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Re: [ColonialWars] Re: The Sword With No Name (Beats "The Rules and the Flame")

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  • Al Maurer
    There s an idea! Actually, I m a bit surprised that after all these years some TSATF fanatic hasn t come out with a custom card deck instead of using standard
    Message 1 of 16 , May 4, 2008
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      There's an idea! Actually, I'm a bit surprised that after all these
      years some TSATF fanatic hasn't come out with a custom card deck instead
      of using standard playing cards.

      Al

      MGluteus@... wrote:
      > Why not take photos of the figures that represent the characters in the game
      > and put them on the cards?
      > Dick bryant
      >
      >
      >
      > **************Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family
      > favorites at AOL Food.
      > (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      > ------------------------------------
      >
      > ColonialWars Photos section - http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ColonialWars/lst
      >
      > *** NEW FILE ATTACHMENT LIST ***
      > ColonialBattles-subscribe@onelist.com
      > (For battle reports and pictures)
      >
      > Community email addresses:
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      > Chat - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ColonialWars/chat
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    • M.D. McGraw
      That s what I did for our last VSF game. I tried using a RWNN kind of card based initiative for our game last Friday
      Message 2 of 16 , May 4, 2008
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        That's what I did for our last VSF game. I tried using
        a RWNN kind of card based initiative for our game last
        Friday

        http://www.arnicarealestate.com/battlereport05-02-08.htm

        It was an interesting experiment and mark and I are
        working on fine tuning the process. We're throwing a
        bunch of different ideas around that include things
        like having a hand of cards, say five, that you play
        your turn from. Unit activation cards and event cards
        that would represent good or bad things for you or
        your opponent. Example: An out of Supply cards that
        forces a unit in the open to fall back. Or a swirling
        smoke event that makes it harder to hit a particular
        unit for the duration of the turn.

        Mike McGraw

        --- Al Maurer <acmaurer@...> wrote:

        > There's an idea! Actually, I'm a bit surprised that
        > after all these
        > years some TSATF fanatic hasn't come out with a
        > custom card deck instead
        > of using standard playing cards.
        >
        > Al
        >
        > MGluteus@... wrote:
        > > Why not take photos of the figures that represent
        > the characters in the game
        > > and put them on the cards?
        > > Dick bryant


        Arnica Real Estate

        Sententia Noster Gravis Putabunt


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      • RON VAUGHAN
        Milton Soong did this at a con game a couple years ago. It was great, there were figure pics for each character, so there was no confusion as to who was who.
        Message 3 of 16 , May 4, 2008
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          Milton Soong did this at a con game a couple years ago. It was great, there were figure pics for each character, so there was no confusion as to who was who.
          Ron V.



          ----- Original Message ----
          From: "MGluteus@..." <MGluteus@...>
          To: ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Sunday, May 4, 2008 5:28:13 AM
          Subject: [ColonialWars] Re: The Sword With No Name (Beats "The Rules and the Flame")

          Why not take photos of the figures that represent the characters in the game
          and put them on the cards?
          Dick bryant

          ************ **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family
          favorites at AOL Food.
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        • RON VAUGHAN
          Bob, I recently bought a pack of cards with this idea: Kings are Bat M, Wyatt E., Wild Bill, & Doc H.; Queeens: Belle S., Annie O., Calamity J., & Pearl
          Message 4 of 16 , May 4, 2008
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            Bob,
            I recently bought a pack of cards with this idea: Kings are Bat M, Wyatt E., Wild Bill, & Doc H.;
            Queeens: Belle S., Annie O., Calamity J., & Pearl Hart- who of course is the Q. of Hearts! Jacks: Jessie J., Johnny Ringo, Billy the Kid, & Black Bart. "Wild West Playing Cards" produced by The United States Playing Card Co., Cincinatti, OH.
            Ron Vaughan



            ----- Original Message ----
            From: "burker1@..." <burker1@...>
            To: ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Saturday, May 3, 2008 9:10:26 AM
            Subject: Re: [ColonialWars] The Sword With No Name (Beats "The Rules and the Flame")

            Al,

            You just gave me a great idea (ok, maybe not great, but fun to kick
            around).

            If you were designing your own deck to use in an Old West game, which
            historical characters would you use for the face cards?

            For the Kings, I can think of Wyatt Earp, Doc Holiday, and Pat Garrett.

            For the Queens, there is Annie Oakley and Belle Star.

            An older name for Jacks was "knave", so I suggest famous villians for
            the Jacks, such as Billy the Kid.

            I'd like to complie a list of other possibilities. Anyone care to
            suggest some?

