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EDIT-Black Diamond Lighthouse Tent (amytys)

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  • Leesa J
    Andy, Wow - you definitely gave the tent a workout!! I had some things for you too check out, upload when ready. Leesa Black Diamond Lighthouse Tent and
    Message 1 of 9 , Nov 30, 2004
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      Andy, Wow - you definitely gave the tent a workout!! I had some
      things for you too check out, upload when ready. Leesa

      Black Diamond Lighthouse Tent and Vestibule
      Long Term Report
      Reviewed By:
      Andrew Mytys


      Areas Prohibiting Sale:
      Due to local fire codes, the Black Diamond Lighthouse Tent is not
      available for sale in California, Louisiana, Massachusetts, Michigan,
      Minnesota, New Jersey, and New York. It is also not available for sale
      in Canada. Internet-based retailers are also prohibited by law from
      shipping the tent to these locations.

      *** So, you didn't use it in Michigan I assume????*** ; )


      *** If you spell out 'pound' then I think you should also spell out kilogram?***

      While I find the vestibule to be an extremely versatile and welcome
      piece of equipment to have when it rains, it does adds a pound (1/2
      kg) of weight to my pack. In order to speed teardown in the morning, I
      don't bother pitching the vestibule unless conditions call for it, so
      when there's no rain in the forecast, it translates into more than a
      pound (1/2 kg) of gear that I carried all day and didn't even use.


      Pitching the Lighthouse in the Rain:
      *** Is the following projecting, or did you really rip a hole in your tent?***
      Should a pole become dislodged from its corner "snap," it can even rip
      a hole in the tent's wall as it tries to straighten itself out.

      Of course, pitching the Lighthouse from the inside results in
      segments of poles in excess of six feet (2 m) in length blindly
      protruding out of the tent and into the air. Fellow hikers in the area
      should be warned in advance, as unsuspecting ***passers-by***
      passerbys could find themselves poked in the eye by a ***renegade***
      renagade tent pole.


      ***…can withstand about six hours of (not or)…
      I've found that the Lighthouse can withstand about six hours or constant rain.

      ***Did you mean 'did NOT show…'?***
      Conversely, walls that were not being hit head-on with rain did show
      any internal moisture developing whatsoever.


      ***…look 'as' pretty as…***
      This technique resulted in a flat application of seam sealer, which,
      once dry, looked more like tape than caulk. While the result didn't
      look at pretty as the original "caulking," it has already lasted
      longer than the initial technique I used.

      ***…caught fire pretty 'quickly'?... ***
      The material caught fire pretty quick, and the flames expanded without pause.
    • Andy Mytys
      ... I m calling it style. I try to keep things in parens short. ... your tent?*** ... Well, a pole that became dislodged while the tent was being blown away
      Message 2 of 9 , Nov 30, 2004
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        --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, Leesa J <leesaj@g...> wrote:
        >
        > *** If you spell out 'pound' then I think you should also spell out
        > kilogram?***
        >

        I'm calling it style. I try to keep things in parens short.

        >
        > Pitching the Lighthouse in the Rain:
        > *** Is the following projecting, or did you really rip a hole in
        your tent?***
        > Should a pole become dislodged from its corner "snap," it can even
        > rip a hole in the tent's wall as it tries to straighten itself out.
        >

        Well, a pole that became dislodged while the tent was being blown
        away did rip a hole in the tent. The material is very thin, and very
        tight. The tips of the poles are uncovered. It is definitely
        something that CAN happen (but not necessarilly something that WILL
        happen, which would definitely be projection).
      • Jerry Goller
        http://www.BackpackGearTest.org : the most comprehensive interactive gear reviews and tests on the planet. ... From: Leesa J [mailto:leesaj@gmail.com] Sent:
        Message 3 of 9 , Nov 30, 2004
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          http://www.BackpackGearTest.org : the most comprehensive interactive gear
          reviews and tests on the planet.



