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Official Dstar DATA Reflector 15C

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  • atms169
    REF015C Reflector 15C multi-media, has been provided to the Dstar community for the use of any digital modes such as, D*Chat, Drats and other terminal
    Message 1 of 17 , May 28, 2009
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      REF015C

      Reflector 15C multi-media, has been provided to the Dstar community for the use of any digital modes such as, D*Chat, Drats and other terminal programs. Reflector 15C will be used solely for Data communications as a meeting place.

      REF015 is located in a commercial data processing environment and should prove to be reliable for use in the US and Europe.

      Please feel free to connect and start D-chatting, D-texting and D-ratsing. Please keep voice calls to a minimum as there will be times we would need to use the voice modes while working with terminal programs.

      Thank you to Darren G7LWT for his efforts and for the use of the reflector.

      Aaron
      KE5KAF
      Laredo, TX
    • Kuby
      1st....Can some one inform us of the definitions of the numerous REF### s? How we are expected to use (or not) the REF### s? What is the definition/use for
      Message 2 of 17 , May 29, 2009
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        1st....Can some one inform us of the definitions of the numerous REF###'s? How we are expected to use (or not) the REF###'s? What is the definition/use for each Ref?

        I do not readily see policy/definition/how-to-be-used about REF's on DstarUser.org.

        2nd....
        Can some one post some links as to these various D-data modes?
        Please give a brief explanation about how-to-use the d-data mode.


        We can't be expected to follow the Rules/Policy or Use them properly if we do not know them. TNX
        This would make a good article/file to be Posted and updated in the groups FILES area!



        --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "atms169" <atms169@...> wrote:
        >
        > REF015C
        >
        > Reflector 15C multi-media, has been provided to the Dstar community for the use of any digital modes such as, D*Chat, Drats and other terminal programs. Reflector 15C will be used solely for Data communications as a meeting place.
        >
        > REF015 is located in a commercial data processing environment and should prove to be reliable for use in the US and Europe.
        >
        > Please feel free to connect and start D-chatting, D-texting and D-ratsing. Please keep voice calls to a minimum as there will be times we would need to use the voice modes while working with terminal programs.
        >
        > Thank you to Darren G7LWT for his efforts and for the use of the reflector.
        >
        > Aaron
        > KE5KAF
        > Laredo, TX
        >
      • Robin Cutshaw
        Hi Kuby. Take a look at: http://www.opendstar.org/tools/readme.txt This include a description of the current reflectors. Also, I think www.dstarinfo.com has
        Message 3 of 17 , May 29, 2009
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          Hi Kuby. Take a look at:

          http://www.opendstar.org/tools/readme.txt

          This include a description of the current reflectors. Also, I think www.dstarinfo.com has a good section on reflectors.

          As for the data modes, you probably want to check some of the other d-star related yahoo groups. They have been discussed extensively and probably don't need another rehash here.

          73,
          Robin
          AA4RC




          --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Kuby" <n6jsx@...> wrote:
          >
          > 1st....Can some one inform us of the definitions of the numerous REF###'s? How we are expected to use (or not) the REF###'s? What is the definition/use for each Ref?
          >
          > I do not readily see policy/definition/how-to-be-used about REF's on DstarUser.org.
          >
          > 2nd....
          > Can some one post some links as to these various D-data modes?
          > Please give a brief explanation about how-to-use the d-data mode.
          >
          >
          > We can't be expected to follow the Rules/Policy or Use them properly if we do not know them. TNX
          > This would make a good article/file to be Posted and updated in the groups FILES area!
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "atms169" <atms169@> wrote:
          > >
          > > REF015C
          > >
          > > Reflector 15C multi-media, has been provided to the Dstar community for the use of any digital modes such as, D*Chat, Drats and other terminal programs. Reflector 15C will be used solely for Data communications as a meeting place.
          > >
          > > REF015 is located in a commercial data processing environment and should prove to be reliable for use in the US and Europe.
          > >
          > > Please feel free to connect and start D-chatting, D-texting and D-ratsing. Please keep voice calls to a minimum as there will be times we would need to use the voice modes while working with terminal programs.
          > >
          > > Thank you to Darren G7LWT for his efforts and for the use of the reflector.
          > >
          > > Aaron
          > > KE5KAF
          > > Laredo, TX
          > >
          >
        • Nate Duehr
          There s also: http://www.dstarinfo.com/Reflectors/Reflectors.aspx And... http://www.dstar.org.au/reflectors.htm (Not mine, just passing along the links. ) Most
          Message 4 of 17 , May 29, 2009
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            There's also:

            http://www.dstarinfo.com/Reflectors/Reflectors.aspx

            And...

            http://www.dstar.org.au/reflectors.htm

            (Not mine, just passing along the links. )

            Most of these types of general announcements are posted on the
            "main" (not the Dongle) list at dstar_digital@yahoogroups.com ...
            since they're not really Dongle-specific, and somewhat "off-topic" for
            the Dongle list... I suppose.

