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RE: [Cadillac_Performance_Association] '94 Seville

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  • Sean Janne
    This company claims it specializes in rebuilding Northstars. http://www.expertengines.ca/index.htm Sean Janne 2000 STS 1979 Deville 472 1994 Deville ...
    Message 1 of 8 , Dec 22, 2004
      This company claims it specializes in rebuilding
      Northstars.

      http://www.expertengines.ca/index.htm

      Sean Janne
      2000 STS
      1979 Deville 472
      1994 Deville

      >
      > I've also heard lots of stories about not being able
      > to rebuild a northstar
      > because nobody makes oversize pistons or rebuild
      > kits etc. Maybe one of the
      > professionals in the group can shed some light as to
      > whether thats urban
      > myth or fact.
      >




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    • Morgan Carter
      from what i have learned about this engine most of the time when torn down the cylinder walls are just fine, not needing an overbore, just new rings, and if
      Message 2 of 8 , Dec 22, 2004
        from what i have learned about this engine most of the
        time when torn down the cylinder walls are just fine,
        not needing an overbore, just new rings, and if your
        intake is shot i dont quite know what that means, but
        you can replace it. the motor isnt that hard to work
        i dont think i have a 93 sts 4.6 northstar torn apart
        out of the car in my garage now, it had bad head
        gaskets so i am rebuilding it to sell i got the car
        for 500 and its perfect. its up to you, but a motor
        is at least 2500 at the least from everything i have
        seen


        --- Jerry Brown <jerome@...> wrote:

        > You might consider a good used engine if you can
        > find one that interchanges
        > with yours. Your car is 11 model years old and while
        > you love it dearly its
        > value is not high. Try Reputable wrecking yards that
        > can demonstrate good
        > compression on all cyls. Some will R&R the engine as
        > well for a package
        > price.
        >
        > I've also heard lots of stories about not being able
        > to rebuild a northstar
        > because nobody makes oversize pistons or rebuild
        > kits etc. Maybe one of the
        > professionals in the group can shed some light as to
        > whether thats urban
        > myth or fact.
        >
        > I've been extremely surprised to find what a low
        > opinion of Northstar
        > engines some yard operators have. I bought some
        > Seville seats recently and
        > the yard, which specializes in GM cars only, had a
        > number of Northstar
        > Cadillacs some wrecked but some without a dent on
        > the body, though one did
        > have four bullet holes in it! Anyway, I had my pick
        > of nice power seats for
        > my streetrod project because of the number of
        > Northstar Cadillacs that were
        > in the yard with bad engines but little else wrong.
        > Could it be engine
        > replacement/rebuilding is so expensive on Northstars
        > that folks dump them?
        >
        > Jerry Brown
        >
        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: Gary Merchant [mailto:gmerchant11@...]
        > Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 10:08 PM
        > To: Cadillac_Performance_Association@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [Cadillac_Performance_Association] '94
        > Seville
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Greetings! New to the club and hoping someone can
        > help me. I have
        > a '94 Seville with the 4.6 Northstar. Car started
        > smoking the other
        > day and I could smell burning. Got it to an
        > independent garage and
        > they say the intake manifold is shot but it would
        > have to be sent
        > out "somewhere" and essentially rebuilt to the tune
        > of atleast
        > $2300.00. Is this right? What are my options?
        > Nobody really wants
        > to work on this thing, except for Cadillac.
        > Everyone wants to "send
        > it out". Should I get another engine and if so,
        > where does one go to
        > find a rebuilt Northstar? I checked with Cadillac
        > and they were
        > talking 5 to 6 grand! I've got a 140,000 on my
        > beloved Caddy and
        > it's otherwise in excellent shape. HELP! Thanks.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >




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      • Steven
        ... I think someone else has hit a point that needs further clarification. When it started smoking and you smelled burning, was the burning smell sweet
        Message 3 of 8 , Dec 22, 2004
          On Wed, 2004-12-22 at 06:08 +0000, Gary Merchant wrote:
          >
          > Greetings! New to the club and hoping someone can help me. I have
          > a '94 Seville with the 4.6 Northstar. Car started smoking the other
          > day and I could smell burning. Got it to an independent garage and
          > they say the intake manifold is shot but it would have to be sent
          > out "somewhere" and essentially rebuilt to the tune of atleast
          > $2300.00. Is this right? What are my options? Nobody really wants
          > to work on this thing, except for Cadillac. Everyone wants to "send
          > it out". Should I get another engine and if so, where does one go to
          > find a rebuilt Northstar? I checked with Cadillac and they were
          > talking 5 to 6 grand! I've got a 140,000 on my beloved Caddy and
          > it's otherwise in excellent shape. HELP! Thanks.