            Bob Burke

            In a message dated 5/3/08 6:08:46 AM, acmaurer@gmail. com writes:

            >
            > If you're considering this route, there are programs out there on the
            > 'net where you can actually design your own playing cards, such as:
            >
            > http://plaincards. http://plainhttp
            >
            > Al
            >
            > Tim Peterson/Pat Dupre wrote:
            > > Greetings,
            > >
            > > Off-list I was discussing using TRWNN-style initiative with TSaTF: This is
            > my suggestion, I'm tossing it out for ideas from the members....
            > >
            > > .........
            > >
            > > With TRWNN, you draw and the player moves when his card is turned, and he
            > can pick up appropriate cards at that time.
            > > TSaTF works the same way, except that there are only 2 characters, red &
            > black. For TRWNN style games, you'd need to make cards for each officer on the
            > table. (So initiative would be like TRWNN, except the character would have
            > 19 helpers.)
            > >
            > > Rather than NCO, Junior, etc, go with experience (Green, Average, Veteran)
            > or quality (Plodding, Average, Brilliant) and so on. You can roll for both
            > the NCO and officer of the unit as to quality. Either the NCO's quality can
            > affect the Officer's actions (Raising or lowering HIS quality: A Brilliant
            > Officer with a plodding NCO acts as an average. A brilliant NCO can raise a
            > plodding officer to average) or will only matter if the officer is killed. A Unit
            > may go from Plodding to Brilliant if the NCO takes over.
            > >
            > > Adding the quality cards would make brilliant officers more useful, and
            > plodders less so. A brilliant officer might well make 3 moves in a row (and get
            > into real trouble) A plodder might not move every turn, or at all. (If you
            > use the Joker) Plodders are no problem if you want them in a static position.
            > But don't count on them to turn a flank!
            > >
            > > So far, it's essentially TRWNN initiative. Units move or shoot when their
            > officer's card comes up, and they can reserve quality cards for opportunity
            > fire, countercharging, etc. And a higher quality Officer can push his move in
            > ahead of a lesser, friend OR foe..
            > >
            > > (You could go further and make 'skills' for the officers: "Stubborn: Will
            > not retire" "Aggressive: Will always advance towards foe and charge at first
            > opportunity" "Impulsive: Will always use ALL cards immediately" "Cautious:
            > Always ignores the highest movement dice (Unless he only has one)")
            > >
            > > This may, however mean that 1-2 units will get all the action, and the
            > rest are only impassible terain and/or decoration. But it presents a different
            > tactical feel than the usual TSaTF.
            > >
            > > You could also give each officer an extra card or two at the beginning of
            > the game based on their quality, and get rid of the quality cards in the
            > deck. It would make brilliant types less brilliant overall. The CinC could also
            > have cards that he could use to prod a unit into action. The better the CinC
            > the more cards.
            > >
            > > Effect cards are more problematic: If they can play them on each other, it
            > becomes more of a card game than a tactical game. However, if you put them
            > into the deck, when one comes up, it effects the next officer drawn. If the
            > next card is a quality card, they are paired, and to take the quality card they
            > must accept the effect: If refused, the effect AND the quality card would be
            > discarded and no longer used in that game (or not discarded, being left for
            > the next appropriate officer.. ) (This would mean that the effect card would
            > have to be kept secret by an umpire, or you could have 2 effects on each
            > card. 1 good, 1 bad, roll high-low after the card is accepted or assigned) This
            > could result in several effects being attached to a single quality card.
            > >
            > > I'd go lightly on the effect cards, (or not, you know your group best) and
            > have most merely minor problems/bonuses: "Rousing Cheer: Plus 1 die movement
            > this turn" "Duty Calls: 1-2 casualties return to duty" "Drifting Smoke:
            > Treat firing as 1 range greater this turn" "Signals Crossed: Lose 1 action"
            > >
            > > This is allI had before my brain gave up: Suggestions, gentlemen?
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            > >
            > > ------------ -------- -------- -----
            > >
            > > ColonialWars Photos section -
            > http://photos. http://photoshtt p://phohttp: //photoshtt
            > >
            > > *** NEW FILE ATTACHMENT LIST ***
            > > ColonialBattles- ColonialBaColoni alBat
            > > (For battle reports and pictures)
            > >
            > > Community email addresses:
            > > Files - http://groups. http://grohttp: //groups.<whttp://gr
            > > Chat - http://groups. http://grohttp: //groups.<whttp://
            > > Post message: ColonialWars@ ColonialWarsCol
            > > Subscribe: ColonialWars- ColonialWaColoni alWarsCol
            > > Unsubscribe: ColonialWars- ColonialWarsColo nialWarsCol
            > > List owner: ColonialWars- ColonialWars- <wbColon
            > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            >

            ************ **
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          • burker1@aol.com
            I should have known that someone else would have thought of such a great idea. Bob Burke ... ************** Wondering what s for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists
            Message 5 of 16 , May 4, 2008
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              I should have known that someone else would have thought of such a great
              idea.