            Nate WY0X

            On May 29, 2009, at 7:09 AM, Robin Cutshaw wrote:

            > Hi Kuby. Take a look at:
            >
            > http://www.opendstar.org/tools/readme.txt
            >
            > This include a description of the current reflectors. Also, I think www.dstarinfo.com
            > has a good section on reflectors.
            >
            > As for the data modes, you probably want to check some of the other
            > d-star related yahoo groups. They have been discussed extensively
            > and probably don't need another rehash here.
            >
            > 73,
            > Robin
            > AA4RC
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Kuby" <n6jsx@...> wrote:
            >>
            >> 1st....Can some one inform us of the definitions of the numerous
            >> REF###'s? How we are expected to use (or not) the REF###'s? What
            >> is the definition/use for each Ref?
            >>
            >> I do not readily see policy/definition/how-to-be-used about REF's
            >> on DstarUser.org.
            >>
            >> 2nd....
            >> Can some one post some links as to these various D-data modes?
            >> Please give a brief explanation about how-to-use the d-data mode.
            >>
            >>
            >> We can't be expected to follow the Rules/Policy or Use them
            >> properly if we do not know them. TNX
            >> This would make a good article/file to be Posted and updated in the
            >> groups FILES area!
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >> --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "atms169" <atms169@> wrote:
            >>>
            >>> REF015C
            >>>
            >>> Reflector 15C multi-media, has been provided to the Dstar
            >>> community for the use of any digital modes such as, D*Chat, Drats
            >>> and other terminal programs. Reflector 15C will be used solely
            >>> for Data communications as a meeting place.
            >>>
            >>> REF015 is located in a commercial data processing environment and
            >>> should prove to be reliable for use in the US and Europe.
            >>>
            >>> Please feel free to connect and start D-chatting, D-texting and D-
            >>> ratsing. Please keep voice calls to a minimum as there will be
            >>> times we would need to use the voice modes while working with
            >>> terminal programs.
            >>>
            >>> Thank you to Darren G7LWT for his efforts and for the use of the
            >>> reflector.
            >>>
            >>> Aaron
            >>> KE5KAF
            >>> Laredo, TX
            >>>
            >>
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >

            --
            Nate Duehr
            nate@...
          • Kuby
            Question to all: Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle HOME ? A place where DVDognle users can seek each other out, concudt tests, ask
            Message 5 of 17 , Jun 6, 2009
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              Question to all: Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle "HOME"? A place where DVDognle users can seek each other out, concudt tests, ask questions, share info, or just rag chew. A "common place" that DVdongle users can hang out.

              Is this possible/permitted?

              Suggest >>> REF019A <<< that will likely have little usage being in Wisconsin and very very little use on 1.2G.

              I say, some use is always better than NO use! I tested 19A and it seems to work by reporting my connection callsign.


