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Shotgun condenser

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  • Johan
    I built a new still today and am testing it right now. Copper this time, vm head. Real easy to adjust. We ll see if it ll close at the end, hope so, tried
    Message 1 of 15 , Aug 29, 2003

      I built a new still today and am testing it right now. Copper this time, vm head. Real easy to adjust. We’ll see if it’ll close at the end, hope so, tried something that may disturb the vm-idea a little..

      Unfortunately I need the make a new top cooler. I’m going to use a circulating pump and the cooling coil at the top makes a lot of resistance for the water. I like to keep it small so I’ll thought of making a shotgun condenser.

       

      The still is made of a 35 mm column, so the condenser has to be that size also.

      Max power in this column will probably be around 600W.

       

      Since I never tried a shotgun condenser I need a little advice, I’ll be able to put about 4-5 10 mm tubes inside or 4 12 mm tubes.

      How effective is it? A 20 cm condenser ought to be enough?

       

      Johan

    • abbababbaccc
      I suggest you use the calculator at Tony s site to give you an estimate of the total length of pipe required. I don t know which heat transfer number you
      Message 2 of 15 , Aug 29, 2003
        I suggest you use the calculator at Tony's site to give you an
        estimate of the total length of pipe required. I don't know which
        heat transfer number you should use though, having never built one.
        I'd also suggest using some silicone for extra sealing after you have
        soldered it together (at least for the inside bottom of the
        condenser). Let us know how it goes.

        Greetz, Riku

        --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Johan" <mugg@h...> wrote:
        > I built a new still today and am testing it right now. Copper this
        time, vm
        > head. Real easy to adjust. We'll see if it'll close at the end,
        hope so,
        > tried something that may disturb the vm-idea a little..
        >
        > Unfortunately I need the make a new top cooler. I'm going to use a
        > circulating pump and the cooling coil at the top makes a lot of
        resistance
        > for the water. I like to keep it small so I'll thought of making a
        shotgun
        > condenser.
        >
        >
        >
        > The still is made of a 35 mm column, so the condenser has to be
        that size
        > also.
        >
        > Max power in this column will probably be around 600W.
        >
        >
        >
        > Since I never tried a shotgun condenser I need a little advice,
        I'll be able
        > to put about 4-5 10 mm tubes inside or 4 12 mm tubes.
        >
        > How effective is it? A 20 cm condenser ought to be enough?
        >
        >
        >
        > Johan
      • mwmccaw
        The smaller the tubes, the better the heat transfer. I d suggest more, 7mm tubes. Since they re in parallel, you ll still have good flow. Also, there s no
        Message 3 of 15 , Aug 29, 2003
          The smaller the tubes, the better the heat transfer. I'd suggest
          more, 7mm tubes. Since they're in parallel, you'll still have good
          flow.
          Also, there's no fundamental reason that the condenser needs to be
          the same diameter as the column - you can use a reducing coupling.
          Mike McCaw

          --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "abbababbaccc"
          <abbababbaccc@y...> wrote:
          > I suggest you use the calculator at Tony's site to give you an
          > estimate of the total length of pipe required. I don't know which
          > heat transfer number you should use though, having never built
          one.
          > I'd also suggest using some silicone for extra sealing after you
          have
          > soldered it together (at least for the inside bottom of the
          > condenser). Let us know how it goes.
          >
          > Greetz, Riku
          >
          > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Johan" <mugg@h...> wrote:
          > > I built a new still today and am testing it right now. Copper
          this
          > time, vm
          > > head. Real easy to adjust. We'll see if it'll close at the end,
          > hope so,
          > > tried something that may disturb the vm-idea a little..
          > >
          > > Unfortunately I need the make a new top cooler. I'm going to use
          a
          > > circulating pump and the cooling coil at the top makes a lot of
          > resistance
          > > for the water. I like to keep it small so I'll thought of making
          a
          > shotgun
          > > condenser.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > The still is made of a 35 mm column, so the condenser has to be
          > that size
          > > also.
          > >
          > > Max power in this column will probably be around 600W.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Since I never tried a shotgun condenser I need a little advice,
          > I'll be able
          > > to put about 4-5 10 mm tubes inside or 4 12 mm tubes.
          > >
          > > How effective is it? A 20 cm condenser ought to be enough?
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Johan
        • Johan
          There is a very fundamental reason, beauty :) I ll see what tubes I get my hands on. Johan The smaller the tubes, the better the heat transfer. I d suggest
          Message 4 of 15 , Aug 29, 2003
            There is a very fundamental reason, beauty :)
            I'll see what tubes I get my hands on.

