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Crankarm question

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  • freetopaddle2007
    Ok..I understand, with the hollowtech technology, why crankarms wound up being so chunky but what the duce prompted manufacturers to bulk up the crankarms
    Message 1 of 13 , Mar 1 7:51 AM
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      Ok..I understand, with the hollowtech technology, 'why' crankarms
      wound up being so chunky but what the duce prompted manufacturers
      to 'bulk up' the crankarms over the years.
      I'm looking at a beautifully slender pair of SR Ralieghs and next to
      them an also slender Shimano RSX and the Sugino SuperMaxy also slender.
      Then we hit a few years into the 80s with the SR Aerox and the arm is
      thicker..Get to the early 90s shimano rx100 and it's thicker still.
      The Simplex compact I got two years ago is thicker yet..
      Was there a viable reason /manufacturing technology behind this
      because..man, cranksets have turned into uglyyy.
      Rich Mc.
    • Anne
      Since it s gone all quiet I ll throw an opinion into the mix. The chunky jelly-mould design brigade is the problem with modern bicycle design. The same
      Message 2 of 13 , Mar 1 2:49 PM
      • 0 Attachment
        Since it's gone all quiet I'll throw an opinion into the mix. The
        chunky jelly-mould design brigade is the problem with modern bicycle
        design. The same school of thought (if you can call it that) infests
        the motor industry at present which is the reason why there are so
        many bloated jelly-mould cars around. Overblown pressed tin
        garbage..... Grrrr.
        The rot set in when some bright spark thought up the cotterless
        crank; - then another bright spark decided that everything should be
        made from alloy, and then carbonfibre or some such other Star Wars
        Sci-Fi material. Once the bicycle industry moved away from quality
        steel components the skilled art of combining strength with lightness
        to produce elegant beauty went right out the window. Blobby
        playdough design took over and it all went to hell in a handcart.

        Grrrrr...

        Annie

        --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com,
        "freetopaddle2007" <freetopaddle2007@...> wrote:
        >
        > Ok..I understand, with the hollowtech technology, 'why' crankarms
        > wound up being so chunky but what the duce prompted manufacturers
        > to 'bulk up' the crankarms over the years.
        > I'm looking at a beautifully slender pair of SR Ralieghs and next
        to
        > them an also slender Shimano RSX and the Sugino SuperMaxy also
        slender.
        > Then we hit a few years into the 80s with the SR Aerox and the arm
        is
        > thicker..Get to the early 90s shimano rx100 and it's thicker still.
        > The Simplex compact I got two years ago is thicker yet..
        > Was there a viable reason /manufacturing technology behind this
        > because..man, cranksets have turned into uglyyy.
        > Rich Mc.
        >
      • John
        ... handcart. Grrrrr... ... Isn t it amazing that with all the modern technology that things really haven t improved all that much. It s 2007 and it s hard to
        Message 3 of 13 , Mar 1 3:45 PM
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          --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Anne" <Artidomal@...> wrote:
          > Blobby playdough design took over and it all went to hell in a
          handcart. Grrrrr...
          >

          Isn't it amazing that with all the modern technology that things
          really haven't improved all that much. It's 2007 and it's hard to get
          a car that gets better than 40 mpg. My daughters '05 Scion is 4 doors,
          seats 4 adults ok, gets 42 mpg. My sister's 1961 Renault Dauphin got
          50 mpg, had 4 doors and sat 4 adults comfortably, and had 4 wheel disc
          brakes. And that wasn't a real big improvement over the '54 Renault
          4CV that I had--4 doors, 4 adults, and 55 mpg. Yes, there's an
          argument about longevity and pollution--but there's another argument
          about smaller engines polluting less to begin with.

          Other than materials, bicycles haven't changed much in over a century.
          Major Taylor (and others) rode 17 pound bikes in the 1890's. Chain and
          shaft drives, aero dynamic concepts, efficient brakes--all are from
          that era. Deraillers were a neat idea that came later, I'll admit, tho.

          But none of it has anything to do with being better. It's all about
          sales--and money. Unfortunately we all pay the price. As Anne says,
          Grrrrr.

