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23Re: Patriarch Smith

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  • Dr. Randall Larsen
    Aug 11, 2009
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      Elyza,

      There were allegations made from time to time against Eldred G. Smith for misconduct with boys--nothing ever came of it. A UofU theater professor johh Smith who was patriarch for a while in the 1930s or 40s I believe had to be released because of misconduct with his male
      theater students. He ended up teaching at the
      University of Hawaii. Is there a genetic predisposition to
      this sort of thing in Hyrum's line? I don't dare speculate.

      warm regards,

      Randall Larsen

      --- In Church_of_the_Firstborn_Westwood@yahoogroups.com, "elyza2012" <adohni@...> wrote:
      >
      > That was absolutely going to be my next question. Will there be an office of Presiding Patriarch in the CoFBW?
      >
      > It's a shame Eldred Smith was treated shabbily at the dedication. Possibly, Presidently Hinkley, (ever the public relations person),
      > didn't want any pictures of him with the Bretheren.
      >
      > I had heard something of one of the Patriarch's having a problem
      > with young men but I thought it was prior to E Smith. My memory may be off some.
      >
      > Thank you so much for your detailed responses.
      >
      > Elyza
      >
      > --- In Church_of_the_Firstborn_Westwood@yahoogroups.com, "Dr. Randall Larsen" <rlars100@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Dewayne,
      > >
      > > Thanks for your scholarly erudition here. I think
      > > we answered Elyza's questions. In doing so we raised
      > > a number of issues. One issue is should there be a
      > > Patriarch to the church today? The revelation given
      > > outling the duties of the office in D&C 128 and in
      > > D&C 107 has NOT be done away by any Thus Saith the Lord
      > > revelations.
      > >
      > > As Joseph tells us:
      > >
      > > Joseph Smith
      > > If anything should have been suggested by us, or any names mentioned, except by commandment, or thus saith the Lord, we do not consider it binding.
      > > DHC3:295; MFP1:94
      > >
      > > Another issue is whether the birthright keys to the evangelical Priesthood are still in the line of Hyrum's natural lineage.
      > >
      > > It would appear from the actions of the LDS leaders that the
      > > birthright keys are NOT in Hyrum's lineage or that the issue
      > > is moot now the office is effectively tabled or done away with.
      > >
      > > I raise the issue that the birthright presiding keys are with Brigham
      > > Young's lineage. His natural birthright heir has the birthright to be both Patriarch and President of the church as Hyrum was at one point. Brigham Young Jr. would have been President of
      > > the church by seniority in the 12 once but he was in poor
      > > health and so he was passed over.
      > >
      > > Brigham Young doesn't have much luck having his wishes (and
      > > birthrights followed in death). He as much predicted this when
      > > he said a man may be a prophet (chosen by God) and NOT president
      > > of the church chosen by the voice of the LDS people or by
      > > coup d'etat (there have been several the first by President
      > > Taylor, another by a monogamist faction in the twelve (used
      > > signature machine to force resignations of John W. Taylor and
      > > Matthias Cowley w/o the cooperation of Joseph F. Smith).
      > >
      > > warm regards,
      > >
      > > Randall Larsen
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In Church_of_the_Firstborn_Westwood@yahoogroups.com, "DeWayne Hafen" <dchafen@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Randall said: [I thnk they were ordained by Joseph and men chosen by him].
      > > >
      > > > The early patriarchs in Zion were definitely ordained by Joseph Smith or by the presiding patriarch. The easiest way to show this is to look at the presiding patriarch since it is well documented.
      > > >
      > > > One term I will use is lineal succession. Most Latter Day Saints originally believed that the Presiding Patriarch of the Church should be transmitted by lineal succession. The first Presiding Patriarch, Joseph Smith, Sr., was the father of the founding prophet.
      > > > "On the eighteenth day of December, 1833, the Prophet and a number of the leading Elders of the Church assembled in the printing office which had just been built and that office was dedicated by the Prophet Joseph Smith. Following this ceremony the Prophet proceeded to bless Oliver Cowdery and several members of the Smith family, after having conferred upon Joseph Smith, Sen., the office and Priesthood of Patriarch of the Church." TPJS p. 38
      > > >
      > > > When the senior Smith was on his deathbed, he ordained his eldest living son, Hyrum Smith, to succeed him in the office by right of inheritance or lineal succession. Sept 14, 1840 Hyrum thereby held the keys to the patriarchal blessing for all the people in the Church of Christ.
      > > > "Blessed of the Lord is my brother Hyrum…..He shall stand in the tracks of his father and be numbered among those who hold the right of Patriarchal Priesthood, even the Evangelical Priesthood and power shall be upon him." TPJS p. 40