          -----Original Message-----
          From: Leesa J [mailto:leesaj@...]
          Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 8:11 AM
          To: backpackgeartest@yahoogroups.com; amytys@...
          Subject: [BackpackGearTest] EDIT-Black Diamond Lighthouse Tent (amytys)


          @@@ I wouldn't worry about this one too much. Had Andy spelled out ounce in
          16 ounces then used kg, then I would agree.


          *** If you spell out 'pound' then I think you should also spell out
          kilogram?***

          While I find the vestibule to be an extremely versatile and welcome piece of
          equipment to have when it rains, it does adds a pound (1/2
          kg) of weight to my pack. In order to speed teardown in the morning, I don't
          bother pitching the vestibule unless conditions call for it, so when there's
          no rain in the forecast, it translates into more than a pound (1/2 kg) of
          gear that I carried all day and didn't even use.


          Pitching the Lighthouse in the Rain:
          *** Is the following projecting, or did you really rip a hole in your
          tent?*** Should a pole become dislodged from its corner "snap," it can even
          rip a hole in the tent's wall as it tries to straighten itself out.

          @@@ This one can probably be left in. It is a possibility that the unwary
          should be made aware of.
        • Andrew Priest
          ... Agree. However, a further clarification along the lines you mention of what happened in the storm would be useful as it provides support to your view. As
          Message 4 of 9 , Nov 30, 2004
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            At 12:58 AM 1/12/2004, you wrote:

            > > Pitching the Lighthouse in the Rain:
            > > *** Is the following projecting, or did you really rip a hole in
            >your tent?***
            > > Should a pole become dislodged from its corner "snap," it can even
            > > rip a hole in the tent's wall as it tries to straighten itself out.
            > >
            >
            >Well, a pole that became dislodged while the tent was being blown
            >away did rip a hole in the tent. The material is very thin, and very
            >tight. The tips of the poles are uncovered. It is definitely
            >something that CAN happen (but not necessarilly something that WILL
            >happen, which would definitely be projection).

            Agree. However, a further clarification along the lines you mention of what
            happened in the storm would be useful as it provides support to your view.
            As it is written it is just a view.

            Andrew


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Andy Mytys
            ... even ... out. ... very ... of what ... your view. ... If someone reads the entire report, they will read that the awning pole did rip the material. Anyone
            Message 5 of 9 , Nov 30, 2004
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              --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, Andrew Priest <apriest@b...>
              wrote:
              > At 12:58 AM 1/12/2004, you wrote:
              >
              > > > Pitching the Lighthouse in the Rain:
              > > > *** Is the following projecting, or did you really rip a hole in
              > >your tent?***
              > > > Should a pole become dislodged from its corner "snap," it can
              even
              > > > rip a hole in the tent's wall as it tries to straighten itself
              out.
              > > >
              > >
              > >Well, a pole that became dislodged while the tent was being blown
              > >away did rip a hole in the tent. The material is very thin, and
              very
              > >tight. The tips of the poles are uncovered. It is definitely
              > >something that CAN happen (but not necessarilly something that WILL
              > >happen, which would definitely be projection).
              >
              > Agree. However, a further clarification along the lines you mention
              of what
              > happened in the storm would be useful as it provides support to
              your view.
              > As it is written it is just a view.
              >
              > Andrew

              If someone reads the entire report, they will read that the awning
              pole did rip the material.

              Anyone getting the tent should be forewarned, and that's what I do.
              I don't really want to go on and on about any given point. Did I
              convey to the reader what I wanted to? Yes. Was the reader warned
              that the ends of the tent poles are uncovered and under tention,
              factors that could have the pole going through the tent material?
              Yes.

              If a reader shells out $350 and either the tent pole slips out of
              their hands while pitching, or the tent isn't staked down or gets
              loose from the stakes and the wind deflects the poles out of their
              corners and through the shell of the tent, they can't say I didn't
              warn them.

              Likewise for branches falling from nearby trees.

