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Re: [Christian-Philosophy] Re: Sexual orientation [was: True Godly Liberty and Luciferian false liberty in society

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  • IW
    ... Hash: SHA1 On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 00:35:07 +0900 arcaneholland ... This is an issue that could be debated forever. It reaches into a whole range of issues and
    Message 1 of 61 , Apr 1, 2009
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      On Fri, 27 Mar 2009 00:35:07 +0900 arcaneholland
      <arcaneholland@...> wrote:
      >First off, exactly how does one "choose" their sexual orientation,

      This is an issue that could be debated forever. It reaches into a
      whole range of issues and philosophical areas.

      I have only just got back internet (after 6 days) and was annoyed
      to find my spam email exceeded my real mail....

      Anyhow....I do not think anyone is born gay anymore than one is
      born to be president...or a movie star...or a philosopher..or a
      liar...or a thief or anything else (except human). We are born with
      certain base features and inclinations - experience, environment
      and CHOICE decide the rest. With gay people I have no doubt that
      many at least have pre-dispositions to being gay (for lack of a
      better word) but just as we are all born with certain genetic
      traits that help mold us - not all of us reach our best or worst
      potential. We are more than the sum of our genetic parts.

      IW (Who works in the world of HIV/AIDS and who has many gay co-

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    • gich2
      ... What makes you think I m a war supporter ? All I m doing in the post you question, is quoting what the Oxford Study Bible has to say concerning Exodus
      Message 61 of 61 , Apr 25, 2009
        >>>You sign "Peace" but I and the world have no peace with a war supporter.<<<
        What makes you think I'm a 'war supporter'?
        All I'm doing in the post you question, is quoting what the Oxford Study Bible has to say concerning Exodus 20.13.
        I'm just providing information for the group, and _not_ expressing any personal opinion whatsoever. 

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Patrick
        Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2009 1:49 AM
        Subject: [Christian-Philosophy] Re: The Sixth Commandment - but here's Jesus

        "gich2" <gich2@...> wrote:
        > Exodus 20.13: "Do not commit murder." [Revised English Bible, 1989]
        > The oxford Study Bible [1992] comments:
        > "That murder does not include capital punishment or killing in war
        > is suggested by Exodus 21.12 and Deuteronomy 20.10-18."
        > Jesus came to uphold the law, so I would think he would agree with
        > this position.
        > Peace
        > Gich

        You sign "Peace" but I and the world have no peace with a war supporter.

        ...murder (the Greek word phonos also means slaughter, and that means
        the killing of people in large numbers, as in battle), strife (war sure is strife), deceit (waging war based on a Bush confession of "faulty intelligence" that he said a couple years ago is making this based on deceit somewhere).. . violent (war sure is violent), proud (proud to be American who wants to be the bully of the world dominating the planet to make everyone obey us or die and if we think you want to kill us we will kill you 1st sure is being proud), boasters, inventors of evil things (like an atomic bomb on Japan in 1945 that slaughtered entire cities or a bomb killing or injuring the innocent like McCain could have done in Vietnam)... undiscerning (this war being based off of "faulty intelligence" sure is that), untrustworthy (how can we trust the leaders anymore on this war that was lied about to get us into it?), unloving (slaughtering people with bombs sure is that, even kicking in the door with the rifle in hand shooting first and asking questions later is that. They have murdered innocent women and children in the house), unforgiving (this war of kill them before they may kill us is worse than being unforgiving because they didn't even do anything in the 1st place), unmerciful (war is that too); who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death (spiritual death in hell), not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them - Romans 1:28-32.

        If you are spiritually inclined to hear what God says through His word, you should be able to understand that those who approve of war deserve spiritual death in hell just because they approve of it. It's best to be safe than sorry, especially when it comes to heaven or hell as your destiny. So stop supporting war.

        Jesus said, "And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled." - Matthew 24:6. Therefore, the war makers are the trouble makers.

        Jesus said, "You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a
        tooth for a tooth.' But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But
        whoever slaps you on the right cheek, turn the other to him also... You have heard that it was said, 'You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' But I say to you love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven... Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect." - Matthew 5:38-48. So that's in the face of all the people who want to use the OT to justify war = there's a new way in the NT for us to live when we are specifically told so, especially by the Lord.

