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Plastic storage vessels

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  • aussiroo
    I have been using PET bottles for storing both 95% spirit and final flavoured spirit. Soda water bottles and the type of bottle used by water providers , the
    Message 1 of 7 , Nov 23, 2003
      I have been using PET bottles for storing both 95% spirit and final
      flavoured spirit. Soda water bottles and the type of bottle used by
      water providers , the 15 liter type that are seen in most work places.

      I recall seeing somewhere that PET is OK for this purpose but have
      recently heard some contrary ideas expressed by others. The view
      expressed was that there is definatly some nasties leached ,
      especially if the plastic has had any UV exposure and that the
      contaminants are the type which the Human body is unable to eliminate.

      Perhaps the chemists among us can clear this up please.

      Aussiroo
    • Robert Elliott
      These emails arrived at my work email address some time ago. Please read BOTH emails. (I too use PET bottles for that purpose and many more) Cheers, Bob. ...
      Message 2 of 7 , Nov 24, 2003
        These emails arrived at my work email address some time ago. Please read
        BOTH emails. (I too use PET bottles for that purpose and many more)

        Cheers,

        Bob.

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Mitch Jakeman [mailto:Mitch.Jakeman@...]
        Sent: Monday, 29 September 2003 2:04 PM
        To: BCO ACA Employees; Callide Managers; Capcoal Snr Management;
        Dartbrook SMT; Drayton SMT; Grasstree Managers; MNC SMT; Moura - SMT

        Subject: OH&S Info - Re-using water bottles



        Safety at home - PLEASE SHARE THIS INFORMATION



        For your health and safety.

        "Many are unaware of poisoning caused by re-using plastic bottles.
        Some of you may be in the habit of using and re-using your disposable
        mineral water bottles (eg. Evian, Aqua, Ice Mountain, Vita, etc),
        keeping them in your car or at work. Not a good idea. In a nutshell,
        the plastic (called polyethylene terephthalate or PET) used in these
        bottles contains a potentially carcinogenic element (something called
        diethylhydroxylamine or DEHA). The bottles are safe for one-time use
        only; if you must keep them longer, it should be or no more than a few
        days, a week max, and keep them away from heat as well. Repeated
        washing and rinsing can cause the plastic to break down and the
        carcinogens (cancer-causing chemical agents) can leach into the water
        that YOU are drinking. Better to invest in water bottles that are
        really meant for multiple uses. This is not something we should be
        scrimping on. Those of you with family - please advise them,
        especially children."








        From SHREC at BCO - ACA.





        -----Original Message-----
        From: Stephen R. Kay [mailto:skay@...]
        Sent: Thursday, 2 October 2003 2:46 AM
        To: Bernard.Jansen@...
        Subject: bottled water containers


        Per your email concerning plastic bottled water containers, the US Food and
        Drug Administration (FDA) regulates bottled water as a packaged food product
        and, for bottled water and all other foods and their packaging, FDA has
        determined that PET meets standards for food contact materials. The basis
        for the email you had received was from, as I understand, a college
        student's masters thesis that was not subject to peer review and did not
        reflect a level of scientific rigor that would provide accurate and reliable
        information about the safety of these products. Fortunately, FDA requires a
        much higher standard to make decisions about food contact packaging. DEHA,
        as mentioned in your email is neither regulated nor classified as a human
        carcinogen. Further, DEHA is not inherent in PET plastic as raw material,
        byproduct or decomposition product. DEHA has been cleared by FDA for food
        contact applications and would not pose a health risk even if present. DEHA
        is a common plasticizer used in many plastic items, many of which are found
        in the lab setting. For this reason, the student's detection (see comment
        above) is likely to have been the result of inadvertent lab contamination.


        Also note that PET plastics used for bottled water containers are not unique
        to this product type and is the same as PET plastics used to package other
        common foods and beverages.


        I hope that this information is helpful.

        --Stephen Kay, IBWA

        Stephen R. Kay
        Vice President, Communications
        International Bottled Water Association (IBWA)
        1700 Diagonal Road, Suite 650
        Alexandria, VA 22314-2844
        phone: 703-683-5213
        fax: 703-683-4074
        e-mail: skay@...
        web: www.bottledwater.org




        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "aussiroo" <aussiroo@...>
        To: <Distillers@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 5:23 PM
        Subject: [Distillers] Plastic storage vessels


        I have been using PET bottles for storing both 95% spirit and final
        flavoured spirit. Soda water bottles and the type of bottle used by
        water providers , the 15 liter type that are seen in most work places.

        I recall seeing somewhere that PET is OK for this purpose but have
        recently heard some contrary ideas expressed by others. The view
        expressed was that there is definatly some nasties leached ,
        especially if the plastic has had any UV exposure and that the
        contaminants are the type which the Human body is unable to eliminate.