      > > >
      > > > D&C: 124 Revelation to Joseph Smith, Nauvoo, Illinois, January 19, 1841. History of the Church 4:274-86.
      > > > 91 And again, verily I say unto you, let my servant William [Law] be appointed, ordained, and anointed, as counselor unto my servant Joseph, in the room of my servant Hyrum, that my servant Hyrum may take the office of Priesthood and Patriarch, which was appointed unto him by his father, by blessing and also by right;
      > > > 92 That from henceforth he shall hold the keys of the patriarchal blessings upon the heads of all my people,
      > > >
      > > > When Hyrum was assassinated in 1844, his youngest brother, the Apostle William Smith became Presiding Patriarch. [I'm not sure who ordained him patriarch]
      > > >
      > > > William broke with Brigham Young, President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, who was acting as President of the Church in Nauvoo, Illinois, in part over the office. William asserted that the Presiding Patriarch's title was "Patriarch over the Church" and Young argued for the less grand "Patriarch to the Church." William was later excommunicated by Young's faction which became The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
      > > >
      > > > After William Smith was excommunicated by Brigham Young, Asael Smith (brother of Joseph Smith, Sr.), should have been the presiding Evangelical Priest (patriarch) by right, but his health was so poor he could not function, and Uncle John Smith (also a brother of Joseph Smith Sr.) acted unofficially as patriarch to the Church. He was officially called to serve as presiding patriarch on Jan 1, 1849. He was sustained and set apart to that position in Salt Lake City. We should also note that John Smith served as an assistant councilor to the president of the church from (1837–until Joseph Smith's death-1844). See: ttp://rsc.byu.edu/PAPJohnSmith.php
      > > >
      > > > Uncle John Smith was ordained a Patriarch by Joseph Smith, not the twelve. Six months before he died, the prophet Joseph ordained John to that office. He was officially called to serve as presiding patriarch on Jan 1, 1849. He was sustained and set apart to that position in Salt Lake City.
      > > >
      > > > "At this time Father John Smith lived at and was President at Macedonia, and by him I was ordained to the High Priesthood; and he being sent for by the Prophet to receive the Patriarchal Priesthood, I accompanied him to Nauvoo for that purpose, and obtained under it his first blessing." B. F. Johnson, "My Life's Review" p. 88.
      > > >
      > > > After the death of Uncle John Smith, another John Smith became Presiding Patriarch of the LDS church in Utah. This John Smith was the son of Hyrum and Jerusha Smith. I have understood, but have no cite to prove, that young John Smith was ordained by Uncle John Smith.
      > > >
      > > > Thereafter, the majority of the Presiding Patriarchs of the LDS Church were descendants of Hyrum, in keeping with the tradition of lineal succession. The LDS Church ceased to sustain Presiding Patriarchs in its hierarchy after 1979.
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > --- In Church_of_the_Firstborn_Westwood@yahoogroups.com, "Dr. Randall Larsen" <rlars100@> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > Elyza,
      > > > >
      > > > > Just to clarify. The Twelve for years have claimed that
      > > > > since Patriarchs were ordained by them, Patriarchs are presided
      > > > > over by the 12. Of course when the Prophet Joseph was with
      > > > > us the Patriarch to the church was Father Smith and later
      > > > > Hyrum Smith who also served as co-President of the church by
      > > > > virtue of his birthright under D&C 107 evangelical ministers.
      > > > > These men were NOT ordained by the twelve (only the Patriarchs
      > > > > whose primary function was giving Patriarchal Blessings to the
      > > > > Fatherless were ordained by the twelve)[I thnk they were ordained
      > > > > by Joseph and men chosen by him]. Read Lost Legacy
      > > > > on this for a period of time the Presiding Patriarch was allowed
      > > > > to preside over the Patriarchs but then the twelve took back
      > > > > its prerogative. A variety of sustaining orders was adopted
      > > > > at general conference over the years. In early years the Patriarch
      > > > > to the church was even sustained before the 12--in later years
      > > > > not.
      > > > >
      > > > > So you can see the nature of the controversy.
      > > > >
      > > > > hope this helps,
      > > > >
      > > > > Randall Larsen
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In Church_of_the_Firstborn_Westwood@yahoogroups.com, "elyza2012" <adohni@> wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > I've often wondered if Patriarch Smith continued with the sealing keys after he was retired (LDS Church) and they only pretended publicly that he didn't perform the higher ordinances. Is it possible that the LDS Church continues the underground unbeknownst to you and me? With only those needing to know or called to know,,,,having that information?
      > > > > >
      > > > > > elyza
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >
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