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Re: TERMS: SUV, forward pass + THANKS: Scull &Bones + motions

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  • melvyn.geo
    ... suggestions about ... hnaty ). I m not sure it s so secret, actually, considering it took me all of 10 seconds to find a list of famous past members and
    Message 1 of 7 , Feb 2, 2002
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      --- In Czechlist@y..., "Irena Steinerova" <irena.steinerova@w...>
      wrote:
      > First of all, I would like to thank to everyone for their
      suggestions about
      > Scull&Bones (I decided to call it simply "tajny spolek Lebka s
      hnaty").

      I'm not sure it's so secret, actually, considering it took me all of
      10 seconds to find a list of famous past members and detailed
      descriptions of their bizarre initiation ceremonies. All good clean
      fun, I'm sure. Hmmm, maybe we should have something like that for
      Czechlist members...:) Tajnustkarsky rather than tajny, if you ask me.

      >Does anyone know what an SUV (sport utility vehicle) is called in
      Czech? It does not have to be an "official" term, just a colloquial
      name. (In my case, it is a Lincoln Navigator). I know what it looks
      like, but what the hell people call it? I have found "vozidlo pro
      volny cas", but it is too long and seems strange.
      >

      Here's a few alternatives for you that I found by looking it up with
      the Czech filter on in Google's advanced search feature (so of course
      they are all authoritative, Karel :)). Talking of search engines, I'd
      be interested in your thoughts on www.webfast.cz - a kind of Czech
      Google.



      uplatnìna pøi tvorbì nejnovìjšího vozu pro volný èas - SUV (Sport
      utility vehicle) znaèky Hyundai. Santa Fe pøichází s neuvìøitelným
      výètem ...
      www.autoagent.cz/santafe/santafe.htm

      (Sport Utility Vehicle - vozidlo pro volný èas) kombinuje prostor s
      vytøíbeným interiérem a nabízí ...
      www.mazda.cz/html/neospac.htm


      PIT STOP - Slovník automobilových pojmù a zkratek:
      SUV Sport Utility Vehicle - sportovnì užitkové vozy
      www.hyperlink.cz/pitstop/Slovn%C3%ADk.htm


      (Sport Utility Vehicle - Sportovnì Užitkové Vozidlo). ...
      www.svet4x4.cz/koktejl/vyrobci1.html


      Je to hybrid mezi tzv. sport-utility-vehicle a sedanem. V podstatì
      pøedstavuje luxusní kanceláø na kolech s libovolnì ...
      www.usmotors.cz/akce/akce_v_zahranici/99_detroit/general_motors/
      detroit_gm.html

      M.
    • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
      ... That really is strange. Your instinct is correct, because most SUVs are not used only for recreation, but as a main family vehicle. Another term for SUV
      Message 2 of 7 , Feb 2, 2002
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        In a message dated 2/2/02 5:03:36 AM, irena.steinerova@... writes:

        >I have found "vozidlo pro
        >volny cas", but it is too long and seems strange.

        That really is strange. Your instinct is correct, because most SUVs are not
        used only for recreation, but as a main family vehicle. Another term for SUV
        would be "all-terrain vehicle". This is also tricky, because most SUV
        drivers -- especially those with Lincoln Navigators -- never go off-roading
        in them. They are driven mainly for image, for their size (to some
        Americans, size = safety), for their better road visibility, and for their
        perceived practicality. For the Lincoln Navigator specifically, you could
        make up a Czech term that means something to the effect of "luxury
        all-terrain vehicle". In fact, I think it's sometimes referred to this way
        even in English. For that segment of the vehicle market in general, you
        could also describe it "passenger utility vehicle". That term also appears
        in English sometimes. In English we can't call it a "Jeep", because as it
        says on the advertisements, "Jeep is a registered trademark of
        DaimlerChrysler," but you may be able to call an SUV a "dz^íp" in Czech, but
        that's not quite right either. My automotive dictionary offers "terénní
        osobní vúz", which sounds accurate to my non-Czech ears, but my guess is that
        you'll probably have to make up a term yourself.

        BTW, I once had a class of students in the CR who said that English was not
        an expressive language and had a smaller vocabulary than Czech, while Czech
        had a word for everything on earth. One of the first things I did to prove
        them wrong was to present them with a bunch of everyday English terms for
        different types of cars and for various driving maneuvers. For most terms
        they could not come up with a Czech equivalent. Then I started the same
        thing with pastry...

        BTW, it may help you a little to understand why the Lincoln Navigator even
        came about. (I worked for years in automotive communications and advertising
        in Detroit.) Lincoln and Cadillac had been severely losing market share for
        a number of years, because their traditional customers were dying. I mean
        they were literally getting old and dying! So, both companies had to come up
        with something to lure younger customers. Baby-boomers are embarrassed by
        overt displays of luxury, unless they appear "practical" somehow, so the
        answer was to come up with a luxury SUV.

        >The other question relates to football. I have the following sentence:
        >"...a lawyer who holds his speech in the same kind of suspicion with which
        Woody
        >Hayes viewed the forward pass." OK, I have found that W.H. was a football
        >coach and I understand that "forward pass" can be either a person or "hozeni
        >mice na protivnikovu branku". But which one fits the context??