          I think someone else has hit a point that needs further clarification.
          When it started smoking and you smelled burning, was the burning smell
          sweet smelling? It may well be that you have just blown either a head
          gasket or an intake gasket. Worse I could think of is if you cracked a
          head.

          Check you water and see if it has oil in it, check your oil and see if
          it looks like milky coffee. IF either one of those, you shouldn't be
          driven for chance you have water in the cylinder and would bend/break
          something not as easy to replace. Anyways the rest of the repair should
          be fairly straight forward.
          --
          Steven <yahoo@...>
        • William Lucke
          If you mean it started emitting oil smoke, that s not a very uncommon problem in high mileage Northstars. The cylinder hone pattern from GM is very aggressive
          Message 4 of 8 , Dec 22, 2004
            If you mean it started emitting oil smoke, that's not a very uncommon
            problem in high mileage Northstars. The cylinder hone pattern from GM is
            very aggressive and retains a lot of oil on the cylinders walls, which
            leads to piston oil rings getting gunked up with carbon deposits and not
            properly scraping the cylinder walls. If the shop says your intake is bad,
            you might want to stay away from them. Another possibility is intake valve
            stem seals, but I think it's more likely to be the piston rings.

            Under what conditions does it smoke? A puff at cold start? Constantly? Only
            when slowing down via engine braking?

            The Northstar is a sufficiently complicated engine that GM would rather
            warrantee the long block than trust a dealership mechanic to work on it.
            I'm in the process of overhauling mine and parts are hard to find and
            expensive. Rod bearings that are $2 each for a small block Chevy are $20
            each for a Northstar!


            Will


            > From: "Gary Merchant" <gmerchant11@...>
            >Subject: '94 Seville
            >
            >
            >Greetings! New to the club and hoping someone can help me. I have
            >a '94 Seville with the 4.6 Northstar. Car started smoking the other
            >day and I could smell burning. Got it to an independent garage and
            >they say the intake manifold is shot but it would have to be sent
            >out "somewhere" and essentially rebuilt to the tune of atleast
            >$2300.00. Is this right? What are my options? Nobody really wants
            >to work on this thing, except for Cadillac. Everyone wants to "send
            >it out". Should I get another engine and if so, where does one go to
            >find a rebuilt Northstar? I checked with Cadillac and they were
            >talking 5 to 6 grand! I've got a 140,000 on my beloved Caddy and
            >it's otherwise in excellent shape. HELP! Thanks.
          • Gary Merchant
            Many thanks for the quick repsonse! My Northstar was running hot by the time I got it to the repair shop, but no damage yet. Oil is full and not milky, but
            Message 5 of 8 , Dec 22, 2004
              Many thanks for the quick repsonse!  My Northstar was running hot by the time I got it to the repair shop, but no damage yet.  Oil is full and not milky, but there was a burning smoky smell working it's way into the car; not really antifreeze-like, more like oil.  I think my problem is that most shops are just intimidated by the engine and so they only want a specialist to work on it.  I'm in that rotten position with an 11 year old car that probably needs a new motor but the repairs may exceed what the car is worth!  Glad to know somebody else out there feels my pain!  LOL!

              William Lucke <wlucke@...> wrote:
              If you mean it started emitting oil smoke, that's not a very uncommon
              problem in high mileage Northstars. The cylinder hone pattern from GM is
              very aggressive and retains a lot of oil on the cylinders walls, which
              leads to piston oil rings getting gunked up with carbon deposits and not
              properly scraping the cylinder walls. If the shop says your intake is bad,
              you might want to stay away from them. Another possibility is intake valve
              stem seals, but I think it's more likely to be the piston rings.

              Under what conditions does it smoke? A puff at cold start? Constantly? Only
              when slowing down via engine braking?

              The Northstar is a sufficiently complicated engine that GM would rather
              warrantee the long block than trust a dealership mechanic to work on it.
              I'm in the process of overhauling mine and parts are hard to find and
              expensive. Rod bearings that are $2 each for a small block Chevy are $20
              each for a Northstar!


