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Re: [Crosley] 1950 Roll down windows

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  • Robert Kirk
    Larry its a good theory IMHO but I doubt anyone will be able to confirm the fact of the matter. Seems to me that any doner to be modified doors would be in
    Message 1 of 6 , Feb 6, 2006
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      Larry its a good theory IMHO but I doubt anyone will
      be able to confirm the fact of the matter. Seems to
      me that any doner to be modified doors would be in
      relative short supply.
      As for OEM color I beleive you need to look
      elsewhere...behind the heater, under the dash beneath
      other covers...headliner, rear panals etc. Few folks
      go to the extreme measure of disassembly when
      changeing colors or repainting.
      robert kirk

      --- Larry <lhabarth@...> wrote:

      >
      > Is there any chance that Crosley factory would have
      > converted the
      > doors with the one piece windows into two piece
      > window doors?
      >
      > Crosley introduced the Super in 1950 with roll down
      > windows (one
      > piece). Later in the year they switched to a fixed
      > vent window (two
      > piece). Does anyone know how long the one pieces
      > windows were used?
      >
      > My car was build in July 1950. The car appears to
      > have been
      > originally painted gay tan but the doors appear to
      > have painted
      > another color under the gay tan. One door looks
      > blue and the other
      > seafoam green. The sound deadener inside both doors
      > is also painted
      > gay tan but the window crank mechanism is painted
      > black. The
      > drivers door still has the front bracket for the one
      > piece window
      > and there is a piece of metal brazed in to support
      > the bottom of the
      > vent window for the two piece window. The passenger
      > door doesn't
      > have the front bracket but does have the metal piece
      > brazed in for
      > the vent window.
      >
      > My guess is there was a problem with the one piece
      > windows, possibly
      > the customers complainting that it was to heavy to
      > roll up. Crosley
      > then made a running change and started pulling the
      > doors off the
      > finished cars to make the change for the new
      > windows. Since they
      > had to braze the new vent support, the doors would
      > have to be
      > repainted. This would explain why the colors on my
      > doors don't match.
      >
      > Could this theory be correct or is it just wishful
      > thinking to
      > explain why my doors are a different color!!
      >
      > Larry
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >


      Regards,
      Robert Kirk

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    • lhabarth@mdiwristwatch.com
      Thanks for the reply Robert, I appreciate your opinion. I am sure the original color is tan. I didn t mention before but it was repainted turquoise/light blue
      Message 2 of 6 , Feb 6, 2006
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        Thanks for the reply Robert, I appreciate your opinion.  I am sure the original color is tan. I didn't mention before but it was repainted turquoise/light blue over the original tan sometime before 1988 when I bought the car. I have started disassembling the car and everything looks original.  The headliner and interior has been removed and the tan paint is everwhere: under dash, behind interior panels, underside of roof, etc.  Behind the voltage regulator is perfect shiny tan paint.  I even found the walnut decal on the tailgate under the chrome license plate light.
         
        Since my car is a Super and should have came with roll down windows, I can't think of a reason why somebody would have replaced the doors.  The body is very solid so I don't think somebody had to replaced rotten out doors.
         
        My theory would be that the donor doors came off the finished cars still at the factory.  The doors would then go to a work area for modification. Then off to the paint area were they grabbed the first available modified left and right door, hence my mismatched doors.
         
        Also, there is no tan paint on any of the window mechanism, door latch assembly and fasteners, lock cylinder or rubber mouldings.
         
        I'd be happy to hear any other theories since I am stumped!
         