            Johan


            The smaller the tubes, the better the heat transfer. I'd suggest
            more, 7mm tubes. Since they're in parallel, you'll still have good
            flow.
            Also, there's no fundamental reason that the condenser needs to be
            the same diameter as the column - you can use a reducing coupling.
            Mike McCaw

            --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "abbababbaccc"
            <abbababbaccc@y...> wrote:
            > I suggest you use the calculator at Tony's site to give you an
            > estimate of the total length of pipe required. I don't know which
            > heat transfer number you should use though, having never built
            one.
            > I'd also suggest using some silicone for extra sealing after you
            have
            > soldered it together (at least for the inside bottom of the
            > condenser). Let us know how it goes.
            >
            > Greetz, Riku
            >
            > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Johan" <mugg@h...> wrote:
            > > I built a new still today and am testing it right now. Copper
            this
            > time, vm
            > > head. Real easy to adjust. We'll see if it'll close at the end,
            > hope so,
            > > tried something that may disturb the vm-idea a little..
            > >
            > > Unfortunately I need the make a new top cooler. I'm going to use
            a
            > > circulating pump and the cooling coil at the top makes a lot of
            > resistance
            > > for the water. I like to keep it small so I'll thought of making
            a
            > shotgun
            > > condenser.
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > The still is made of a 35 mm column, so the condenser has to be
            > that size
            > > also.
            > >
            > > Max power in this column will probably be around 600W.
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Since I never tried a shotgun condenser I need a little advice,
            > I'll be able
            > > to put about 4-5 10 mm tubes inside or 4 12 mm tubes.
            > >
            > > How effective is it? A 20 cm condenser ought to be enough?
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Johan



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          • Robert N
            Hi Johan, I too am in the middle of building a shotgun condenser, for my compound still. Due to a lack of any real guide and figuring that my mathematics’
            Message 5 of 15 , Aug 31, 2003

              Hi Johan, I too am in the middle of building a shotgun condenser, for my compound still. Due to a lack of any real guide and figuring that my mathematics’ being what it isL I believe overkill should be the order of the day. To that end, I am having this made of stainless steel, it will have 18 ¼” inner tubes, the outer pipe will be 330mm long by 100mm diameter tube. There will be a 100mm to 50mm reducer below this condenser to reduce the size to match everything else. Below this is a triclover fitting which will join an “EL” head and once again a 50mm triclover to join onto the 1500mm tower. The water inlet and outlets will have 25mm hose fittings. So hopefully, the flow rate of coolant will be such that it will do the job it is supposed to.

               

              Reason for changing, is that the $200 pump I purchased 6 months ago is showing signs of wear, due to the constant pressure that is needed to push the water 2.4 metres high and then through 13 foot of ¼” cu tube that is the current condenser. With the pump slowly wearing, the surrounding atmosphere was starting to get more alcohol that I was collecting, whenever I ran the still. Should have it by the end of the week when I get back from a short trip overseas, and will post a couple of pictures next weekend.

               

              Yours in Spirit

               

               

              Robert

               

               

              -----Original Message-----
              From:
              Johan [mailto:mugg@...]
              Sent
              :
              Saturday, August 30, 2003 8:08 AM
              To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: SV: [Distillers] Re: Shotgun condenser

               


              There is a very fundamental reason, beauty :)
              I'll see what tubes I get my hands on.