              Bob Burke

              In a message dated 5/4/08 1:47:49 PM, ronvaughan@... writes:


              >
              > Bob,
              > I recently bought a pack of cards with this idea: Kings are Bat M, Wyatt E.,
              > Wild Bill, & Doc H.;
              > Queeens: Belle S., Annie O., Calamity J., & Pearl Hart- who of course is the
              > Q. of Hearts! Jacks: Jessie J., Johnny Ringo, Billy the Kid, & Black Bart.
              > "Wild West Playing Cards" produced by The United States Playing Card Co.,
              > Cincinatti, OH.
              > Ron Vaughan
              >
              > ----- Original Message ----
              > From: "burker1@..." <burker1@...>
              > To: ColonialWars@ColonialWarsCol
              > Sent: Saturday, May 3, 2008 9:10:26 AM
              > Subject: Re: [ColonialWars] The Sword With No Name (Beats "The Rules and the
              > Flame")
              >
              > Al,
              >
              > You just gave me a great idea (ok, maybe not great, but fun to kick
              > around).
              >
              > If you were designing your own deck to use in an Old West game, which
              > historical characters would you use for the face cards?
              >
              > For the Kings, I can think of Wyatt Earp, Doc Holiday, and Pat Garrett.
              >
              > For the Queens, there is Annie Oakley and Belle Star.
              >
              > An older name for Jacks was "knave", so I suggest famous villians for
              > the Jacks, such as Billy the Kid.
              >
              > I'd like to complie a list of other possibilities. Anyone care to
              > suggest some?
              >
              > Bob Burke
              >
              > In a message dated 5/3/08 6:08:46 AM, acmaurer@gmail. com writes:
              >
              > >
              > > If you're considering this route, there are programs out there on the
              > > 'net where you can actually design your own playing cards, such as:
              > >
              > > http://plaincards. http://plainhttp
              > >
              > > Al
              > >
              > > Tim Peterson/Pat Dupre wrote:
              > > > Greetings,
              > > >
              > > > Off-list I was discussing using TRWNN-style initiative with TSaTF: This
              > is
              > > my suggestion, I'm tossing it out for ideas from the members....
              > > >
              > > > .........
              > > >
              > > > With TRWNN, you draw and the player moves when his card is turned, and
              > he
              > > can pick up appropriate cards at that time.
              > > > TSaTF works the same way, except that there are only 2 characters, red &
              > > black. For TRWNN style games, you'd need to make cards for each officer on
              > the
              > > table. (So initiative would be like TRWNN, except the character would have
              > > 19 helpers.)
              > > >
              > > > Rather than NCO, Junior, etc, go with experience (Green, Average,
              > Veteran)
              > > or quality (Plodding, Average, Brilliant) and so on. You can roll for both
              > > the NCO and officer of the unit as to quality. Either the NCO's quality
              > can
              > > affect the Officer's actions (Raising or lowering HIS quality: A Brilliant
              > > Officer with a plodding NCO acts as an average. A brilliant NCO can raise
              > a
              > > plodding officer to average) or will only matter if the officer is killed.
              > A Unit
              > > may go from Plodding to Brilliant if the NCO takes over.
              > > >
              > > > Adding the quality cards would make brilliant officers more useful, and
              > > plodders less so. A brilliant officer might well make 3 moves in a row
              > (and get
              > > into real trouble) A plodder might not move every turn, or at all. (If you
              > > use the Joker) Plodders are no problem if you want them in a static
              > position.
              > > But don't count on them to turn a flank!
              > > >
              > > > So far, it's essentially TRWNN initiative. Units move or shoot when
              > their
              > > officer's card comes up, and they can reserve quality cards for
              > opportunity
              > > fire, countercharging, etc. And a higher quality Officer can push his move
              > in
              > > ahead of a lesser, friend OR foe..
              > > >
              > > > (You could go further and make 'skills' for the officers: "Stubborn:
              > Will
              > > not retire" "Aggressive: Will always advance towards foe and charge at
              > first
              > > opportunity" "Impulsive: Will always use ALL cards immediately" "Cautious:
              > > Always ignores the highest movement dice (Unless he only has one)")
              > > >
              > > > This may, however mean that 1-2 units will get all the action, and the
              > > rest are only impassible terain and/or decoration. But it presents a
              > different
              > > tactical feel than the usual TSaTF.
              > > >
              > > > You could also give each officer an extra card or two at the beginning
              > of
              > > the game based on their quality, and get rid of the quality cards in the
              > > deck. It would make brilliant types less brilliant overall. The CinC could
              > also
              > > have cards that he could use to prod a unit into action. The better the
              > CinC
              > > the more cards.
              > > >
              > > > Effect cards are more problematic: If they can play them on each other,
              > it
              > > becomes more of a card game than a tactical game. However, if you put them
              > > into the deck, when one comes up, it effects the next officer drawn. If
              > the
              > > next card is a quality card, they are paired, and to take the quality card
              > they
              > > must accept the effect: If refused, the effect AND the quality card would
              > be
              > > discarded and no longer used in that game (or not discarded, being left
              > for
              > > the next appropriate officer.. ) (This would mean that the effect card
              > would
              > > have to be kept secret by an umpire, or you could have 2 effects on each
              > > card. 1 good, 1 bad, roll high-low after the card is accepted or assigned)
              > This
              > > could result in several effects being attached to a single quality card.
              > > >
              > > > I'd go lightly on the effect cards, (or not, you know your group best)
              > and
              > > have most merely minor problems/bonuses: "Rousing Cheer: Plus 1 die
              > movement
              > > this turn" "Duty Calls: 1-2 casualties return to duty" "Drifting Smoke:
              > > Treat firing as 1 range greater this turn" "Signals Crossed: Lose 1
              > action"
              > > >
              > > > This is allI had before my brain gave up: Suggestions, gentlemen?
              > > >
              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > ------------ -------- -------- -----
              > > >
              > > > ColonialWars Photos section -
              > > http://photos. http://photoshtt p://phohttp: //photoshtt
              > > >
              > > > *** NEW FILE ATTACHMENT LIST ***
              > > > ColonialBattles- ColonialBaColoni alBat
              > > > (For battle reports and pictures)
              > > >
              > > > Community email addresses:
              > > > Files - http://groups. http://grohttp: //groups.<whttp://gr
              > > > Chat - http://groups. http://grohttp: //groups.<whttp:wh
              > > > Post message: ColonialWars@ ColonialWarsCol
              > > > Subscribe: ColonialWars- ColonialWaColoni alWarsCol
              > > > Unsubscribe: ColonialWars- ColonialWarsColo nialWarsCol
              > > > List owner: ColonialWars- ColonialWars- <wbColon
              > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              > ************ **
              > Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family
              > favorites at AOL Food.
              >
              > (http://food. aol.com/dinner- tonight?NCID= aolfod0003000000 0001)
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >




              **************
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              favorites at AOL Food.

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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Michael Moore
              I bought the TSAF deck and dynomite deck from pat at TVAG they are preety cool.....Mikey RON VAUGHAN wrote: Bob, I recently
              Message 6 of 16 , May 4, 2008
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                I bought the TSAF deck and dynomite deck from pat at TVAG they are preety cool.....Mikey

                RON VAUGHAN <ronvaughan@...> wrote: Bob,
                I recently bought a pack of cards with this idea: Kings are Bat M, Wyatt E., Wild Bill, & Doc H.;
                Queeens: Belle S., Annie O., Calamity J., & Pearl Hart- who of course is the Q. of Hearts! Jacks: Jessie J., Johnny Ringo, Billy the Kid, & Black Bart. "Wild West Playing Cards" produced by The United States Playing Card Co., Cincinatti, OH.
                Ron Vaughan

                ----- Original Message ----
                From: "burker1@..." <burker1@...>
                To: ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Saturday, May 3, 2008 9:10:26 AM
                Subject: Re: [ColonialWars] The Sword With No Name (Beats "The Rules and the Flame")

                Al,

                You just gave me a great idea (ok, maybe not great, but fun to kick
                around).

                If you were designing your own deck to use in an Old West game, which
                historical characters would you use for the face cards?

                For the Kings, I can think of Wyatt Earp, Doc Holiday, and Pat Garrett.

                For the Queens, there is Annie Oakley and Belle Star.

                An older name for Jacks was "knave", so I suggest famous villians for
                the Jacks, such as Billy the Kid.

                I'd like to complie a list of other possibilities. Anyone care to
                suggest some?

                Bob Burke

                In a message dated 5/3/08 6:08:46 AM, acmaurer@gmail. com writes:

