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Re: My favorite question

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  • swete_00
    swete: If I may, the authors of our Constitution and Bill of Rights were Theists and believed that God, in a generic sense, created all men with the right to
    Message 1 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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      swete: If I may, the authors of our Constitution and Bill of Rights
      were "Theists" and believed that God, in a generic sense, created all
      men with the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
      They made no distinctions between Christian, Jew, Islamist, Pagan or
      Atheist. At least that's the way it is portrayed historically.



      --- In TruthorTradition@yahoogroups.com, "yeah right"
      <furshluginer@y...> wrote:
      >
      > I signed up for this group a few minutes ago and haven't been with
      > Yahoo long either. I like to as a particular question of people
      > and, really, I don't think I've ever gotten a satisfactory answer,
      > probably because atheists can't answer it without embarrassment.
      > Here goes:
      >
      > Our Declaration of Independence (US) states that all our rights
      come
      > from God. It pretty much establishes that he alone is our
      guarantor
      > of life, liberty and pursuit of happiness...are we in agreement
      > here? The purpose of this document was to establish our
      > independence from Brittain and authorize the formation of our own
      > government-including the creation of a constitution.
      >
      > In recent months, various institutions in the US have been under
      > attack for including reference to religion (usually christian) in
      > governmental and civic activities and even at times business
      > practices. I guess to tie the question to the theme of the group
      > would be to state that "traditionally", we assume that atheists
      have
      > rights and heed them in these matters (eg. remove the generic
      > word "God" from things). However, and this is the heart of my
      > question, how can an atheist claim to have freedom of (non)
      > religion, or any rights at all for that matter, if they do not
      > beleive in the garantor of those rights?
      > I have heard the humanists claim sometimes that rights are obtained
      > by another means; although this is not the way the Declaration of
      > Independence established-popular vote. However, the popular vote
      is
      > almost always Christian too. What moral, legal or traditional
      > grounds do atheists have to rid our way of life of the usage of the
      > word, "God"?
    • jennifer decker
      well, the honest truth is: none. that s right. however, they have usurped this right while christians have stood by and done nothing. it s only been very
      Message 2 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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          well, the honest truth is: none. that's right. however, they have usurped this right while christians have stood by and done nothing.  it's only been very recently, that the christians have begun to get involved in the political arena, to make a difference for a moral standard.  i hope that more and more christians will got involved, because the right to worhip god is being taken away in this country, while we all stand by and watch.  sooner than we think, i believe churches will be forced underground, and undergo terrible persecution, similar other countries around the world.  i believe it will be a sign of the last days.  but, i'm rambling. 
            the bottom line is, you can't reason with unreasonable people.  meaning this, you can quote all the scripture, present the best arguments, use all reason and logic, and he who has determined in his heart to not follow god will not follow god, no matter what you do.  you can only pray for them, and get involved, to try to keep them from taking your rights away. 
           sorry if this was confusing, it's late and i'm really tired.

        yeah right <furshluginer@...> wrote:

        I signed up for this group a few minutes ago and haven't been with
        Yahoo long either.  I like to as a particular question of people
        and, really, I don't think I've ever gotten a satisfactory answer,
        probably because atheists can't answer it without embarrassment. 
        Here goes:

        Our Declaration of Independence (US) states that all our rights come
        from God.  It pretty much establishes that he alone is our guarantor
        of life, liberty and pursuit of happiness...are we in agreement
        here?  The purpose of this document was to establish our
        independence from Brittain and authorize the formation of our own
        government-including the creation of a constitution.

        In recent months, various institutions in the US have been under
        attack for including reference to religion (usually christian) in
        governmental and civic activities and even at times business
        practices.  I guess to tie the question to the theme of the group
        would be to state that "traditionally", we assume that atheists have
        rights and heed them in these matters (eg. remove the generic
        word "God" from things).  However, and this is the heart of my
        question,  how can an atheist claim to have freedom of (non)
        religion, or any rights at all for that matter, if they do not
        beleive in the garantor of those rights? 
        I have heard the humanists claim sometimes that rights are obtained
        by another means; although this is not the way the Declaration of
        Independence established-popular vote.  However, the popular vote is
        almost always Christian too.  What moral, legal or traditional
        grounds do atheists have to rid our way of life of the usage of the
        word, "God"?