              Johan


              The smaller the tubes, the better the heat transfer.  I'd suggest
              more, 7mm tubes.  Since they're in parallel, you'll still have good
              flow.
              Also, there's no fundamental reason that the condenser needs to be
              the same diameter as the column - you can use a reducing coupling.
              Mike McCaw

              --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "abbababbaccc"
              <abbababbaccc@y...> wrote:
              > I suggest you use the calculator at Tony's site to give you an
              > estimate of the total length of pipe required. I don't know which
              > heat transfer number you should use though, having never built
              one.
              > I'd also suggest using some silicone for extra sealing after you
              have
              > soldered it together (at least for the inside bottom of the
              > condenser). Let us know how it goes.
              >
              > Greetz, Riku
              >
              > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Johan" <mugg@h...> wrote:
              > > I built a new still today and am testing it right now. Copper
              this
              > time, vm
              > > head. Real easy to adjust. We'll see if it'll close at the end,
              > hope so,
              > > tried something that may disturb the vm-idea a little..
              > >
              > > Unfortunately I need the make a new top cooler. I'm going to use
              a
              > > circulating pump and the cooling coil at the top makes a lot of
              > resistance
              > > for the water. I like to keep it small so I'll thought of making
              a
              > shotgun
              > > condenser.
              > >
              > > 
              > >
              > > The still is made of a 35 mm column, so the condenser has to be
              > that size
              > > also.
              > >
              > > Max power in this column will probably be around 600W.
              > >
              > > 
              > >
              > > Since I never tried a shotgun condenser I need a little advice,
              > I'll be able
              > > to put about 4-5 10 mm tubes inside or 4 12 mm tubes.
              > >
              > > How effective is it? A 20 cm condenser ought to be enough?
              > >
              > > 
              > >
              > > Johan



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            • Johan
              I made the condenser now. I used 7 8 mm pipes, and put that into a 32 mm pipe (I said the diameter was 35 on the still earlier, it is 32) The condenser is
              Message 6 of 15 , Sep 1, 2003

                I made the condenser now. I used 7 8 mm pipes, and put that into a 32 mm pipe (I said the diameter was 35 on the still earlier, it is 32)

                The condenser is about 15 cm high.

                Cooling water comes into the bottom side and out the other side at the top.

                700W is no problem at all.

                I’m very pleased with it, waterflow isn’t a problem anymore and the condenser is effective and small.

                I though it would be difficult to build it but it wasn’t, no leaks.

                VM head,  55 cm column, filled with pro-pak. this still is my first good looking still

                And pro-pak is very good stuff, I’m very pleased with that packing.

                 

                I can guarantee you Robert that the condenser you build will be enough.

                 

                Cheers fellow distillers

                 

                Johan

                 

                -----Ursprungligt meddelande-----
                Från: Robert N [mailto:dinks_c@...]
                Skickat: den 31 augusti 2003 16:05
                Till: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                Ämne: RE: [Distillers] Re: Shotgun condenser

                 

                Hi Johan, I too am in the middle of building a shotgun condenser, for my compound still. Due to a lack of any real guide and figuring that my mathematics’ being what it isL I believe overkill should be the order of the day. To that end, I am having this made of stainless steel, it will have 18 ¼” inner tubes, the outer pipe will be 330mm long by 100mm diameter tube. There will be a 100mm to 50mm reducer below this condenser to reduce the size to match everything else. Below this is a triclover fitting which will join an “EL” head and once again a 50mm triclover to join onto the 1500mm tower. The water inlet and outlets will have 25mm hose fittings. So hopefully, the flow rate of coolant will be such that it will do the job it is supposed to.

                 

                Reason for changing, is that the $200 pump I purchased 6 months ago is showing signs of wear, due to the constant pressure that is needed to push the water 2.4 metres high and then through 13 foot of ¼” cu tube that is the current condenser. With the pump slowly wearing, the surrounding atmosphere was starting to get more alcohol that I was collecting, whenever I ran the still. Should have it by the end of the week when I get back from a short trip overseas, and will post a couple of pictures next weekend.

                 

                Yours in Spirit

                 

                 

                Robert

                 

                 

                -----Original Message-----
                From: Johan [mailto:mugg@...]
                Sent:
                Saturday, August 30, 2003 8:08 AM
                To: Distillers@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: SV: [Distillers] Re: Shotgun condenser

                 


                There is a very fundamental reason, beauty :)
                I'll see what tubes I get my hands on.

