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Re: Question/Discussion

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  • gargoyle@xxxxxx.xxx
    ... keep it, it works fine and is different than most other games with hit points ... keep them the same, just lower the starting points, Im mean really,
    Message 1 of 102 , Oct 18, 1999
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      > From: "Christian Conkle" <conkle@...>
      >
      > Okay, CP2020 gamers..
      >
      > Just what, in your opinion, are the "immutable" rules in CP2020. Rules that
      > shouldn't be changed in an official publication ever ever. No patches, no
      > house rules, no alternatives, no options.
      >
      > Examples:
      > Damage chart?

      keep it, it works fine and is "different" than most other games with "hit
      points"

      > Stat/Skill benchmarks?

      keep them the same, just lower the starting points, Im mean really, what kind
      of stats were they expecting when they suggested people start with 85 points to
      divide among 9 stats...

      > Roles?

      definitally keep, they can be altered to fit the desired effect, unlike
      most "classes" they are well defined and WORK!

      > Special Abilities?

      some could be toned dow, but as long as there is a non SA version of the
      ability out there I never saw the problem (Family=Kith, Interface=System
      Knowledge...etc...)

      > Range-based difficulty for combat?

      these could be modified a bit, maybe, just depends on what was worked up

      > Humanity Loss?

      KEEP!!!!!

      > Netrunning?

      an overhaul is in order, but it could still work with the stat+skill+program
      STR+roll method, background and clarifications are in order

      >
      > What of the above should continue completely unchanged? All of it? Some of
      > it?
      >

      as you can see IMO very little, what I believed should be changed has been
      posted at my website, it is still identifiable as cyberpunk and interlock. (I
      have done nothing with netrunning, as my players only want to use them as NPCs)

      > In other words, what makes Cyberpunk 2020 "Cyberpunk 2020"? Is it these
      > details? If any of them are changed, are the rules no longer "Interlock"?
      > What about Mekton? Cyberpunk 2013?

      there were changes between all of their different flavors of interlock,
      HOWEVER, it was very simple to switch between the games. I has wished that
      Dreampark and Faulkenstein had used Interlock (I owned dreampark, wasnt that
      impressed, havent had a good look at CF though). My biggest complaint about the
      switch in systems is, it wasnt needed. I go off of the theory, if it isnt
      broke, dont fix it, Interlock wasnt broke, just needed some fine
      tuning.

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    • geoff heald
      ... PCs should continue to take damage. ... There should be such benchmarks, but they need to be moved. ... never liked em much. Well, that s not true. I
      Message 102 of 102 , Nov 4, 1999
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        Many replies below:

        >
        >Okay, CP2020 gamers..
        >
        >Just what, in your opinion, are the "immutable" rules in CP2020. Rules that
        >shouldn't be changed in an official publication ever ever. No patches, no
        >house rules, no alternatives, no options.
        >
        >Examples:
        >Damage chart?
        PCs should continue to take damage.
        >Stat/Skill benchmarks?
        There should be such benchmarks, but they need to be moved.
        >Roles?
        never liked 'em much. Well, that's not true. I liked 'em fine in 1st ed.
        But what I liked was having no related stat, so you could have a puny smart
        Solo if that suited you.
        >Special Abilities?
        not really a fan. I made 'em skills.
        >Range-based difficulty for combat?
        It should be harder to shoot things that are farther away, yes.
        >Humanity Loss?
        in some form.
        >Netrunning?
        in some form.
        >
        >What of the above should continue completely unchanged? All of it? Some of
        >it?
        >
        >In other words, what makes Cyberpunk 2020 "Cyberpunk 2020"? Is it these
        >details? If any of them are changed, are the rules no longer "Interlock"?
        >What about Mekton? Cyberpunk 2013?

        So long as some measure of compatability is maintained, or at least
        conversion is easy, scrap the whole system if you want. For a long time I
        played with a cobbled together mixture of Mekton and 1st edition instead of
        the CP2020 rules, but I've decided to opt for another system entirely
        unless Fuzion really changes my mind.

        >
        >How do you define the "Interlock" system? What would you have to take away
        >to make it not "Interlock" anymore?
        >

        It would have to not Interlock anymore. Seriously, the whole point of
        Interlock, as described in (Mekton 2?), was that it be a bunch of
        interlocking parts. Don't like that combat system, plug in this one.
        Don't like those damage rules, use these. Fuzion is just a big variant on
        the character generation system, but the smooth conversion makes it easy to
        use one or the other, so it still "Interlocks".

        >From: gargoyle@...
        >
        >> Never mind that this isn't the first re-do of Friday Night Fire
        >> Fight! or that each Interlock and Fuzion game is different!
        >
        >I must interject here, hoiw long did the first edition rules of FNF last?
        1-2
        >years? how about the second edition? 10 years? that is ten years of play,
        ten
        >years of supplements, 10 years of a good system that can and has been
        modified
        >to meet the needs of its users...

        10 years of a system that _I_, for one, never used. Hated it. So count
        the original FNFF as 12 years for me. Worked for 12 years, so why change it?

        >From: Christian Conkle <conkle@...>
        >
        >And that's exactly what Fuzion uses too. So, the question now becomes, what
        >makes Fuzion not Interlock?
        >

        According to everything I've seen, including an interview with the great
        Mike, the change in name is the only way Fuzion differs from Interlock. He
        saw Fuzion as the next step in Interlock, and doesn't see what all the fuss
        is about.

        >From: "Night Flyer" <gargoyle@...>
        >
        >but *is* it interlock? has anyone seen Dragonball Z's version of Fusion? it
        >has a grand total of 4 stats (unless i missed something while skimming the
        >book)
        >

        Dragonball Z (and Usagi Yojimbo) uses "Instant Fuzion", which is a
        simplified version of Fuzion. The big change is that the stats and skills
        are grouped together, so that instead of having Strengthe and Body Type,
        you have Physical, and instead of Tech, Int, and Cool, you have Mental, and
        instead of Ref and Dex you have Combat. And, instead of all your Science
        skills, you take "do Mental stuff". Definitely the TWERPS end of the
        Fuzion spectrum.

        >From: "Night Flyer" <gargoyle@...>
        >
        I do see your problem, but it is not as big as it might be.

        >everything he has done will now have to be CONVERTED to the new system
        *if* he >wishes to use any of the new stuff coming down the pike
        >characters have different stats now with different ranges (convert all
        >characters),
        Multiply all stats by 0.7, except for Ref, which you multiply by 1.4 and
        then divide between 2 stats. No biggie. And moving the other way is a lot
        easier: Add Dex and Ref together and divide by 2, then multiply all stats
        by 1.4

        >weapons will probbably have different stats (convert all stats),
        Not from what I've seen, although at the extreme high ends of the damage
        spectrum (Maximum Metal) there is some feeling that the damage values are
        not accurate.

        Bubblegum Crisis is probably the best indication of what CP203x might be
        like, but BGC is not as gritty or realistic as Cyberpunk.

        ============================
        Geoff Heald
        ============================
        Attention all enemies of the Rival Ninja Corporation: You will lay down
        your weapons and surrender to your nearest R.N.C. representative. Failure
        to do so will result in your total destruction. Thank you.
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