                >
                > If you're considering this route, there are programs out there on the
                > 'net where you can actually design your own playing cards, such as:
                >
                > http://plaincards. http://plainhttp
                >
                > Al
                >
                > Tim Peterson/Pat Dupre wrote:
                > > Greetings,
                > >
                > > Off-list I was discussing using TRWNN-style initiative with TSaTF: This is
                > my suggestion, I'm tossing it out for ideas from the members....
                > >
                > > .........
                > >
                > > With TRWNN, you draw and the player moves when his card is turned, and he
                > can pick up appropriate cards at that time.
                > > TSaTF works the same way, except that there are only 2 characters, red &
                > black. For TRWNN style games, you'd need to make cards for each officer on the
                > table. (So initiative would be like TRWNN, except the character would have
                > 19 helpers.)
                > >
                > > Rather than NCO, Junior, etc, go with experience (Green, Average, Veteran)
                > or quality (Plodding, Average, Brilliant) and so on. You can roll for both
                > the NCO and officer of the unit as to quality. Either the NCO's quality can
                > affect the Officer's actions (Raising or lowering HIS quality: A Brilliant
                > Officer with a plodding NCO acts as an average. A brilliant NCO can raise a
                > plodding officer to average) or will only matter if the officer is killed. A Unit
                > may go from Plodding to Brilliant if the NCO takes over.
                > >
                > > Adding the quality cards would make brilliant officers more useful, and
                > plodders less so. A brilliant officer might well make 3 moves in a row (and get
                > into real trouble) A plodder might not move every turn, or at all. (If you
                > use the Joker) Plodders are no problem if you want them in a static position.
                > But don't count on them to turn a flank!
                > >
                > > So far, it's essentially TRWNN initiative. Units move or shoot when their
                > officer's card comes up, and they can reserve quality cards for opportunity
                > fire, countercharging, etc. And a higher quality Officer can push his move in
                > ahead of a lesser, friend OR foe..
                > >
                > > (You could go further and make 'skills' for the officers: "Stubborn: Will
                > not retire" "Aggressive: Will always advance towards foe and charge at first
                > opportunity" "Impulsive: Will always use ALL cards immediately" "Cautious:
                > Always ignores the highest movement dice (Unless he only has one)")
                > >
                > > This may, however mean that 1-2 units will get all the action, and the
                > rest are only impassible terain and/or decoration. But it presents a different
                > tactical feel than the usual TSaTF.
                > >
                > > You could also give each officer an extra card or two at the beginning of
                > the game based on their quality, and get rid of the quality cards in the
                > deck. It would make brilliant types less brilliant overall. The CinC could also
                > have cards that he could use to prod a unit into action. The better the CinC
                > the more cards.
                > >
                > > Effect cards are more problematic: If they can play them on each other, it
                > becomes more of a card game than a tactical game. However, if you put them
                > into the deck, when one comes up, it effects the next officer drawn. If the
                > next card is a quality card, they are paired, and to take the quality card they
                > must accept the effect: If refused, the effect AND the quality card would be
                > discarded and no longer used in that game (or not discarded, being left for
                > the next appropriate officer.. ) (This would mean that the effect card would
                > have to be kept secret by an umpire, or you could have 2 effects on each
                > card. 1 good, 1 bad, roll high-low after the card is accepted or assigned) This
                > could result in several effects being attached to a single quality card.
                > >
                > > I'd go lightly on the effect cards, (or not, you know your group best) and
                > have most merely minor problems/bonuses: "Rousing Cheer: Plus 1 die movement
                > this turn" "Duty Calls: 1-2 casualties return to duty" "Drifting Smoke:
                > Treat firing as 1 range greater this turn" "Signals Crossed: Lose 1 action"
                > >
                > > This is allI had before my brain gave up: Suggestions, gentlemen?
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                > >
                > > ------------ -------- -------- -----
                > >
                > > ColonialWars Photos section -
                > http://photos. http://photoshtt p://phohttp: //photoshtt
                > >
                > > *** NEW FILE ATTACHMENT LIST ***
                > > ColonialBattles- ColonialBaColoni alBat
                > > (For battle reports and pictures)
                > >
                > > Community email addresses:
                > > Files - http://groups. http://grohttp: //groups.<whttp://gr
                > > Chat - http://groups. http://grohttp: //groups.<whttp://
                > > Post message: ColonialWars@ ColonialWarsCol
                > > Subscribe: ColonialWars- ColonialWaColoni alWarsCol
                > > Unsubscribe: ColonialWars- ColonialWarsColo nialWarsCol
                > > List owner: ColonialWars- ColonialWars- <wbColon
                > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >
                >

                ************ **
                Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family
                favorites at AOL Food.

                (http://food. aol.com/dinner- tonight?NCID= aolfod0003000000 0001)

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              • Ross Maker
                ... I ve done that. And I picked up the idea from a game I played at RockCon five or six years ago. RWM
                Message 7 of 16 , May 4, 2008
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                  MGluteus@... wrote:
                  > Why not take photos of the figures that represent the characters in the
                  > game and put them on the cards?

                  I've done that. And I picked up the idea from a game I played at
                  RockCon five or six years ago.