        Jesus said, "For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts (WMD
        accusation), murders (I told you the Greek word phonos also means
        slaughter, and that means the killing of people in large numbers, as in battle)... false witness (WMD accusation was said to be faulty
        intelligence) ... These are the things which defile a man..."
        - Matthew 15:19,20.

        Jesus said, "And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul, but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." - Matthew 10:28. That's totally in your war mongering face.

        Jesus said, "If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself
        (lose sight of one's self and one's own interest), and take up his
        cross, and follow Me. For whoever desires to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake will find it. For what proifit is it to a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his soul? Or what will a man give in exchange for his own soul?" - Matthew 16:24-26

        It sure doesn't look like kill them before they MAY kill you with WMD.
        Since we are to take up our cross and follow Christ, then we ought to
        die, not kill. Following Christ means we die, because that is what He
        did. When He was arrested and one of His followers cut the ear off of
        one of the enemy's head, Christ said put the sword away and He healed
        the man. He could have called a host of angels to fight for Him, but He willingly died. He did not kill. If you want to follow Christ you will not kill. You will go ahead and let them kill you. Gaining a worldly advantage by killing the enemy in war will do you no good in the afterlife because it will make your soul be lost and headed for hell. The exchange to give in comparison to that is giving your life. We should die, not kill.

        Repay no one evil for evil... Beloved, do not avenge yourselves, but
        rather give place to wrath; for it is written, "Vengeance is Mine, I
        will repay," says the Lord - Romans 12:17-19. Now someone might refer to Romans chapter 13, and I will agree. But the USA is not the government of the world to where every other country has to be subject to obey us or die. I have no problem with the police carrying guns to enforce the law. It is like the "for he does not bear the sword in vain" (Romans 13:4). But there is a big difference between carrying a gun to enforce the law by the governing authorities, than a country going to another country and taking it over or using bombs on them for revenge. The fact that this chapter goes on to talk about taxes proves it is about within a country's own government.

        For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh.
        For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for
        pulling down strongholds, casting down arguments and every high thing
        that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ, and being ready to punish all disobedience when your obedience is fulfilled - 2 Cor. 10:3-6.

        Now read what this means...

        Strongholds are the reasonings of others against us. I pull down war
        supporters words by writing against them with godly truth that we are
        not suppose to be warring in the flesh to kill people. We should cast
        down (not listen to) everything that doesn't obey Christ. Someone who
        tries to justify war by saying it is for protection of the people to
        kill other people who might want to kill us is a high thing of pride
        that says your life should be saved by killing someone else. Since I
        obey Christ (when my obedience is fulfilled) I have a right to
        discipline erring brethren (being ready to punish all disobedience) .
        Punishing disobedience is not about killing all our enemies if we feel
        they are disobedient to society. Life is not about the good guys have a right to kill the bad guys. 2 wrongs don't make a right. Punishing
        disobedience is discipline that corrects people who have their high
        minded thoughts.

        Some war supporters like to use Ecclesiastes 3, but those are
        comparisons of BAD things against good thngs. Since they think it means it is your time to go to war, then it is also your time to DIE, not be born (v. 2). It is your time to KILL, and not to heal. It is your time to BREAK DOWN, and not to build up (V.3). It is your time to WEEP, and not to laugh. It is your time to MOURN, and not to dance (v. 4). It is your time to LOSE, and not to gain. It is your time to THROW AWAY, and not to keep (v. 6). It is your time KEEP SILENT, and not to speak (v.7). It is your time to HATE, and not to love (v.8). Are they happy now?

        Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His
        might. Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand
        against the wiles of the devil. For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places
        - Ephesians 6:10-12.

        But You have cast us off and put us to shame, and You do not go out with our armies - Psalm 44:9.

        ...Scatter the peoples who delight in war - Psalm 68:30.

        Humans making war against other humans is wrong. If you have no fear of God, then you can feel comfortable to kill whoever you want to. I'd
        rather die than kill and go to hell.

        I hope you like my preaching pages:

        The Way To Heaven, according to the Bible
        http://www.geocitie s.com/1christlov er

        "Once Saved, Always Saved" IS WRONG
        http://www.geocitie s.com/1christlov er/OSAS-. html

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