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Re: Lubes and stuff

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  • Rich
    LOVE THE SRAM CHAIN! (FIND IT SUPERIOR TO THE ULTEGRA AND CHANGED IT OUT ON MY -ONLY NEW-CF MOTOBECANE)AND IT S ON THE ROSS SIGNATURE, THE ROSS PARAGON,THE PD
    Message 1 of 16 , Jan 2, 2012
      LOVE THE SRAM CHAIN!
      (FIND IT SUPERIOR TO THE ULTEGRA AND CHANGED IT OUT ON MY -ONLY NEW-CF MOTOBECANE)AND IT'S ON THE ROSS SIGNATURE, THE ROSS PARAGON,THE PD SERIES PARAMOUNT.
      ONLY ONE RUNNING SOMETHING ELSE IS THE LETOUR TOURIST WITH A NOS SEDIS GOLD FROM YJ. THE SRAM I'M TOLD IS SEDIS YES??
      RICH 'ROADS WERE DRY WE RODE NEW YEARS DAY!'MC

      --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "john" <old99jh@...> wrote:
      >
      > Thank you for the info, Sergio. I suppose I'll give it a try next time I lube up the bike.
      >
      > I use the SRAM 8 speed chain as well for my own bikes. It's relatively inexpensive, lasts well and has the power link. I've been using them for a number of years now on different bikes.
      >
      >
      > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, js montes <jsmontes-1937@> wrote:
      > >
      > > On 29/12/2011 5:12 AM, john wrote:
      > > >> After nearly 40 years of cycling I heard the voice of reason: motor oil is nasty stuff
      > > >> for bike chains. I have changed to paraffin wax with excellent results. Sure it is more
      > > >> work, you have to split the chain every few months and dunk it in hot, liquid paraffin wax
      > > >> ( actually from a large candle from a dollar store), but you have a clean, lubed chain
      > > >> that will not attract dirt, nor soil hands and clothes.
      > > >> Frank Berto is very eloquent on this subject and as in most things, he is quite right.
      > > >>
      > > >> Sergio Montes
      > > >>
      > > > Sergio
      > > > How long have you been using the wax method? I've read about this for years but have never tried it. Even tho I've read and respect Berto's work, I have a hard time accepting it.
      > > >
      > > > Thanks
      > >
      > > John,
      > > I've been a convert for at least five years. As I own several bikes, it is difficult to
      > > ascertain the longevity of the chains with wax lubrication, but the convenience of having
      > > a clean chain (outwardly at least) is enormous.
      > > It would be interesting to know what chains our listers are using. My latest purchases (
      > > not many) have been of inexpensive SRAM 8-speed chain.
      > >
      > > Sergio Montes
      > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ------------------------------------
      > > >
      > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > -----
      > > > No virus found in this message.
      > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
      > > > Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4707 - Release Date: 12/27/11
      > > >
      > >
      >
    • Rich
      I switched from the wax to the teflon based lube. The wax was great in dry weather riding..not so much in wet. I ve been using tri flow teflon spray for years
      Message 2 of 16 , Jan 2, 2012
        I switched from the wax to the teflon based lube.
        The wax was great in dry weather riding..not so much in wet.
        I've been using tri flow teflon spray for years and the chains have held up well.
        Keep the lubes away fron the ceramic bearing pullys etc.
        Rich