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      • Vincent M. Chenault
        What? Are you nuts? There were only Christians here when that happened and no others. They founded this country on God, the Bible, and Christianity and schools
        Message 3 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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          What? Are you nuts? There were only Christians here when that happened and no others. They founded this country on God, the Bible, and Christianity and schools and colleges were set up to teach the BIBLE! Fraternities started putting the Greek letters above their doors because of 1st corinthians 1:22. In order to let their peers know that they were "wisdom seekers". My how far we have come AWAY from that! Now they kick the book out! Madlyn Murray O'Hare 6-17-1963! We all know what happened to her down in Mexico. Her son became a Born-Again Baptist preacher and she disowned him. She's rotting in hell as sure as Charles Manson will also!  

          swete_00 <swete_00@...> wrote:

          swete: If I may, the authors of our Constitution and Bill of Rights
          were "Theists" and believed that God, in a generic sense, created all
          men with the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
          They made no distinctions between Christian, Jew, Islamist, Pagan or
          Atheist. At least that's the way it is portrayed historically.



          --- In TruthorTradition@yahoogroups.com, "yeah right"
          <furshluginer@y...> wrote:
          >
          > I signed up for this group a few minutes ago and haven't been with
          > Yahoo long either.  I like to as a particular question of people
          > and, really, I don't think I've ever gotten a satisfactory answer,
          > probably because atheists can't answer it without embarrassment. 
          > Here goes:
          >
          > Our Declaration of Independence (US) states that all our rights
          come
          > from God.  It pretty much establishes that he alone is our
          guarantor
          > of life, liberty and pursuit of happiness...are we in agreement
          > here?  The purpose of this document was to establish our
          > independence from Brittain and authorize the formation of our own
          > government-including the creation of a constitution.
          >
          > In recent months, various institutions in the US have been under
          > attack for including reference to religion (usually christian) in
          > governmental and civic activities and even at times business
          > practices.  I guess to tie the question to the theme of the group
          > would be to state that "traditionally", we assume that atheists
          have
          > rights and heed them in these matters (eg. remove the generic
          > word "God" from things).  However, and this is the heart of my
          > question,  how can an atheist claim to have freedom of (non)
          > religion, or any rights at all for that matter, if they do not
          > beleive in the garantor of those rights? 
          > I have heard the humanists claim sometimes that rights are obtained
          > by another means; although this is not the way the Declaration of
          > Independence established-popular vote.  However, the popular vote
          is
          > almost always Christian too.  What moral, legal or traditional
          > grounds do atheists have to rid our way of life of the usage of the
          > word, "God"?






          " That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth, the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. " " For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. " Romans 10:9-10&13


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        • jaytadly
          that is truly a wise and thought-provoking question which i will use in my conversations with atheists. you are exactly right - they have no ground to stand on
          Message 4 of 8 , Jan 1, 2005
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            that is truly a wise and thought-provoking question which i will use
            in my conversations with atheists. you are exactly right - they have
            no ground to stand on for assuming to have ANY rights without also
            giving some sort of assent as to Who or where those rights come from.

            thank you for making that point!

            : )

            in Christ,

            tad

            --- In TruthorTradition@yahoogroups.com, "yeah right"
            <furshluginer@y...> wrote:
            >
            > I signed up for this group a few minutes ago and haven't been with
            > Yahoo long either. I like to as a particular question of people
            > and, really, I don't think I've ever gotten a satisfactory answer,
            > probably because atheists can't answer it without embarrassment.
            > Here goes:
            >
            > Our Declaration of Independence (US) states that all our rights
            come
            > from God. It pretty much establishes that he alone is our
            guarantor
            > of life, liberty and pursuit of happiness...are we in agreement
            > here? The purpose of this document was to establish our
            > independence from Brittain and authorize the formation of our own
            > government-including the creation of a constitution.
            >
            > In recent months, various institutions in the US have been under
            > attack for including reference to religion (usually christian) in
            > governmental and civic activities and even at times business
            > practices. I guess to tie the question to the theme of the group
            > would be to state that "traditionally", we assume that atheists
            have
            > rights and heed them in these matters (eg. remove the generic
            > word "God" from things). However, and this is the heart of my
            > question, how can an atheist claim to have freedom of (non)
            > religion, or any rights at all for that matter, if they do not
            > beleive in the garantor of those rights?
            > I have heard the humanists claim sometimes that rights are
            obtained
            > by another means; although this is not the way the Declaration of
            > Independence established-popular vote. However, the popular vote
            is
            > almost always Christian too. What moral, legal or traditional
            > grounds do atheists have to rid our way of life of the usage of
            the
            > word, "God"?
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