                Johan


                The smaller the tubes, the better the heat transfer.  I'd suggest
                more, 7mm tubes.  Since they're in parallel, you'll still have good
                flow.
                Also, there's no fundamental reason that the condenser needs to be
                the same diameter as the column - you can use a reducing coupling.
                Mike McCaw

                --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "abbababbaccc"
                <abbababbaccc@y...> wrote:
                > I suggest you use the calculator at Tony's site to give you an
                > estimate of the total length of pipe required. I don't know which
                > heat transfer number you should use though, having never built
                one.
                > I'd also suggest using some silicone for extra sealing after you
                have
                > soldered it together (at least for the inside bottom of the
                > condenser). Let us know how it goes.
                >
                > Greetz, Riku
                >
                > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Johan" <mugg@h...> wrote:
                > > I built a new still today and am testing it right now. Copper
                this
                > time, vm
                > > head. Real easy to adjust. We'll see if it'll close at the end,
                > hope so,
                > > tried something that may disturb the vm-idea a little..
                > >
                > > Unfortunately I need the make a new top cooler. I'm going to use
                a
                > > circulating pump and the cooling coil at the top makes a lot of
                > resistance
                > > for the water. I like to keep it small so I'll thought of making
                a
                > shotgun
                > > condenser.
                > >
                > > 
                > >
                > > The still is made of a 35 mm column, so the condenser has to be
                > that size
                > > also.
                > >
                > > Max power in this column will probably be around 600W.
                > >
                > > 
                > >
                > > Since I never tried a shotgun condenser I need a little advice,
                > I'll be able
                > > to put about 4-5 10 mm tubes inside or 4 12 mm tubes.
                > >
                > > How effective is it? A 20 cm condenser ought to be enough?
                > >
                > > 
                > >
                > > Johan



                To unsubscribe from this group send a blank email to
                distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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                FAQ and other information at http://homedistiller.org

                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/







                To unsubscribe from this group send a blank email to   distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                Distillers list archives : http://archive.nnytech.net/
                FAQ and other information at http://homedistiller.org


                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                To unsubscribe from this group send a blank email to   distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                Distillers list archives : http://archive.nnytech.net/
                FAQ and other information at http://homedistiller.org


                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
              • Hector A. Landaeta C.
                ... Hola! Join the club Mike! I¹m beginning to build my new still¹s condenser (hopefully) next week using 304 SS also. It will have 38 1/4 inch O.D. Tubes
                Message 7 of 15 , Sep 1, 2003
                  Not just shotgun, Vulcan cannon condenser On 31/8/03 10:05 AM, "Robert N" <dinks_c@...> wrote:

                  Hi Johan, I too am in the middle of building a shotgun condenser, for my compound still. Due to a lack of any real guide and figuring that my mathematics’ being what it isL I believe overkill should be the order of the day. To that end, I am having this made of stainless steel, it will have 18 ?” inner tubes, the outer pipe will be 330mm long by 100mm diameter tube. There will be a 100mm to 50mm reducer below this condenser to reduce the size to match everything else. Below this is a triclover fitting which will join an “EL” head and once again a 50mm triclover to join onto the 1500mm tower. The water inlet and outlets will have 25mm hose fittings. So hopefully, the flow rate of coolant will be such that it will do the job it is

                  Hola!
                  Join the club Mike!  I’m beginning to build my new still’s condenser (hopefully) next week using 304 SS also.  It will have 38 1/4 inch O.D. Tubes inside a 3 inch one with a thing my builder insists on but that I really think it’s sanitary overkill: two 3 inch triclover clamps on each end of the cooling tubes enclosure to facilitate cleaning.  On the vapor feed end I’ll use a 3 x 1 inch reduction soldered to the TC clamp ferrule and in the outlet a 3 x 1/2 inch one equally attached.  My turn for performance overkill comes from having it 45 centimeters long (that’s pretty short considering the 1,2 meter long one on the Christian Carl still).  I’m still fretting and wondering if it will be enough for the new 500+ liter boiler (hard to calculate and oval’s volume, that’s why I don’t know it’s exact holding capacity).  Since my digital camera is kaput I’ll borrow a friends to send you guys some snapshots of the making of my new still when I start it.
                  Salud!
                  --
                  Hector Landaeta.
                  Colonia Tovar - Venezuela.
                • Shane Kirkman
                  I notice a few members moving to the shotgun condenser . What would be the comfortable minimum condenser length for the average still-45 to 65mm dia (say 3kw,
                  Message 8 of 15 , Sep 12, 2003
                    I notice a few members moving to the 'shotgun condenser'.
                    What would be the comfortable minimum condenser length for the average
                    still-45 to 65mm dia (say 3kw, if you got distracted during heatup), would
                    100mm be to short. Keeping, minimum coolant usage in mind.
                    How many 8mm tubes would you need.
                    Do you need 8mm or is 6mm alright, just use more.


