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Cesky Honza

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  • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
    What do you do with Cesky Honza in English? I ve got an old account of some man saying that when he was younger (this occurred about 150 years ago) he played
    Message 1 of 25 , Feb 26, 2002
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      What do you do with "Cesky Honza" in English?

      I've got an old account of some man saying that when he was younger (this
      occurred about 150 years ago) he played dumb so that he could get into a
      company and do some industrial espionage. (He later became very successful
      with the technology he stole.) The man says that he acted so foolish that
      the company's employees called him "Cesky Hozna". I think many of the
      employees were Germans.

      I don't know how to render that in a blue-collar industrial setting.
      (Please! No one suggest "Silly Billy"! Thank you!) The closest thing I can
      think of is "that Bohunk hick", but that's a little strong.

      Any better suggestions?

      Jamie
    • Rubkova
      Ahoj, Vite, pokousela jsem se te kontaktovat pres Yahoo Messengera, ale nemohou tam nalezt tve ID. Sarka
      Message 2 of 25 , Feb 26, 2002
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        Ahoj, Vite,

        pokousela jsem se te kontaktovat pres Yahoo Messengera, ale nemohou tam
        nalezt tve ID.

        Sarka
      • Simon Vaughan
        ... can ... Boh n head? ;-) Simon
        Message 3 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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          > I don't know how to render that in a blue-collar industrial setting.
          > (Please! No one suggest "Silly Billy"! Thank you!) The closest thing I
          can
          > think of is "that Bohunk hick", but that's a little strong.
          >
          > Any better suggestions?

          Boh'n'head? ;-)

          Simon
        • PSS Praha - Coilin O' Connor
          ... From: Simon Vaughan To: Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 11:35 AM Subject: Re: [Czechlist] Cesky
          Message 4 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "Simon Vaughan" <rachelandsimon@...>
            To: <Czechlist@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 11:35 AM
            Subject: Re: [Czechlist] Cesky Honza


            > > I don't know how to render that in a blue-collar industrial setting.
            > > (Please! No one suggest "Silly Billy"! Thank you!) The closest thing
            I
            > can
            > > think of is "that Bohunk hick", but that's a little strong.
            > >

            Redneck? "okey from niskokie"?

            I suppose "bumpkin", or "Tim nice-but-dim" would be too BE?

            Brgds

            Coilin
          • Martin Janda
            OK, no Silly Billy, How about Hilly Billy then? :-) ... thing
            Message 5 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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              OK, no Silly Billy, How about Hilly Billy then? :-)

              > > > (Please! No one suggest "Silly Billy"! Thank you!) The closest
              thing
              > I
            • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
              ... Bumpkin is a common word in North America too, but it doesn t express nationality. I don t think Americans would be able to make sense of the other
              Message 6 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                In a message dated 2/27/02 5:39:42 AM, coilin.oconnor@... writes:

                >I suppose "bumpkin", or "Tim nice-but-dim" would be too BE?

                "Bumpkin" is a common word in North America too, but it doesn't express
                nationality. I don't think Americans would be able to make sense of the
                other expression without stopping at it.

                The search goes on. Thanks very much.

                Jamie
              • jurpelka
                ... express ... of the ... Hi Jamie, What about Johnny six-pack ? I don t think that the term cesky honza has to be translated with nationality - it s a
                Message 7 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                  > "Bumpkin" is a common word in North America too, but it doesn't
                  express
                  > nationality. I don't think Americans would be able to make sense
                  of the
                  > other expression without stopping at it.

                  Hi Jamie,

                  What about "Johnny six-pack"?

                  I don't think that the term cesky honza has to be translated with
                  nationality - it's a generic fairy tale figure.

                  Anyway, the author is trying to say that he was looking precisely
                  like no rocket-scientist, and therefore he could get any place
                  without any suspicion.

                  Jiri
                • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
                  ... Except that Joe Six-Pack and Joe Lunch-Bucket can both be very sensible at times. ... But don t you think that if a largely German staff called some guy
                  Message 8 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                    In a message dated 2/27/02 8:22:12 AM, gtp1@... writes:

                    >What about "Johnny six-pack"?