                  RWM
                • Gabriel Landowski
                  Upload your own custom face images: http://www.customizedplayingcards.com/
                  Message 8 of 16 , May 5, 2008
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                    Upload your own custom face images:
                    http://www.customizedplayingcards.com/
                  • misterpalmtree
                    Guilty as charged, your honor. A couple of years ago I went a little wild. Inspired by Stephen Luscombe s TSATF card decks for British and Afghan forces, I
                    Message 9 of 16 , May 12, 2008
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                      Guilty as charged, your honor.
                      A couple of years ago I went a little wild. Inspired by Stephen
                      Luscombe's TSATF card decks for British and Afghan forces, I worked up
                      similar sets for French, Russian, German, Italian, Chinese, African,
                      Arab, Chinese, Sikh, Turkish, and Egyptian forces....

                      --- In ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com, Al Maurer <acmaurer@...> wrote:
                      >
                      I'm a bit surprised that after all these years some TSATF fanatic
                      hasn't come out with a custom card deck instead of using standard
                      playing cards.
                      >
                      > Al
                    • Mintz, Mark
                      Tim, I ve been thinking about this for two weeks now and while I love the idea, I haven t come up with anything! I ve not played TRWNN but I like the idea of
                      Message 10 of 16 , May 21, 2008
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                        Tim,

                        I've been thinking about this for two weeks now and while I love the idea, I haven't come up with anything! I've not played TRWNN but I like the idea of the ratings for officers/NCOs and I can see that having a great effect in the play of a TSATF game. I'd be very interested to hear what a playtest of something like this would come out like. If you do play it, please, let us know how it works and what you did...

                        Thanks and sorry I have nothing to really add (other than support for the concept)...
                        Mark

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com
                        [mailto:ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Tim Peterson/Pat Dupre
                        Sent: May 3, 2008 12:04 AM
                        To: cw
                        Subject: [ColonialWars] The Sword With No Name (Beats "The Rules and the
                        Flame")


                        Greetings,

                        Off-list I was discussing using TRWNN-style initiative with TSaTF: This is my suggestion, I'm tossing it out for ideas from the members....

                        .........

                        With TRWNN, you draw and the player moves when his card is turned, and he can pick up appropriate cards at that time.
                        TSaTF works the same way, except that there are only 2 characters, red & black. For TRWNN style games, you'd need to make cards for each officer on the table. (So initiative would be like TRWNN, except the character would have 19 helpers.)

                        Rather than NCO, Junior, etc, go with experience (Green, Average, Veteran) or quality (Plodding, Average, Brilliant) and so on. You can roll for both the NCO and officer of the unit as to quality. Either the NCO's quality can affect the Officer's actions (Raising or lowering HIS quality: A Brilliant Officer with a plodding NCO acts as an average. A brilliant NCO can raise a plodding officer to average) or will only matter if the officer is killed. A Unit may go from Plodding to Brilliant if the NCO takes over.

                        Adding the quality cards would make brilliant officers more useful, and plodders less so. A brilliant officer might well make 3 moves in a row (and get into real trouble) A plodder might not move every turn, or at all. (If you use the Joker) Plodders are no problem if you want them in a static position. But don't count on them to turn a flank!

                        So far, it's essentially TRWNN initiative. Units move or shoot when their officer's card comes up, and they can reserve quality cards for opportunity fire, countercharging, etc. And a higher quality Officer can push his move in ahead of a lesser, friend OR foe..

                        (You could go further and make 'skills' for the officers: "Stubborn: Will not retire" "Aggressive: Will always advance towards foe and charge at first opportunity" "Impulsive: Will always use ALL cards immediately" "Cautious: Always ignores the highest movement dice (Unless he only has one)")

                        This may, however mean that 1-2 units will get all the action, and the rest are only impassible terain and/or decoration. But it presents a different tactical feel than the usual TSaTF.

                        You could also give each officer an extra card or two at the beginning of the game based on their quality, and get rid of the quality cards in the deck. It would make brilliant types less brilliant overall. The CinC could also have cards that he could use to prod a unit into action. The better the CinC the more cards.

                        Effect cards are more problematic: If they can play them on each other, it becomes more of a card game than a tactical game. However, if you put them into the deck, when one comes up, it effects the next officer drawn. If the next card is a quality card, they are paired, and to take the quality card they must accept the effect: If refused, the effect AND the quality card would be discarded and no longer used in that game (or not discarded, being left for the next appropriate officer.. ) (This would mean that the effect card would have to be kept secret by an umpire, or you could have 2 effects on each card. 1 good, 1 bad, roll high-low after the card is accepted or assigned) This could result in several effects being attached to a single quality card.

                        I'd go lightly on the effect cards, (or not, you know your group best) and have most merely minor problems/bonuses: "Rousing Cheer: Plus 1 die movement this turn" "Duty Calls: 1-2 casualties return to duty" "Drifting Smoke: Treat firing as 1 range greater this turn" "Signals Crossed: Lose 1 action"

                        This is allI had before my brain gave up: Suggestions, gentlemen?

