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Re: Trial Run on Reflx Column

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  • Harry
    ... One more point I forgot to mention. Propane is a fast heat source, but it s economy and efficiency is degraded if it s just a gas ring under a pot.
    Message 1 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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      --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
      wrote:
      >
      > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, suitcase1499@a... wrote:
      > >
      > > This was 50 liter turbo sugar wash and planning just a once
      > through job. I do
      > > some test on when to take the heart on some mostly by smell and
      > taste. I f I
      > > run it hotter I will lose alot of %ABV right ??? Thanks
      > >
      > > Suitcase
      >
      >
      >
      > Ok. There's a couple of things you need to get your head around.
      >
      > 1) The volume of a column is Pi x R^2 x Ht.
      <snip>


      One more point I forgot to mention. Propane is a fast heat source,
      but it's economy and efficiency is degraded if it's just a gas ring
      under a pot. Much heat is lost to the surrounding air. It really
      needs to be incorporated into some form of firebox. Surround the
      thing with fire-brick to direct all the heat to the pot bottom.
      Conversely, build a metal skirt with air draught holes so the flames
      get oxygen, yet the heat is trapped. You'll be amazed at how much
      quicker it heats the beer, as well as being somewhat safer. Of
      course it will reduce the amount of heat you'll have in the barn,
      but you've got internal heating with whiskey, no? :-))

      Slainte!
      regards Harry
    • suitcase1499@aol.com
      In a message dated 1/1/2005 7:52:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, ... OK Harry, You lost me there I m a dumbass country boy with a little education not a Masters
      Message 2 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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        In a message dated 1/1/2005 7:52:30 PM Eastern Standard Time,
        gnikomson2000@... writes:

        > Ok. There's a couple of things you need to get your head around.
        >
        > 1) The volume of a column is Pi x R^2 x Ht.



        OK Harry,
        You lost me there I'm a dumbass country boy with a little
        education not a Masters Degree (LOL) I have no idea what that means. and I do
        have a metal ring not fire brick just steel with air holes to direct the heat, a
        friend made it for me to fit the bottom of the keg. But it still helps heat
        the barn I have it in an enclosed stall of 8' x 12' with a lot of air holes
        believe me. Bottom line is how can I increase output would two columns do it or
        just need two stills.???? Thanks

        Oh yeah I do have that internal heat source for myself 86 proof plain sugar
        head : )

        Suitcase.


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      • Harry
        ... little ... means. and I do ... direct the heat, a ... helps heat ... air holes ... columns do it or ... plain sugar ... Sorry about the maths equation. The
        Message 3 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, suitcase1499@a... wrote:
          > OK Harry,
          > You lost me there I'm a dumbass country boy with a
          little
          > education not a Masters Degree (LOL) I have no idea what that
          means. and I do
          > have a metal ring not fire brick just steel with air holes to
          direct the heat, a
          > friend made it for me to fit the bottom of the keg. But it still
          helps heat
          > the barn I have it in an enclosed stall of 8' x 12' with a lot of
          air holes
          > believe me. Bottom line is how can I increase output would two
          columns do it or
          > just need two stills.???? Thanks
          >
          > Oh yeah I do have that internal heat source for myself 86 proof
          plain sugar
          > head : )
          >
          > Suitcase.


          Sorry about the maths equation. The reason I gave it is to explain
          why a small increase in column diameter gives such a large change in
          performance or output, which is the "bottom line answer" to your
          question. YOU NEED A BIGGER DIAMETER COLUMN to achieve bigger
          output. (not shouting, just emphasising) :-)

          All is relative. To increase output, you need to put more vapor up
          the column. This requires more applied heat. More heat requires an
          increase in column capacity, otherwise the vapor speed will increase
          also, and reduce your purity.

          The math on column capacity is easy to follow if you remember back
          to school when they taught about circles. There are formulae for
          circumference, area, cylinder volume (that's what we want).

          To explain: Pi is always 3.1416 (near enough). R is radius of
          column (half the diameter). ^2 is the previous number (radius)
          multiplied by itself. Ht is the height of the column.
          So for your column (cylinder) it's:
          Pi x R^2 x Ht
          3.1416 x 0.75" x 0.75" x 26" which gives 46 cubic inches.

          If you increase the column to 2", then:
          3.1416 x 1.0" x 1.0" x 26" which gives 81 cubic inches, nearly
          double the volume or capacity.

