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Re: [CatVet] What would you do?

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  • imacline6@webtv.com
    Hi Edna, How have you treated Kaazan s RW? Is he symptomatic? I have been involved in rescue for over 20 years, and I certainly wouldn t euthanise a cat for
    Message 1 of 6 , Jan 1, 2004
      Hi Edna,
      How have you treated Kaazan's RW? Is he symptomatic? I have
      been involved in rescue for over 20 years, and I certainly wouldn't
      euthanise a cat for RW, what are the other problems? Immune boosters are
      tricky, the best luck I've had is with chinese mushroom preparations,
      but a good TCM trained Vet can be tough to find:(. Please fill in the
      blanks a bit, there has to be more to this than RW.
      Margo
    • cd4h4
      ... him ... was ... and ... his ... get ... to ... crystals ... with ... outside ... well ... Hi Edna, A whole bunch of suggestions here. Don t panic, it can
      Message 2 of 6 , Jan 1, 2004
        --- In CatVet@yahoogroups.com, "Edna White" <EdnaJas@a...> wrote:
        > Hi:
        >
        > I am torn between keeping my bicolor black/white neutered male
        > Persian cat, age 6 years or putting him to sleep. I e-mailed the
        > Purebred Rescue in Wisconsin last night and asked Kirsten to help
        > me. I told her everything that has happened to Kaazan in the year
        > that I have had him. He has had RW for one year that I have had
        him
        > and still has it. Got a call from the vet a little after 5:00PM
        > yesterday afternoon telling me the RW Culture taken on 12/24/2003
        was
        > still positive.
        >
        > Kirsten from Wisconsin Rescue said that Kaazan is "not adoptable"
        and
        > if she had him, she would have him PTS because no one wants a sick
        > cat. Apparently the reason he cannot shed this RW is because of
        his
        > immune system. It must be totally out of whack. Kaazan's vet,
        > myself and Kirsten from the Rescue all agree that this cat cannot
        get
        > well due to a compromised immune system. Kirsten pleaded with me
        to
        > do the humane thing and have him PTS. Right now, I cannot do it.
        > The emotional bond is too great for me to do this.
        >
        > He was also diagnosed two days ago, 12/29/2003 with struvite
        crystals
        > in his urine and is on Hill's Prescription Diet (moist). I am the
        > only one in the world willing to keep an immune compromised cat
        with
        > RW, Struvite Crystals and peeing outside of two litter boxes on the
        > bedroom carpet where he is kept like a convicted felon in order to
        > protect myself and 4 other Persian cats.
        >
        > Does anyone know about injections to strengthen immune systems in
        > cats or a product called Transfer Factor for Cats that also is
        > supposed to help the immune system heal? Thank you in advance.
        >
        > This cat was only 5.5 lbs when adopted a year ago and now weighs at
        > least 15 lbs. He does not look or act sick except for peeing
        outside
        > of his 2 litter boxes. He eats his Hills Prescription food very
        well
        > and drinks his water (he has a large bowl of fresh water every day).
        >
        > Edna White


        Hi Edna,
        A whole bunch of suggestions here. Don't panic, it can be eliminated
        along with his other problems.

        First of all Ring Worm is a fungus that produces spores. It loves to
        get itself inbedded in carpeting. One of his problems could be that
        he's reinfecting himself from the environment. Carpeting can be a
        major obstacle.

        The best situation would be an area without rugs that can be
        santized. If he needs to stay in the carpeted room, I would buy a
        medium to large dog crate. If a cage is out of question ... then
        vacume the carpets as often as possible and DISPOSE of the bag after.

        Plus ... a cat not using litterboxes is easily retrained by caging.
        Later when loose again in the room ... keep food and water AS FAR
        AWAY from litterbox as possible. While Persians who miss the box are
        thought to be "dirty", they are actually VERY clean and are fussy
        about wanting very clean litterboxes. Try clumping litter, if not
        using already.

        There is a shot called ImmunoRegulin for immune boosting. You can buy
        it from Revival (revivalanimal.com) 1-800-786-4751. You will need a
        syringe to inject it. I'm sure your Vet could inject him for you.

        As far as the special food goes ... there are dry foods available for
        crystals ... thru your Vet ... that would be more affordable for the
        long term. Eventually, after a few months ... if put on a quality
        food, he can come off the prescription food totally. Many FUS
        experiences come from stress and sometimes food changes (persians are
        very suseptible to FUS) and should always be fed best quality food.

        Now the Ring Worm. It is easily spread thru contact. Always take care
        of him last thing. Change your clothes and always wash your hands up
        to your elbows - to prevent passing it to the others right now. Have
        grooming tools that are for him only. Don't worry ... you won't have
        to do extra stuff for too long.

        There is a product that is sold for fleas, called Program. This
        product has accidently been discovered to kill ringworm like nothing
        else. It is very safe and works fantastic! It interfers with the
        shell development in fleas and the same with the cell wall of the
        ringworm. It stays in the animals fat tissues for about 30 days.

        The best price I have ever found is an internet site called ...
        xfleas.com Not only a good price but includes shipping.