                    Eat-Drink-Smoke and be Happy.
                    Shane.
                  • Matthew Garner
                    3kw is over 10amps on a 250v supply (what we have in aus) it is infact 12 amps which would mean u would have to directly wire it to the supply or wire it into
                    Message 9 of 15 , Sep 12, 2003
                      3kw is over 10amps on a 250v supply (what we have in aus)
                      it is infact 12 amps which would mean u would have to directly wire
                      it to the supply or wire it into a 15amp socket (used mainly for air
                      con)
                      i am not a spoil sport i am just givinga frendly advice in most case
                      the circt breaker will trip oh 2500w is 0 amps on a 250supply

                      u will find most house will have 2 power circts a 8 or 10 amp and a
                      15 but check ya swich board they will be clearly maked and make sure
                      when u use it notghing else major is on the circt eg.washine machine
                      and most amjor appliances even a kettle witha standard 1500w element
                      will pull 6 amps
                      tahnx
                      this advice is for Austrlains in your area might be different
                      --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Shane Kirkman"
                      <shanekirkman@y...> wrote:
                      > I notice a few members moving to the 'shotgun condenser'.
                      > What would be the comfortable minimum condenser length for the
                      average
                      > still-45 to 65mm dia (say 3kw, if you got distracted during
                      heatup), would
                      > 100mm be to short. Keeping, minimum coolant usage in mind.
                      > How many 8mm tubes would you need.
                      > Do you need 8mm or is 6mm alright, just use more.
                      >
                      >
                      > Eat-Drink-Smoke and be Happy.
                      > Shane.
                    • Johan
                      Mine is made of seven 8 mm pipes in a 35 mm pipe. 15 cm high, 800W is the maximum it can handle, more than that in it starts surge. Coolant leaving at 65-70 C.
                      Message 10 of 15 , Sep 12, 2003
                        Mine is made of seven 8 mm pipes in a 35 mm pipe. 15 cm high, 800W is the
                        maximum it can handle, more than that in it starts surge. Coolant leaving at
                        65-70 C.
                        I wouldn't recommend going lower than 8 mm pipes or close to it.
                        10 cm isn't much for that much power. I won't say it won't work but if you
                        want to use minimum coolant I would have used at least 15-20 cm.

                        Johan

                        I notice a few members moving to the 'shotgun condenser'.
                        What would be the comfortable minimum condenser length for the average
                        still-45 to 65mm dia (say 3kw, if you got distracted during heatup), would
                        100mm be to short. Keeping, minimum coolant usage in mind.
                        How many 8mm tubes would you need.
                        Do you need 8mm or is 6mm alright, just use more.


                        Eat-Drink-Smoke and be Happy.
                        Shane.




                        To unsubscribe from this group send a blank email to
                        distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        Distillers list archives : http://archive.nnytech.net/
                        FAQ and other information at http://homedistiller.org

                        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      • Mike Nixon
                        Shane Kirkman Subject: [Distillers] Shotgun condenser I notice a few members moving to the shotgun condenser . What would be the comfortable minimum condenser
                        Message 11 of 15 , Sep 12, 2003
                          Shane Kirkman
                          Subject: [Distillers] Shotgun condenser

                          I notice a few members moving to the 'shotgun condenser'.
                          What would be the comfortable minimum condenser length for the average still-45 to 65mm dia (say 3kw, if you got distracted during heatup), would 100mm be to short. Keeping, minimum coolant usage in mind.
                          How many 8mm tubes would you need. Do you need 8mm or is 6mm alright, just use more.
                          ======================
                          Hi Shane,

                          If the tubes are too small then they will choke as you have vapor and liquid going in opposing directions and surface tension rears its ugly head. Smaller tubes can be used only if you engineer your setup so the vapor and liquid go in the same direction. As for length, simply ask yourself what length tubing you would need to make a simple Liebig condenser to do the same job, then do a bit of simple division. After all, a 'shotgun' or 'firebox' condenser is just a set of Liebigs set in parallel, but efficiency is high as the temperature differential throughout is greater than the average for a long Liebig. As for coolant rate, that will depend on the physical characteristics of the condenser you end up with, so the only practical answer is to test it at a given boiler power and note the minimum flow rate of cooling water needed ... then add a 'fudge factor' for security.