          Luddite in training,
          sj
        • Forbes Bagatelle-Black
          ... Want a really green Scion? Get an eBox! http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1084 http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1172 - Forbes
          Message 4 of 13 , Mar 1 3:53 PM
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            --- John <old99jh@...> wrote:

            > Isn't it amazing that with all the modern technology
            > that things
            > really haven't improved all that much. It's 2007 and
            > it's hard to get
            > a car that gets better than 40 mpg. My daughters '05
            > Scion is 4 doors,
            > seats 4 adults ok, gets 42 mpg.

            Want a really green Scion? Get an eBox!

            http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1084

            http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1172

            - Forbes Bagatelle-Black, Santa Clarita, CA

            650B Tires, Leather Saddles, Classic Roadster Bikes and Parts at:

            http://cyclesvalhalla.com/




            ____________________________________________________________________________________
            Need Mail bonding?
            Go to the Yahoo! Mail Q&A for great tips from Yahoo! Answers users.
            http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396546091
          • Steve Birmingham
            Deraillers were around then too. Not in an easily recognisable form, but they were around. I m not the first in line when it comes to recommending some of the
            Message 5 of 13 , Mar 1 5:30 PM
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              Message
              Deraillers were around then too. Not in an easily recognisable form, but they were around.
               
              I'm not the first in line when it comes to recommending some of the modern stuff, but it all has it's uses.
              Cotterless cranks are easier to assemble, and in most cases easier to disassemble. So maybe a bottom bracket
              gets overhauled a bit more often which isn't bad.
              Index shifting is much better at shifting under a heavy load, like you'd see in racing. Or shifting on a hill.
              But the mechanisms are prone to problems, so they "need" replacement every few years.
               
              The pro racers need the modern stuff to keep the sponsors happy. Which is their job. If parts are only good for a couple years
              that's ok, since they get new ones whenever it's needed (or sooner, why take a chance with your job? )
              The companies need to spin it so everyone else will buy enough to make it worth tooling up for. 
               
              I don't actually see any bike parts as better or worse than another. Even gripshifts, which I personally dislike
              because they're expensive and break easily are great for some people. without them, they wouldn't ride.
              Case in point, I sold a nice mountain bike to someone through the shop. Two weeks later, the girlfriend shows up
              saying something "drags" I test ride, and can't find a problem. then it's "the shifting won't work" so I show her
              the shifting working fine. Eventually, the whole story comes out. The boyfriend can't run the shifting, because it dosen't have
              numbers on the shifters like his friends bike. And he's constantly embarrased by people on the path being faster than
              he is (Oh the horror! ) The mechanical stuff I can fix, but I have to pass on fixing the boyfriend. So, I take the bike back.
              Not so bad, since I was sort of regretting delling that one. later on, he buys a huffy with twist grips which is just what
              he wanted. I guess it was still slow, but maybe having a few painted on numbers makes one more manly?
               
              So to me, it's a matter of who is using it for what. Lances bike is fine to race on, but isn't great for a grocery run,
              while a 3 speed is fantastic for groceries, but would probably hold Lance back a bit.
               
              Steve Birmingham
              Lowell, Ma
               
              -----Original Message-----
              From: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John
              Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 6:46 PM
              To: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [Bicycle_Restoration] Re: Crankarm question

              --- In Bicycle_Restoration @yahoogroups. com, "Anne" <Artidomal@. ..> wrote:
              > Blobby playdough design took over and it all went to hell in a
              handcart. Grrrrr...
              >

              Isn't it amazing that with all the modern technology that things
              really haven't improved all that much. It's 2007 and it's hard to get
              a car that gets better than 40 mpg. My daughters '05 Scion is 4 doors,
              seats 4 adults ok, gets 42 mpg. My sister's 1961 Renault Dauphin got
              50 mpg, had 4 doors and sat 4 adults comfortably, and had 4 wheel disc
              brakes. And that wasn't a real big improvement over the '54 Renault
              4CV that I had--4 doors, 4 adults, and 55 mpg. Yes, there's an
              argument about longevity and pollution--but there's another argument
              about smaller engines polluting less to begin with.