              And that's really what I wanted to make known... the warning. I
              didn't want to clutter that up with a bunch of text. I do enough
              rambling as it is. :)
            • Andrew Priest
              ... Andy I give up .... the magic word IF . All that is needed is a simple sentence. Is that so hard? Apparently so. Andrew [Non-text portions of this
              Message 6 of 9 , Nov 30, 2004
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                At 01:17 PM 1/12/2004, you wrote:

                > >
                > > Agree. However, a further clarification along the lines you mention
                >of what
                > > happened in the storm would be useful as it provides support to
                >your view.
                > > As it is written it is just a view.
                > >
                > > Andrew
                >
                >If someone reads the entire report, they will read that the awning
                >pole did rip the material.

                Andy

                I give up .... the magic word "IF". All that is needed is a simple
                sentence. Is that so hard? Apparently so.

                Andrew



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • JimSabis@aol.com
                In a message dated 12/1/2004 3:52:12 AM Eastern Standard Time, ... Andy I give up .... the magic word IF . All that is needed is a simple sentence. Is that
                Message 7 of 9 , Dec 1, 2004
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                  In a message dated 12/1/2004 3:52:12 AM Eastern Standard Time,
                  apriest@... writes:
                  >
                  >If someone reads the entire report, they will read that the awning
                  >pole did rip the material.

                  Andy

                  I give up .... the magic word "IF". All that is needed is a simple
                  sentence. Is that so hard? Apparently so.

                  Andrew
                  ######

                  I normally do not jump in on this sort of thing, but as a fellow Lighthouse
                  tester, I feel I should add my two cents here:

                  Andy, I read the passage being discussed above. My concern is that I came
                  away from the statement, as currently worded, with the feeling that the
                  'pop-tear' scenario has a high probability of occuring. As a user of the tent, I know
                  this is not the case. Once set up, it takes considerable effort to get the
                  poles out of their seating rings. It takes far more effort to get them shifted to
                  the point where the end of the pole is outside the heavy re-inforced corner
                  patch. In fact, the tension is so great it is nearly impossible to do this
                  without intentionally risking damage to the tent or pole. Your passage makes no
                  mention of the reinforcing patch at all, which leads to what would be an
                  inaccurate conclusion on the part of the reader.

                  Granted, you did experience a pretty dramatic problem, but it required pretty
                  dramatic circumstances. Your description of the event leads me to believe
                  that any tent would have suffered considerable damage in that scenario. My
                  comments would actually go beyond Andrews, having used the tent heavily myself. Your
                  description of this concern should be linked directly to the description of
                  the event that caused your damage, which would put it in more accurate
                  perspective. As a stand alone statement it is misleading, which I'm certain is not
                  your intent.

                  I read the full report and understood, as a user of the tent, precisely what
                  happened. As a user of the tent, I know how unlikely this occurance is under
                  'normal circumstances'. Someone researching the tent, and therefore unfamiliar
                  with it, does not have the advantage of my Lighthouse experience and could
                  easily draw the wrong conclusion.

                  Just my two cents, for what it is worth. Carry on.

                  Jim S.


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Andy Mytys
                  ... Jim, I ll just remove the sentence altogether.
                  Message 8 of 9 , Dec 1, 2004
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                    --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, JimSabis@a... wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > Andy, I read the passage being discussed above. My concern is that
                    > I came away from the statement, as currently worded, with the
                    > feeling that the 'pop-tear' scenario has a high probability of
                    > occuring.


                    Jim,


                    I'll just remove the sentence altogether.
                  • JimSabis@aol.com
                    In a message dated 12/1/2004 10:09:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, ... Jim, I ll just remove the sentence altogether. ###### Andy, that was not my intent, but it
                    Message 9 of 9 , Dec 1, 2004
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                      In a message dated 12/1/2004 10:09:46 AM Eastern Standard Time,
                      amytys@... writes:
                      --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, JimSabis@a... wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > Andy, I read the passage being discussed above. My concern is that
                      > I came away from the statement, as currently worded, with the
                      > feeling that the 'pop-tear' scenario has a high probability of
                      > occuring.


                      Jim,


                      I'll just remove the sentence altogether.
                      ######

                      Andy, that was not my intent, but it may actually be better that way. You
                      cover the incident, and it results, pretty thoroughly later in the report.

                      Thanks for understanding.

                      Jim S.


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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