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Re: [CalontirDance] Opinions needed!

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  • katriana
    I m sending you a longer message in private. Most music during a ball is pretty serious. There is a limited amount of time to get through the ball sets.
    Message 1 of 5 , May 19 5:07 PM
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      I'm sending you a longer message in private.

      Most music during a ball is pretty "serious." There
      is a limited amount of time to get through the ball
      sets. After the ball is the time for "funny" stuff.

      A lot more weirdness happens at Pennsic just 'cause
      we're all there, night after night, doing many of the
      same dances over and over. Still, most of the playing
      around happens later at night when the casual dancers
      have left.

      The musicians messing around with the music can really
      throw inexperienced dancers, so it is best done with
      experienced people. If the dancers stop dancing
      because they don't "get it", it really isn't any fun
      for anybody.

      When we have really good musicians playing, who can
      ornament the music, few "weirdnesses" happen because
      the rest of us are just trying to keep up :-)

      katriana


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    • Carol O'Connell of Graphic World
      Gosh, you ve really posed some interesting questions! I m looking forward to hearing some dancers perspectives. ... 1. I have to admit that I view dance music
      Message 2 of 5 , May 20 7:46 AM
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        Gosh, you've really posed some interesting questions! I'm looking forward to
        hearing some dancers' perspectives.

        Constantia wrote:
        >From the musicians, I would like to know,

        > 1. Is this serious stuff for you, or is it - something else? What else?
        > 2. Have you ever been talked into performing something in a certain way that
        > you regretted?
        > (Maanshaft on Kazoo, perhaps?)
        > 3. What makes playing for a ball satisfying for you (speak now or forever
        > hold your piece, I
        > say!)
        > 4. If you've ever had a bad time playing at a ball, what made it bad?
        >

        1. I have to admit that I view dance music more as a service than as an art. I
        take the strictly instrumental music a lot more seriously. With dance music,
        the beat is the most important thing; nouances that I might put into
        instrumental music might go unnoticed with dancers who are busy dancing and
        musicians who are also trying to keep the beat steady for the dancers. And I'm
        usually so hung up on the steady beat goal that there's not much time for
        anything else. Not much room for creativity; but I know that going in to dance
        music, so that's not a complaint; it's just the reality. (And now I'm trying to
        learn the other parts, so that's keeping things interesting for me.)

        2. Since it is all volunteer, I'm sort of bugged when I'm asked to sit out a
        song or play it on an instrument that I don't feel like playing at the time. I
        have regretted trying to muddle through songs I could "kinda" play, only to
        have a trainwreck in the middle of a dance. When in doubt, go with a CD, if
        possible.

        3. I really, really like it when the musician gel, and we play really well
        together. This is hard to control. It seems to happen when the stars align and
        God smiles down on us. Usually when all the musicians know and like each other.
        We listen to each other, and we're all just a bit more in tune with each other.
        Like we're a 5-headed musician, rather than five separate musicians each
        playing a part in isolation. Maybe a big group hug at the start of the ball
        would help this ;-)

        4. The bad experiences come from mean people. I don't think that's allowed in
        Calontir, right?

        Conna
      • Keith McClune
        As an interested outsider who is unlikely to attend Lillies, I will respond and you may take it for what its worth. If you find wisdom in my words, you may
        Message 3 of 5 , May 20 3:51 PM
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          As an interested outsider who is unlikely to attend Lillies, I will
          respond and you may take it for what its worth. If you find wisdom in
          my words, you may please use it. If not, just ignore my feeble rants.

          I am a dancer who has been to several Pennsic Wars, a couple of Estrella
          Wars, and KWDS II & III. I work with our local musicians on occasion to
          coordinate dance music, so I will try to see their side as well.

          > What I want to know from the dancer point of view is,
          > 1. What is it that musicians do during balls that irritate dancers?

          I really haven't seen much, if anything, that constitutes
          irritating. I am immensely grateful to the musicians who play for us.

          The worst thing for dancers is an unpredictable beat, so musicians
          that hesitate over unfamilliar music can be irritating. Next on the
          list is a beat that's hard to follow, especially when other musical
          queues are absent. Bassa dances, for instance, need strong beats and
          tenor lines. Many dancers with limited experience rely on a specific
          known recording: dancers who can only dance to a familliar recording
          are not the musicans fault, though.

          > 2. What is just NOT funny coming from the musicians pit?

          Anything that seems to be deliberately disruptive, such as changing
          the dance without notice or otherwise making it impossible for the
          dancers to participate, is just NOT funny. I've never seen this, I
          mearly suggest that anything less than this MAY be funny.

          I guess my caveat would be: don't over do it. Try the fun stuff
          sparingly at first until you have a good feel for how it fits in. This
          works both on the level of learning from the experience of several
          events and on the level of the course of a single evening of dance.

          > 3. Is ANYTHING funny from the musicians pit, or is it only funny to the
          > musicians?