              Other than materials, bicycles haven't changed much in over a century.
              Major Taylor (and others) rode 17 pound bikes in the 1890's. Chain and
              shaft drives, aero dynamic concepts, efficient brakes--all are from
              that era. Deraillers were a neat idea that came later, I'll admit, tho.

              But none of it has anything to do with being better. It's all about
              sales--and money. Unfortunately we all pay the price. As Anne says,
              Grrrrr.

              Luddite in training,
              sj


            • David Toppin
              I agree with all of the bike comments except efficient brakes. Major Taylor was at his peak in 1898, the first efficent coaster brakes were a little after
              Message 6 of 13 , Mar 1 7:09 PM
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                I agree with all of the bike comments except efficient brakes.  Major Taylor was at his peak in 1898, the first efficent coaster brakes were a little after that I believe.  I drove across Major Taylor Blvd tonite and past George Street, in Worcester MA, where he used to train. 
                 
                Everything is always about sales and money.  It has to be, if it wasn't we wouldn't have anything!
                 

                David Toppin
                dave@...
                www.pelletizer.com  <------  see our complete, searchable inventory.


                The Pelletizer Group, Inc.
                4 LaChance Street
                Gardner, MA 01440-2476

                (978) 669-0060
                (978) 669-0061 fax

                 


                From: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John
                Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 6:46 PM
                To: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [Bicycle_Restoration] Re: Crankarm question

                --- In Bicycle_Restoration @yahoogroups. com, "Anne" <Artidomal@. ..> wrote:

                > Blobby playdough design took
                over and it all went to hell in a
                handcart. Grrrrr...
                >

                Isn't it amazing that with all the modern technology that things
                really haven't improved all that much. It's 2007 and it's hard to get
                a car that gets better than 40 mpg. My daughters '05 Scion is 4 doors,
                seats 4 adults ok, gets 42 mpg. My sister's 1961 Renault Dauphin got
                50 mpg, had 4 doors and sat 4 adults comfortably, and had 4 wheel disc
                brakes. And that wasn't a real big improvement over the '54 Renault
                4CV that I had--4 doors, 4 adults, and 55 mpg. Yes, there's an
                argument about longevity and pollution--but there's another argument
                about smaller engines polluting less to begin with.

                Other than materials, bicycles haven't changed much in over a century.
                Major Taylor (and others) rode 17 pound bikes in the 1890's. Chain and
                shaft drives, aero dynamic concepts, efficient brakes--all are from
                that era. Deraillers were a neat idea that came later, I'll admit, tho.

                But none of it has anything to do with being better. It's all about
                sales--and money. Unfortunately we all pay the price. As Anne says,
                Grrrrr.

                Luddite in training,
                sj



                --
                No virus found in this outgoing message.
                Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.5/706 - Release Date: 2/28/2007 4:09 PM

              • Mark Garvey
                ... on boys! (and ladies!) No I am not ANGRY here, but the whole racing bike mind set is one that is about 99.9% guaranteed to light my fuse. Arrrrgh
                Message 7 of 13 , Mar 1 8:06 PM
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                  On 3/1/07, Steve Birmingham <sbirmingham@...> wrote:

                  So to me, it's a matter of who is using it for what. Lances bike is fine to race on, but isn't great for a grocery run,
                  while a 3 speed is fantastic for groceries, but would probably hold Lance back a bit.
                   
                  Steve Birmingham
                  Lowell, Ma
                   
                  You just pushed one of MY particular "on" buttons so get yer flame suits on boys! (and ladies!)