              --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, Nate Duehr <nate@...> wrote:
              >
              > There's also:
              >
              > http://www.dstarinfo.com/Reflectors/Reflectors.aspx
              >
              > And...
              >
              > http://www.dstar.org.au/reflectors.htm
              >
              > (Not mine, just passing along the links. )
              >
              > Most of these types of general announcements are posted on the
              > "main" (not the Dongle) list at dstar_digital@yahoogroups.com ...
              > since they're not really Dongle-specific, and somewhat "off-topic" for
              > the Dongle list... I suppose.
              >
              > Nate WY0X
              >
              > On May 29, 2009, at 7:09 AM, Robin Cutshaw wrote:
              >
              > > Hi Kuby. Take a look at:
              > >
              > > http://www.opendstar.org/tools/readme.txt
              > >
              > > This include a description of the current reflectors. Also, I think www.dstarinfo.com
              > > has a good section on reflectors.
              > >
              > > As for the data modes, you probably want to check some of the other
              > > d-star related yahoo groups. They have been discussed extensively
              > > and probably don't need another rehash here.
              > >
              > > 73,
              > > Robin
              > > AA4RC
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Kuby" <n6jsx@> wrote:
              > >>
              > >> 1st....Can some one inform us of the definitions of the numerous
              > >> REF###'s? How we are expected to use (or not) the REF###'s? What
              > >> is the definition/use for each Ref?
              > >>
              > >> I do not readily see policy/definition/how-to-be-used about REF's
              > >> on DstarUser.org.
              > >>
              > >> 2nd....
              > >> Can some one post some links as to these various D-data modes?
              > >> Please give a brief explanation about how-to-use the d-data mode.
              > >>
              > >>
              > >> We can't be expected to follow the Rules/Policy or Use them
              > >> properly if we do not know them. TNX
              > >> This would make a good article/file to be Posted and updated in the
              > >> groups FILES area!
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >> --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "atms169" <atms169@> wrote:
              > >>>
              > >>> REF015C
              > >>>
              > >>> Reflector 15C multi-media, has been provided to the Dstar
              > >>> community for the use of any digital modes such as, D*Chat, Drats
              > >>> and other terminal programs. Reflector 15C will be used solely
              > >>> for Data communications as a meeting place.
              > >>>
              > >>> REF015 is located in a commercial data processing environment and
              > >>> should prove to be reliable for use in the US and Europe.
              > >>>
              > >>> Please feel free to connect and start D-chatting, D-texting and D-
              > >>> ratsing. Please keep voice calls to a minimum as there will be
              > >>> times we would need to use the voice modes while working with
              > >>> terminal programs.
              > >>>
              > >>> Thank you to Darren G7LWT for his efforts and for the use of the
              > >>> reflector.
              > >>>
              > >>> Aaron
              > >>> KE5KAF
              > >>> Laredo, TX
              > >>>
              > >>
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------------------------------
              > >
              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              > --
              > Nate Duehr
              > nate@...
              >
            • Kuby
              Question for all: Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle HOME ? A place where DVdongle users can seek each other out, conduct tests, ask
              Message 6 of 17 , Jun 25, 2009
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                Question for all:

                Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle "HOME"?

                A place where DVdongle users can seek each other out, conduct tests, ask questions, share info, or just rag chew. A "common place" that DVdongle users can hang out.


                Suggest >>> REF019A <<< that will likely have little usage being in Wisconsin and very very little Ops on 1.2G.

                Some use is always better than NO use! I tested 19A and it seems to work by reporting my connection on the web site tracker:
                http://ref019.dstargateway.org/
              • n2slb
                Idea sounds good. Bob
                Message 7 of 17 , Jun 26, 2009
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                  Idea sounds good. Bob

                  --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Kuby" <n6jsx@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Question for all:
                  >
                  > Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle "HOME"?
                  >
                  > A place where DVdongle users can seek each other out, conduct tests, ask questions, share info, or just rag chew. A "common place" that DVdongle users can hang out.
                  >
                  >
                  > Suggest >>> REF019A <<< that will likely have little usage being in Wisconsin and very very little Ops on 1.2G.
                  >
                  > Some use is always better than NO use! I tested 19A and it seems to work by reporting my connection on the web site tracker:
                  > http://ref019.dstargateway.org/
                  >
                • Woodrick, Ed
                  Kuby, Just a tidbit of information. The letter on a reflector has nothing to do with a frequency. There is absolutely no correlation between the reflector s A
                  Message 8 of 17 , Jun 27, 2009
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                    Kuby,

                     

                    Just a tidbit of information. The letter on a reflector has nothing to do with a frequency. There is absolutely no correlation between the reflector’s A module and 1.2 GHz. Also, a reflectors location has little to do (at this time) with the stations that are connected to it.

                     

                    Another tidbit, the correlation between the module letter and a frequency is a practice started by the trust team. In Japan, the first module on the air is the A module, the next being B. Japan has a number of repeaters where the A module is a 440 frequency.

                     

                    Ed WA4YIH

                     

                     

                     

                    From: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com [mailto:DVDongle@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kuby
                    Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 2:11 PM
                    To: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [DVDongle] DVDongle users "HOME" - sugggest "Reflector 19A"

                     




                    Question for all:

                    Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle "HOME"?