                    Except that Joe Six-Pack and Joe Lunch-Bucket can both be very sensible at
                    times.

                    >I don't think that the term cesky honza has to be translated with
                    >nationality - it's a generic fairy tale figure.

                    But don't you think that if a largely German staff called some guy Cesky
                    Honza it would have national connotations in that situation? I wonder.

                    >Anyway, the author is trying to say that he was looking precisely
                    >like no rocket-scientist, and therefore he could get any place
                    >without any suspicion.

                    Maybe just "the hick" would do.

                    Thanks.

                    Jamie
                  • PSS Praha - Coilin O' Connor
                    ... Well, if you re convinced that it has some semi-racist connotations, then there are probably an array of options. Certain Englishers are still quite
                    Message 9 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                      > >What about "Johnny six-pack"?
                      >
                      > Except that Joe Six-Pack and Joe Lunch-Bucket can both be very sensible at
                      > times.
                      >
                      > >I don't think that the term cesky honza has to be translated with
                      > >nationality - it's a generic fairy tale figure.
                      >
                      > But don't you think that if a largely German staff called some guy Cesky
                      > Honza it would have national connotations in that situation? I wonder.
                      >
                      > >Anyway, the author is trying to say that he was looking precisely
                      > >like no rocket-scientist, and therefore he could get any place
                      > >without any suspicion.
                      >
                      > Maybe just "the hick" would do.


                      Well, if you're convinced that it has some "semi-racist" connotations, then
                      there are probably an array of options. Certain Englishers are still quite
                      fond of us thick "Micks and Paddies" :-). I'm also pretty sure I've heard
                      lots of "dumb Polack" (Polac?) slurs in US movies/TV series etc.

                      HTH

                      Coilin
                    • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
                      ... No, not racist. ... quite ... I once saw an American movie with Czech subtitles, and whenever a comedian said Polak , the subtitles said policajt . A
                      Message 10 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                        In a message dated 2/27/02 8:42:39 AM, coilin.oconnor@... writes:

                        >Well, if you're convinced that it has some "semi-racist" connotations,

                        No, not racist.

                        >then there are probably an array of options. Certain Englishers are still
                        quite
                        >fond of us thick "Micks and Paddies" :-). I'm also pretty sure I've heard
                        >lots of "dumb Polack" (Polac?) slurs in US movies/TV series etc.

                        I once saw an American movie with Czech subtitles, and whenever a comedian
                        said "Polak", the subtitles said "policajt". A culturally accurate
                        translation.

                        Jamie
                      • PSS Praha - Coilin O' Connor
                        Would simple Simon be too silly-billyish? (No offence intended to certain listmates:-) Coilin
                        Message 11 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                          Would "simple Simon" be too silly-billyish?

                          (No offence intended to certain listmates:-)

                          Coilin
                        • livingston@seznam.cz
                          ... How bout Homeboy ? Nathan Cutler
                          Message 12 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                            > I don't know how to render that in a blue-collar industrial setting.
                            > (Please! No one suggest "Silly Billy"! Thank you!) The closest thing I
                            > can think of is "that Bohunk hick", but that's a little strong.
                            >
                            > Any better suggestions?

                            How 'bout "Homeboy"?

                            Nathan Cutler
                          • Michael Grant
                            ... I think the Bohunk (without hick) might actually be a pretty good solution, assuming you need to retain the idea that he was Czech. Of course, if he can
                            Message 13 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                              On 2/26/02 11:59 PM, "JPKIRCHNER@..." <JPKIRCHNER@...> wrote:

                              > The closest thing I can
                              > think of is "that Bohunk hick", but that's a little strong.

                              I think "the Bohunk" (without hick) might actually be a pretty good
                              solution, assuming you need to retain the idea that he was Czech. Of course,
                              if he can be a Polak the problem solves itself.

