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Re: [BodgerPark] Re: Options for 144th and Doty corridor

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  • Kim
    yup, think you are pretty well alone. but I catch your drift. ... From: katzz4me@aol.com Sent: Apr 16, 2004 1:55 PM To: BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com Subject:
    Message 1 of 12 , Apr 18, 2004
    • 0 Attachment
      yup, think you are pretty well alone. but I catch your drift.

      -----Original Message-----
      From: katzz4me@...
      Sent: Apr 16, 2004 1:55 PM
      To: BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [BodgerPark] Re: Options for 144th and Doty corridor

      Here Here April I agree I would even go as far as a gated
      community, but I'm probably alone in that one.....

      Darlene
      147th & Doty

      In a message dated 4/15/2004 6:05:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
      flowerfairy62@... writes:
      Ever since I have moved into this neighborhood I thought
      how nice it would be to barricade off both entarances off
      of Rosecrans.....one at Doty and one at Kornblum.
      Wouldn't that keep the riff-raff from the other side of Rosecrans
      out of here??????
      That loud BOOMING music wafting through the neighbor
      all afternoon is about to drive me nuts!!!

      April

      --- In BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com, Aron Levinson <aron10@y...> wrote:
      > I agree mostly with Lori.
      >
      > Stop signs with police watching them seem to work most
      effectively. How many tickets have been written in the last 3
      weeks? I'll bet more than 30.
      >
      > Barricades? No. I don't want people going around the barricade
      and turning down my street (W 146th) trying to figure out which way
      is out.
      >
      > As for large speed bumps? I'd like to learn more about how
      effective they can be.
      >
      > Aron
      > Lori Holzem <lholzem@s...> wrote:
      > My comments:
      >
      > 1. Stops signs at all corners would probably be the least
      offensive, least
      > costly, and should slow the traffic. Hopefully the people running
      through
      > one stop sign may think twice of running thru four stops signs,
      especially
      > if police patrol area passing out tickets.
      >
      > 2. Speed bumps. I have friends who have speed bumps on their
      street and
      > it's a pain for the residence. Driving thru the speed bumps you
      can drive
      > real slow and there's no problem, a little faster the car does not
      perform
      > well, and if you pick up speed just a little faster you go over
      them
      > smoother, and yes their is clunking noises. Due to cost and
      nuisance I do
      > not recommend this as an alternative.
      >
      > 3. Barrier, who's liable for people hitting them? Do not
      recommend, people
      > will speed around them creating noise and cars will be a little
      more out of
      > control creating more of a hazard for the children playing at the
      homes on
      > the corner houses. Also, agree they will not be pretty and will
      be costly.
      >
      > 4. Traffic barricades, do not like this idea at all.
      >
      >
      >
      > > -----Original Message-----
      > > From: Brent Morgan [mailto:brentamorgan@h...]
      > > Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2004 11:30 PM
      > > To: BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com
      > > Subject: [BodgerPark] Options for 144th and Doty corridor
      > >
      > >
      > > I'd like to start a discussion about what options we have for
      traffic
      > > control along the 144th to Doty corridor. Replies can be sent to
      > > this list
      > > or to me privately. This email will address traffic control.
      Parking
      > > control, including permits, will be the subject of another email
      > > when I've
      > > gathered more information on the subject.
      > >
      > > The problem as I see it is that people don't stop at the stop
      > > signs. I live
      > > within eyesight of the four way stop where Doty turns into 147th
      and I
      > > frequently see cars that don't even tap on their brakes as they
      > > go through
      > > the nearby stop sign. Some even speed up along this curved
      > > stretch of road
      > > (ignoring the stop signs). The majority of people that I see
      are going
      > > straight through the intersection, leading me to believe that
      > > they are using
      > > 147th-Doty as a shortcut between Prairie and Rosecrans.
      > >
      > > We have several options to address this problem, and even if you
      > > don't live
      > > along 147th-Doty they may affect you, so please make your voice
      heard.
      > >
      > > 1. Signage - Place a stop sign at each corner like the City of
      > > Lawndale has
      > > done in the last year on 147th. This may inconvenience people
      > > enough that
      > > they avoid using the shortcut. It may also reduce average
      speed. It may
      > > increase noise along the road due to braking and acceleration.
      > > It will not
      > > address the people who ignore the stop signs. I believe we would
      > > be adding
      > > only 3 stop signs at Bodger, W 145th, and W 144th St. This
      > > assumes that the
      > > stop sign at 144th Pl gets replaced by the City as we've
      requested.
      > >
      > > 2. Speed bumps - current thinking among roadway planners is
      against
      > > speedbumps due to the fact that they increase noise (braking,
      rattling as
      > > you go over, and acceleration), increase liability, and aren't
      very
      > > effective. I would recommend that we not consider speed bumps.
      > >
      > > 3. Traffic Calming - This is currently a very popular concept
      > > among the road
      > > design crowd and it refers to confining or defining the roadway
      in such a
      > > manner that people automatically drive more slowly. We might be
      able to
      > > accomplish traffic calming by placing a circular barrier in the
      middle of
      > > several intersections. The barrier would force people to drive
      around it
      > > somewhat to get through the intersection. The drawback is that
      > > people may
      > > not be adequately deterred from using 147th-Doty as a shortcut
      > > and may take
      > > excess speed around the barriers as a challenge.
      > >
      > > 4. Traffic Barricades - The idea here would be to place a
      barrier across
      > > Doty or 147th at a cross street. The barrier would prevent
      people from
      > > going straight through the intersection and signs would indicate
      > > that a left
      > > or right turn only is permitted. These would be most effective
      at
      > > 147th-Doty and W146th and at Doty-144th St. There would be a
      slight
      > > inconvenience to residents that use the 147th Doty route, but
      generally
      > > these people can find their way around the neighborhood. I
      believe that
      > > this would dramatically reduce the number of people using 147th-
      Doty as a
      > > shortcut. The drawback to this idea is that traffic may re-route
      > > somewhere
      > > else in the neighborhood. For instance, I would expect traffic
      > > on 146th St
      > > to increase somewhat if people come in and find that they must
      > > turn left or
      > > right at 147th and W146th.
      > >
      > >
      > > The City manager has expressed support for the idea of trying
      some of the
      > > barrier ideas on a temporary basis to see how they work. Keep
      in mind,
      > > however, that the City's idea of a barrier may be much uglier
      > > than yours and
      > > mine. I have a vision of a low planter filled with drought
      > > tolerant bushes.
      > > They might envision orange sand barrers as used on offramps.
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Brent
      > >

