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## Re: [Distillers] Digest Number 1691

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• watts = Voltage * amp is Ohms law, this is correct as for the 220/110 volt thing I suggest a DPDT switch label one side start up or High, the other run
Message 1 of 7 , Feb 4, 2004
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watts = Voltage * amp is Ohms law, this is correct

as for the 220/110 volt thing I suggest a DPDT switch label one side "start
up" or High, the other "run" or Low or Simmer the wiring wont be too hard
I can send you a diagram. remember to properly ground the metal of the
still also, or you risk getting a zap.

IBEW 305 sparky

Steve

----- Original Message ----- From: "Brain Solenoid"
<brain_solenoid@...>
Subject: Re: Yet More Questions + Bigtime Thankyou to Alex

> Pardon my electrical ignorance here, but:
> If you use a 3000W element (240V) plugged into 120V supply do you
need any special requirements in the plug or cord. How many amps is
it?
>
> I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy
> Ben

Ben,
Watts = Volts x Amps, and since the Wattage is quartered when you
apply 110V to a 220/240V element, then:

(3000W / 4) / 120V = 6.25A

I'm not sparky, but that's the way it looks to me. The great Mike
Nixon explained why the Wattage is quartered, but I have that E-mail
on my home computer and not here.

BS
• (P)Watts = (I)Current times (E)voltage is the Power equation. Ohms Law is (E)Voltage = (I)Current times (R)Resistance A couple of things to look for. When I
Message 2 of 7 , Feb 4, 2004
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(P)Watts = (I)Current times (E)voltage is the Power equation.
Ohms Law is (E)Voltage = (I)Current times (R)Resistance

A couple of things to look for. When I was working on my Brewery, I
tried using a RIMS system at one time. It used a heating element in a
chamber which the wort was pumped (recirculated) through.

One thing I found was that different heating elements were rated at
different voltages. For Instance I saw 220V, 235V, and 240V. There
may be others as well.

To determine the resistance of the element, use ohms law.

for the 3000w element, I'll use the example of 220VAC.

E = I * R

P = I * E

If we rewrite Ohms law to solve for I we have I = E / R,

And substituting this in the power equation we have

P = (E / R) * R = E * E / R or P = E Square over R

Solving for R we have:

R = E * E / P = 220 * 220 / 3000 = 16.333 Ohms

Using this element at 110VAC one would see:

P = 110 * 110 / 16.333 = 750W

Now the tricky thing is that if the element had actually been rated
at 240V instead of 220V(fine print), the results would have been:

R= 240 * 240 / 3000 = 19.2 Ohms
P = 110 * 110 / 19.2 = 630W !

This is 120Watts less than expected.

In addition, I have seen a 15% variation in line voltage at my house
over the course of a month. So, be sure to measure your line voltage
occasionally. If you are running a marginal heating element this
could make things a bit sticky.

It is a good idea to read the fine print on the heating element
before you buy one to determine the actual rating of it at your
voltage.

Sven

--- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Steve" <kyoto@c...> wrote:
> watts = Voltage * amp is Ohms law, this is correct
>
> as for the 220/110 volt thing I suggest a DPDT switch label one
side "start
> up" or High, the other "run" or Low or Simmer the wiring wont be
too hard
> I can send you a diagram. remember to properly ground the metal of
the
> still also, or you risk getting a zap.
>
> IBEW 305 sparky
>
> Steve
>
...snip...
• \$10 dollars (american?) for less than a litre of Nectar which is to be fermented out sounds very expensive. You must truly love Authentic tequila.
Message 3 of 7 , Feb 4, 2004
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\$10 dollars (american?) for less than a litre of Nectar which is to be fermented out sounds very expensive.
You must truly love Authentic tequila.

Recommendations and lessons learned:
#1. The 5 gallon bucket is a better deal than ordering 6 quarts of
agave nectar. \$200 per 20 quarts versus \$100 for 6 quarts when
ordering jugs. Next time, I will go with a full bucket.

#2. Much of the flavor of tequila is in the heads. Be stingy with
how much of the heads you throw away.

#3. Don't try to stretch the run on the back side. Better to cut
tails too early than too late.

#4. 8 kg of agave nectar won't give you the same yield as 8 kg of
sugar.

#5. If you try the agave nectar route, it WILL make good tequila! :)

best regards,
Tar
sipping on a shot glass full of "El Mulo Blanco Mojo Tarquila" as he
types this message :-)
• ... it is definitely not cheap and agave prices continue their boom and bust fluctuations much like coffee has for hundreds of years. However we pay such a
Message 4 of 7 , Feb 4, 2004
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On Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 06:42:03AM +0800, Murphy-Marsh, Leigh wrote:
> \$10 dollars (american?) for less than a litre of Nectar which is to be fermented out sounds very expensive.
> You must truly love Authentic tequila.

it is definitely not cheap and agave prices continue their boom and bust
fluctuations much like coffee has for hundreds of years. However we pay
such a large tax on distilled spirits in the US (approx 58% of retail
price goes to taxes) that even as a niche hobby, it's still worth it :)

Plus, while it lacks the romanticism and of course the full flavor of a
true 100% agave tequila, you could cut the sugar a bit using honey, or
even refined sugar. Make a tradeoff, e.g.: 70/30 agave/sugar.