                              Michael

                              --
                              "A journey of a thousand miles does begin with a single step, but it
                              continues with the second and third...."

                              - Art Palmer
                            • Michael Grant
                              On 2/27/02 4:37 AM, PSS Praha - Coilin O Connor ... That s Okie from Muskogee (a real town in Oklahoma). Michael from a little ways south o there -- When
                              Message 14 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                On 2/27/02 4:37 AM, "PSS Praha - Coilin O' Connor"
                                <coilin.oconnor@...> wrote:

                                > Redneck? "okey from niskokie"?

                                That's Okie from Muskogee (a real town in Oklahoma).
                                Michael
                                from a little ways south o' there

                                --

                                "When I was coming up, it was a dangerous world, and you knew exactly who
                                they were," he said. "It was us vs. them, and it was clear who them was.
                                Today, we are not so sure who the they are, but we know they're there."

                                - George W. Bush, Iowa Western Community College, Jan 21, 2000
                              • PSS Praha - Coilin O' Connor
                                ... Thanks for the correction. I was writing it the way I had always heard it in that and we don t take no trips on LSD country song by that guy whose name
                                Message 15 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                  > > Redneck? "okey from niskokie"?
                                  >
                                  > That's Okie from Muskogee (a real town in Oklahoma).
                                  > Michael
                                  > from a little ways south o' there
                                  >


                                  Thanks for the correction. I was writing it the way I had always heard it
                                  in that "and we don't take no trips on LSD" country song by that guy whose
                                  name I can't remember...

                                  Brgds

                                  Coilin
                                • Zemedelec@aol.com
                                  Simple Simon?
                                  Message 16 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                    Simple Simon?
                                  • Simon Vollam
                                    ... You called?
                                    Message 17 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                      > Simple Simon?

                                      You called?
                                    • raesim
                                      According to Jonathon Green s Dictionary of Slang, bohunk and its variants (came to) combine the ideas of Slavic and stupid: bohunk/bohak/bohawk n. (US) 1.
                                      Message 18 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                        According to Jonathon Green's Dictionary of Slang, 'bohunk' and its
                                        variants (came to) combine the ideas of Slavic and stupid:

                                        bohunk/bohak/bohawk n. (US) 1. [late 19C+] a Slav immigrant f.
                                        Eastern Europe. 2. [1910s+] an oafish, dull, if muscular person. 3.
                                        [1930s+] an East European language. [Standard English Bohemian +
                                        Hungarian]

                                        Here's another idea:

                                        bootchkey/butchski n. [20C] (US) a Czech immigrant. [Czech pockej,
                                        wait, used by Czech youngsters while playing games and thus adopted
                                        as generic by early Eastern European immigrants]

                                        Simon
                                      • Zemedelec@aol.com
                                        In a message dated 2/27/2 9:34:20, vollams@matrix.cz writes: Simple Simon? You called? ... That s the problem with an undeclined language, isn t it--the
                                        Message 19 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                          In a message dated 2/27/2 9:34:20, vollams@... writes:

                                          << > Simple Simon?


                                          You called?

                                          >>

                                          That's the problem with an undeclined language, isn't it--the vocative can be
                                          ambiguous.
                                        • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
                                          ... Might not be. Thanks. JK
                                          Message 20 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                            In a message dated 2/27/02 8:53:15 AM, coilin.oconnor@... writes:

                                            >Would "simple Simon" be too silly-billyish?

                                            Might not be. Thanks.

                                            JK
                                          • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
                                            ... Don t you think Bohunk is too derogatory? It could be affectionate or viscious, like the N-word, I suppose, depending on the context. Jamie
                                            Message 21 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                              In a message dated 2/27/02 9:56:43 AM, mgrant@... writes:

                                              >I think "the Bohunk" (without hick) might actually be a pretty good
                                              >solution, assuming you need to retain the idea that he was Czech.

                                              Don't you think "Bohunk" is too derogatory? It could be affectionate or
                                              viscious, like the N-word, I suppose, depending on the context.

