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Re: join group

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  • cherylmelancon
    Welcome Levi, who feels the presence of God. What were you before you were saved 3 years ago? Contraceptives,...????? What do you think? Are you talking about
    Message 1 of 125 , Aug 31, 2008
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      Welcome Levi, who feels the presence of God.

      What were you before you were saved 3 years ago?

      Contraceptives,...????? What do you think?

      Are you talking about between a married couple or for birth control in


      --- In Christian-Philosophy@yahoogroups.com, "Levi"
      <a_mighty_roar@...> wrote:
      > --- In Christian-Philosophy@yahoogroups.com, "Brother Dave"
      > <truthist@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Welcome all new Members !
      > >
      > >
      > > Please send us a message of introduction or questions or answers.
      > >
      > >
      > > Peace and progress,
      > >
      > > Brother Dave, group owner
      > >
      > Hello. My name is Levi. I've been saved for 3 years now, and the power
      > of God is flowing through my veins every day, thanks to His redeeming
      > love. I love to study theologya and doctrine, and I love to teach
      > others and also to learn from others.
      > Question: What is your perspective, as a Christian, on Contraceptives?
    • geoff
      ... Which is called SIN ... That would be called perfection, and is known in noone other than Christ. ... The ascetics tended to be dualists, that is, they
      Message 125 of 125 , Sep 8, 2008
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        Sbkidde@... wrote:
        > When human will is against God, it is wrong.

        Which is called "SIN"

        > What is human will when it is in accord with divine will?

        That would be called perfection, and is known in noone other than Christ.

        > The idea of confession for self-correction is consistent with an
        > ascetic tradition that extends back in time to the formation of the
        > biblical record.

        The ascetics tended to be dualists, that is, they believed in an evil
        fleshly body and a "good" spirit. They wanted the spirit to be set free
        from the flesh to attain all it could be, and until it was set free,
        they would "restrain" the flesh through various hardships.
        We now know this was based on a faulty understanding of Scripture. The
        OT authors did not conceive of a body that could be separated from its
        "soul" (or spirit). This is a later invention (popularised by Plato and

        I think 1 John covers the stain of sin on a believer adequately. Fact
        is, we continue to need correction for the deeds we do, but the state of
        "will opposed to God" can not be corrected by any human action. It
        requires, as Jesus says "to be reborn" (john 3). There is no possibility
        of this being accomplished by "being good". The words were understood by
        their hearers to mean a literal rebirth.

        > Confession still implies the possibility of alignment with divine will.
        > Difficulties arise when erroneous claims to the knowledge of divine will
        > arise. When a political leader says, "God told me to invade..." we have
        > to wonder about which idea of god was being referenced. Sounds like the
        > god of war to me.
        > Nevertheless, there are biblical passages that suggest the potential for
        > alignment.
        > Micah 6:8 He has told you, O mortal, what is good;
        > And what does the Lord require of you
        > but to do justice, and to love kindness,
        > and to walk humbly with your God?
        > Other passages suggest that charity for the widow, the orphan, the sick,
        > the poor or, to add a modern designation, the disabled, is an essential
        > component of that justice that is in accord with God's plan for
        > humanity. After all, poverty is a byproduct of human competition.
        > Therefore, charity is simply a form of reparation for excesses of
        > aggression. These views should be common to Judaism, Christianity,
        > Islam, Buddhism and any other religion that advocates care for those who
        > are in need of assistance. This kind of activity is considered a
        > participation in the divine will for humans.
        > While we have respect for the power of that divine knowledge which is
        > ascribed to God, we need to acknowledge that free will is a large part
        > of the plan for creation that allows error. Thus, while it is
        > conceivable that the divine mind could know all that which is yet to
        > happen, the divine will desires voluntary participation in the unfolding
        > of time and will have chosen not to know that which is yet to happen.

        I think you're completely wrong. We do need to acknowledge freewill is a
        large part of the plan for creation. It is, but the problem is that will
        is a prisoner of "nature". One can not choose outside of ones desires,
        wants, needs, longings, all the things that make a person a person. If
        this is bent to evil (that is, if it is not totally surrendered to God -
        Gen 6:5), then it can only do evil. Will is not free, freely willing is
        not free, it is subject to all the criteria that make a "choice".
        In order for us to will outside of our nature, we need freedom, and
        biblically this freedom only comes though a change of nature. And a
        change of nature can only be effected by the creator, not the created.

        > I agree that all that which is good is from God. All that which is not
        > is from wrong choice, error in judgement or, more spiritually speaking,
        > it is simply part of the learning process of humanity in a way
        > that allows for the inclusion of consciousness.
        > Steve K.
        > In a message dated 9/5/2008 9:27:53 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
        > geoff@... writes:
        > According to the Scriptures, a humans will is against God, and
        > therefore
        > a human can not choose to be saved, therefore Salvation itself is God
        > going against human beings freewill.
        > Besides that, God CAN AND DOES foreknow human actions. He also knows
        > which child will and will not be born and plans accordingly.
        > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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