Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [Distillers] Re: L-o-n-g columns! Anyone ?

Expand Messages
  • BOKAKOB
    You already have it. If you reduce the heat input in your boiler to the point that you don t use cooling water, then you have what you want. stronkus2003
    Message 1 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
    • 0 Attachment
      You already have it. If you reduce the heat input in your boiler to the point that you don't use cooling water, then you have what you want.

      stronkus2003 <stronkus2003@...> wrote:Is it possible to build a fractionating still without any reflux and get the same quality and output? It would be a lot easier to build and probably easier to run. Or? Regards Stronk



      I can be wrong I must say
      Cheers, Alex...



      ---------------------------------
      Do you Yahoo!?
      Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • stronkus2003
      Yes I realise that, I am just beeing curious that maybe it would be an easy way to go to build a column without a reflux head and use the available space to
      Message 2 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
      • 0 Attachment
        Yes I realise that, I am just beeing curious that maybe it would be
        an easy way to go to build a column without a reflux head and use the
        available space to build a taller column and get a good result. Or am
        I totally getting it wrong?

        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, BOKAKOB <bokakob@y...> wrote:
        > You already have it. If you reduce the heat input in your boiler to
        the point that you don't use cooling water, then you have what you
        want.
        >
        > stronkus2003 <stronkus2003@y...> wrote:Is it possible to build a
        fractionating still without any reflux and get the same quality and
        output? It would be a lot easier to build and probably easier to run.
        Or? Regards Stronk
        >
        >
        >
        > I can be wrong I must say
        > Cheers, Alex...
        >
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > Do you Yahoo!?
        > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • homedistiller
        Stronkus, you absolutely have a right clue, but reflux is always necessary! Heightening a column creates the possibility of increasing the amount of stages.
        Message 3 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
        • 0 Attachment
          Stronkus, you absolutely have a right clue, but reflux is always
          necessary!

          Heightening a column creates the possibility of increasing the amount
          of stages.
          More stages means less reflux necessary for the same purity.
          Less reflux will result in much greater efficiency.

          Again I refer to:
          http://persephone.agcom.purdue.edu/AgCom/Pubs/AE/AE-117.html

          Check table 4

          Less reflux demands more stages, but will reward you with less energy
          consumption, smaller columns and less distilling time.

          Regards,
          Dirk






          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003" <stronkus2003@y...>
          wrote:
          > Yes I realise that, I am just beeing curious that maybe it would be
          > an easy way to go to build a column without a reflux head and use
          the
          > available space to build a taller column and get a good result. Or
          am
          > I totally getting it wrong?
          >
          > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, BOKAKOB <bokakob@y...> wrote:
          > > You already have it. If you reduce the heat input in your boiler
          to
          > the point that you don't use cooling water, then you have what you
          > want.
          > >
          > > stronkus2003 <stronkus2003@y...> wrote:Is it possible to build a
          > fractionating still without any reflux and get the same quality and
          > output? It would be a lot easier to build and probably easier to
          run.
          > Or? Regards Stronk
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > I can be wrong I must say
          > > Cheers, Alex...
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > ---------------------------------
          > > Do you Yahoo!?
          > > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
          > >
          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • stronkus2003
          Hi Dirk, what I am thinking is that since most of us have a limited height to use, the primary concern when building should be to build a column head as short
          Message 4 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi Dirk, what I am thinking is that since most of us have a limited
            height to use, the primary concern when building should be to build a
            column head as short as ever possible to get a column as high as
            possible and that total reflux control should be secondary.

            Hm time to go home and rebuild again.....