        This is how to dose him. You buy the largest size sold for dogs that
        are over 90lbs. Don't worry this stuff is non-toxic. The first dose
        will be to crush up a whole pill into a canned food meal. He must eat
        the whole thing, so make it fairly small. Then once done, give him
        more canned food. A fatty meal makes the product work better. 2 weeks
        later, repeat the same dosage. 1 pill,once a month-in canned food
        will keep it working. Once he cultures negative- you can reduce the
        program to 1/2 pill-in canned food- 1x monthly.

        All other cats should also be treated (just in case) at the same
        time. They can be given a whole pill the first time, with the fatty
        meal. Just repeat, reducing them to a maintenance dose of a 1/2 pill-
        canned meal, every time he gets his.

        The reason to continue the treatments for several more months ... is
        because the spores will still be in the environment for awhile and
        you will need to prevent infection to all of the cats. Once he's
        culturing neg, he can run with the others if you wish. It's the room
        he's in that will continue to need thorough cleaning for awhile.

        Cats are believed to be a natural host for ring worm, which is why
        they are suseptible to it. USA Persians seem to be extra suseptible
        to it. People can also get it but are not a natural host and a little
        micatin cream on any spots will kill it quickly. Once a cat has been
        on Program for even a short while, they become negative very quickly
        and will no longer spread it themselves.

        Even if you don't want to keep him ... you still have to treat the
        others and super clean the environment. So hopefully, you'll want to
        give him one more chance.

        If you want to email me personally, that would be fine.

        Best of luck ... been there.

        Sue
        cd4h4@...
      • Irene Skrybailo
        Edna - I didn t realize RW is Ringworm. (thanks Sue). Everything Sue says is right on the money.. I just want to add one little sidenote, if you re ever on a
        Message 3 of 6 , Jan 1, 2004
          Edna - I didn't realize RW is Ringworm. (thanks Sue). Everything Sue
          says is right on the money.. I just want to add one little sidenote,
          if you're ever on a steriod (Prednisone for example) it may SLIGHTLY
          increase your chance of getting RW :-P . My doctor informed me of
          this after I had an awful case of poison ivy over the summer and was
          volunteering at a shelter and well, you get the picture. Thankfully
          it's A LOT easier to deal with in people than cats, but my husband
          was not thrilled.

          Good luck with the kitty - is the room is in carpeted? Any chance of
          moving him to a different room with a different floor? Bless your
          heart for taking care of Kaazan - ringworm is tough to erradicate in
          kitties.


          --- In CatVet@yahoogroups.com, "cd4h4" <cd4h4@y...> wrote:
          > --- In CatVet@yahoogroups.com, "Edna White" <EdnaJas@a...> wrote:
          > > Hi:
          > >
          > > I am torn between keeping my bicolor black/white neutered male
          > > Persian cat, age 6 years or putting him to sleep. I e-mailed the
          > > Purebred Rescue in Wisconsin last night and asked Kirsten to help
          > > me. I told her everything that has happened to Kaazan in the
          year
          > > that I have had him. He has had RW for one year that I have had
          > him
          > > and still has it. Got a call from the vet a little after 5:00PM
          > > yesterday afternoon telling me the RW Culture taken on 12/24/2003
          > was
          > > still positive.
          > >
        • imacline6@webtv.com
          I m afraid I have to disagree with few of Sue s points :). A cat with struvite crystals should not probably not go back on regular food, but remain on a
          Message 4 of 6 , Jan 1, 2004
            I'm afraid I have to disagree with few of Sue's points :). A cat
            with struvite crystals should not probably not go back on "regular"
            food, but remain on a prescription maintenance food. The foods that help
            dissolve the crystals, such as Hills s/d are for short term use, but the
            target Ph (which the prescription food helps maintain) does not change
            once the crystals are under control. Some of the foods that "promote
            urinary health" may be okay, as these target struvite crystals, but they
            may not be enough to prevent new stones. A cat that has been diagnosed
            with stones is likely to develop them again. (None of this applies to
            oxalate stones, they cannot eat any of the non-prescription foods
            ESPECIALLY those that target "urinary health"). FUS (now known as FLUTD,
            Feline Lower Urinary Tract Disease) can be caused be thngs other than
            struvite crystals. It is currently recommended that all cats with
            urinary issues be fed canned food only, as it increases fluid intake.
            You might get past this be using soaked drt food, but don't leave it out
            for more than an hour, bacteria multiplies quickly in that environment.
            More water intake helps keep the bladder "flushed". This includes cats
            with kidney and bladder issues.
            Unfortunately, Program (Lufenuron) has not proven to be as
            effective as was once hoped, and needs to be used in conjunction with
            topical and/or systemic treatments. It can help, but won't cure RW on
            it's own. The Fanciers Health website has some great RW info, and you do
            not have to be a breeder to access their info, I'm not<G>. Some
            medications are more effective than others, but some of the less toxic
            ones (fluconazole and itraconazole) are quite pricey, but plain old
            Lymdyp is often enough when used consistently for 6 weeks (as all
            treatments need to be).That's why I asked what had been done.
            HTH
            Margo
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