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • misterpalmtree
                        Is this what you re suggesting? http://www.geocities.com/cdferree/rulesnoturn/rulesnoturn.htm ... This is my suggestion, I m tossing it out for ideas from the
                        Message 11 of 16 , May 21, 2008
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                          Is this what you're suggesting?
                          http://www.geocities.com/cdferree/rulesnoturn/rulesnoturn.htm



                          --- In ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Peterson/Pat Dupre"
                          <gisby@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Greetings,
                          >
                          > Off-list I was discussing using TRWNN-style initiative with TSaTF:
                          This is my suggestion, I'm tossing it out for ideas from the
                          members....
                          >
                          > .........
                          >
                          > With TRWNN, you draw and the player moves when his card is turned,
                          and he can pick up appropriate cards at that time.
                          > TSaTF works the same way, except that there are only 2 characters,
                          red & black. For TRWNN style games, you'd need to make cards for each
                          officer on the table. (So initiative would be like TRWNN, except the
                          character would have 19 helpers.)
                          >
                          > Rather than NCO, Junior, etc, go with experience (Green, Average,
                          Veteran) or quality (Plodding, Average, Brilliant) and so on. You can
                          roll for both the NCO and officer of the unit as to quality. Either
                          the NCO's quality can affect the Officer's actions (Raising or
                          lowering HIS quality: A Brilliant Officer with a plodding NCO acts as
                          an average. A brilliant NCO can raise a plodding officer to average)
                          or will only matter if the officer is killed. A Unit may go from
                          Plodding to Brilliant if the NCO takes over.
                          >
                          > Adding the quality cards would make brilliant officers more useful,
                          and plodders less so. A brilliant officer might well make 3 moves in
                          a row (and get into real trouble) A plodder might not move every
                          turn, or at all. (If you use the Joker) Plodders are no problem if
                          you want them in a static position. But don't count on them to turn a
                          flank!
                          >
                          > So far, it's essentially TRWNN initiative. Units move or shoot when
                          their officer's card comes up, and they can reserve quality cards for
                          opportunity fire, countercharging, etc. And a higher quality Officer
                          can push his move in ahead of a lesser, friend OR foe..
                          >
                          > (You could go further and make 'skills' for the
                          officers: "Stubborn: Will not retire" "Aggressive: Will always
                          advance towards foe and charge at first opportunity" "Impulsive: Will
                          always use ALL cards immediately" "Cautious: Always ignores the
                          highest movement dice (Unless he only has one)")
                          >
                          > This may, however mean that 1-2 units will get all the action, and
                          the rest are only impassible terain and/or decoration. But it
                          presents a different tactical feel than the usual TSaTF.
                          >
                          > You could also give each officer an extra card or two at the
                          beginning of the game based on their quality, and get rid of the
                          quality cards in the deck. It would make brilliant types less
                          brilliant overall. The CinC could also have cards that he could use
                          to prod a unit into action. The better the CinC the more cards.
                          >
                          > Effect cards are more problematic: If they can play them on each
                          other, it becomes more of a card game than a tactical game. However,
                          if you put them into the deck, when one comes up, it effects the next
                          officer drawn. If the next card is a quality card, they are paired,
                          and to take the quality card they must accept the effect: If refused,
                          the effect AND the quality card would be discarded and no longer used
                          in that game (or not discarded, being left for the next appropriate
                          officer.. ) (This would mean that the effect card would have to be
                          kept secret by an umpire, or you could have 2 effects on each card. 1
                          good, 1 bad, roll high-low after the card is accepted or assigned)
                          This could result in several effects being attached to a single
                          quality card.
                          >
                          > I'd go lightly on the effect cards, (or not, you know your group
                          best) and have most merely minor problems/bonuses: "Rousing Cheer:
                          Plus 1 die movement this turn" "Duty Calls: 1-2 casualties return to
                          duty" "Drifting Smoke: Treat firing as 1 range greater this
                          turn" "Signals Crossed: Lose 1 action"
                          >
                          > This is allI had before my brain gave up: Suggestions, gentlemen?
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                        • johnisoninsurance
                          To tim peterson and pat dupre, WOW! i love the idea of initiative, leader quality, and effect cards to add the the truely AWESOME genius of the TSATF rules.
                          Message 12 of 16 , May 22, 2008
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                            To tim peterson and pat dupre,

                            WOW! i love the idea of initiative, leader quality, and effect cards
                            to add the the truely AWESOME genius of the TSATF rules.

                            what you have described sounds great. however i have one question.
                            have you playtested these new rules and if so what was the results.

                            i would love to hear about what you have found from a playtest. one
                            thought i had was this would be easy to incorpate into a solo game,
                            plus it would add a great new system of possibilites in this setting.