            Regards

            Stronk

            --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "homedistiller"
            <homedistiller@y...> wrote:
            > Stronkus, you absolutely have a right clue, but reflux is always
            > necessary!
            >
            > Heightening a column creates the possibility of increasing the
            amount
            > of stages.
            > More stages means less reflux necessary for the same purity.
            > Less reflux will result in much greater efficiency.
            >
            > Again I refer to:
            > http://persephone.agcom.purdue.edu/AgCom/Pubs/AE/AE-117.html
            >
            > Check table 4
            >
            > Less reflux demands more stages, but will reward you with less
            energy
            > consumption, smaller columns and less distilling time.
            >
            > Regards,
            > Dirk
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003"
            <stronkus2003@y...>
            > wrote:
            > > Yes I realise that, I am just beeing curious that maybe it would
            be
            > > an easy way to go to build a column without a reflux head and use
            > the
            > > available space to build a taller column and get a good result. Or
            > am
            > > I totally getting it wrong?
            > >
            > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, BOKAKOB <bokakob@y...> wrote:
            > > > You already have it. If you reduce the heat input in your boiler
            > to
            > > the point that you don't use cooling water, then you have what
            you
            > > want.
            > > >
            > > > stronkus2003 <stronkus2003@y...> wrote:Is it possible to build
            a
            > > fractionating still without any reflux and get the same quality
            and
            > > output? It would be a lot easier to build and probably easier to
            > run.
            > > Or? Regards Stronk
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > I can be wrong I must say
            > > > Cheers, Alex...
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > ---------------------------------
            > > > Do you Yahoo!?
            > > > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
            > > >
            > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • homedistiller
            Stronk, I m afraid that just a few centimeters extra won t benefit THAT much. You can also look at it like this: that relatively small hole in the
            Message 5 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
            • 0 Attachment
              Stronk,

              I'm afraid that just a few centimeters extra won't benefit THAT much.

              You can also look at it like this: that relatively small hole in the
              ceiling/floor can easily provide for a double high column and even
              provide a much better acces to the reflux and distillate collection
              area!

              Dirk



              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003" <stronkus2003@y...>
              wrote:
              > Hi Dirk, what I am thinking is that since most of us have a limited
              > height to use, the primary concern when building should be to build
              a
              > column head as short as ever possible to get a column as high as
              > possible and that total reflux control should be secondary.
              >
              > Hm time to go home and rebuild again.....
              >
              > Regards
              >
              > Stronk
            • stronkus2003
              I am sure You are right but another small parameter to be concerned is the relatively small but crucial hole I will obtain in my head if the wife sees a column
              Message 6 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
              • 0 Attachment
                I am sure You are right but another small parameter to be concerned
                is the relatively small but crucial hole I will obtain in my head if
                the wife sees a column emerge from the cellar into the kitchen...;-)

                Regards Stronk

                --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "homedistiller"
                <homedistiller@y...> wrote:
                > Stronk,
                >
                > I'm afraid that just a few centimeters extra won't benefit THAT
                much.
                >
                > You can also look at it like this: that relatively small hole in
                the
                > ceiling/floor can easily provide for a double high column and even
                > provide a much better acces to the reflux and distillate collection
                > area!
                >
                > Dirk
                >
                >
                >
                > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003"
                <stronkus2003@y...>
                > wrote:
                > > Hi Dirk, what I am thinking is that since most of us have a
                limited
                > > height to use, the primary concern when building should be to
                build
                > a
                > > column head as short as ever possible to get a column as high as
                > > possible and that total reflux control should be secondary.
                > >
                > > Hm time to go home and rebuild again.....
                > >
                > > Regards
                > >
                > > Stronk
              • homedistiller
                (LOL) Even better! To avoid that (indeed very crucial!) small hole in your head, (you could try to) explain your wife that you will extend the column even
                Message 7 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
                • 0 Attachment
                  (LOL) Even better!

                  To avoid that (indeed very crucial!) small hole in your head, (you
                  could try to) explain your wife that you will extend the column even
                  higher!

                  You could even let her choose the colour of the surrounding box, that
                  is absolutely necessary to insulate the column!

                  Regards,
                  Dirk


                  --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003" <stronkus2003@y...>
                  wrote:
                  > I am sure You are right but another small parameter to be concerned
                  > is the relatively small but crucial hole I will obtain in my head
                  if
                  > the wife sees a column emerge from the cellar into the kitchen...;-)
                  >
                  > Regards Stronk
                • w_upnorth
                  Is it possible or reasonable to build a horizontal condenser? Say a 25mm T adapted to 50mm pipe with a condenser inside cap on the end with a small relief
                  Message 8 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Is it possible or reasonable to build a horizontal condenser? Say a
                    25mm "T" adapted to
                    50mm pipe with a condenser inside cap on the end with a small relief
                    hole, a slight angel to flow
                    product towards needle valves for reflux and take off. Would the
                    gained height in the column be worth it?