                    A place where DVdongle users can seek each other out, conduct tests, ask questions, share info, or just rag chew. A "common place" that DVdongle users can hang out.

                    Suggest >>> REF019A <<< that will likely have little usage being in Wisconsin and very very little Ops on 1.2G.

                    Some use is always better than NO use! I tested 19A and it seems to work by reporting my connection on the web site tracker:
                    http://ref019.dstargateway.org/

                  • n2slb
                    What happened to your idea? Bob
                    Message 9 of 17 , Jul 2, 2009
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                      What happened to your idea? Bob
                      --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Kuby" <n6jsx@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Question for all:
                      >
                      > Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle "HOME"?
                      >
                      > A place where DVdongle users can seek each other out, conduct tests, ask questions, share info, or just rag chew. A "common place" that DVdongle users can hang out.
                      >
                      >
                      > Suggest >>> REF019A <<< that will likely have little usage being in Wisconsin and very very little Ops on 1.2G.
                      >
                      > Some use is always better than NO use! I tested 19A and it seems to work by reporting my connection on the web site tracker:
                      > http://ref019.dstargateway.org/
                      >
                    • Kuby
                      I ve been there many times but it s hard to have a sane conversation with only myself..... and the past three days I ve been down - working at cleaning/killing
                      Message 10 of 17 , Jul 3, 2009
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                        I've been there many times but it's hard to have a sane conversation with only myself..... and the past three days I've been down - working at cleaning/killing a hijack virus off my PC.

                        And tying REF19"A" to 1.2g was a such a serious faux-pas that it had to be publicly slapped down minimizing my effort and indirectly shaming anyone from doing Dongle REF19A.

                        I've not seen any support for this idea in the group - not from Group management, Dongle creator, or users.

                        I had an idea and tried twice to get momentum - but it looks like my effort was for not.

                        Kuby

                        --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "n2slb" <n2slb@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > What happened to your idea? Bob
                        > --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Kuby" <n6jsx@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Question for all:
                        > >
                        > > Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle "HOME"?
                        > >
                        > > A place where DVdongle users can seek each other out, conduct tests, ask questions, share info, or just rag chew. A "common place" that DVdongle users can hang out.
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > Suggest >>> REF019A <<< that will likely have little usage being in Wisconsin and very very little Ops on 1.2G.
                        > >
                        > > Some use is always better than NO use! I tested 19A and it seems to work by reporting my connection on the web site tracker:
                        > > http://ref019.dstargateway.org/
                        > >
                        >
                      • Woodrick, Ed
                        I certainly hope that you didn t take my comments as a slap down My comments were only meant to make sure that a couple of common misperceptions were not
                        Message 11 of 17 , Jul 3, 2009
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                          I certainly hope that you didn’t take my comments as a “slap down” My comments were only meant to make sure that a couple of “common misperceptions” were not occurring.

                           

                          The whole concept of the reflectors is foreign to many D-STAR users. There are a number of users that I’ve talked to that really do think that the C module on a reflector has something to do with a 2M repeater. There’s also a large number who think that the B module “has to be” 440 MHz.

                           

                          Just wanted to keep the facts straight.

                           

                          Ed WA4YIH

                           

                           

                           

                          From: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com [mailto:DVDongle@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kuby
                          Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 10:45 AM
                          To: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: [DVDongle] Re: DVDongle users "HOME" - sugggest "Reflector 19A"

                           




                          I've been there many times but it's hard to have a sane conversation with only myself..... and the past three days I've been down - working at cleaning/killing a hijack virus off my PC.

                          And tying REF19"A" to 1.2g was a such a serious faux-pas that it had to be publicly slapped down minimizing my effort and indirectly shaming anyone from doing Dongle REF19A.

                          I've not seen any support for this idea in the group - not from Group management, Dongle creator, or users.

                          I had an idea and tried twice to get momentum - but it looks like my effort was for not.