      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >

      >
      >

      >


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





      Yahoo! Groups Links
    • Kim
      thank goodness, a breath of sensible air. ... From: James Radek Sent: Apr 18, 2004 8:01 PM To: BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re:
      Message 2 of 12 , Apr 18, 2004
      • 0 Attachment
        thank goodness, a breath of sensible air.

        -----Original Message-----
        From: James Radek <jimbokat@...>
        Sent: Apr 18, 2004 8:01 PM
        To: BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [BodgerPark] Re: Options for 144th and Doty corridor

        Just my 2 cents worth on the 144/Doty/147th St. problems (1) I don't think you can put stop signs at 144th St. going north & south (too close to Rosecrans) (2) I have lived here for 29 years & I don't think there were ever stop signs at 144th Pl. If you lok at the street that was never repaved, there are not marks on the street where STOP was or where the stop bar would be. (3) If stop signs were put on all the intersections, cars would start going down 144th to Cordary, around or down Kornblum to 147th to Doty or thru everyone elses neighborhood. (4) If you want to see what barricades do, go to Gale & Imperial. The city closed that intersection & trash gathers around the barricades all the time. Barricades would also make us go to Kornblum or Yukon to get to Rosecrans or go down 147th to Prairie to go west on Rosecrans.

        A better idea would be to have no right or left turns off Rosecrans to Doty southbound from 6-9 am & 3-6 pm. Also at the same times, Doty southbound from Moneta Gardens can only go left or right, not straight. (Like the City did for Isis & Rosecrans)

        Thanks for all the input from everyone --- Jim Radek (former City of Hawthorne Street Dept. Supervisor)