        Larry
         
         
         
        Robert Kirk <kirkbrit@...> wrote:
        Larry its a good theory IMHO but I doubt anyone will
        be able to confirm the fact of the matter.  Seems to
        me that any doner to be modified doors would be in
        relative short supply. 
        As for OEM color I beleive you need to look
        elsewhere...behind the heater, under the dash beneath
        other covers...headliner, rear panals etc.  Few folks
        go to the extreme measure of disassembly when
        changeing colors or repainting.
        robert kirk

        --- Larry <lhabarth@...> wrote:

        >
        > Is there any chance that Crosley factory would have
        > converted the
        > doors with the one piece windows into two piece
        > window doors?
        >
        > Crosley introduced the Super in 1950 with roll down
        > windows (one
        > piece).  Later in the year they switched to a fixed
        > vent window (two
        > piece).  Does anyone know how long the one pieces
        > windows were used?
        >
        > My car was build in July 1950. The car appears to
        > have been
        > originally painted gay tan but the doors appear to
        > have painted
        > another color under the gay tan.  One door looks
        > blue and the other
        > seafoam green. The sound deadener inside both doors
        > is also painted
        > gay tan but the window crank mechanism is painted
        > black.  The
        > drivers door still has the front bracket for the one
        > piece window
        > and there is a piece of metal brazed in to support
        > the bottom of the
        > vent window for the two piece window.  The passenger
        > door doesn't
        > have the front bracket but does have the metal piece
        > brazed in for
        > the vent window.
        >
        > My guess is there was a problem with the one piece
        > windows, possibly
        > the customers complainting that it was to heavy to
        > roll up.  Crosley
        > then made a running change and started pulling the
        > doors off the
        > finished cars to make the change for the new
        > windows.  Since they
        > had to braze the new vent support, the doors would
        > have to be
        > repainted. This would explain why the colors on my
        > doors don't match.
        >
        > Could this theory be correct or is it just wishful
        > thinking to
        > explain why my doors are a different color!! 
        >
        > Larry
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >  
        >
        >
        >
        >


        Regards,
        Robert Kirk

        __________________________________________________
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      • mrcooby
        lhabarth@... wrote: Thanks for the reply Robert, I appreciate your opinion. I am sure the original color is tan. I didn t mention before but it was
        Message 3 of 6 , Feb 9, 2006
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          "lhabarth@..." wrote:

          Thanks for the reply
          Robert, I appreciate your
          opinion. I am sure the
          original color is tan. I
          didn't mention before but
          it was repainted
          turquoise/light blue over
          the original tan sometime
          before 1988 when I bought
          the car. I have started
          disassembling the car and
          everything looks original.
          The headliner and interior
          has been removed and the
          tan paint is everwhere:
          under dash, behind interior
          panels, underside of roof,
          etc. Behind the voltage
          regulator is perfect shiny
          tan paint. I even found
          the walnut decal on the
          tailgate under the chrome
          license plate light.

          Since my car is a Super and
          should have came with roll
          down windows, I can't think
          of a reason why somebody
          would have replaced the
          doors. The body is very
          solid so I don't think
          somebody had to replaced
          rotten out doors.

          My theory would be that the
          donor doors came off the
          finished cars still at the
          factory. The doors would
          then go to a work area for
          modification. Then off to
          the paint area were they
          grabbed the first available
          modified left and right
          door, hence my mismatched
          doors.

          Also, there is no tan paint
          on any of the window
          mechanism, door latch
          assembly and fasteners,
          lock cylinder or rubber
          mouldings.

          I'd be happy to hear any
          other theories since I am
          stumped!
          >
          > Larry

          Larry <lhabarth@...> wrote:


          Is there any chance that
          Crosley factory would have
          converted the doors with
          the one piece windows into
          two piece
          window doors?

          Crosley introduced the
          Super in 1950 with roll
          down windows (one piece).
          Later in the year they
          switched to a fixed vent
          window (two piece). Does
          anyone know how long the
          one piece windows were
          used?