        --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Rich" <mcyak@...> wrote:
        >
        > LOVE THE SRAM CHAIN!
        > (FIND IT SUPERIOR TO THE ULTEGRA AND CHANGED IT OUT ON MY -ONLY NEW-CF MOTOBECANE)AND IT'S ON THE ROSS SIGNATURE, THE ROSS PARAGON,THE PD SERIES PARAMOUNT.
        > ONLY ONE RUNNING SOMETHING ELSE IS THE LETOUR TOURIST WITH A NOS SEDIS GOLD FROM YJ. THE SRAM I'M TOLD IS SEDIS YES??
        > RICH 'ROADS WERE DRY WE RODE NEW YEARS DAY!'MC
        >
        > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "john" <old99jh@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Thank you for the info, Sergio. I suppose I'll give it a try next time I lube up the bike.
        > >
        > > I use the SRAM 8 speed chain as well for my own bikes. It's relatively inexpensive, lasts well and has the power link. I've been using them for a number of years now on different bikes.
        > >
        > >
        > > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, js montes <jsmontes-1937@> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > On 29/12/2011 5:12 AM, john wrote:
        > > > >> After nearly 40 years of cycling I heard the voice of reason: motor oil is nasty stuff
        > > > >> for bike chains. I have changed to paraffin wax with excellent results. Sure it is more
        > > > >> work, you have to split the chain every few months and dunk it in hot, liquid paraffin wax
        > > > >> ( actually from a large candle from a dollar store), but you have a clean, lubed chain
        > > > >> that will not attract dirt, nor soil hands and clothes.
        > > > >> Frank Berto is very eloquent on this subject and as in most things, he is quite right.
        > > > >>
        > > > >> Sergio Montes
        > > > >>
        > > > > Sergio
        > > > > How long have you been using the wax method? I've read about this for years but have never tried it. Even tho I've read and respect Berto's work, I have a hard time accepting it.
        > > > >
        > > > > Thanks
        > > >
        > > > John,
        > > > I've been a convert for at least five years. As I own several bikes, it is difficult to
        > > > ascertain the longevity of the chains with wax lubrication, but the convenience of having
        > > > a clean chain (outwardly at least) is enormous.
        > > > It would be interesting to know what chains our listers are using. My latest purchases (
        > > > not many) have been of inexpensive SRAM 8-speed chain.
        > > >
        > > > Sergio Montes
        > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > ------------------------------------
        > > > >
        > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > -----
        > > > > No virus found in this message.
        > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
        > > > > Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4707 - Release Date: 12/27/11
        > > > >
        > > >
        > >
        >
      • Steve Birmingham
        I ve been using the Teflon sprays for a few years now. I haven t seen much difference in brand, as long as it s Teflon. I am a bit curious though, why keep the
        Message 3 of 16 , Jan 3, 2012

          I’ve been using the Teflon sprays for a few years now. I haven’t seen much difference in brand, as long as it’s Teflon.

           

          I am a bit curious though, why keep the lube away from the ceramic bearings?

          More new stuff……

           

          Steve B

           

          From: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rich
          Sent: Monday, January 02, 2012 8:38 PM
          To: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [Bicycle_Restoration] Re: Lubes and stuff

           

           

          I switched from the wax to the teflon based lube.
          The wax was great in dry weather riding..not so much in wet.
          I've been using tri flow teflon spray for years and the chains have held up well.
          Keep the lubes away fron the ceramic bearing pullys etc.
          Rich

          --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Rich" <mcyak@...> wrote:
          >
          > LOVE THE SRAM CHAIN!
          > (FIND IT SUPERIOR TO THE ULTEGRA AND CHANGED IT OUT ON MY -ONLY NEW-CF MOTOBECANE)AND IT'S ON THE ROSS SIGNATURE, THE ROSS PARAGON,THE PD SERIES PARAMOUNT.
          > ONLY ONE RUNNING SOMETHING ELSE IS THE LETOUR TOURIST WITH A NOS SEDIS GOLD FROM YJ. THE SRAM I'M TOLD IS SEDIS YES??
          > RICH 'ROADS WERE DRY WE RODE NEW YEARS DAY!'MC
          >
          > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "john" <old99jh@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Thank you for the info, Sergio. I suppose I'll give it a try next time I lube up the bike.
          > >
          > > I use the SRAM 8 speed chain as well for my own bikes. It's relatively inexpensive, lasts well and has the power link. I've been using them for a number of years now on different bikes.
          > >
          > >
          > > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, js montes <jsmontes-1937@> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > On 29/12/2011 5:12 AM, john wrote:
          > > > >> After nearly 40 years of cycling I heard the voice of reason: motor oil is nasty stuff
          > > > >> for bike chains. I have changed to paraffin wax with excellent results. Sure it is more
          > > > >> work, you have to split the chain every few months and dunk it in hot, liquid paraffin wax
          > > > >> ( actually from a large candle from a dollar store), but you have a clean, lubed chain
          > > > >> that will not attract dirt, nor soil hands and clothes.
          > > > >> Frank Berto is very eloquent on this subject and as in most things, he is quite right.
          > > > >>
          > > > >> Sergio Montes
          > > > >>
          > > > > Sergio
          > > > > How long have you been using the wax method? I've read about this for years but have never tried it. Even tho I've read and respect Berto's work, I have a hard time accepting it.
          > > > >
          > > > > Thanks
          > > >
          > > > John,
          > > > I've been a convert for at least five years. As I own several bikes, it is difficult to
          > > > ascertain the longevity of the chains with wax lubrication, but the convenience of having
          > > > a clean chain (outwardly at least) is enormous.
          > > > It would be interesting to know what chains our listers are using. My latest purchases (
          > > > not many) have been of inexpensive SRAM 8-speed chain.
          > > >
          > > > Sergio Montes
          > > >
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > ------------------------------------
          > > > >
          > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > -----
          > > > > No virus found in this message.
          > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
          > > > > Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4707 - Release Date: 12/27/11
          > > > >
          > > >
          > >
          >