        Perhaps the chemists among us can clear this up please.

        Aussiroo








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      • jimpuchai
        ... places. ... eliminate. ... Perhaps some info here: http://www.ttb.gov/alcohol/info/revrule/rules/82-12.htm Jim
        Message 3 of 7 , Nov 24, 2003
          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "aussiroo" <aussiroo@y...> wrote:
          > I have been using PET bottles for storing both 95% spirit and final
          > flavoured spirit. Soda water bottles and the type of bottle used by
          > water providers , the 15 liter type that are seen in most work
          places.
          >
          > I recall seeing somewhere that PET is OK for this purpose but have
          > recently heard some contrary ideas expressed by others. The view
          > expressed was that there is definatly some nasties leached ,
          > especially if the plastic has had any UV exposure and that the
          > contaminants are the type which the Human body is unable to
          eliminate.
          >
          > Perhaps the chemists among us can clear this up please.
          >
          > Aussiroo

          Perhaps some info here:

          http://www.ttb.gov/alcohol/info/revrule/rules/82-12.htm

          Jim
        • peter_vcb
          i have heard PET is ok up to 40%. try diluting some of your 96% stuff in water and see if any plastic comes out of solution i.e. it will go cloudy if it has
          Message 4 of 7 , Nov 24, 2003
            i have heard PET is ok up to 40%. try diluting some of your 96% stuff
            in water and see if any plastic comes out of solution i.e. it will go
            cloudy if it has plastic.
            everything seems to be carcinogenic these days, i gave up worrying a
            long time ago. god forbid the industrial strength poisonous solvent
            that you are drinking by the pint has traces of plastic in it!

            Peter
          • Eric
            ... a ... hahah, Amen. I was considering using Mouthwash bottles that are cleand out really well, since they usually contain about 20%+/- alcohol by weight
            Message 5 of 7 , Nov 24, 2003
              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "peter_vcb" <viciousblackout@y...>
              wrote:
              > everything seems to be carcinogenic these days, i gave up worrying
              a
              > long time ago. god forbid the industrial strength poisonous solvent
              > that you are drinking by the pint has traces of plastic in it!
              >
              > Peter

              hahah, Amen.

              I was considering using Mouthwash bottles that are cleand out really
              well, since they usually contain about 20%+/- alcohol by weight
              anyway, and PETE bottles are used for liqour according to
              http://www.solidwaste.org/reccodes.htm and they hold 1L to 1.75L on
              average


              PETE
              Polyethylene terephthalate

              Typical Products:
              Bottles: (soft drink-with or without Code 1 sysmbol), honey, liquor,
              dish detergent, antacid, cold medicine, some ovenable food trays,
              peanut butter jars.

              Features:
              High strength, high resistance

              Appearance:
              Transparent with high gloss; clear or colored; no seams; injection
              molding nub on bottom or opaque with dull finish.

              Physical Properties:
              Tough; highly resilient, slick surface; semi-rigid; hard to scratch;
              sinks in water.

              SPI Code:
              1
              PETE
            • Hector A. Landaeta C.
              Hola! I used to work in a plastics plant and read a lot of documentation (to catch up with the chem. eng.¹s jargon) on it, also a German trade magazine I¹m
              Message 6 of 7 , Nov 25, 2003
                Hola!
                I used to work in a plastics plant and read a lot of documentation (to catch
                up with the chem. eng.¹s jargon) on it, also a German trade magazine I¹m
                subscribed to has fastidiously published deep and vast investigations in the
                plastic¹s composition and proprieties. PET is fine (and inert) for alcohol
                at any concentration. It is gas permeable, though. Perhaps in time (and
                high storage temps) your ³angel¹s share² would be a bit high.
                Seem to remember DEHA is used as a plasticizer in HDPE (High Density
                Polyethylene), though. Think a big lot of us use it. Johan even builds
                stills with the thing! I don¹t trust too much the guy in that disclaimer
                letter. I remember that a similar lobbying organization paid by Monsanto
                was crying to the four winds that PCB¹s where inert and human-safe up to the
                late eighties! American lobbyists are a different breed of humans, I
                believe.
                Salud! (literally means health in Spanish).
                --
                Hector Landaeta.
                Colonia Tovar - Venezuela.



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Austin Smith
                You may recall that the ATF said that their concern with PET was that it allowed WATER to migrate, increasing the proof. Therefore, they opined, alcohol
                Message 7 of 7 , Nov 25, 2003
                  You may recall that the ATF said that their concern with PET was that it allowed WATER to migrate, increasing the proof. Therefore, they opined, alcohol revenues would not decrease. So PET was a good thing.

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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