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Bumbrlicek and Bivoj

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  • Petr Jarolím
    Ahoj, it’s me again... I am translating a newspaper article about National Property Fund and three companies involved in a tender. I would need smart English
    Message 1 of 12 , Feb 4, 2003
      Ahoj,

      it’s me again...

      I am translating a newspaper article about National Property Fund and
      three companies involved in a tender.
      I would need smart English equivalents for Bumbrlicek and Bivoj

      Bumbrlicek (FNM)

      Three companies:
      Bivoj (was awarded the tender, is the biggest, but the tender does not
      seem to be transparent enough)
      David = the uninportant one
      Golias (Bivoj’s major competitor)

      Thanks a lost
    • Matej Klimes
      You re going to have to fish in at least the Grimm brothers stories, but even then I think the result will be hard to understand, David and Goliath are
      Message 2 of 12 , Feb 4, 2003
        You're going to have to fish in at least the Grimm brothers' stories, but
        even then I think the result will be hard to understand, David and Goliath
        are simple, not sure I see the reason they used the two Czech lads without
        context - perhaps some big gangster character for Bivoj (what's the name of
        Nicholson's character in Batman - Two Faces?) and something along the lines
        of innocent, trusting the wrong guy - or was that Budulinek? - Disney has
        that story about the little piglets that let the wolf in, doesn't he?

        M



        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Petr Jarolím" <ok2med@...>
        To: <Czechlist@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 9:19 AM
        Subject: [Czechlist] Bumbrlicek and Bivoj


        > Ahoj,
        >
        > it’s me again...
        >
        > I am translating a newspaper article about National Property Fund and
        > three companies involved in a tender.
        > I would need smart English equivalents for Bumbrlicek and Bivoj
        >
        > Bumbrlicek (FNM)
        >
        > Three companies:
        > Bivoj (was awarded the tender, is the biggest, but the tender does not
        > seem to be transparent enough)
        > David = the uninportant one
        > Golias (Bivoj’s major competitor)
        >
        > Thanks a lost
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Czechlist archive: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Czechlist
        >
        > Czechlist resources:
        > http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7953/Intro.html
        >
        > Post message: Czechlist@yahoogroups.com
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        >
      • tomas_barendregt <barendregt@earthlink.n
        I would suggest Behemoth for Bivoj, that way you have biblical names for all three of them (not that that is of supreme importance...). Tom
        Message 3 of 12 , Feb 4, 2003
          I would suggest Behemoth for Bivoj, that way you have biblical names
          for all three of them (not that that is of supreme importance...).

          Tom
        • Martin Janda
          I think we are still missing the point with Bumbrlicek - we need someone huge, fat and ever hungry... Are UK/US audience familiar with Gargantua and
          Message 4 of 12 , Feb 4, 2003
            I think we are still missing the point with Bumbrlicek - we need someone
            huge, fat and ever hungry... Are UK/US audience familiar with Gargantua and
            Pantagruel?

            M.

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: <barendregt@...>
            To: <Czechlist@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 5:17 PM
            Subject: [Czechlist] Re: Bumbrlicek and Bivoj


            > I would suggest Behemoth for Bivoj, that way you have biblical names
            > for all three of them (not that that is of supreme importance...).
            >
            > Tom
            >
            >
            > Czechlist archive: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Czechlist
            >
            > Czechlist resources:
            > http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7953/Intro.html
            >
            > Post message: Czechlist@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >
            >
          • erisdiscordia.rm <erik@sky.cz>
            ... someone ... Gargantua and ... I can t speak for the UK audience, but as far as the US audience, no, that would require us to read books, which we don t. We
            Message 5 of 12 , Feb 4, 2003
              --- In Czechlist@yahoogroups.com, "Martin Janda" <mjanda@g...> wrote:
              > I think we are still missing the point with Bumbrlicek - we need
              someone
              > huge, fat and ever hungry... Are UK/US audience familiar with
              Gargantua and
              > Pantagruel?
              >
              > M.
              I can't speak for the UK audience, but as far as the US audience, no,
              that would require us to read books, which we don't. We can't find
              the button on the remote control to turn them on.

              The only biblical character I can think of who is "huge, fat, and
              ever hungry" would be Nero, and I'm not even sure he's biblical.

              Here's some information from thesaurus.com on words for "large
              characters":

              Entry: giant
              Function: noun
              Definition: goliath
              Synonyms: Hercules, behemoth, brobdingnagian, bulk, colossus,
              cyclops, elephant, goliath, hulk, jumbo, leviathan, lump, mammoth,
              monster, mountain, ogre, polypheme, titan, whale, whopper
              Concept: size (large)
              Source: Roget's Interactive Thesaurus, First Edition (v 1.0.0)
              Copyright © 2003 by Lexico Publishing Group, LLC. All rights
              reserved.