        • Rich
          I tried the teflon spray on the ceramic bushings in the ultegra 6700 The pullys ground to an abrupt halt.I should mention I sprayed a very lite whiff onto
          Message 4 of 16 , Jan 3, 2012
            I tried the teflon spray on the ceramic bushings in the ultegra 6700
            The pullys ground to an abrupt halt.I should mention I sprayed a very lite 'whiff' onto the ceramic bushings. They felt dry to the touch when I disassembled the pully wheels.
            So..I contacted Shimano about what to use as a lube.
            I guess there IS a lube out specificlly for ceramic bearings and bushings (and-midst the testosterone-you'll probably get the correct answer on bike forums)but the teflon really 'gathered goo' so to speak.
            Sence the issue with FSAs infamous crank arm problems arose at the same time, I had the lBS do a once over on the pully bushings/bearings while they were tackling the crank arm issue.
            Rich

            --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Birmingham" <sbirmingham@...> wrote:
            >
            > I've been using the Teflon sprays for a few years now. I haven't seen much
            > difference in brand, as long as it's Teflon.
            >
            >
            >
            > I am a bit curious though, why keep the lube away from the ceramic bearings?
            >
            > More new stuff..
            >
            >
            >
            > Steve B
            >
            >
            >
            > From: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
            > [mailto:Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rich
            > Sent: Monday, January 02, 2012 8:38 PM
            > To: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [Bicycle_Restoration] Re: Lubes and stuff
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > I switched from the wax to the teflon based lube.
            > The wax was great in dry weather riding..not so much in wet.
            > I've been using tri flow teflon spray for years and the chains have held up
            > well.
            > Keep the lubes away fron the ceramic bearing pullys etc.
            > Rich
            >
            > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
            > <mailto:Bicycle_Restoration%40yahoogroups.com> , "Rich" <mcyak@> wrote:
            > >
            > > LOVE THE SRAM CHAIN!
            > > (FIND IT SUPERIOR TO THE ULTEGRA AND CHANGED IT OUT ON MY -ONLY NEW-CF
            > MOTOBECANE)AND IT'S ON THE ROSS SIGNATURE, THE ROSS PARAGON,THE PD SERIES
            > PARAMOUNT.
            > > ONLY ONE RUNNING SOMETHING ELSE IS THE LETOUR TOURIST WITH A NOS SEDIS
            > GOLD FROM YJ. THE SRAM I'M TOLD IS SEDIS YES??
            > > RICH 'ROADS WERE DRY WE RODE NEW YEARS DAY!'MC
            > >
            > > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
            > <mailto:Bicycle_Restoration%40yahoogroups.com> , "john" <old99jh@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Thank you for the info, Sergio. I suppose I'll give it a try next time I
            > lube up the bike.
            > > >
            > > > I use the SRAM 8 speed chain as well for my own bikes. It's relatively
            > inexpensive, lasts well and has the power link. I've been using them for a
            > number of years now on different bikes.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
            > <mailto:Bicycle_Restoration%40yahoogroups.com> , js montes <jsmontes-1937@>
            > wrote:
            > > > >
            > > > > On 29/12/2011 5:12 AM, john wrote:
            > > > > >> After nearly 40 years of cycling I heard the voice of reason: motor
            > oil is nasty stuff
            > > > > >> for bike chains. I have changed to paraffin wax with excellent
            > results. Sure it is more
            > > > > >> work, you have to split the chain every few months and dunk it in
            > hot, liquid paraffin wax
            > > > > >> ( actually from a large candle from a dollar store), but you have a
            > clean, lubed chain
            > > > > >> that will not attract dirt, nor soil hands and clothes.
            > > > > >> Frank Berto is very eloquent on this subject and as in most things,
            > he is quite right.
            > > > > >>
            > > > > >> Sergio Montes
            > > > > >>
            > > > > > Sergio
            > > > > > How long have you been using the wax method? I've read about this
            > for years but have never tried it. Even tho I've read and respect Berto's
            > work, I have a hard time accepting it.
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Thanks
            > > > >
            > > > > John,
            > > > > I've been a convert for at least five years. As I own several bikes,
            > it is difficult to
            > > > > ascertain the longevity of the chains with wax lubrication, but the
            > convenience of having
            > > > > a clean chain (outwardly at least) is enormous.
            > > > > It would be interesting to know what chains our listers are using. My
            > latest purchases (
            > > > > not many) have been of inexpensive SRAM 8-speed chain.
            > > > >
            > > > > Sergio Montes
            > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > > ------------------------------------
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > > -----
            > > > > > No virus found in this message.
            > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
            > > > > > Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4707 - Release Date:
            > 12/27/11
            > > > > >
            > > > >
            > > >
            > >
            >
          • Steve Birmingham
            That s good to know. We have some special stuff at the shop, but I ve been getting all the really old stuff so I m not sure what it is. Steve From:
            Message 5 of 16 , Jan 3, 2012

