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## Re: More Of The Same

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• Smudge after this post I can only see two possibilities: you are just a plain nut or you are a member of the flat-earth society (doesn t preclude the first
Message 1 of 4 , Apr 1, 2003
Smudge after this post I can only see two possibilities: you are just
a plain nut or you are a member of the flat-earth society (doesn't
preclude the first possibility).

I suppose there is also the chance that you're just having fun with
us. Is this the case Smudge? Please let us know.

--- In Distillers@yahoogroups.com, "smudge311065" <smudge@b...> wrote:
> Here's yesterday's post explained a little differently.
>
> There is a relationship between output temperature and output
purity.
> This relationship is not cause and effect  its effect and
effect.
>
> Output purity and temperature change together as a result of a
> process that occurs in the column. Call this process heat transfer,
> call it reflux, call it Brian. I don't care what you call it,
because
> alcohol doesn't care what you call it.
>
> This relationship is defined by the following equation:
>
> y = -2E-07x6 + 9E-05x5 - 0.0189x4 + 2.229x3 - 147.27x2 + 5177x

75640
>
> Y is the % output, X is the temp, and degrees are in Celsius. This
is
> based on other people's research into the behaviour of
ethanol/water
> vapour. The best-fit line is thanks to Microsoft. It's not a
perfect
> predictor, but its pretty close.
>
> This relationship is not up for debate. This relationship applies
to
> ethanol/water vapour and is irrespective of still design. Your
still
> design may preclude you from operating at some points on this line,
> but it DOES NOT CHANGE THIS RELATIONSHIP.
>
> For someone to say purity is important and temperature is not is
> simply ridiculous  they are two sides of the same coin. Every
point
> at which you operate your still can be equally described in terms
of
> purity or temperature.
>
> I confuse people by saying I set the temperature at the top of my
> column. That is true in practical terms, but in reality this is a
> simplification of the truth:
>
> The only thing I do at the top of my column is MEASURE the
> temperature. Just like the rest of you.
>
> I will throw away my controller for a minute and replace the
> thermocouple with a thermometer. As I'm distilling, I notice the
> output temperature start to rise. (I could also notice the purity
> drop, but its easier to measure the temperature). If I had a reflux
> valve I could increase the reflux ratio to compensate. I don't have
a
> reflux valve so I reduce the input power, which is just another way
> of increasing the reflux ratio.
>
> You can measure the output purity and adjust the reflux ratio
> directly, or measure the output temperature and adjust the input
> power. Same effective measurement; same effective action.
>
> The one and only real difference is that you make this adjustment
> manually and I have a box that does it for me. (And I'm told I have
a
> lot to learn about still design).
>
>
> Smudge
• Stop Smudging My Brainz!!!! smudge311065 wrote:Here s yesterday s post explained a little differently. There is a relationship between
Message 2 of 4 , Apr 1, 2003

Stop Smudging My Brainz!!!!

smudge311065 <smudge@...> wrote:

Here's yesterday's post explained a little differently.

There is a relationship between output temperature and output purity.
This relationship is not cause and effect � its effect and effect.

Output purity and temperature change together as a result of a
process that occurs in the column. Call this process heat transfer,
call it reflux, call it Brian. I don't care what you call it, because
alcohol doesn't care what you call it.

This relationship is defined by the following equation:

y = -2E-07x6 + 9E-05x5 - 0.0189x4 + 2.229x3 - 147.27x2 + 5177x � 75640

Y is the % output, X is the temp, and degrees are in Celsius. This is
based on other people's research into the behaviour of ethanol/water
vapour. The best-fit line is thanks to Microsoft. It's not a perfect
predictor, but its pretty close.

This relationship is not up for debate. This relationship applies to
ethanol/water vapour and is irrespective of still design. Your still
design may preclude you from operating at some points on this line,
but it DOES NOT CHANGE THIS RELATIONSHIP.

For someone to say purity is important and temperature is not is
simply ridiculous � they are two sides of the same coin. Every point
at which you operate your still can be equally described in terms of
purity or temperature.

I confuse people by saying I set the temperature at the top of my
column. That is true in practical terms, but in reality this is a
simplification of the truth:

The only thing I do at the top of my column is MEASURE the
temperature. Just like the rest of you.

I will throw away my controller for a minute and replace the
thermocouple with a thermometer. As I'm distilling, I notice the
output temperature start to rise. (I could also notice the purity
drop, but its easier to measure the temperature). If I had a reflux
valve I could increase the reflux ratio to compensate. I don't have a
reflux valve so I reduce the input power, which is just another way
of increasing the reflux ratio.

You can measure the output purity and adjust the reflux ratio
directly, or measure the output temperature and adjust the input
power. Same effective measurement; same effective action.

The one and only real difference is that you make this adjustment
manually and I have a box that does it for me. (And I'm told I have a
lot to learn about still design).

Smudge

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