              Wouldn't behemoth be better for bumbrlicek? To me that more suggests
              bigness, slowness, and appetite.

              What I can't figure out is why Bivoj was used for a company that
              was "not transparent" enough - what's not transparent about a
              lovestruck, boar-baiting barbarian?

              Erik

              >
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: <barendregt@e...>
              > To: <Czechlist@yahoogroups.com>
              > Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 5:17 PM
              > Subject: [Czechlist] Re: Bumbrlicek and Bivoj
              >
              >
              > > I would suggest Behemoth for Bivoj, that way you have biblical
              names
              > > for all three of them (not that that is of supreme importance...).
              > >
              > > Tom
              > >
              > >
              > > Czechlist archive: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Czechlist
              > >
              > > Czechlist resources:
              > > http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7953/Intro.html
              > >
              > > Post message: Czechlist@yahoogroups.com
              > >
              > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
              http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              > >
              > >
              > >
            • Michael Trittipo
              ... U.S. audiences probably know Gargantua ( gargantuan is a perfectly good adjective in English). But unless they wasted their youth as a French lit major
              Message 6 of 12 , Feb 4, 2003
                >
                >
                >>huge, fat and ever hungry... Are UK/US audience familiar with
                >>
                >>
                >Gargantua and
                >
                >
                >>Pantagruel?
                >>
                >>
                U.S. audiences probably know Gargantua ("gargantuan" is a perfectly good
                adjective in English). But unless they wasted their youth as a French
                lit major as I did, they probably don't know Pantagruel, Trinquamel,
                Epistemon, Bridoie, etc.
              • melvyn.geo <zehrovak@dr.com>
                ... A guy who goes around biffing boars on the bonce rather reminds me of Asterix. Could Bumbrlicek then be represented by the gluttonous Obelix? OK they re
                Message 7 of 12 , Feb 4, 2003
                  --- In Czechlist@yahoogroups.com, "erisdiscordia.rm <erik@s...>" <erik@s...> wrote:


                  > a lovestruck, boar-baiting barbarian?
                  >
                  A guy who goes around biffing boars on the bonce rather reminds me of Asterix. Could Bumbrlicek then be represented by the gluttonous Obelix? OK they're not legendary characters as such but perhaps they are the kind of archetypal figures that you are looking for.

                  M.
                  ---
                  Exhilaration is that feeling you get just after a great idea
                  hits you, and just before you realize what's wrong with it.
                • Rubková
                  For me Bumbrlicek is a fairy tale person. Greedy fatty child eating everything. Not barbarian eating boars. I don t know how you get to boar-eating barbarian,
                  Message 8 of 12 , Feb 4, 2003
                    For me Bumbrlicek is a fairy tale person. Greedy fatty child eating
                    everything. Not barbarian eating boars. I don't know how you get to
                    boar-eating barbarian, but he looks like Bivoj, mythical strong person who
                    brought his fiancee a life boar on his back.

                    But back to Bumbrdliček, what about Humpry-Dumpty?

                    Sarka
                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: melvyn.geo <zehrovak@...> [mailto:zehrovak@...]
                    Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 12:18 AM
                    To: Czechlist@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [Czechlist] Re: Bumbrlicek and Bivoj


                    --- In Czechlist@yahoogroups.com, "erisdiscordia.rm <erik@s...>" <erik@s...>
                    wrote:


                    > a lovestruck, boar-baiting barbarian?
                    >
                    A guy who goes around biffing boars on the bonce rather reminds me of
                    Asterix. Could Bumbrlicek then be represented by the gluttonous Obelix? OK
                    they're not legendary characters as such but perhaps they are the kind of
                    archetypal figures that you are looking for.

                    M.
                    ---
                    Exhilaration is that feeling you get just after a great idea
                    hits you, and just before you realize what's wrong with it.



                    Czechlist archive: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Czechlist

                    Czechlist resources:
                    http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7953/Intro.html

                    Post message: Czechlist@yahoogroups.com

                    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


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                  • melvyn.geo <zehrovak@dr.com>
                    ... o brought his fiancee a life boar on his back.Nobody said he ate the boar. Didn t Bivoj just hit the boar on the nose (in= a forest clearing at Kavci
                    Message 9 of 12 , Feb 5, 2003
                      --- In Czechlist@yahoogroups.com, Rubková <rubkova@l...> wrote:
                      > For me Bumbrlicek is a fairy tale person. Greedy fatty child eating
                      > everything. Not barbarian eating boars. I don't know how you get to
                      > boar-eating barbarian, but he looks like Bivoj, mythical strong person wh=
                      o
                      > brought his fiancee a life boar on his back.