                  No I am not ANGRY here, but the whole "racing bike" mind set is one that is about 99.9% guaranteed to light my fuse.  Arrrrgh ar4rrgh!  Racing bikes drive me NUTZ!  Ok ok! i LIKe racing bikes there is nothing WRONG with racing bikes. but WHY IN THE HELL DOES EVERYONE THINK THEY HAVE TO RACE EVERYWHERE???? (pant pant pant! Ok caught my breath from the huge high D shout!)  What the hell is it with racing bikes?  where is it written that you can't have fenders (Mudguards Anne, Mudgurads) or Baskets, or carriers or somewhere to stash more than a TOOTHBRUSH on your bike?  I have like the oldest grubbiest grungy set of panniers on my trike because I USE THE DAMNED THINGS ALLA TIME!  I have FENDERS!  I ride in snow, rain, sleet, ummmmm, well not ALL cold stuff!  But fog, thunderstorms, tornado warnings, 70 mph wind gusts, Leaping Deer, scrambling foxes, slithering snakes and possums playing...well, possum!  My bike (well, my TRIKE realy) is my VEHICLE about 9 months a year.  I have TWO bikes I REALLY REALLY want! a Velomobile of some kind so that I can ride in cold and rain and stay warm and dry, and a Bakfeits Dutch cargo bike with the front cargo bin.  I don't even care if it is a SINGLE SPEED!  Bikes are TRANSPORTATION!  they are not TOYS damnit!

                  People say "Bikes aren't PRACTICAL! they are uncomfortable and you can't carry anything!  Well DUH!  go out and buy a Damned Formula 1 racing car and try to use THAT for daily transportation!  It might WORK, and it would be exceiting allright, but just TRY carrying anything more than your own butt around and even THAT will be a challenge if you weigh more than my niece Jennifer (who is a stick thin former fashion model!  If she breaks 100 lbs, I will eat my entire WizWheels trike...without condiments!)  I make up two and a half Jennifers!  Try squeezing ME into the seat of an F-1!

                  what people want is a MINIVAN!  something you can toss the kids into, drop in a bag fo toys and hit the park, or ramble to the grocery store for a few necessities that can be tossed into the tub and carried home convienently!

                  Sheesh!


                  ......ok, i ran down.  But racing bikes, like fashion models, are fun and exceiting for a bit, but like a fashion model, they need LOTS of attention and expense.  Like the song says, "If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, don't make a pretty woman your wife!  ....marry someone who can COOK baby!  I like LOOKING at pretty girls and pretty bikes.....but i appreceate and live with my long time partner and a good basic cargo bike!

                  mark

                  --
                  Mark (Mr. WizWheelz!) Garvey
                  Cedar Rapids, Iowa free state!

                  Check out the web site at:
                  http://www.vine-ave.com  

                  contact us to have INVISIBLE INC! appear at your next program!  Details at www.vine-ave.com

                     Get on yer Trike and RIDE!
                • Anne
                  *clap* *clap* *clap* Well said that man. Cheers, Annie ... is fine ... hold Lance ... flame suits ... one that is ... bikes ... with ... RACE ... high D ...
                  Message 8 of 13 , Mar 1 9:38 PM
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                    *clap* *clap* *clap* 'Well said that man.'