          My car was built in July
          1950. The car appears to
          have been originally
          painted gay tan but the
          doors appear to have
          painted another color under
          the gay tan. One door looks
          blue and the other seafoam
          green. The sound deadener
          inside both doors is also
          painted gay tan but the
          window crank mechanism is
          painted black. The
          drivers door still has the
          front bracket for the one
          piece window and there is a
          piece of metal brazed in to
          support the bottom of the
          vent window for the two
          piece window. The passenger
          door doesn't have the front
          bracket but does have the
          metal piece brazed in for
          the vent window.
          My guess is there was a
          problem with the one piece
          windows, possibly the
          customers complainting that
          it was too heavy to roll
          up.
          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~R:~~~~~~~~~~~~
          I think the reasons are
          lost in history but I'm
          thinking that maybe there
          was a fit problem with the
          big one-piece window, or
          maybe (and this sounds more
          realistic) there was water
          leakage happening - or
          maybe Crosley, really
          trying to economize by that
          point, found it cheaper
          somehow to make that
          change, although I can't
          imagine how, with the extra
          work involved.
          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
          then made a running change
          and started pulling the
          doors off the finished cars
          to make the change for the
          new windows. Since they
          had to braze the new vent
          support, the doors would
          have to be repainted. This
          would explain why the
          colors on my doors don't
          match.
          ~~~~~~~~~~~~R:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
          One thing we did hear from
          former Crosley employees at
          the 1992 employee reunion
          in Marion IN was that
          quality control was
          paramount, and that just
          one inspector could shut
          down the whole Crosley
          assembly line until the
          problem was corrected.
          That flies right in the
          face of those over the
          years who have said that
          Crosleys were thrown
          together just because the
          prices were low.
          So maybe it was a running
          change due to quality
          problems.
          I can relate a similar
          story at Packard at around
          that same time, where all
          their 2-door Mayfair
          hardtops leaked terribly
          around the windows, and
          this went on for a while
          before it was corrected.
          Kaiser never did correct
          their leakage problems in
          nine years.
          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
          Could this theory be
          correct or is it just
          wishful thinking to explain
          why my doors are a
          different color!!

          Larry
        • G foster
          I was just thinking may be it was not a change of roll up to roll up but may be the order came in for a super and all they had at hand was the standard model
          Message 4 of 6 , Feb 9, 2006
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            I was just thinking may be it was not a change of roll up to roll up but may
            be the order came in for a super and all they had at hand was the standard
            model with sliders?how hard is it to just change out the doors and put on
            that chrome name plate ?just curious what are the differences between the
            two.ill bet they were trying to get rid of the standards that may be slower
            sellers.Gary Foster
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "mrcooby" <x779@...>
            To: <Crosley@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Thursday, February 09, 2006 10:29 AM
            Subject: [Crosley] Re: 1950 Roll down windows