                            i will ponder additions to this, but i think you are on to something
                            here!

                            ENDEAVOR TO PERSEVERE!

                            JOHN ISON

                            --- In ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com, "Mintz, Mark" <mark.mintz@...>
                            wrote:
                            >
                            > Tim,
                            >
                            > I've been thinking about this for two weeks now and while I love
                            the idea, I haven't come up with anything! I've not played TRWNN but
                            I like the idea of the ratings for officers/NCOs and I can see that
                            having a great effect in the play of a TSATF game. I'd be very
                            interested to hear what a playtest of something like this would come
                            out like. If you do play it, please, let us know how it works and
                            what you did...
                            >
                            > Thanks and sorry I have nothing to really add (other than support
                            for the concept)...
                            > Mark
                            >
                            > -----Original Message-----
                            > From: ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com
                            > [mailto:ColonialWars@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Tim Peterson/Pat
                            Dupre
                            > Sent: May 3, 2008 12:04 AM
                            > To: cw
                            > Subject: [ColonialWars] The Sword With No Name (Beats "The Rules
                            and the
                            > Flame")
                            >
                            >
                            > Greetings,
                            >
                            > Off-list I was discussing using TRWNN-style initiative with TSaTF:
                            This is my suggestion, I'm tossing it out for ideas from the
                            members....
                            >
                            > .........
                            >
                            > With TRWNN, you draw and the player moves when his card is turned,
                            and he can pick up appropriate cards at that time.
                            > TSaTF works the same way, except that there are only 2 characters,
                            red & black. For TRWNN style games, you'd need to make cards for each
                            officer on the table. (So initiative would be like TRWNN, except the
                            character would have 19 helpers.)
                            >
                            > Rather than NCO, Junior, etc, go with experience (Green, Average,
                            Veteran) or quality (Plodding, Average, Brilliant) and so on. You can
                            roll for both the NCO and officer of the unit as to quality. Either
                            the NCO's quality can affect the Officer's actions (Raising or
                            lowering HIS quality: A Brilliant Officer with a plodding NCO acts as
                            an average. A brilliant NCO can raise a plodding officer to average)
                            or will only matter if the officer is killed. A Unit may go from
                            Plodding to Brilliant if the NCO takes over.
                            >
                            > Adding the quality cards would make brilliant officers more useful,
                            and plodders less so. A brilliant officer might well make 3 moves in
                            a row (and get into real trouble) A plodder might not move every
                            turn, or at all. (If you use the Joker) Plodders are no problem if
                            you want them in a static position. But don't count on them to turn a
                            flank!
                            >
                            > So far, it's essentially TRWNN initiative. Units move or shoot when
                            their officer's card comes up, and they can reserve quality cards for
                            opportunity fire, countercharging, etc. And a higher quality Officer
                            can push his move in ahead of a lesser, friend OR foe..
                            >
                            > (You could go further and make 'skills' for the
                            officers: "Stubborn: Will not retire" "Aggressive: Will always
                            advance towards foe and charge at first opportunity" "Impulsive: Will
                            always use ALL cards immediately" "Cautious: Always ignores the
                            highest movement dice (Unless he only has one)")
                            >
                            > This may, however mean that 1-2 units will get all the action, and
                            the rest are only impassible terain and/or decoration. But it
                            presents a different tactical feel than the usual TSaTF.
                            >
                            > You could also give each officer an extra card or two at the
                            beginning of the game based on their quality, and get rid of the
                            quality cards in the deck. It would make brilliant types less
                            brilliant overall. The CinC could also have cards that he could use
                            to prod a unit into action. The better the CinC the more cards.
                            >
                            > Effect cards are more problematic: If they can play them on each
                            other, it becomes more of a card game than a tactical game. However,
                            if you put them into the deck, when one comes up, it effects the next
                            officer drawn. If the next card is a quality card, they are paired,
                            and to take the quality card they must accept the effect: If refused,
                            the effect AND the quality card would be discarded and no longer used
                            in that game (or not discarded, being left for the next appropriate
                            officer.. ) (This would mean that the effect card would have to be
                            kept secret by an umpire, or you could have 2 effects on each card. 1
                            good, 1 bad, roll high-low after the card is accepted or assigned)
                            This could result in several effects being attached to a single
                            quality card.
                            >
                            > I'd go lightly on the effect cards, (or not, you know your group
                            best) and have most merely minor problems/bonuses: "Rousing Cheer:
                            Plus 1 die movement this turn" "Duty Calls: 1-2 casualties return to
                            duty" "Drifting Smoke: Treat firing as 1 range greater this
                            turn" "Signals Crossed: Lose 1 action"
                            >
                            > This is allI had before my brain gave up: Suggestions, gentlemen?
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
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