        flowerfairy62 <flowerfairy62@...> wrote:
        A gated community sounds great to me, if we could afford
        it we'd be gone in a minute!!
        You are not alone!!!!!
        --- In BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com, katzz4me@a... wrote:
        > Here Here April I agree I would even go as far as a
        gated
        > community, but I'm probably alone in that one.....
        >
        > Darlene
        > 147th & Doty
        >
        > In a message dated 4/15/2004 6:05:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
        > flowerfairy62@y... writes:
        > Ever since I have moved into this neighborhood I thought
        > how nice it would be to barricade off both entarances off
        > of Rosecrans.....one at Doty and one at Kornblum.
        > Wouldn't that keep the riff-raff from the other side of Rosecrans
        > out of here??????
        > That loud BOOMING music wafting through the neighbor
        > all afternoon is about to drive me nuts!!!
        >
        > April
        >
        > --- In BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com, Aron Levinson <aron10@y...>
        wrote:
        > > I agree mostly with Lori.
        > >
        > > Stop signs with police watching them seem to work most
        > effectively. How many tickets have been written in the last 3
        > weeks? I'll bet more than 30.
        > >
        > > Barricades? No. I don't want people going around the barricade
        > and turning down my street (W 146th) trying to figure out which
        way
        > is out.
        > >
        > > As for large speed bumps? I'd like to learn more about how
        > effective they can be.
        > >
        > > Aron
        > > Lori Holzem <lholzem@s...> wrote:
        > > My comments:
        > >
        > > 1. Stops signs at all corners would probably be the least
        > offensive, least
        > > costly, and should slow the traffic. Hopefully the people
        running
        > through
        > > one stop sign may think twice of running thru four stops signs,
        > especially
        > > if police patrol area passing out tickets.
        > >
        > > 2. Speed bumps. I have friends who have speed bumps on their
        > street and
        > > it's a pain for the residence. Driving thru the speed bumps you
        > can drive
        > > real slow and there's no problem, a little faster the car does
        not
        > perform
        > > well, and if you pick up speed just a little faster you go over
        > them
        > > smoother, and yes their is clunking noises. Due to cost and
        > nuisance I do
        > > not recommend this as an alternative.
        > >
        > > 3. Barrier, who's liable for people hitting them? Do not
        > recommend, people
        > > will speed around them creating noise and cars will be a little
        > more out of
        > > control creating more of a hazard for the children playing at
        the
        > homes on
        > > the corner houses. Also, agree they will not be pretty and will
        > be costly.
        > >
        > > 4. Traffic barricades, do not like this idea at all.
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > > -----Original Message-----
        > > > From: Brent Morgan [mailto:brentamorgan@h...]
        > > > Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2004 11:30 PM
        > > > To: BodgerPark@yahoogroups.com
        > > > Subject: [BodgerPark] Options for 144th and Doty corridor
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > I'd like to start a discussion about what options we have for
        > traffic
        > > > control along the 144th to Doty corridor. Replies can be sent
        to
        > > > this list
        > > > or to me privately. This email will address traffic control.
        > Parking
        > > > control, including permits, will be the subject of another
        email
        > > > when I've
        > > > gathered more information on the subject.
        > > >
        > > > The problem as I see it is that people don't stop at the stop
        > > > signs. I live
        > > > within eyesight of the four way stop where Doty turns into
        147th
        > and I
        > > > frequently see cars that don't even tap on their brakes as they
        > > > go through
        > > > the nearby stop sign. Some even speed up along this curved
        > > > stretch of road
        > > > (ignoring the stop signs). The majority of people that I see
        > are going
        > > > straight through the intersection, leading me to believe that
        > > > they are using
        > > > 147th-Doty as a shortcut between Prairie and Rosecrans.
        > > >
        > > > We have several options to address this problem, and even if
        you
        > > > don't live
        > > > along 147th-Doty they may affect you, so please make your
        voice
        > heard.
        > > >
        > > > 1. Signage - Place a stop sign at each corner like the City of
        > > > Lawndale has
        > > > done in the last year on 147th. This may inconvenience people
        > > > enough that
        > > > they avoid using the shortcut. It may also reduce average
        > speed. It may
        > > > increase noise along the road due to braking and acceleration.
        > > > It will not
        > > > address the people who ignore the stop signs. I believe we
        would
        > > > be adding
        > > > only 3 stop signs at Bodger, W 145th, and W 144th St. This
        > > > assumes that the
        > > > stop sign at 144th Pl gets replaced by the City as we've
        > requested.
        > > >
        > > > 2. Speed bumps - current thinking among roadway planners is
        > against
        > > > speedbumps due to the fact that they increase noise (braking,
        > rattling as
        > > > you go over, and acceleration), increase liability, and aren't
        > very
        > > > effective. I would recommend that we not consider speed bumps.
        > > >
        > > > 3. Traffic Calming - This is currently a very popular concept
        > > > among the road
        > > > design crowd and it refers to confining or defining the
        roadway
        > in such a
        > > > manner that people automatically drive more slowly. We might
        be
        > able to
        > > > accomplish traffic calming by placing a circular barrier in
        the
        > middle of
        > > > several intersections. The barrier would force people to
        drive
        > around it
        > > > somewhat to get through the intersection. The drawback is that
        > > > people may
        > > > not be adequately deterred from using 147th-Doty as a shortcut
        > > > and may take
        > > > excess speed around the barriers as a challenge.
        > > >
        > > > 4. Traffic Barricades - The idea here would be to place a
        > barrier across
        > > > Doty or 147th at a cross street. The barrier would prevent
        > people from
        > > > going straight through the intersection and signs would
        indicate
        > > > that a left
        > > > or right turn only is permitted. These would be most
        effective
        > at
        > > > 147th-Doty and W146th and at Doty-144th St. There would be a
        > slight
        > > > inconvenience to residents that use the 147th Doty route, but
        > generally
        > > > these people can find their way around the neighborhood. I
        > believe that
        > > > this would dramatically reduce the number of people using
        147th-
        > Doty as a
        > > > shortcut. The drawback to this idea is that traffic may re-
        route
        > > > somewhere
        > > > else in the neighborhood. For instance, I would expect traffic
        > > > on 146th St
        > > > to increase somewhat if people come in and find that they must
        > > > turn left or
        > > > right at 147th and W146th.
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > The City manager has expressed support for the idea of trying
        > some of the
        > > > barrier ideas on a temporary basis to see how they work. Keep
        > in mind,
        > > > however, that the City's idea of a barrier may be much uglier
        > > > than yours and
        > > > mine. I have a vision of a low planter filled with drought
        > > > tolerant bushes.
        > > > They might envision orange sand barrers as used on offramps.
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Brent
        > > >
        >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > >
        >
        > >
        > >
        >
        > >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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