              That’s good to know. We have some special stuff at the shop, but I’ve been getting all the really old stuff so I’m not sure what it is.

               

              Steve

               

              From: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rich
              Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2012 3:18 PM
              To: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [Bicycle_Restoration] Re: Lubes and stuff

               

               

              I tried the teflon spray on the ceramic bushings in the ultegra 6700
              The pullys ground to an abrupt halt.I should mention I sprayed a very lite 'whiff' onto the ceramic bushings. They felt dry to the touch when I disassembled the pully wheels.
              So..I contacted Shimano about what to use as a lube.
              I guess there IS a lube out specificlly for ceramic bearings and bushings (and-midst the testosterone-you'll probably get the correct answer on bike forums)but the teflon really 'gathered goo' so to speak.
              Sence the issue with FSAs infamous crank arm problems arose at the same time, I had the lBS do a once over on the pully bushings/bearings while they were tackling the crank arm issue.
              Rich

              --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Birmingham" <sbirmingham@...> wrote:
              >
              > I've been using the Teflon sprays for a few years now. I haven't seen much
              > difference in brand, as long as it's Teflon.
              >
              >
              >
              > I am a bit curious though, why keep the lube away from the ceramic bearings?
              >
              > More new stuff..
              >
              >
              >
              > Steve B
              >
              >
              >
              > From: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
              > [mailto:Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rich
              > Sent: Monday, January 02, 2012 8:38 PM
              > To: Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [Bicycle_Restoration] Re: Lubes and stuff
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > I switched from the wax to the teflon based lube.
              > The wax was great in dry weather riding..not so much in wet.
              > I've been using tri flow teflon spray for years and the chains have held up
              > well.
              > Keep the lubes away fron the ceramic bearing pullys etc.
              > Rich
              >
              > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
              > <mailto:Bicycle_Restoration%40yahoogroups.com> , "Rich" <mcyak@> wrote:
              > >
              > > LOVE THE SRAM CHAIN!
              > > (FIND IT SUPERIOR TO THE ULTEGRA AND CHANGED IT OUT ON MY -ONLY NEW-CF
              > MOTOBECANE)AND IT'S ON THE ROSS SIGNATURE, THE ROSS PARAGON,THE PD SERIES
              > PARAMOUNT.
              > > ONLY ONE RUNNING SOMETHING ELSE IS THE LETOUR TOURIST WITH A NOS SEDIS
              > GOLD FROM YJ. THE SRAM I'M TOLD IS SEDIS YES??
              > > RICH 'ROADS WERE DRY WE RODE NEW YEARS DAY!'MC
              > >
              > > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
              > <mailto:Bicycle_Restoration%40yahoogroups.com> , "john" <old99jh@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Thank you for the info, Sergio. I suppose I'll give it a try next time I
              > lube up the bike.
              > > >
              > > > I use the SRAM 8 speed chain as well for my own bikes. It's relatively
              > inexpensive, lasts well and has the power link. I've been using them for a
              > number of years now on different bikes.
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com
              > <mailto:Bicycle_Restoration%40yahoogroups.com> , js montes <jsmontes-1937@>
              > wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > On 29/12/2011 5:12 AM, john wrote:
              > > > > >> After nearly 40 years of cycling I heard the voice of reason: motor
              > oil is nasty stuff
              > > > > >> for bike chains. I have changed to paraffin wax with excellent
              > results. Sure it is more
              > > > > >> work, you have to split the chain every few months and dunk it in
              > hot, liquid paraffin wax
              > > > > >> ( actually from a large candle from a dollar store), but you have a
              > clean, lubed chain
              > > > > >> that will not attract dirt, nor soil hands and clothes.
              > > > > >> Frank Berto is very eloquent on this subject and as in most things,
              > he is quite right.
              > > > > >>
              > > > > >> Sergio Montes
              > > > > >>
              > > > > > Sergio
              > > > > > How long have you been using the wax method? I've read about this
              > for years but have never tried it. Even tho I've read and respect Berto's
              > work, I have a hard time accepting it.
              > > > > >
              > > > > > Thanks
              > > > >
              > > > > John,
              > > > > I've been a convert for at least five years. As I own several bikes,
              > it is difficult to
              > > > > ascertain the longevity of the chains with wax lubrication, but the
              > convenience of having
              > > > > a clean chain (outwardly at least) is enormous.
              > > > > It would be interesting to know what chains our listers are using. My
              > latest purchases (
              > > > > not many) have been of inexpensive SRAM 8-speed chain.
              > > > >
              > > > > Sergio Montes
              > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > > ------------------------------------
              > > > > >
              > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > > -----
              > > > > > No virus found in this message.
              > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
              > > > > > Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4707 - Release Date:
              > 12/27/11
              > > > > >
              > > > >
              > > >
              > >
              >