                    --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003" <stronkus2003@y...>
                    wrote:
                    > Hi Dirk, what I am thinking is that since most of us have a limited
                    > height to use, the primary concern when building should be to build a
                    > column head as short as ever possible to get a column as high as
                    > possible and that total reflux control should be secondary.
                    >
                    > Hm time to go home and rebuild again.....
                    >
                    > Regards
                    >
                    > Stronk
                    >
                    > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "homedistiller"
                    > <homedistiller@y...> wrote:
                    > > Stronkus, you absolutely have a right clue, but reflux is always
                    > > necessary!
                    > >
                    > > Heightening a column creates the possibility of increasing the
                    > amount
                    > > of stages.
                    > > More stages means less reflux necessary for the same purity.
                    > > Less reflux will result in much greater efficiency.
                    > >
                    > > Again I refer to:
                    > > http://persephone.agcom.purdue.edu/AgCom/Pubs/AE/AE-117.html
                    > >
                    > > Check table 4
                    > >
                    > > Less reflux demands more stages, but will reward you with less
                    > energy
                    > > consumption, smaller columns and less distilling time.
                    > >
                    > > Regards,
                    > > Dirk
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003"
                    > <stronkus2003@y...>
                    > > wrote:
                    > > > Yes I realise that, I am just beeing curious that maybe it would
                    > be
                    > > > an easy way to go to build a column without a reflux head and use
                    > > the
                    > > > available space to build a taller column and get a good result. Or
                    > > am
                    > > > I totally getting it wrong?
                    > > >
                    > > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, BOKAKOB <bokakob@y...> wrote:
                    > > > > You already have it. If you reduce the heat input in your boiler
                    > > to
                    > > > the point that you don't use cooling water, then you have what
                    > you
                    > > > want.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > stronkus2003 <stronkus2003@y...> wrote:Is it possible to build
                    > a
                    > > > fractionating still without any reflux and get the same quality
                    > and
                    > > > output? It would be a lot easier to build and probably easier to
                    > > run.
                    > > > Or? Regards Stronk
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > > I can be wrong I must say
                    > > > > Cheers, Alex...
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > > ---------------------------------
                    > > > > Do you Yahoo!?
                    > > > > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
                    > > > >
                    > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • abbababbaccc
                    Assuming you build a column without reflux head and have it properly insulated there s no reflux and the result is essentially the same as no column at all.
                    Message 9 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Assuming you build a column without reflux head and have it properly
                      insulated there's no reflux and the result is essentially the same as
                      no column at all. Uninsulated column let's vapors condense on the
                      column inner surface and provides reflux that way. However, it's not
                      as efficient as having all the reflux appear at the top of the
                      packing and flow down. Top down approach utilizes all the packing for
                      re-evaporation and recondensing cycle while sidecondensing utilizes
                      only part of the packing (not to mention channeling at the column
                      surface) and somewhat disturbs the equilibrium.

                      BTW, my LM rig has 1.4 meters of packing and it works well with low
                      reflux ratios.

                      Greetz, Riku

                      --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003" <stronkus2003@y...>
                      wrote:
                      > Yes I realise that, I am just beeing curious that maybe it would be
                      > an easy way to go to build a column without a reflux head and use
                      the
                      > available space to build a taller column and get a good result. Or
                      am
                      > I totally getting it wrong?
                      >
                      > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, BOKAKOB <bokakob@y...> wrote:
                      > > You already have it. If you reduce the heat input in your boiler
                      to
                      > the point that you don't use cooling water, then you have what you
                      > want.
                      > >
                      > > stronkus2003 <stronkus2003@y...> wrote:Is it possible to build a
                      > fractionating still without any reflux and get the same quality and
                      > output? It would be a lot easier to build and probably easier to
                      run.
                      > Or? Regards Stronk
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > I can be wrong I must say
                      > > Cheers, Alex...
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > ---------------------------------
                      > > Do you Yahoo!?
                      > > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
                      > >
                      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • BOKAKOB
                      in my opinion simply put - NO w_upnorth wrote: Is it possible or reasonable to build a horizontal condenser? Say a 25mm T adapted to
                      Message 10 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
                      • 0 Attachment
                        in my opinion simply put - NO