                          Mike N


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Robert N
                          Shane Kirkman Subject: [Distillers] Shotgun condenser I notice a few members moving to the shotgun condenser . What would be the comfortable minimum condenser
                          Message 12 of 15 , Sep 12, 2003
                            Shane Kirkman
                            Subject: [Distillers] Shotgun condenser

                            I notice a few members moving to the 'shotgun condenser'.
                            What would be the comfortable minimum condenser length for the average
                            still-45 to 65mm dia (say 3kw, if you got distracted during heatup),
                            would 100mm be to short. Keeping, minimum coolant usage in mind.
                            How many 8mm tubes would you need. Do you need 8mm or is 6mm alright,
                            just use more.
                            ======================
                            Hi Shane,

                            If the tubes are too small then they will choke as you have vapor and
                            liquid going in opposing directions and surface tension rears its ugly
                            head. Smaller tubes can be used only if you engineer your setup so the
                            vapor and liquid go in the same direction. As for length, simply ask
                            yourself what length tubing you would need to make a simple Liebig
                            condenser to do the same job, then do a bit of simple division. After
                            all, a 'shotgun' or 'firebox' condenser is just a set of Liebigs set in
                            parallel, but efficiency is high as the temperature differential
                            throughout is greater than the average for a long Liebig. As for
                            coolant rate, that will depend on the physical characteristics of the
                            condenser you end up with, so the only practical answer is to test it at
                            a given boiler power and note the minimum flow rate of cooling water
                            needed ... then add a 'fudge factor' for security.

                            Mike N
                            +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

                            Hi all, Shane I would agree with Mike on this one. Although, I would
                            like to know your reason to build a shotgun condenser? As my logic tells
                            me that if your ¼” copper coil condenser works already and you are still
                            going to connect the garden hose to it, then is there much efficiency in
                            water usage to be gained by building the shotgun condenser, just turn
                            the tap down until the water coming out is around the 50C mark. Of
                            course, you may have a number of other reasons for wishing to build a
                            shotgun condenser.

                            What I have found from experience is that the thru tubes 3mm (1/8”) ID,
                            I have used, do flood at around the 1800 Watt mark; I have 18 of them in
                            a 100mm diameter tube that is 330mm long. I am about to rebuild this
                            (bugger!) with larger diameter thru tubes, somewhere in the order of 8mm
                            (5/16”) ID, just depends on what I can buy, as the vapour speed from my
                            2400watt element causes everything to choke.

                            As ever, if someone has advice, please don’t hesitate to forward it to
                            me.




                            Yours in spirit

                            Robert


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Shane Kirkman
                            Hi Robert, Saving a bit off height, and I am making a new EL head for my old still. Also making it detachable to put on my new 2.6m x 65mm new still. (when I
                            Message 13 of 15 , Sep 12, 2003
                              Hi Robert,
                              Saving a bit off height, and I am making a new EL head for
                              my old still. Also making it detachable to put on my new 2.6m x 65mm new
                              still. (when I get it made that is.)


                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: "Robert N" <dinks_c@...>
                              To: <Distillers@yahoogroups.com>
                              Sent: Saturday, September 13, 2003 2:24 PM
                              Subject: RE: [Distillers] Shotgun condenser

                              Hi all, Shane I would agree with Mike on this one. Although, I would
                              like to know your reason to build a shotgun condenser? As my logic tells
                              me that if your ¼" copper coil condenser works already and you are still
                              going to connect the garden hose to it, then is there much efficiency in
                              water usage to be gained by building the shotgun condenser, just turn
                              the tap down until the water coming out is around the 50C mark. Of
                              course, you may have a number of other reasons for wishing to build a
                              shotgun condenser.
                              ___________________________________________




                              Eat-Drink-Smoke and be Happy.
                              Shane.
                            • Shane Kirkman
                              Not when using 2 elements plugged into different wall plugs. ... From: Matthew Garner To: Sent:
                              Message 14 of 15 , Sep 13, 2003
                                Not when using 2 elements plugged into different wall plugs.