                      Nobody said he ate the boar. Didn't Bivoj just hit the boar on the nose (in=
                      a forest clearing at Kavci hora, I believe, at a spot close to the Czech TV=
                      Director's office) so he could give it to Kazi, Libuse's smarter elder sis=
                      ter?

                      > But back to Bumbrdlièek, what about Humpry-Dumpty?

                      Hmmm. He's fat because he looks like pan Vajicko even if Hais Hodek do call=
                      him Bumbrlicek too. He's not really well-known for eating a lot. Billy Bunt=
                      er is one archetypal British fat kid but he's a comic book character rather =
                      than a figure from fairy tales. I'm not sure he would fit the context.

                      Any chance of seeing more context here?

                      Melvyn
                      ---
                      Humpty Dumpty was pushed.
                    • Petr Jarolím
                      Dear listmates! Some context for Bumbrlicek a Bivoj: 1. Bumbrlicek ma hlad... 2. Vitezny Bivoj je z cele trojice konkurentu zrejme nejzkusenejsi 3. Ne vsechna
                      Message 10 of 12 , Feb 5, 2003
                        Dear listmates!

                        Some context for Bumbrlicek a Bivoj:
                        1. Bumbrlicek ma hlad...
                        2. Vitezny Bivoj je z cele trojice konkurentu zrejme nejzkusenejsi
                        3. Ne vsechna tato vyjadreni "kopou" za Bivoje (really terrible Czech
                        sentence...)

                        I have not made up my mind yet, but "Bivoj" can be "The Strong One", and
                        Bumbrlicek will be probably referred to as "The Big One" in my translation.

                        The target reader will be the shareholder of one of those companies. And
                        that company is neither US nor UK....

                        regards and thanks for all suggestions!
                        Hanka


                        melvyn.geo wrote:
                        > --- In Czechlist@yahoogroups.com, Rubková <rubkova@l...> wrote:
                        >
                        >>For me Bumbrlicek is a fairy tale person. Greedy fatty child eating
                        >>everything. Not barbarian eating boars. I don't know how you get to
                        >>boar-eating barbarian, but he looks like Bivoj, mythical strong person wh=
                        >
                        > o
                        >
                        >>brought his fiancee a life boar on his back.
                        >
                        >
                        > Nobody said he ate the boar. Didn't Bivoj just hit the boar on the nose (in=
                        > a forest clearing at Kavci hora, I believe, at a spot close to the Czech TV=
                        > Director's office) so he could give it to Kazi, Libuse's smarter elder sis=
                        > ter?
                        >
                        >
                        >>But back to Bumbrdlièek, what about Humpry-Dumpty?
                        >
                        >
                        > Hmmm. He's fat because he looks like pan Vajicko even if Hais Hodek do call=
                        > him Bumbrlicek too. He's not really well-known for eating a lot. Billy Bunt=
                        > er is one archetypal British fat kid but he's a comic book character rather =
                        > than a figure from fairy tales. I'm not sure he would fit the context.
                        >
                        > Any chance of seeing more context here?
                        >
                        > Melvyn
                        > ---
                        > Humpty Dumpty was pushed.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Czechlist archive: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Czechlist
                        >
                        > Czechlist resources:
                        > http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7953/Intro.html
                        >
                        > Post message: Czechlist@yahoogroups.com
                        >
                        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • Michal Ginter
                        Ja bych nechal jmena v originale a pridal vysvetlivku. M.
                        Message 11 of 12 , Feb 5, 2003
                          Ja bych nechal jmena v originale a pridal vysvetlivku.
                          M.
                        • melvyn.geo <zehrovak@dr.com>
                          ... n.Would it be stylistically permissible to invent a couple of Mr Men? Mr Hung= ry or Mr Stout versus Mr Strong or Mr Muscles? Might well work in
                          Message 12 of 12 , Feb 5, 2003
                            --- In Czechlist@yahoogroups.com, Petr Jarolím <ok2med@c...> wrote:


                            >
                            > I have not made up my mind yet, but "Bivoj" can be "The Strong One", and =

                            > Bumbrlicek will be probably referred to as "The Big One" in my translatio=
                            n.

                            Would it be stylistically permissible to invent a couple of Mr Men? Mr Hung=
                            ry or Mr Stout versus Mr Strong or Mr Muscles? Might well work in journalist=
                            ic style IMHO.

                            The sky's the limit, really. Mr Rapacious, Opaque and Entirely Oblivious to=
                            the Social Consequences of his Dubious Accounting Practices atd.

                            S pozdravem,

                            M.
                            ---
                            Nejsem nerozumny. Jen nemam ten stejny rozum jako vy.
                            - Diogenes
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