                          Kuby

                          --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "n2slb" <n2slb@...> wrote:

                          >
                          > What happened to your idea? Bob
                          > --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com,
                          "Kuby" <n6jsx@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Question for all:
                          > >
                          > > Do you think we could adopt a USA REFLECTOR as a DVDongle
                          "HOME"?
                          > >
                          > > A place where DVdongle users can seek each other out, conduct tests,
                          ask questions, share info, or just rag chew. A "common place" that DVdongle users can hang out.
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Suggest >>> REF019A <<< that will likely have
                          little usage being in Wisconsin and very very little Ops on 1.2G.
                          > >
                          > > Some use is always better than NO use! I tested 19A and it seems to
                          work by reporting my connection on the web site tracker:
                          > > http://ref019.dstargateway.org/
                          > >
                          >

                        • verhulst01876
                          ... Yes, but you only have to look at D-StarUsers.org to understand why people think that there is. Here s a snipped from that site: PA3ANG 07/05/09 21:35:30
                          Message 12 of 17 , Jul 5, 2009
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                            --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Woodrick, Ed" <ewoodrick@...> wrote:

                            > Just a tidbit of information. The letter on a reflector has nothing to do with a frequency. There is absolutely no correlation between the reflector's A module and 1.2 GHz.

                            Yes, but you only have to look at D-StarUsers.org to understand why people think that there is. Here's a snipped from that site:

                            PA3ANG 07/05/09 21:35:30 UTC REF017 A 1.2GHz DVD Amsterdam
                            W1DYS 07/05/09 21:33:30 UTC REF017 A 1.2GHz DVD Amsterdam
                            PA7FRN 07/05/09 21:32:35 UTC REF017 A 1.2GHz DVD Amsterdam
                            VE2NBZ 07/05/09 21:11:12 UTC REF016 C 2 Meters DVD Unknown
                            N2SLB 07/05/09 21:09:42 UTC REF001 C 2 Meters DVD Unknown
                            KC2SCY 07/05/09 20:54:56 UTC REF020 A 1.2GHz DVD Unknown
                            KI6TWT 07/05/09 20:49:20 UTC REF016 B 440 MHz DVD Unknown
                            PD0MAR 07/05/09 20:45:30 UTC REF017 A 1.2GHz DVD Amsterdam

                            73s, Tony
                          • Louis Cashmer
                            Agreed, there is no mandatory correlation between letter designation and band. However, I think a standard needs to be accepted and adopted. DSTAR has a fairly
                            Message 13 of 17 , Jul 7, 2009
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                              Agreed, there is no mandatory correlation between letter designation and band. However, I think a standard needs to be accepted and adopted.

                              DSTAR has a fairly steep learning curve. As a matter of fact, I think it may be more work than many HAMs are willing to put in. The lack of consistency and documentation make it more difficult.

                              I ran into this very issue on my first attempt at contributing some documentation for new users to our community. I think it would be a simple matter for us all to simply agree to a common standard for alpha designations and publish.

                              Open architecture doesn't have to mean anarchy. Standards can be a good thing.

                              Just MHO
                              Louis
                              KG4QPQ

                              --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "verhulst01876" <w1dys@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Woodrick, Ed" <ewoodrick@> wrote:
                              >
                              > > Just a tidbit of information. The letter on a reflector has nothing to do with a frequency. There is absolutely no correlation between the reflector's A module and 1.2 GHz.
                              >
                            • John Hays
                              It is not a standard, it is a convention - but we would be better served by understanding what it is than just accepting and adopting it. Think of this
                              Message 14 of 17 , Jul 7, 2009
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                                It is not a standard, it is a convention - but we would be better served by understanding what it is than just accepting and adopting it.

                                Think of this scenario:

                                You have an Icom RP2C controller and you decide to hook up 4 Icom repeater modules to it.

                                145.105- MHz.
                                147.395+ MHz.
                                445.491250- MHz.
                                449.493750- MHz.

                                (The controller accepts four modules, regardless of band or mode, e,g. DD/DV)

                                Since you can't have two "B" modules and two "C" modules, what are you going to do?  Simple, you just name them "A", "B", "C", and "D"  or "X", "Y", "Z", and "Q" - it really doesn't matter.  The letters are only there to differentiate multiple modules assigned to the same callsign.  (Actually, if the gateway software and controller firmware were smarter, you could have different callsigns and no letters at all).

                                You don't really need to know what band/frequency the repeater is on when going through the gateway, you just need to know its callsign (address).  With callsign directed calls, it becomes even less important because you may not even know, or care what repeater the end station is at.

                                From an "air protocol" a lot of what is in the current gateway/controller is overly complex for no good reason from a user point of view.  Unfortunately, people make policy based on what makes sense to them, rather than looking at the architectural issues and creating sensible approaches to the problem domain.