          Our local musicians harbour a propensity to speed up and slow down
          the music semi-randomly. They have been know to stand up and wander out
          amoungst the dancers. These actions could be irritating for new dancers
          or dancers with carefully rehersed performances, but our musicians are
          wise enough to avoid disruption in these situations. The first several
          repetition of the music are done straight; only when the piece is
          becoming boring (even to some new dancers) do they "play" with it so
          severely. When compelled to play endless repetitions of
          Hole-In-The-Head, they will signal that the dance is ending by wandering
          out amoung the dancers and generally being a nuisance. Personally, I
          find this endeering.

          > 4. What is more fun at a ball - an ambiance of regality and dignity, or is
          > it something looser,
          > and less refined? like more of a comradery sort of thing?)

          It depends. What is the nature of the event? At a Feast of Fools
          events, I would expect foolishness from the start. At formal event
          where great effort has gone into carefull preparation for the ball,
          dignity is the order of business. At a multi-day event, such as Lillies
          War, some days need not (and probably should not) be too serious. At
          least *some* time, however, should be serious for those who want or need
          it, even if its the first hour of the Saturday evening ball and no other
          time. Such diversity can be indicated in play lists and advertisements,
          so the dancers and musicians both know what to expect.

          My generic preference is to start with some dignity and
          predicatability and then become less formal as the evening pregresses.
          This lets performers and new dancers begin without fear of unexpected
          weirdness. It also alows a comradery to build as everyone gets used to
          each other, culminating in more casual fun as the evening winds down.
          From some descriptions, this coincidentally seems to be how the Inns of
          Court Revels progressed.

          > 5. Why do dancers dance? (I've tried it, but not much so I am curious)

          My interest in dance has grown over the last ten years to the point that
          I concentrate much more on dance then any other SCA activity (and I have
          many other SCA activities). I feel that dance should be a core activity
          for any serious SCA participant. I have thought long and hard about how
          to entice others to take up dancing. As yet, I have no idea why I find
          dance such a pleasing pastime, let alone how to convince others. Partly
          its the fliting, partly its the formal movement, but in the end I just
          don't know. I try to lead by example.

          > 6. What makes a musician pit good to dance to?

          The ambiance. The ability to taylor the performance to dancer's needs
          (instead of CD recorders' needs). SCA players can perform the correct
          repeat structure with an identifiable beat and, when sufficiently
          comfortable, can interact with the dancers in surprising ways.
          >
          > >From the musicians, I would like to know,
          > 1. Is this serious stuff for you, or is it - something else? What else?

          OK, I can't really answer this, except to say that I have met some very
          serious musicians, and they often have the best sense of humor. The
          audience seems to be important to them (otherwise I suppose they
          wouldn't show up for dancing).

          > 2. Have you ever been talked into performing something in a certain way that
          > you regretted?

          I seek feedback from our musicians before, during, and after our
          dances. The only complaint that sticks in my mind is playing a dance
          that they have not been given sufficient opportunity to practice. I
          suspect that being forced to share instruments or go too long without a
          break would be issues.

          > 3. What makes playing for a ball satisfying for you (speak now or forever
          > hold your piece, I say!)

          Since I'm not a musician, I'll pass on this one (can't even answer for
          dancers, and I are one!).

          > 4. If you've ever had a bad time playing at a ball, what made it bad?

          The bigest complaint that I've heard was that visiting musicians were
          treated as beginners simply because the other musicians did not know
          them. Its not much fun for the two leading musicians from a kingdom to
          be told "here, play this bass line, we'll play the hard stuff," just
          because the others didn't know them. I suppose the best way to address
          this is simply to ask new musicians "what have you done before/at home,
          and what do you think you can do here?" Some music may be unfamilliar
          to the visitors, but they may also play unusual instruments beautifaully
          on the pieces that they do know. Just don't treat them as unwelcome
          guests after they travelled so far to participate at the War.

          OK, not exactly a short post, but not too bad for ten questions.

          I would add a personal request to try move away from Grosely Our Of
          Period dances. We have so many period dances that we could do, I hate
          to see them displaced by dances that don't especially belong in the
          SCA. I'm not asking that every non-period dance be instantly purged
          from our experience, just that, when deciding between which dance to do
          next, consider giving the period dance a higher priority (especially
          early in the evening). I think its unfortunate that many people do not
          know the difference, and I think it falls to the dance leaders to be
          honest about which dances are out of period.

          Enough rambling. Let's dance!

          Keith / Guillaume S:}>
          Denver / Caerthe, Outlands
        • Deborah Fairchild
          Greetings. I am Lady Ursula Strom from the Barony of Small Gray Bear in Meridies. Every year we host Diamond Wars and have many people from Calontir attend.
          Message 4 of 5 , May 23 7:23 PM
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            Greetings. I am Lady Ursula Strom from the Barony of Small Gray Bear in
            Meridies. Every year we host Diamond Wars and have many people from
            Calontir attend. This year we are trying to include the Calontirians in our
            event. I am autocrat for Diamonds this year and am searching for someone to
            run the ball. The war takes place the last weekend of September and is
            located outside of Malvern, Arkansas. Is there anyone who might be
            interested in running the ball? I can provide a jambox and most of the
            music.

            Sincerely,
            Ursula
            mka: Deborah
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