                        w_upnorth <w_upnorth@...> wrote:
                        Is it possible or reasonable to build a horizontal condenser? Say a
                        25mm "T" adapted to
                        50mm pipe with a condenser inside cap on the end with a small relief
                        hole, a slight angel to flow
                        product towards needle valves for reflux and take off. Would the
                        gained height in the column be worth it?


                        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003" <stronkus2003@y...>
                        wrote:
                        > Hi Dirk, what I am thinking is that since most of us have a limited
                        > height to use, the primary concern when building should be to build a
                        > column head as short as ever possible to get a column as high as
                        > possible and that total reflux control should be secondary.
                        >
                        > Hm time to go home and rebuild again.....
                        >
                        > Regards
                        >
                        > Stronk
                        >
                        > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "homedistiller"
                        > <homedistiller@y...> wrote:
                        > > Stronkus, you absolutely have a right clue, but reflux is always
                        > > necessary!
                        > >
                        > > Heightening a column creates the possibility of increasing the
                        > amount
                        > > of stages.
                        > > More stages means less reflux necessary for the same purity.
                        > > Less reflux will result in much greater efficiency.
                        > >
                        > > Again I refer to:
                        > > http://persephone.agcom.purdue.edu/AgCom/Pubs/AE/AE-117.html
                        > >
                        > > Check table 4
                        > >
                        > > Less reflux demands more stages, but will reward you with less
                        > energy
                        > > consumption, smaller columns and less distilling time.
                        > >
                        > > Regards,
                        > > Dirk
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "stronkus2003"
                        > <stronkus2003@y...>
                        > > wrote:
                        > > > Yes I realise that, I am just beeing curious that maybe it would
                        > be
                        > > > an easy way to go to build a column without a reflux head and use
                        > > the
                        > > > available space to build a taller column and get a good result. Or
                        > > am
                        > > > I totally getting it wrong?
                        > > >
                        > > > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, BOKAKOB <bokakob@y...> wrote:
                        > > > > You already have it. If you reduce the heat input in your boiler
                        > > to
                        > > > the point that you don't use cooling water, then you have what
                        > you
                        > > > want.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > stronkus2003 <stronkus2003@y...> wrote:Is it possible to build
                        > a
                        > > > fractionating still without any reflux and get the same quality
                        > and
                        > > > output? It would be a lot easier to build and probably easier to
                        > > run.
                        > > > Or? Regards Stronk
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > I can be wrong I must say
                        > > > > Cheers, Alex...
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > ---------------------------------
                        > > > > Do you Yahoo!?
                        > > > > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
                        > > > >
                        > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


                        Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT

                        To unsubscribe from this group send a blank email to distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        Distillers list archives : http://archive.nnytech.net/
                        FAQ and other information at http://homedistiller.org

                        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.




                        I can be wrong I must say
                        Cheers, Alex...



                        ---------------------------------
                        Do you Yahoo!?
                        Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Mike Nixon
                        w_upnorth wrote: Subject: [Distillers] Re: L-o-n-g columns! Anyone ? Is it possible or reasonable to build a horizontal condenser? Say a 25mm T adapted to
                        Message 11 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
                        • 0 Attachment
                          w_upnorth wrote:
                          Subject: [Distillers] Re: L-o-n-g columns! Anyone ?