                                On Jul 7, 2009, at 6:54 AM, Louis Cashmer wrote:

                                Agreed, there is no mandatory correlation between letter designation and band. However, I think a standard needs to be accepted and adopted.

                                DSTAR has a fairly steep learning curve. As a matter of fact, I think it may be more work than many HAMs are willing to put in. The lack of consistency and documentation make it more difficult.

                                I ran into this very issue on my first attempt at contributing some documentation for new users to our community. I think it would be a simple matter for us all to simply agree to a common standard for alpha designations and publish.

                                Open architecture doesn't have to mean anarchy. Standards can be a good thing.

                                Just MHO
                                Louis
                                KG4QPQ 

                                John Hays
                                Amateur Radio: K7VE

                              • Woodrick, Ed
                                And the accepted convention, as far as I know, is.... For systems connected to the US Trust Server C = 140MHz B = 440MHz A=1.2 GHz For systems connected to the
                                Message 15 of 17 , Jul 7, 2009
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                                  And the accepted convention, as far as I know, is….

                                   

                                   

                                  For systems connected to the US Trust Server

                                   

                                  C = 140MHz

                                  B = 440MHz

                                  A=1.2 GHz

                                   

                                  For systems connected to the Japan Trust Server

                                   

                                  A=First module

                                  B=Second module.

                                  (There is no 2 M in Japan)

                                   

                                  (The frequency allocation differs dependent on the country. US is on 440, most of the rest of the world is 430. Similar for other bands.)

                                   

                                  For Reflectors

                                  A, B, C have no frequency correlation. You can find on REF001C, 144, 440, and 1200 MHz servers all interconnected.

                                   

                                   

                                  IF D-STAR moves to other bands, the US Trust Server, in my opinion, would be in danger of having to be rethought. We can’t, and shouldn’t create a letter for each band. The real intent, as John mentioned is ABCD, for module 1-4.

                                   

                                   

                                  And in an attempt to simplify D-STAR for the new user, we all need to start referring to the callsigns and letters similarly to the way we specify tones for FM repeaters.

                                   

                                  For a FM repeater, WB4QDX 444.000 +5.0 88Hz

                                  For a DSTAR repeater WD4STR 440.550 +5.0 Mod B

                                   

                                  And to program your D-STAR radio, set the frequency, set RPT1 to WD4STR B RPT2 to WD4STR G. RPT1 8th character is always the module. RPT2 8th character is always G. (Yes there are a few exceptions, just like there are exceptions to setting the tone, but you don’t teach that to beginners) UR is always CQCQCQ.

                                   

                                  What’s so tough about that? Do you teach new FM users how to link repeaters to begin with? D-STAR is much easier than most people make it.

                                   

                                  Ed WA4YIH

                                   

                                  From: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com [mailto:DVDongle@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Hays
                                  Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 3:41 PM
                                  To: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com
                                  Subject: Re: [DVDongle] Re: DVDongle users "HOME" - sugggest "Reflector 19A"

                                   




                                  It is not a standard, it is a convention - but we would be better served by understanding what it is than just accepting and adopting it.

                                   

                                  Think of this scenario:

                                   

                                  You have an Icom RP2C controller and you decide to hook up 4 Icom repeater modules to it.

                                   

                                  145.105- MHz.

                                  147.395+ MHz.

                                  445.491250- MHz.

                                  449.493750- MHz.

                                   

                                  (The controller accepts four modules, regardless of band or mode, e,g. DD/DV)

                                   

                                  Since you can't have two "B" modules and two "C" modules, what are you going to do?  Simple, you just name them "A", "B", "C", and "D"  or "X", "Y", "Z", and "Q" - it really doesn't matter.  The letters are only there to differentiate multiple modules assigned to the same callsign.  (Actually, if the gateway software and controller firmware were smarter, you could have different callsigns and no letters at all).

                                   

                                  You don't really need to know what band/frequency the repeater is on when going through the gateway, you just need to know its callsign (address).  With callsign directed calls, it becomes even less important because you may not even know, or care what repeater the end station is at.

                                   

                                  From an "air protocol" a lot of what is in the current gateway/controller is overly complex for no good reason from a user point of view.  Unfortunately, people make policy based on what makes sense to them, rather than looking at the architectural issues and creating sensible approaches to the problem domain.

                                   

                                   

                                  On Jul 7, 2009, at 6:54 AM, Louis Cashmer wrote:



                                  Agreed, there is no mandatory correlation between letter designation and band. However, I think a standard needs to be accepted and adopted.