          This will enable you to increase the heat input without increasing
          the vapor speed. Then you'll get your increased product output and
          no loss of quality. But remember, all is relative. If you increase
          the heat, you need to remove that increased heat at the condenser,
          IOW up the coolant flowrate to match.

          Slainte!
          regards Harry
        • suitcase1499@aol.com
          In a message dated 1/1/2005 11:43:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, gnikomson2000@yahoo.com writes: This will enable you to increase the heat input without
          Message 4 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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            In a message dated 1/1/2005 11:43:05 PM Eastern Standard Time,
            gnikomson2000@... writes:

            This will enable you to increase the heat input without increasing
            the vapor speed. Then you'll get your increased product output and
            no loss of quality. But remember, all is relative. If you increase
            the heat, you need to remove that increased heat at the condenser,
            IOW up the coolant flowrate to match.

            Slainte!
            regards Harry



            My pump is a standard sump pump it recirculates the water at 25GPM or 1250
            GPH this should do Huh??? I'm thinking of going to a 3" or maybe 4" column, As
            all my friends are drunks as well (LOL) How much output could I expect from
            that??? Thanks Harry. This shit is new to me I've always been potstill man we
            never had a thermometer in one I don't think till I was about 16 or 18 years
            old.I'm from the mountains of North Carolina all we knew was corn liquor and now
            I'm trying to learn some new stuff to pass on to my grand kids. I really
            appreciate all you do to help, The internet is a graet thing since I've finally
            learned how to use it. Many thanks Harry.

            Suitcase


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Harry
            ... or 1250 ... I m thinking of going to a 3 or maybe 4 column, As ... expect from ... Thanks Harry. This shit is new to me I ve always been potstill man we
            Message 5 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, suitcase1499@a... wrote:
              > My pump is a standard sump pump it recirculates the water at 25GPM
              or 1250
              > GPH this should do Huh???



              >>>>>> Definitely.


              I'm thinking of going to a 3" or maybe 4" column, As
              > all my friends are drunks as well (LOL) How much output could I
              expect from
              > that???


              >>>>>>> Heh, do the math. ;-)


              Thanks Harry. This shit is new to me I've always been potstill man
              we
              > never had a thermometer in one I don't think till I was about 16
              or 18 years
              > old.I'm from the mountains of North Carolina all we knew was corn
              liquor and now
              > I'm trying to learn some new stuff to pass on to my grand kids.


              >>>>>>>>> If you want to leave a legacy, lose the liebig section and
              go to a proper reflux outfit with condenser to match. There's loads
              about coils, offset and crossflow heads in the archives and on
              Tony's site http://homedistiller.org
              Trust me, the grandkids will appreciate it.


              I really
              > appreciate all you do to help, The internet is a graet thing since
              I've finally
              > learned how to use it. Many thanks Harry.

              >>>>>>>>>>>> You're welcome. Just a word about that 3 or 4"
              column. Now you're getting into the realms of shall we say "above
              average" home distilling. ;-)
              You'll need to have a much larger surface area in the boiling wash
              for the larger volume of vapor to escape. A simple solution to that
              is to take said keg, turn it on it's SIDE, cut a hole in the side to
              match your salad bowl and big column, then put 2 or 3 burners or
              modified gaspipes under the thing. Of course you'll need to plate
              off the existing hole you've got. With a rig like that you could
              get a couple GALLONS per hour, but it's no longer a hobby thing, is
              it? :^)

              Slainte!
              regards Harry
            • suitcase1499@aol.com
              In a message dated 1/2/2005 12:14:54 AM Eastern Standard Time, ... go to a proper reflux outfit with condenser to match. There s loads about coils, offset and
              Message 6 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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                In a message dated 1/2/2005 12:14:54 AM Eastern Standard Time,
                gnikomson2000@... writes:

                >>>>>>>>> If you want to leave a legacy, lose the liebig section and
                go to a proper reflux outfit with condenser to match. There's loads
                about coils, offset and crossflow heads in the archives and on
                Tony's site http://homedistiller.org
                Trust me, the grandkids will appreciate it


                Do you mean like a Nixon Stone or something like Alex makes so as the vapor
                doesn't flow through the condensor , just the coolant and the vapor goes to it
                condeses and falls back down ??? As I said I'm just a dumbass country boy...
                Thanks Again Harry I really apreciate all your help. Excuse my spelling it's
                12:30 am here 1/2/05 I'm about half lit. : ) What time is it there.

                Suitcase


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