                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: "Matthew Garner" <mgarner@...>
                                To: <Distillers@yahoogroups.com>
                                Sent: Saturday, September 13, 2003 1:38 AM
                                Subject: [Distillers] Re: Shotgun condenser


                                > 3kw is over 10amps on a 250v supply (what we have in aus)
                                > it is infact 12 amps which would mean u would have to directly wire
                                > it to the supply or wire it into a 15amp socket (used mainly for air
                                > con)
                                > i am not a spoil sport i am just givinga frendly advice in most case
                                > the circt breaker will trip oh 2500w is 0 amps on a 250supply
                                >
                                > u will find most house will have 2 power circts a 8 or 10 amp and a
                                > 15 but check ya swich board they will be clearly maked and make sure
                                > when u use it notghing else major is on the circt eg.washine machine
                                > and most amjor appliances even a kettle witha standard 1500w element
                                > will pull 6 amps
                                > tahnx
                                > this advice is for Austrlains in your area might be different
                                > --- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Shane Kirkman"
                                > <shanekirkman@y...> wrote:
                                > > I notice a few members moving to the 'shotgun condenser'.
                                > > What would be the comfortable minimum condenser length for the
                                > average
                                > > still-45 to 65mm dia (say 3kw, if you got distracted during
                                > heatup), would
                                > > 100mm be to short. Keeping, minimum coolant usage in mind.
                                > > How many 8mm tubes would you need.
                                > > Do you need 8mm or is 6mm alright, just use more.
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > Eat-Drink-Smoke and be Happy.
                                > > Shane.
                                >
                                >
                                >
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                              • Shane Kirkman
                                Hmmmm! Interesting ! Really stretching the brain cells there ? ... To get my brain going in the same direction do you mean a larger tube carrying the vapors
                                Message 15 of 15 , Sep 13, 2003
                                  Hmmmm! Interesting ! Really stretching the brain cells there ?
                                  >>Smaller tubes can be used only if you engineer your >>setup so the vapor and liquid go in the same >>direction.
                                  To get my brain going in the same direction do you mean a larger tube carrying the vapors up to the top of condenser(maybe around the outside). Then feeding them down thru the small tubes ? With maybe another pipe in the center as a vent to the column ?
                                  As in say a 65mm with a 50mm and a 15mm inside. The vapors go up between the 65 & 50mm, down between the 50 and 15mm where your 6mm tubes are. The top is capped except for the 15mm which acts as a vent.




                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  From: "Mike Nixon" <mike@...>
                                  To: <Distillers@yahoogroups.com>
                                  Sent: Saturday, September 13, 2003 6:48 AM
                                  Subject: Re: [Distillers] Shotgun condenser


                                  > Shane Kirkman
                                  > Subject: [Distillers] Shotgun condenser
                                  >
                                  > I notice a few members moving to the 'shotgun condenser'.
                                  > What would be the comfortable minimum condenser length for the average still-45 to 65mm dia (say 3kw, if you got distracted during heatup), would 100mm be to short. Keeping, minimum coolant usage in mind.
                                  > How many 8mm tubes would you need. Do you need 8mm or is 6mm alright, just use more.
                                  > ======================
                                  > Hi Shane,
                                  >
                                  > If the tubes are too small then they will choke as you have vapor and liquid going in opposing directions and surface tension rears its ugly head. Smaller tubes can be used only if you engineer your setup so the vapor and liquid go in the same direction. As for length, simply ask yourself what length tubing you would need to make a simple Liebig condenser to do the same job, then do a bit of simple division. After all, a 'shotgun' or 'firebox' condenser is just a set of Liebigs set in parallel, but efficiency is high as the temperature differential throughout is greater than the average for a long Liebig. As for coolant rate, that will depend on the physical characteristics of the condenser you end up with, so the only practical answer is to test it at a given boiler power and note the minimum flow rate of cooling water needed ... then add a 'fudge factor' for security.
                                  >
                                  > Mike N
                                  >
                                  >


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