        It's not the person (in fact, I have never even heard the term used to refer
        to a person). It's the "hozeni mice" meaning.

        Would you by any chance be translating a training manual for salespeople?
        Those things are always full of sports stories that don't translate into othe
        r cultures. What do you do with that? In fact, when those things would
        appear on our desks for the first time, my coworkers and I used to play a
        game: "Hey, you guys! Is this one going to be football, basketball or
        baseball?" You might tell the client that American football stories are
        meaningless to Czechs and ask for another way to handle that section.
        They'll probably be totally ignorant of foreign cultures and tell you "just
        translate it", but at least you'll have said something. At one company where
        I worked, the account people told the Spanish translator "just translate it",
        and the title of the automotive sales training program came out in Puerto
        Rican Spanish meaning "A Big Bowel Movement". It had been printed all over
        pens, note pads and T-shirts to be given to the seminar participants, and the
        problem wasn't discovered until right before "show time".

        Jamie
      • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
        I still think that vozidlo pro volny cas is a terrible translation of the term, and very inaccurate. That calque sportovni uzitkovy vuz is better, but I
        Message 3 of 7 , Feb 2, 2002
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          I still think that "vozidlo pro volny cas" is a terrible translation of the
          term, and very inaccurate. That calque "sportovni uzitkovy vuz" is better,
          but I don't know if it sounds natural to Czechs.

          Keep in mind that automotive companies in the US, and their ad agencies,
          almost never check the accuracy of those translations, so bad terms -- or
          even completely nonsensical terms -- can go undetected. They can even
          perpetuate themselves under the justification that, "That's what they used
          last time," or "It's what we usually use," etc. In one manual I went over,
          they were using the Spanish equivalent of "záliv" to refer to a section of a
          garage. It was totally nonsensical and incomprehensible, but people
          justified it by saying, "That's been used before!" So, keep in mind that you
          can change a pre-existing bad term to a good one, and probably no one will
          notice on the American side, and on the Czech side they may even be grateful.

          Jamie
        • ottop1
          ... translation of the ... I go with on this Jamie. I have been always used to call such cars terenni vuz or terenak (colloquial style). BR Otto
          Message 4 of 7 , Feb 2, 2002
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            > I still think that "vozidlo pro volny cas" is a terrible
            translation of the
            > term, and very inaccurate. That calque "sportovni uzitkovy vuz" is

            I go with on this Jamie. I have been always used to call such
            cars "terenni vuz" or "terenak" (colloquial style).

            BR

            Otto
          • Matej Klimes
            SUV is Sport Utility Vehicle, as I m sure you know, I ve seen it translated as: Sportovni uzitkovy vuz in Czecho, but don t think it s anything else than a
            Message 5 of 7 , Feb 2, 2002
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              SUV is Sport Utility Vehicle, as I'm sure you know, I've seen it translated
              as:

              Sportovni uzitkovy vuz in Czecho, but don't think it's anything else than a
              literal translation....

              I've also seen these acronyms (SUV, HRV, etc) used as such - I think they
              are understood among car people, maybe try using SUV, explaining it and then
              sticking to it?

              Matej


              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Irena Steinerova <irena.steinerova@...>
              To: Czechlist <Czechlist@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 11:03 AM
              Subject: [Czechlist] TERMS: SUV, forward pass + THANKS: Scull &Bones +
              motions


              > First of all, I would like to thank to everyone for their suggestions
              about
              > Scull&Bones (I decided to call it simply "tajny spolek Lebka s hnaty").
              Many
              > thanks to Michal Borek and Michael Trittipo for their valuable help with a
              > discovery motion/m. to supress!
              >
              > Today, I have two more questions. The first one is related to vehicles
              (the
              > topic I am quite ignorant of): Does anyone know what an SUV (sport utility
              > vehicle) is called in Czech? It does not have to be an "official" term,
              just
              > a colloquial name. (In my case, it is a Lincoln Navigator). I know what it
              > looks like, but what the hell people call it? I have found "vozidlo pro
              > volny cas", but it is too long and seems strange.
              >
              > The other question relates to football. I have the following sentence:
              "...a
              > lawyer who holds his speech in the same kind of suspicion with which Woody
              > Hayesviewed the forward pass." OK, I have found that W.H. was a football
              > coach and I understand that "forward pass" can be either a person or
              "hozeni
              > mice na protivnikovu branku". But which one fits the context??
              >
              > Many thanks in advance!
              > Irena
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Czechlist: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Czechlist
              > Post message: Czechlist@yahoogroups.com
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
            • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
              ... I think vozidlo pro volny cas must originally have been the translation of recreational vehicle ( RV for short), and was then misapplied to SUVs.
              Message 6 of 7 , Feb 2, 2002
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                In a message dated 2/2/02 11:07:25 AM, otto@... writes:

                >> I still think that "vozidlo pro volny cas" is a terrible
                >translation of the
                >> term, and very inaccurate. That calque "sportovni uzitkovy vuz" is

                >I go with on this Jamie. I have been always used to call such
                >cars "terenni vuz" or "terenak" (colloquial style).

                I think "vozidlo pro volny cas" must originally have been the translation of
                "recreational vehicle" ("RV" for short), and was then misapplied to SUVs.

                Jamie
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