                                  DSTAR has a fairly steep learning curve. As a matter of fact, I think it may be more work than many HAMs are willing to put in. The lack of consistency and documentation make it more difficult.

                                  I ran into this very issue on my first attempt at contributing some documentation for new users to our community. I think it would be a simple matter for us all to simply agree to a common standard for alpha designations and publish.

                                  Open architecture doesn't have to mean anarchy. Standards can be a good thing.

                                  Just MHO
                                  Louis
                                  KG4QPQ 

                                   

                                  John Hays

                                  Amateur Radio: K7VE

                                   

                                • Steve Glen
                                  A Rose by any other name.......   For a new user the difference between a Standard and a Convention has no meaning.  If DStar wishes to grow and see
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Jul 8, 2009
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    A Rose by any other name.......
                                     
                                    For a new user the difference between a Standard and a Convention has no meaning.  If DStar wishes to grow and see increased acceptance in the Ham Radio community then we will be better off answering the question asked by newcomers.  "How do I get my radio to work on the DStar repeater" is the most common first timer question.  Those of us on DStar now had better be ready with a non-computer geek speak answer.  For the kind of prices that Icom is asking for end user radios that are DStar capable we had better make it easy for the new purchaser to get going or that same user will simply get angry.  
                                    Ed's posting on this topic should be copied to every piece of DStar Documentation in the world that a new user might ever find.  To date Ed's answer to the above question is the best I have found. 
                                     
                                    73 de W5EN Steve

                                    --- On Tue, 7/7/09, John Hays <john@...> wrote:

                                    From: John Hays <john@...>
                                    Subject: Re: [DVDongle] Re: DVDongle users "HOME" - sugggest "Reflector 19A"
                                    To: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com
                                    Date: Tuesday, July 7, 2009, 2:41 PM

                                    It is not a standard, it is a convention - but we would be better served by understanding what it is than just accepting and adopting it.

                                    Think of this scenario:

                                    You have an Icom RP2C controller and you decide to hook up 4 Icom repeater modules to it.

                                    145.105- MHz.
                                    147.395+ MHz.
                                    445.491250- MHz.
                                    449.493750- MHz.

                                    (The controller accepts four modules, regardless of band or mode, e,g. DD/DV)

                                    Since you can't have two "B" modules and two "C" modules, what are you going to do?  Simple, you just name them "A", "B", "C", and "D"  or "X", "Y", "Z", and "Q" - it really doesn't matter.  The letters are only there to differentiate multiple modules assigned to the same callsign.  (Actually, if the gateway software and controller firmware were smarter, you could have different callsigns and no letters at all).

                                    You don't really need to know what band/frequency the repeater is on when going through the gateway, you just need to know its callsign (address)..  With callsign directed calls, it becomes even less important because you may not even know, or care what repeater the end station is at.

                                    From an "air protocol" a lot of what is in the current gateway/controller is overly complex for no good reason from a user point of view.  Unfortunately, people make policy based on what makes sense to them, rather than looking at the architectural issues and creating sensible approaches to the problem domain.


                                    On Jul 7, 2009, at 6:54 AM, Louis Cashmer wrote:

                                    Agreed, there is no mandatory correlation between letter designation and band. However, I think a standard needs to be accepted and adopted.

                                    DSTAR has a fairly steep learning curve. As a matter of fact, I think it may be more work than many HAMs are willing to put in. The lack of consistency and documentation make it more difficult.

                                    I ran into this very issue on my first attempt at contributing some documentation for new users to our community. I think it would be a simple matter for us all to simply agree to a common standard for alpha designations and publish.

                                    Open architecture doesn't have to mean anarchy. Standards can be a good thing.

                                    Just MHO
                                    Louis
                                    KG4QPQ 

                                    John Hays
                                    Amateur Radio: K7VE


                                  • Kuby
                                    This posting subject was hijacked! The latest responses have NO bearing on the subject! But a few must state, restate,and nit-pick the hijacking! And we wonder
                                    Message 17 of 17 , Jul 8, 2009
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      This posting subject was hijacked!
                                      The latest responses have NO bearing on the subject!
                                      But a few must state, restate,and nit-pick the hijacking!