                    Cheers,

                    Annie


                    --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Mark
                    Garvey" <lazybee45@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > On 3/1/07, Steve Birmingham <sbirmingham@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > So to me, it's a matter of who is using it for what. Lances bike
                    is fine
                    > > to race on, but isn't great for a grocery run,
                    > > while a 3 speed is fantastic for groceries, but would probably
                    hold Lance
                    > > back a bit.
                    > >
                    > > Steve Birmingham
                    > > Lowell, Ma
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > You just pushed one of MY particular "on" buttons so get yer
                    flame suits
                    > on boys! (and ladies!)
                    >
                    > No I am not ANGRY here, but the whole "racing bike" mind set is
                    one that is
                    > about 99.9% guaranteed to light my fuse. Arrrrgh ar4rrgh! Racing
                    bikes
                    > drive me NUTZ! Ok ok! i LIKe racing bikes there is nothing WRONG
                    with
                    > racing bikes. but WHY IN THE HELL DOES EVERYONE THINK THEY HAVE TO
                    RACE
                    > EVERYWHERE???? (pant pant pant! Ok caught my breath from the huge
                    high D
                    > shout!) What the hell is it with racing bikes? where is it
                    written that
                    > you can't have fenders (Mudguards Anne, Mudgurads) or Baskets, or
                    carriers
                    > or somewhere to stash more than a TOOTHBRUSH on your bike? I have
                    like the
                    > oldest grubbiest grungy set of panniers on my trike because I USE
                    THE DAMNED
                    > THINGS ALLA TIME! I have FENDERS! I ride in snow, rain, sleet,
                    ummmmm,
                    > well not ALL cold stuff! But fog, thunderstorms, tornado
                    warnings, 70 mph
                    > wind gusts, Leaping Deer, scrambling foxes, slithering snakes and
                    possums
                    > playing...well, possum! My bike (well, my TRIKE realy) is my
                    VEHICLE about
                    > 9 months a year. I have TWO bikes I REALLY REALLY want! a
                    Velomobile of
                    > some kind so that I can ride in cold and rain and stay warm and
                    dry, and a
                    > Bakfeits Dutch cargo bike with the front cargo bin. I don't even
                    care if it
                    > is a SINGLE SPEED! Bikes are TRANSPORTATION! they are not TOYS
                    damnit!
                    >
                    > People say "Bikes aren't PRACTICAL! they are uncomfortable and you
                    can't
                    > carry anything! Well DUH! go out and buy a Damned Formula 1
                    racing car and
                    > try to use THAT for daily transportation! It might WORK, and it
                    would be
                    > exceiting allright, but just TRY carrying anything more than your
                    own butt
                    > around and even THAT will be a challenge if you weigh more than my
                    niece
                    > Jennifer (who is a stick thin former fashion model! If she breaks
                    100 lbs,
                    > I will eat my entire WizWheels trike...without condiments!) I
                    make up two
                    > and a half Jennifers! Try squeezing ME into the seat of an F-1!
                    >
                    > what people want is a MINIVAN! something you can toss the kids
                    into, drop
                    > in a bag fo toys and hit the park, or ramble to the grocery store
                    for a few
                    > necessities that can be tossed into the tub and carried home
                    convienently!
                    >
                    > Sheesh!
                    >
                    >
                    > ......ok, i ran down. But racing bikes, like fashion models, are
                    fun and
                    > exceiting for a bit, but like a fashion model, they need LOTS of
                    attention
                    > and expense. Like the song says, "If you wanna be happy for the
                    rest of
                    > your life, don't make a pretty woman your wife! ....marry someone
                    who can
                    > COOK baby! I like LOOKING at pretty girls and pretty
                    bikes.....but i
                    > appreceate and live with my long time partner and a good basic
                    cargo bike!
                    >
                    > mark
                    >
                    > --
                    > Mark (Mr. WizWheelz!) Garvey
                    > Cedar Rapids, Iowa free state!
                    >
                    > Check out the web site at:
                    > http://www.vine-ave.com
                    >
                    > contact us to have INVISIBLE INC! appear at your next program!
                    Details at
                    > www.vine-ave.com
                    >
                    > Get on yer Trike and RIDE!
                    >
                  • citsncycles
                    Derailliers are not the only new idea that has been around a long time. Rudge-Whitworth bike had cotterless cranks 100 years ago, & both they & Sunbeam were
                    Message 9 of 13 , Mar 2 12:21 AM
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                      Derailliers are not the only 'new' idea that has been around a long
                      time. Rudge-Whitworth bike had cotterless cranks 100 years ago, &
                      both they & Sunbeam were fitting alloy rims on the bikes.

                      About 15 years ago a friend of mine was invited to apply for a job
                      with a new cycling magazine that was strting up. Part of the
                      application was to write in a set number of words about what he
                      thought was the greatest advance in cycleing in the last 10 years.
                      What he actually wrote was how there hadn't been an advance because
                      it had all been done before. He got the job!

