > > he's been having - can you help him out ?
              > >
              > > Tony
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
              http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              > >
              > >
            • D. C.
              Message 6 of 9 , Oct 31, 2001
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                << I have found that 1 teaspoon of plain american white oak
                (chips/shavings/dust) in 1 litre of 40% for about 2 weeks adds, for me, just
                about the right amount of oak flavour. >>

                Sometimes I like to throw in a handful of chips in about 2 weeks before I
                distill. I then transfer the wash and the chips into the still and go to
                town. I have found that the oak absorbs (or at least makes me believe) some
                of the fusels that we try to cut. The chips also quickens the distillation
                times. The oak also adds some interesting flavor when using it this way.

                Your Brother in Magick,
                Rev. David M. Cunningham
                email@...

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              • D. C.
                I would also recommend
                Message 7 of 9 , Oct 31, 2001
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                  << Use a [beer] brewers yeast, not a wine or turbo yeast, and aim for about
                  8% alcohol yield, give or take a few percent. >>

                  I would also recommend experimenting with a combination of brewers yeast and
                  bakers yeast for an interesting "Old Style" flavor to your brew. I would
                  recommend starting out with 4-5 days with the bakers yeast and a pinch of
                  the brewer's yeast. Rack it off and pitch the brewers yeast in and sit on it
                  for about 2 weeks. You might need to add some sugar when you rack.
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