-Matt sf

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
• ... be fermented out sounds very expensive. ... Yes and yes! The demand for tequila and problems with agave crops and meeting demand has driven tequila prices
Message 5 of 7 , Feb 4, 2004
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--- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Murphy-Marsh, Leigh"
<Leigh.Murphy-Marsh@w...> wrote:
> \$10 dollars (american?) for less than a litre of Nectar which is to
be fermented out sounds very expensive.
> You must truly love Authentic tequila.

Yes and yes!

The demand for tequila and problems with agave crops and meeting
demand has driven tequila prices sky high. So yes, you can expect to
pay up for the fixin's if you want to experiment with making
authentic tequila.

Since a quart of agave nectar yields roughly a quart of tequila, it
is still a bargain at \$10 a quart. Heck, it was a bargain at \$20 a
quart!
• Hello Sven, Wednesday, February 4, 2004, 8:36:36 AM, you wrote: One thing I would like to add to this is that the resistance of most heating (nichrome) wire
Message 6 of 7 , Feb 7, 2004
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Hello Sven,

Wednesday, February 4, 2004, 8:36:36 AM, you wrote:

One thing I would like to add to this is that the resistance of most
heating (nichrome) wire changes with temperature. So the resistance
that you measure at room temperature is most likely 5% lower than
what it will be at the elements operating temperature. The only real
way to know what true wattage you are getting is to measure the
current and voltage at the elements operating temperature.

V X I = W.

SP> (P)Watts = (I)Current times (E)voltage is the Power equation.
SP> Ohms Law is (E)Voltage = (I)Current times (R)Resistance

SP> A couple of things to look for. When I was working on my Brewery, I
SP> tried using a RIMS system at one time. It used a heating element in a
SP> chamber which the wort was pumped (recirculated) through.

SP> One thing I found was that different heating elements were rated at
SP> different voltages. For Instance I saw 220V, 235V, and 240V. There
SP> may be others as well.

SP> To determine the resistance of the element, use ohms law.

SP> for the 3000w element, I'll use the example of 220VAC.

SP> E = I * R

SP> P = I * E

SP> If we rewrite Ohms law to solve for I we have I = E / R,

SP> And substituting this in the power equation we have

SP> P = (E / R) * R = E * E / R or P = E Square over R

SP> Solving for R we have:

SP> R = E * E / P = 220 * 220 / 3000 = 16.333 Ohms

SP> Using this element at 110VAC one would see:

SP> P = 110 * 110 / 16.333 = 750W

SP> Now the tricky thing is that if the element had actually been rated
SP> at 240V instead of 220V(fine print), the results would have been:

SP> R= 240 * 240 / 3000 = 19.2 Ohms
SP> P = 110 * 110 / 19.2 = 630W !

SP> This is 120Watts less than expected.

SP> In addition, I have seen a 15% variation in line voltage at my house
SP> over the course of a month. So, be sure to measure your line voltage
SP> occasionally. If you are running a marginal heating element this
SP> could make things a bit sticky.

SP> It is a good idea to read the fine print on the heating element
SP> before you buy one to determine the actual rating of it at your
SP> voltage.

SP> Sven

SP> --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Steve" <kyoto@c...> wrote:
>> watts = Voltage * amp is Ohms law, this is correct
>>
>> as for the 220/110 volt thing I suggest a DPDT switch label one
SP> side "start
>> up" or High, the other "run" or Low or Simmer the wiring wont be
SP> too hard
>> I can send you a diagram. remember to properly ground the metal of
SP> the
>> still also, or you risk getting a zap.
>>
>> IBEW 305 sparky
>>
>> Steve
>>
SP> ...snip...

--
Best regards,
John mailto:nicol@...
• True, however the heating elements are rated under load. That is why I calculated the effective resistance from the boiler-plate voltage and power rating of
Message 7 of 7 , Feb 7, 2004
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True, however the heating elements are rated under load. That is why
I calculated the effective resistance from the boiler-plate voltage
and power rating of the element.

I suspect this is also why the resistance is not on the boiler-plate.

Sven
--- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, John Nicol <nicol@h...> wrote:
> Hello Sven,
>
> Wednesday, February 4, 2004, 8:36:36 AM, you wrote:
>
> One thing I would like to add to this is that the resistance of most
> heating (nichrome) wire changes with temperature. So the resistance
> that you measure at room temperature is most likely 5% lower than
> what it will be at the elements operating temperature. The only
real
> way to know what true wattage you are getting is to measure the
> current and voltage at the elements operating temperature.
>
> V X I = W.
>
>
...snip...
>
> --
> Best regards,
> John mailto:nicol@h...
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