                      Regards,

                      Mike Sims
                      --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Birmingham"
                      <sbirmingham@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Deraillers were around then too. Not in an easily recognisable
                      form, but
                      > they were around.
                      >
                      > I'm not the first in line when it comes to recommending some of
                      the modern
                      > stuff, but it all has it's uses.
                      > Cotterless cranks are easier to assemble, and in most cases easier
                      to
                      > disassemble. So maybe a bottom bracket
                      > gets overhauled a bit more often which isn't bad.
                      > Index shifting is much better at shifting under a heavy load, like
                      you'd see
                      > in racing. Or shifting on a hill.
                      > But the mechanisms are prone to problems, so they "need"
                      replacement every
                      > few years.
                      >
                      > The pro racers need the modern stuff to keep the sponsors happy.
                      Which is
                      > their job. If parts are only good for a couple years
                      > that's ok, since they get new ones whenever it's needed (or
                      sooner, why take
                      > a chance with your job? )
                      > The companies need to spin it so everyone else will buy enough to
                      make it
                      > worth tooling up for.
                      >
                      > I don't actually see any bike parts as better or worse than
                      another. Even
                      > gripshifts, which I personally dislike
                      > because they're expensive and break easily are great for some
                      people.
                      > without them, they wouldn't ride.
                      > Case in point, I sold a nice mountain bike to someone through the
                      shop. Two
                      > weeks later, the girlfriend shows up
                      > saying something "drags" I test ride, and can't find a problem.
                      then it's
                      > "the shifting won't work" so I show her
                      > the shifting working fine. Eventually, the whole story comes out.
                      The
                      > boyfriend can't run the shifting, because it dosen't have
                      > numbers on the shifters like his friends bike. And he's constantly
                      > embarrased by people on the path being faster than
                      > he is (Oh the horror! ) The mechanical stuff I can fix, but I have
                      to pass
                      > on fixing the boyfriend. So, I take the bike back.
                      > Not so bad, since I was sort of regretting delling that one. later
                      on, he
                      > buys a huffy with twist grips which is just what
                      > he wanted. I guess it was still slow, but maybe having a few
                      painted on
                      > numbers makes one more manly?
                      >
                      > So to me, it's a matter of who is using it for what. Lances bike
                      is fine to
                      > race on, but isn't great for a grocery run,
                      > while a 3 speed is fantastic for groceries, but would probably
                      hold Lance
                      > back a bit.
                      >
                      > Steve Birmingham
                      > Lowell, Ma
                      >
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
                      > [mailto:Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John
                      > Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 6:46 PM
                      > To: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: [Bicycle_Restoration] Re: Crankarm question
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > --- In Bicycle_Restoration <mailto:Bicycle_Restoration%
                      40yahoogroups.com>
                      > @yahoogroups.com, "Anne" <Artidomal@> wrote:
                      > > Blobby playdough design took over and it all went to hell in a
                      > handcart. Grrrrr...
                      > >
                      >
                      > Isn't it amazing that with all the modern technology that things
                      > really haven't improved all that much. It's 2007 and it's hard to
                      get
                      > a car that gets better than 40 mpg. My daughters '05 Scion is 4
                      doors,
                      > seats 4 adults ok, gets 42 mpg. My sister's 1961 Renault Dauphin
                      got
                      > 50 mpg, had 4 doors and sat 4 adults comfortably, and had 4 wheel
                      disc
                      > brakes. And that wasn't a real big improvement over the '54 Renault
                      > 4CV that I had--4 doors, 4 adults, and 55 mpg. Yes, there's an
                      > argument about longevity and pollution--but there's another
                      argument
                      > about smaller engines polluting less to begin with.
                      >
                      > Other than materials, bicycles haven't changed much in over a
                      century.
                      > Major Taylor (and others) rode 17 pound bikes in the 1890's. Chain
                      and
                      > shaft drives, aero dynamic concepts, efficient brakes--all are from
                      > that era. Deraillers were a neat idea that came later, I'll admit,
                      tho.
                      >
                      > But none of it has anything to do with being better. It's all about
                      > sales--and money. Unfortunately we all pay the price. As Anne says,
                      > Grrrrr.
                      >
                      > Luddite in training,
                      > sj
                      >
                    • sam lingo
                      ... Cyclo twin wire 1936--Russ Tandem---London England. 70 years old 3 speed and I still can t ride in the Lake Pipin ABC 3 speed tour!
                      Message 10 of 13 , Mar 2 6:25 AM
                      • 0 Attachment
                        --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Birmingham"
                        <sbirmingham@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Deraillers were around then too. Not in an easily recognisable form, but
                        > they were around.
                        Cyclo twin wire 1936--Russ Tandem---London England.
                        70 years old 3 speed and I still can't ride in the Lake Pipin ABC 3
                        speed tour!
                        [IMG]http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l283/frameteam2003/cyclo.jpg%5b/IMG]
                      • John
                        ... Alexandra Paul! Woowoo! Becky!!!!
                        Message 11 of 13 , Mar 2 12:38 PM
                        • 0 Attachment
                          --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, Forbes Bagatelle-Black
                          <diarmaede@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1084
                          > http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1172
                          >