            • mtdmudbug
              I m with Rich - been using Triflow for close to 17 years. Light, yet gives excellent overall lubrication without gummy side effects. When I rode in Florida
              Message 6 of 16 , Jan 7, 2012
                I'm with Rich - been using Triflow for close to 17 years. Light, yet gives excellent overall lubrication without gummy side effects. When I rode in Florida with all the sand that was huge.

                --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Rich" <mcyak@...> wrote:
                >
                > I switched from the wax to the teflon based lube.
                > The wax was great in dry weather riding..not so much in wet.
                > I've been using tri flow teflon spray for years and the chains have held up well.
                > Keep the lubes away fron the ceramic bearing pullys etc.
                > Rich
                >
                > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "Rich" <mcyak@> wrote:
                > >
                > > LOVE THE SRAM CHAIN!
                > > (FIND IT SUPERIOR TO THE ULTEGRA AND CHANGED IT OUT ON MY -ONLY NEW-CF MOTOBECANE)AND IT'S ON THE ROSS SIGNATURE, THE ROSS PARAGON,THE PD SERIES PARAMOUNT.
                > > ONLY ONE RUNNING SOMETHING ELSE IS THE LETOUR TOURIST WITH A NOS SEDIS GOLD FROM YJ. THE SRAM I'M TOLD IS SEDIS YES??
                > > RICH 'ROADS WERE DRY WE RODE NEW YEARS DAY!'MC
                > >
                > > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, "john" <old99jh@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > Thank you for the info, Sergio. I suppose I'll give it a try next time I lube up the bike.
                > > >
                > > > I use the SRAM 8 speed chain as well for my own bikes. It's relatively inexpensive, lasts well and has the power link. I've been using them for a number of years now on different bikes.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > --- In Bicycle_Restoration@yahoogroups.com, js montes <jsmontes-1937@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > On 29/12/2011 5:12 AM, john wrote:
                > > > > >> After nearly 40 years of cycling I heard the voice of reason: motor oil is nasty stuff
                > > > > >> for bike chains. I have changed to paraffin wax with excellent results. Sure it is more
                > > > > >> work, you have to split the chain every few months and dunk it in hot, liquid paraffin wax
                > > > > >> ( actually from a large candle from a dollar store), but you have a clean, lubed chain
                > > > > >> that will not attract dirt, nor soil hands and clothes.
                > > > > >> Frank Berto is very eloquent on this subject and as in most things, he is quite right.
                > > > > >>
                > > > > >> Sergio Montes
                > > > > >>
                > > > > > Sergio
                > > > > > How long have you been using the wax method? I've read about this for years but have never tried it. Even tho I've read and respect Berto's work, I have a hard time accepting it.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Thanks
                > > > >
                > > > > John,
                > > > > I've been a convert for at least five years. As I own several bikes, it is difficult to
                > > > > ascertain the longevity of the chains with wax lubrication, but the convenience of having
                > > > > a clean chain (outwardly at least) is enormous.
                > > > > It would be interesting to know what chains our listers are using. My latest purchases (
                > > > > not many) have been of inexpensive SRAM 8-speed chain.
                > > > >
                > > > > Sergio Montes
                > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > ------------------------------------
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > -----
                > > > > > No virus found in this message.
                > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                > > > > > Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4707 - Release Date: 12/27/11
                > > > > >
                > > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >
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