              Will


              >   From: "Gary Merchant" <gmerchant11@...>
              >Subject: '94 Seville
              >
              >
              >Greetings!  New to the club and hoping someone can help me.  I have
              >a '94 Seville with the 4.6 Northstar.  Car started smoking the other
              >day and I could smell burning.  Got it to an independent garage and
              >they say the intake manifold is shot but it would have to be sent
              >out "somewhere" and essentially rebuilt to the tune of atleast
              >$2300.00.  Is this right?  What are my options?  Nobody really wants
              >to work on this thing, except for Cadillac.  Everyone wants to "send
              >it out".  Should I get another engine and if so, where does one go to
              >find a rebuilt Northstar?  I checked with Cadillac and they were
              >talking 5 to 6 grand!  I've got a 140,000 on my beloved Caddy and
              >it's otherwise in excellent shape.  HELP!  Thanks.



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            • William Lucke
              Ok, did the car suddenly start smoking, or gradually? What kind of smoke is coming out of the tail pipe? white? blue? black? ok, if it popped a head gasket,
              Message 6 of 8 , Dec 23, 2004
                Ok, did the car suddenly start smoking, or gradually? What kind of smoke is
                coming out of the tail pipe? white? blue? black?
                ok, if it popped a head gasket, the gasket should be replaceable, HOWEVER
                Northstar blocks have a tendency to let go of their head bolt threads, so
                once it's apart, it ought ot have all the head bolt threads time-serted.

                Losing an intake gasket will not put coolant into anything as there's no
                coolant in the manifold. Dunno how it would even lose an intake gasket...

                Need more information on EXACTLY what happened in order to make diagnosis.


                Will



                > From: Gary Merchant <gmerchant11@...>
                >Subject: Re: Re: '94 Seville
                >
                >Many thanks for the quick repsonse! My Northstar was running hot by the
                >time I got it to the repair shop, but no damage yet. Oil is full and not
                >milky, but there was a burning smoky smell working it's way into the car;
                >not really antifreeze-like, more like oil. I think my problem is that
                >most shops are just intimidated by the engine and so they only want a
                >specialist to work on it. I'm in that rotten position with an 11 year old
                >car that probably needs a new motor but the repairs may exceed what the
                >car is worth! Glad to know somebody else out there feels my pain! LOL!
                >
                >William Lucke <wlucke@...> wrote:If you mean it started emitting
                >oil smoke, that's not a very uncommon
                >problem in high mileage Northstars. The cylinder hone pattern from GM is
                >very aggressive and retains a lot of oil on the cylinders walls, which
                >leads to piston oil rings getting gunked up with carbon deposits and not
                >properly scraping the cylinder walls. If the shop says your intake is bad,
                >you might want to stay away from them. Another possibility is intake valve
                >stem seals, but I think it's more likely to be the piston rings.
                >
                >Under what conditions does it smoke? A puff at cold start? Constantly? Only
                >when slowing down via engine braking?
                >
                >The Northstar is a sufficiently complicated engine that GM would rather
                >warrantee the long block than trust a dealership mechanic to work on it.
                >I'm in the process of overhauling mine and parts are hard to find and
                >expensive. Rod bearings that are $2 each for a small block Chevy are $20
                >each for a Northstar!
                >
                >
                >Will
                >
                >
                > > From: "Gary Merchant" <gmerchant11@...>
                > >Subject: '94 Seville
                > >
                > >
                > >Greetings! New to the club and hoping someone can help me. I have
                > >a '94 Seville with the 4.6 Northstar. Car started smoking the other
                > >day and I could smell burning. Got it to an independent garage and
                > >they say the intake manifold is shot but it would have to be sent
                > >out "somewhere" and essentially rebuilt to the tune of atleast
                > >$2300.00. Is this right? What are my options? Nobody really wants
                > >to work on this thing, except for Cadillac. Everyone wants to "send
                > >it out". Should I get another engine and if so, where does one go to
                > >find a rebuilt Northstar? I checked with Cadillac and they were
                > >talking 5 to 6 grand! I've got a 140,000 on my beloved Caddy and
                > >it's otherwise in excellent shape. HELP! Thanks.
                >
                >
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