                          Alexandra Paul! Woowoo! Becky!!!!
                        • Forbes Bagatelle-Black
                          ... She s a friend of my brother s from highschool, and a very nice person who is working hard to make the world a better place. - Forbes Bagatelle-Black,
                          Message 12 of 13 , Mar 2 1:09 PM
                          • 0 Attachment
                            --- John <old99jh@...> wrote:

                            > Alexandra Paul! Woowoo! Becky!!!!

                            She's a friend of my brother's from highschool, and a
                            very nice person who is working hard to make the world
                            a better place.

                            - Forbes Bagatelle-Black, Santa Clarita, CA

                            650B Tires, Leather Saddles, Classic Roadster Bikes and Parts at:

                            http://cyclesvalhalla.com/



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                          • Anne
                            What a brilliant car! I remember all the experiments with electric cars back in the 1970s, but the eBox leaves them all waaaaaay behind. I think if folk
                            Message 13 of 13 , Mar 2 4:27 PM
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                              What a brilliant car! I remember all the experiments with electric
                              cars back in the 1970s, but the eBox leaves them all waaaaaay
                              behind. I think if folk could walk into the local car dealership and
                              buy something like that off the floor they'd sell like hot cakes.

                              Last week I decided to look into getting myself a little electric
                              assistance for my tricycle so the more challenging parts of my paper
                              round don't leave me sweating and pushing in the Summer sun.
                              Basically I wanted something that I could ignore while riding on the
                              flat and bring into use as needed on the 'trials section' of my paper
                              round. I've actually gone ahead and purchased a 24volt 250 watt 26
                              inch electric bicycle wheel complete with tyre and fitting kit.....

                              http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/8887/electricwheelrj4.jpg

                              ......for $NZ299.00. BUT for the same money the dealer also had 48cc
                              two stroke engine kits for converting bicycles. To tell the truth I
                              was not tempted at all; - here in NZ I would need to register an
                              internal combustion engined bicycle as a moped. With the electric
                              wheel option no rego is necessary :-)
                              The other thing of course is that electricity is silent; - if I want
                              to roar around on two wheels I'll haul my old Suzuki twin out of the
                              garage, put on my leather jacket and red bandana & etc... I ride a
                              bicycle because I like the peaceful quality of being a cyclist, - so
                              no noisy smelly noisemakers on my bike thankyou!
                              As I said before I wanted flexibility too. The electric wheel is a
                              switch click away should I find myself flagging, but I don't want use
                              it all the time. No petrol tanks to peer into and shake to hear
                              petrol sloshing around; No arcane mixing of two stroke mixtures; Just
                              plug it into the wall and let all the hydro-electric and wind farms
                              we have in NZ provide the sparks.

                              Cheers,

                              Annie

                              --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, Forbes Bagatelle-Black
                              <diarmaede@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > Want a really green Scion? Get an eBox!
                              >
                              > http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1084
                              >
                              > http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1172
                              >
                              > - Forbes Bagatelle-Black, Santa Clarita, CA
                              >
                              > 650B Tires, Leather Saddles, Classic Roadster Bikes and Parts at:
                              >
                              > http://cyclesvalhalla.com/
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
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