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Re: [Czechlist] Re: TERM: Samospasitelnost

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  • James Kirchner
    ... Definitely not salve. That s a different thing entirely. ... abiding by ... I think that in English this concept is expressed in a religious context as
    Message 1 of 11 , May 31, 2005
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      On Tuesday, May 31, 2005, at 11:36 AM, Terminus Technicus wrote:

      > > "V cirkvi se setkavame casto i s opacnym jevem - se
      > samospasitelnosti, kdy
      > > si lide chteji zajistit spasu svymi zboznymi skutky a dodrzovanim
      > cirkevnich
      > > prikazani".
      >
      >
      > self-redemption, self-salvation...  the "lide snazici se zajistit si
      > spasu"
      > bit is the key...
      >
      > people trying to save(salve)

      Definitely not salve. That's a different thing entirely.

      > themselves by performing religious deeds and
      > obiding with

      abiding by

      > church "rules"

      I think that in English this concept is expressed in a religious
      context as "obtaining salvation through (good) works", "achieving
      salvation by (good) deeds". Any variation of [achieving/obtaining
      salvation through/by works/deeds] would work.

      Some people who want to express the idea negatively (usually Christian
      Evangelicals with a strong, less-informed anti-Catholic prejudice) will
      even say "purchase salvation by works".

      If the tone is derisive and intended as a sarcastic comment about
      people who think that their good works alone will save them, it
      wouldn't be strange to say "do-it-yourself salvation". I think
      Catholics and Protestants would use this to talk about immoral people
      who want to buy their way into heaven by doing things.

      If I knew the ideological bent of the text, I could guess it better.

      Jamie


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Laura Rescio
      Hello all, here I am, late again... the text is by no means sarcastic, it is an interview with cardinal Spidlik and I don t think the journalist meant it in
      Message 2 of 11 , Jun 6, 2005
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        Hello all,

        here I am, late again... the text is by no means sarcastic, it is an
        interview with cardinal Spidlik and I don't think the journalist meant
        it in any less than orthodox way :)
        I think I'll stick to "self-redemption" or "self-salvation" then, not
        forgetting the "good deeds". I hope I find a good Italian equivalent.
        Many thanks to all of you who shed light on the matter: Jirka, Tomas,
        Melvyn, Matej, James. You've been a great help!

        Laura

        James Kirchner wrote:

        >On Tuesday, May 31, 2005, at 11:36 AM, Terminus Technicus wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        >>>"V cirkvi se setkavame casto i s opacnym jevem - se
        >>>
        >>>
        >>samospasitelnosti, kdy
        >>
        >>
        >>>si lide chteji zajistit spasu svymi zboznymi skutky a dodrzovanim
        >>>
        >>>
        >>cirkevnich
        >>
        >>
        >>>prikazani".
        >>>
        >>>
        >>self-redemption, self-salvation... the "lide snazici se zajistit si
        >>spasu"
        >>bit is the key...
        >>
        >>people trying to save(salve)
        >>
        >>
        >
        >Definitely not salve. That's a different thing entirely.
        >
        >
        >
        >>themselves by performing religious deeds and
        >>obiding with
        >>
        >>
        >
        >abiding by
        >
        >
        >
        >>church "rules"
        >>
        >>
        >
        >I think that in English this concept is expressed in a religious
        >context as "obtaining salvation through (good) works", "achieving
        >salvation by (good) deeds". Any variation of [achieving/obtaining
        >salvation through/by works/deeds] would work.
        >
        >Some people who want to express the idea negatively (usually Christian
        >Evangelicals with a strong, less-informed anti-Catholic prejudice) will
        >even say "purchase salvation by works".
        >
        >If the tone is derisive and intended as a sarcastic comment about
        >people who think that their good works alone will save them, it
        >wouldn't be strange to say "do-it-yourself salvation". I think
        >Catholics and Protestants would use this to talk about immoral people
        >who want to buy their way into heaven by doing things.
        >
        >If I knew the ideological bent of the text, I could guess it better.
        >
        >Jamie
        >
        >
        >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >
        >Czechlist resources:
        >http://www.bohemica.com/czechtranslation
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
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        >
        >Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
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      • melvyn.geo
        ... La self-service redenzione? :-) My Italian is so bad that I have difficulty saying one ice-cream and be quick about it! , but how about autoredenzione ?
        Message 3 of 11 , Jun 7, 2005
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          --- In Czechlist@yahoogroups.com, Laura Rescio <lrescio@f...> wrote:
          > I think I'll stick to "self-redemption" or "self-salvation" then, not
          > forgetting the "good deeds". I hope I find a good Italian equivalent.

          La self-service redenzione? :-) My Italian is so bad that I have
          difficulty saying 'one ice-cream and be quick about it!', but how
          about 'autoredenzione'? Or does that mean 'car repairs'? :-)

          M.
        • Laura Rescio
          Actually, autoredenzione IS the word I was considering... it s a longish word, but it has quite a lot of google hits, both in positive and negative meanings
          Message 4 of 11 , Jun 7, 2005
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            Actually, "autoredenzione" IS the word I was considering... it's a
            longish word, but it has quite a lot of google hits, both in positive
            and negative meanings of the word... good guess :)

            Laura

            melvyn.geo wrote:

            >La self-service redenzione? :-) My Italian is so bad that I have
            >difficulty saying 'one ice-cream and be quick about it!', but how
            >about 'autoredenzione'? Or does that mean 'car repairs'? :-)
            >
            >M.
            >
            >
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