            > "lhabarth@..." wrote:
            >
            > Thanks for the reply
            > Robert, I appreciate your
            > opinion. I am sure the
            > original color is tan. I
            > didn't mention before but
            > it was repainted
            > turquoise/light blue over
            > the original tan sometime
            > before 1988 when I bought
            > the car. I have started
            > disassembling the car and
            > everything looks original.
            > The headliner and interior
            > has been removed and the
            > tan paint is everwhere:
            > under dash, behind interior
            > panels, underside of roof,
            > etc. Behind the voltage
            > regulator is perfect shiny
            > tan paint. I even found
            > the walnut decal on the
            > tailgate under the chrome
            > license plate light.
            >
            > Since my car is a Super and
            > should have came with roll
            > down windows, I can't think
            > of a reason why somebody
            > would have replaced the
            > doors. The body is very
            > solid so I don't think
            > somebody had to replaced
            > rotten out doors.
            >
            > My theory would be that the
            > donor doors came off the
            > finished cars still at the
            > factory. The doors would
            > then go to a work area for
            > modification. Then off to
            > the paint area were they
            > grabbed the first available
            > modified left and right
            > door, hence my mismatched
            > doors.
            >
            > Also, there is no tan paint
            > on any of the window
            > mechanism, door latch
            > assembly and fasteners,
            > lock cylinder or rubber
            > mouldings.
            >
            > I'd be happy to hear any
            > other theories since I am
            > stumped!
            > >
            > > Larry
            >
            > Larry <lhabarth@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > Is there any chance that
            > Crosley factory would have
            > converted the doors with
            > the one piece windows into
            > two piece
            > window doors?
            >
            > Crosley introduced the
            > Super in 1950 with roll
            > down windows (one piece).
            > Later in the year they
            > switched to a fixed vent
            > window (two piece). Does
            > anyone know how long the
            > one piece windows were
            > used?
            >
            > My car was built in July
            > 1950. The car appears to
            > have been originally
            > painted gay tan but the
            > doors appear to have
            > painted another color under
            > the gay tan. One door looks
            > blue and the other seafoam
            > green. The sound deadener
            > inside both doors is also
            > painted gay tan but the
            > window crank mechanism is
            > painted black. The
            > drivers door still has the
            > front bracket for the one
            > piece window and there is a
            > piece of metal brazed in to
            > support the bottom of the
            > vent window for the two
            > piece window. The passenger
            > door doesn't have the front
            > bracket but does have the
            > metal piece brazed in for
            > the vent window.
            > My guess is there was a
            > problem with the one piece
            > windows, possibly the
            > customers complainting that
            > it was too heavy to roll
            > up.
            > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~R:~~~~~~~~~~~~
            > I think the reasons are
            > lost in history but I'm
            > thinking that maybe there
            > was a fit problem with the
            > big one-piece window, or
            > maybe (and this sounds more
            > realistic) there was water
            > leakage happening - or
            > maybe Crosley, really
            > trying to economize by that
            > point, found it cheaper
            > somehow to make that
            > change, although I can't
            > imagine how, with the extra
            > work involved.
            > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
            > then made a running change
            > and started pulling the
            > doors off the finished cars
            > to make the change for the
            > new windows. Since they
            > had to braze the new vent
            > support, the doors would
            > have to be repainted. This
            > would explain why the
            > colors on my doors don't
            > match.
            > ~~~~~~~~~~~~R:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
            > One thing we did hear from
            > former Crosley employees at
            > the 1992 employee reunion
            > in Marion IN was that
            > quality control was
            > paramount, and that just
            > one inspector could shut
            > down the whole Crosley
            > assembly line until the
            > problem was corrected.
            > That flies right in the
            > face of those over the
            > years who have said that
            > Crosleys were thrown
            > together just because the
            > prices were low.
            > So maybe it was a running
            > change due to quality
            > problems.
            > I can relate a similar
            > story at Packard at around
            > that same time, where all
            > their 2-door Mayfair
            > hardtops leaked terribly
            > around the windows, and
            > this went on for a while
            > before it was corrected.
            > Kaiser never did correct
            > their leakage problems in
            > nine years.
            > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
            > Could this theory be
            > correct or is it just
            > wishful thinking to explain
            > why my doors are a
            > different color!!
            >
            > Larry
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
          • lhabarth@mdiwristwatch.com
            Hi Gary, I gave that idea some though also. It would be easy enough to change the doors on a standard to turn it into a Super. But the doors and front
            Message 5 of 6 , Feb 9, 2006
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              Hi Gary,
               
              I gave that idea some though also.  It would be easy enough to change the doors on a standard to turn it into a Super.  But the doors and front fenders would need the second piece of stainless trim added in addition to the Super script on the fenders.  Also, the standard has the hood ornament and no fender ornaments but the Super has the opposite - fender ornaments and no hood ornament.  This means either replacing the hood or filling the holes and repainting it. The interior is also different between the standard and Super.  All this seems like alot of work for the factory.
               
              My car's doors were definitely converted from one piece windows not sliders because the front bracket for the one piece window is still attached.     
               
              I agree that the standards were probably slow sellers but I wonder if Crosley forced the dealers to take the standards before filling their orders for the Supers. 
               
              I wonder if Crosley stop making the standards after the Super was introducing in late June 1950?
               
              Larry

              G foster <GFOSTER11@...> wrote:
              I was just thinking may be it was not a change of roll up to roll up but may
              be the order came in for a super and all they had at hand was the standard
              model with sliders?how hard is it to just change out the doors and put on
              that chrome name plate ?just curious what are the differences between the
              two.ill bet they were trying to get rid of the standards that may be slower
              sellers.Gary Foster
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "mrcooby" <x779@...>
              To: <Crosley@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Thursday, February 09, 2006 10:29 AM
              Subject: [Crosley] Re: 1950 Roll down windows