                          Is it possible or reasonable to build a horizontal condenser? Say a 25mm "T"
                          adapted to 50mm pipe with a condenser inside cap on the end with a small
                          relief hole, a slight angel to flow product towards needle valves for reflux
                          and take off. Would the
                          gained height in the column be worth it?
                          =========================
                          Perfectly feasible. Just ensure that you do have that slight angle so the
                          liquid runs the way you want it to.
                          The coils used in the recent experiments with air cooling are just that, and
                          occupy far less space than an equivalent length of straight tubing.

                          Mike N
                        • nanosleep
                          It seems like a lot of trouble for not much return. Why not just distill twice? Instant doubling of the column height!!!! ... 25mm T ... for reflux ... so
                          Message 12 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
                          • 0 Attachment
                            It seems like a lot of trouble for not much return.

                            Why not just distill twice? Instant doubling of the column height!!!!


                            --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Nixon" <mike@s...> wrote:
                            > w_upnorth wrote:
                            > Subject: [Distillers] Re: L-o-n-g columns! Anyone ?
                            >
                            > Is it possible or reasonable to build a horizontal condenser? Say a
                            25mm "T"
                            > adapted to 50mm pipe with a condenser inside cap on the end with a small
                            > relief hole, a slight angel to flow product towards needle valves
                            for reflux
                            > and take off. Would the
                            > gained height in the column be worth it?
                            > =========================
                            > Perfectly feasible. Just ensure that you do have that slight angle
                            so the
                            > liquid runs the way you want it to.
                            > The coils used in the recent experiments with air cooling are just
                            that, and
                            > occupy far less space than an equivalent length of straight tubing.
                            >
                            > Mike N
                          • Mike Nixon
                            nanosleep wrote: Subject: [Distillers] Re: L-o-n-g columns! Anyone ? It seems like a lot of trouble for not much return. Why not just distill twice? Instant
                            Message 13 of 18 , Dec 1, 2003
                            • 0 Attachment
                              nanosleep wrote:
                              Subject: [Distillers] Re: L-o-n-g columns! Anyone ?

                              It seems like a lot of trouble for not much return.

                              Why not just distill twice? Instant doubling of the column height!!!!
                              =======================
                              Because it is a hobby, NS. Part of the enjoyment of a hobby, for me anyway,
                              is seeing if I can push the boundaries of our knowledge a bit further.
                              Gardeners spend years looking for the perfect rose. Sports people seek to
                              beat their own personal best records. It's fun! :-)

                              All the best,
                              Mike N
                              =======================

                              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Nixon" <mike@s...> wrote:
                              > w_upnorth wrote:
                              > Subject: [Distillers] Re: L-o-n-g columns! Anyone ?
                              >
                              > Is it possible or reasonable to build a horizontal condenser? Say a
                              25mm "T"
                              > adapted to 50mm pipe with a condenser inside cap on the end with a small
                              > relief hole, a slight angel to flow product towards needle valves
                              for reflux
                              > and take off. Would the
                              > gained height in the column be worth it?
                              > =========================
                              > Perfectly feasible. Just ensure that you do have that slight angle
                              so the
                              > liquid runs the way you want it to.
                              > The coils used in the recent experiments with air cooling are just
                              that, and
                              > occupy far less space than an equivalent length of straight tubing.
                              >
                              > Mike N


                              Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                              ADVERTISEMENT




                              To unsubscribe from this group send a blank email to
                              distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                              Distillers list archives : http://archive.nnytech.net/
                              FAQ and other information at http://homedistiller.org

                              Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                            • homedistiller
                              Nanosleep, It depends what one likes. I really would enjoy an entire batch being finished in one hour! I really would enjoy a small-diameter-continuous-still
                              Message 14 of 18 , Dec 2, 2003
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Nanosleep,

                                It depends what one likes.

                                I really would enjoy an entire batch being finished in one hour!

                                I really would enjoy a small-diameter-continuous-still of, let's say,
                                5 or 6 meters high, nicely chugging along!

                                Wouldn't you ?

                                Regards,
                                Dirk





                                --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "nanosleep" <nanosleep@y...> wrote:
                                > It seems like a lot of trouble for not much return.
                                >
                                > Why not just distill twice? Instant doubling of the column
                                height!!!!
                              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.