                                              Jamie
                                            • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
                                              ... Merle Haggard
                                              Message 22 of 25 , Feb 27, 2002
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                                                In a message dated 2/27/02 10:05:11 AM, coilin.oconnor@... writes:

                                                >Thanks for the correction. I was writing it the way I had always heard it
                                                >in that "and we don't take no trips on LSD" country song by that guy whose
                                                >name I can't remember...

                                                Merle Haggard
                                              • Michael Grant
                                                ... Norwegian? From your description I thought it should be at least a little bit derogatory. No one I know down here uses Bohunk except as a joke, and I m
                                                Message 23 of 25 , Feb 28, 2002
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                                                  On 2/27/02 9:08 PM, "JPKIRCHNER@..." <JPKIRCHNER@...> wrote:

                                                  >> I think "the Bohunk" (without hick) might actually be a pretty good
                                                  >> solution, assuming you need to retain the idea that he was Czech.
                                                  >
                                                  > Don't you think "Bohunk" is too derogatory? It could be affectionate or
                                                  > viscious, like the N-word, I suppose, depending on the context.

                                                  Norwegian?

                                                  From your description I thought it should be at least a little bit
                                                  derogatory. No one I know down here uses "Bohunk" except as a joke, and I'm
                                                  sure if I were of Czech descent I wouldn't be offended by it. Czechs in
                                                  Texas aren't a group that anyone looks down on AFAIK. If the word is used
                                                  with real venom elsewhere I may not have the proper feel for it.

                                                  Michael

                                                  --
                                                  _
                                                  | |
                                                  _| ~~~
                                                  }
                                                  \/\ * /
                                                  \ |
                                                • JPKIRCHNER@aol.com
                                                  ... I can t tell from the writing style of the quote if the guy was called Cesky Honza derogatorily or affectionately. It s written in that 19th-century
                                                  Message 24 of 25 , Feb 28, 2002
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                                                    In a message dated 2/28/02 11:14:56 AM, mgrant@... writes:

                                                    >From your description I thought it should be at least a little bit
                                                    >derogatory. No one I know down here uses "Bohunk" except as a joke, and
                                                    >I'm sure if I were of Czech descent I wouldn't be offended by it. Czechs in
                                                    >Texas aren't a group that anyone looks down on AFAIK. If the word is used
                                                    >with real venom elsewhere I may not have the proper feel for it.

                                                    I can't tell from the writing style of the quote if the guy was called "Cesky
                                                    Honza" derogatorily or affectionately. It's written in that 19th-century
                                                    style which aims at breezy reading and pleasant amusement even when
                                                    describing unpleasantness, so it's hard to tell. Since Bohunk, like Polack
                                                    and n***er (pardon my timidity; I work at universities) can be both
                                                    affectionate and derogatory, I guess Bohunk would do.

                                                    Thanks very much.

                                                    Jamie
                                                  • Tony Long
                                                    Most of the fishing boats/quays I once worked on - high nickname environments) had a resident thicko. Reverse humour usually gave him his nickname, more often
                                                    Message 25 of 25 , Mar 1, 2002
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                                                      Most of the fishing boats/quays I once worked on - high nickname
                                                      environments) had a resident thicko. Reverse humour usually gave him his
                                                      nickname, more often than not '[Nationality] Einstein', or 'Brain of
                                                      [Nationality]' after a radio quiz show that doesn't seem to know when to
                                                      die. 'Shit-for-Brains' also featured, but might be a little OTT for the
                                                      context. And in memory of Saint Dury, let us never forget 'Clever Trevor',
                                                      who haunted nearly every part-time job I ever had in the south of England.

                                                      Best

                                                      Tony

                                                      Known in those days as 'Bollocky Long' not, unfortunately because of any
                                                      particular courage or sexuality, but because of a reputation for getting
                                                      very bad-tempered, often with authority figures (usually the harbourmaster
                                                      or the local bailiffs), and being very stroppy about rules and regulations.
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