              > "lhabarth@..." wrote:
              >
              >  Thanks for the reply
              > Robert, I appreciate your
              > opinion.  I am sure the
              > original color is tan. I
              > didn't mention before but
              > it was repainted
              > turquoise/light blue over
              > the original tan sometime
              > before 1988 when I bought
              > the car. I have started
              > disassembling the car and
              > everything looks original.
              > The headliner and interior
              > has been removed and the
              > tan paint is everwhere:
              > under dash, behind interior
              > panels, underside of roof,
              > etc.  Behind the voltage
              > regulator is perfect shiny
              > tan paint.  I even found
              > the walnut decal on the
              > tailgate under the chrome
              > license plate light.
              >
              > Since my car is a Super and
              > should have came with roll
              > down windows, I can't think
              > of a reason why somebody
              > would have replaced the
              > doors.  The body is very
              > solid so I don't think
              > somebody had to replaced
              > rotten out doors.
              >
              > My theory would be that the
              > donor doors came off the
              > finished cars still at the
              > factory.  The doors would
              > then go to a work area for
              > modification. Then off to
              > the paint area were they
              > grabbed the first available
              > modified left and right
              > door, hence my mismatched
              > doors.
              >
              > Also, there is no tan paint
              > on any of the window
              > mechanism, door latch
              > assembly and fasteners,
              > lock cylinder or rubber
              > mouldings.
              >
              > I'd be happy to hear any
              > other theories since I am
              > stumped!
              > >
              > >   Larry
              >
              > Larry <lhabarth@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > Is there any chance that
              > Crosley factory would have
              > converted the doors with
              > the one piece windows into
              > two piece
              > window doors?
              >
              >  Crosley introduced the
              > Super in 1950 with roll
              > down windows (one piece).
              > Later in the year they
              > switched to a fixed vent
              > window (two piece).  Does
              > anyone know how long the
              > one piece windows were
              > used?
              >
              >  My car was built in July
              > 1950. The car appears to
              > have been originally
              > painted gay tan but the
              > doors appear to have
              > painted another color under
              > the gay tan.  One door looks
              > blue and the other seafoam
              > green. The sound deadener
              > inside both doors is also
              > painted gay tan but the
              > window crank mechanism is
              > painted black.  The
              > drivers door still has the
              > front bracket for the one
              > piece window and there is a
              > piece of metal brazed in to
              > support the bottom of the
              > vent window for the two
              > piece window.  The passenger
              > door doesn't have the front
              > bracket but does have the
              > metal piece brazed in for
              > the vent window.
              >  My guess is there was a
              > problem with the one piece
              > windows, possibly the
              > customers complainting that
              > it was too heavy to roll
              > up.
              > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~R:~~~~~~~~~~~~
              > I think the reasons are
              > lost in history but I'm
              > thinking that maybe there
              > was a fit problem with the
              > big one-piece window, or
              > maybe (and this sounds more
              > realistic) there was water
              > leakage happening - or
              > maybe Crosley, really
              > trying to economize by that
              > point, found it cheaper
              > somehow to make that
              > change, although I can't
              > imagine how, with the extra
              > work involved.
              > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
              > then made a running change
              > and started pulling the
              > doors off the finished cars
              > to make the change for the
              > new windows.  Since they
              > had to braze the new vent
              > support, the doors would
              > have to be repainted. This
              > would explain why the
              > colors on my doors don't
              > match.
              > ~~~~~~~~~~~~R:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
              > One thing we did hear from
              > former Crosley employees at
              > the 1992 employee reunion
              > in Marion IN was that
              > quality control was
              > paramount, and that just
              > one inspector could shut
              > down the whole Crosley
              > assembly line until the
              > problem was corrected.
              > That flies right in the
              > face of those over the
              > years who have said that
              > Crosleys were thrown
              > together just because the
              > prices were low.
              > So maybe it was a running
              > change due to quality
              > problems.
              > I can relate a similar
              > story at Packard at around
              > that same time, where all
              > their 2-door Mayfair
              > hardtops leaked terribly
              > around the windows, and
              > this went on for a while
              > before it was corrected.
              > Kaiser never did correct
              > their leakage problems in
              > nine years.
              > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
              >  Could this theory be
              > correct or is it just
              > wishful thinking to explain
              > why my doors are a
              > different color!!
              >
              > Larry
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >


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