                                      And we wonder why DVDongle is loosing interest?!@#$%^&*()!@#$%^&*(



                                      --- In DVDongle@yahoogroups.com, "Woodrick, Ed" <ewoodrick@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > And the accepted convention, as far as I know, is....
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > For systems connected to the US Trust Server
                                      >
                                      > C = 140MHz
                                      > B = 440MHz
                                      > A=1.2 GHz
                                      >
                                      > For systems connected to the Japan Trust Server
                                      >
                                      > A=First module
                                      > B=Second module.
                                      > (There is no 2 M in Japan)
                                      >
                                      > (The frequency allocation differs dependent on the country. US is on 440, most of the rest of the world is 430. Similar for other bands.)
                                      >
                                      > For Reflectors
                                      > A, B, C have no frequency correlation. You can find on REF001C, 144, 440, and 1200 MHz servers all interconnected.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > IF D-STAR moves to other bands, the US Trust Server, in my opinion, would be in danger of having to be rethought. We can't, and shouldn't create a letter for each band. The real intent, as John mentioned is ABCD, for module 1-4.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > And in an attempt to simplify D-STAR for the new user, we all need to start referring to the callsigns and letters similarly to the way we specify tones for FM repeaters.
                                      >
                                      > For a FM repeater, WB4QDX 444.000 +5.0 88Hz
                                      > For a DSTAR repeater WD4STR 440.550 +5.0 Mod B
                                      >
                                      > And to program your D-STAR radio, set the frequency, set RPT1 to WD4STR B RPT2 to WD4STR G. RPT1 8th character is always the module. RPT2 8th character is always G. (Yes there are a few exceptions, just like there are exceptions to setting the tone, but you don't teach that to beginners) UR is always CQCQCQ.
                                      >
                                      > What's so tough about that? Do you teach new FM users how to link repeaters to begin with? D-STAR is much easier than most people make it.
                                      >
                                      > Ed WA4YIH
                                      >
                                      > From: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com [mailto:DVDongle@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Hays
                                      > Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 3:41 PM
                                      > To: DVDongle@yahoogroups.com
                                      > Subject: Re: [DVDongle] Re: DVDongle users "HOME" - sugggest "Reflector 19A"
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > It is not a standard, it is a convention - but we would be better served by understanding what it is than just accepting and adopting it.
                                      >
                                      > Think of this scenario:
                                      >
                                      > You have an Icom RP2C controller and you decide to hook up 4 Icom repeater modules to it.
                                      >
                                      > 145.105- MHz.
                                      > 147.395+ MHz.
                                      > 445.491250- MHz.
                                      > 449.493750- MHz.
                                      >
                                      > (The controller accepts four modules, regardless of band or mode, e,g. DD/DV)
                                      >
                                      > Since you can't have two "B" modules and two "C" modules, what are you going to do? Simple, you just name them "A", "B", "C", and "D" or "X", "Y", "Z", and "Q" - it really doesn't matter. The letters are only there to differentiate multiple modules assigned to the same callsign. (Actually, if the gateway software and controller firmware were smarter, you could have different callsigns and no letters at all).
                                      >
                                      > You don't really need to know what band/frequency the repeater is on when going through the gateway, you just need to know its callsign (address). With callsign directed calls, it becomes even less important because you may not even know, or care what repeater the end station is at.
                                      >
                                      > From an "air protocol" a lot of what is in the current gateway/controller is overly complex for no good reason from a user point of view. Unfortunately, people make policy based on what makes sense to them, rather than looking at the architectural issues and creating sensible approaches to the problem domain.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > On Jul 7, 2009, at 6:54 AM, Louis Cashmer wrote:
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Agreed, there is no mandatory correlation between letter designation and band. However, I think a standard needs to be accepted and adopted.
                                      >
                                      > DSTAR has a fairly steep learning curve. As a matter of fact, I think it may be more work than many HAMs are willing to put in. The lack of consistency and documentation make it more difficult.
                                      >
                                      > I ran into this very issue on my first attempt at contributing some documentation for new users to our community. I think it would be a simple matter for us all to simply agree to a common standard for alpha designations and publish.
                                      >
                                      > Open architecture doesn't have to mean anarchy. Standards can be a good thing.
                                      >
                                      > Just MHO
                                      > Louis
                                      > KG4QPQ
                                      >
                                      > John Hays
                                      > Amateur Radio: K7VE
                                      > john@...<mailto:john@...>
                                      >
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