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Re: Mountainsmith wisp

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  • cmcrooker
    I have a vested interest in the Wisp (I was chosen as a tester), so yep, testers have been chosen. Jerry reported that the Vision would also be tested. Carol
    Message 1 of 21 , Sep 1, 2003
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      I have a vested interest in the Wisp (I was chosen as a tester), so
      yep, testers have been chosen. Jerry reported that the Vision would
      also be tested.
      Carol
      --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, "llenrocnave"
      <llenrocnave@b...> wrote:
      > On the wisp, I just looked on the database and it said waiting for
      > shipment, does that mean the testers have already been chosen?
      And
      > also, is the Vision going to be tested as well?
    • David Anderson
      Hi Evan, It s like Andy said before, we really don t like to say what is going to be tested ahead of time for several reasons. The main reason is that it has a
      Message 2 of 21 , Sep 1, 2003
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        Hi Evan,

        It's like Andy said before, we really don't like to say what is going to be
        tested ahead of time for several reasons.

        The main reason is that it has a tendency to jinx the test so that it never
        happens. Some of the reasons that we have had tests disappear on us include
        having our contact at the company leave, or the manufacturer has production
        issues where they cannot keep up with customer demand.

        From the tester side of things, we don't want testers avoiding a test call
        for one item because they know that an item they really want is in the
        pipeline. The real problem here is that if we have 3 of a real popular item
        in the pipe, but 30 people REALLY want it and are willing to wait for it,
        that means we are going to have 27 testers that are not applying for other
        similar gear.

        For those popular items, there is always stiff competition. What you should
        concern yourself with at this point is working on your reviews and
        applications. Do a great job testing the less popular gear and you will
        find that your reputation with the moderators greatly increases. Writing
        additional Owner Reviews will also help out here. If you are around here
        long enough, you will get to test out just about every sort of gear, it
        just may not be the exact brand and model that you want. You will also find
        that you will like testing out a lot of the gear that you would never have
        bought for yourself, it's just more fun to try out something new.


        At 11:43 AM 9/1/2003 +0000, you wrote:
        >On the wisp, I just looked on the database and it said waiting for
        >shipment, does that mean the testers have already been chosen? And
        >also, is the Vision going to be tested as well?

        --
        David Anderson
        Moderator
        http://www.BackpackGearTest.org
      • llenrocnave
        I don t really mind if I don t get the vision, it s just that I need a new sleeping bag and I want a sleeping bag to be the first thing I test, as I am a
        Message 3 of 21 , Sep 1, 2003
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          I don't really mind if I don't get the vision, it's just that I need
          a new sleeping bag and I want a sleeping bag to be the first thing I
          test, as I am a newbie, and will have to wait six months until I can
          test multiple items at once.
        • David Anderson
          ... I m afraid that you are going to be disappointed then. If you go to http://www.backpackgeartest.org/reviews/Sleep%20Gear/Sleeping%20Bags/ you will notice
          Message 4 of 21 , Sep 1, 2003
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            At 09:01 PM 9/1/2003 +0000, you wrote:
            >I don't really mind if I don't get the vision, it's just that I need
            >a new sleeping bag and I want a sleeping bag to be the first thing I
            >test, as I am a newbie, and will have to wait six months until I can
            >test multiple items at once.

            I'm afraid that you are going to be disappointed then. If you go to
            http://www.backpackgeartest.org/reviews/Sleep%20Gear/Sleeping%20Bags/
            you will notice that we have only run tests on three bags in two different
            test series so far, with a grand total of 7 testers.

            We have also run test calls for a couple of other bags where the test has
            not gotten underway, and I believe that those tests only had 3 testers
            each. Most of our well proven veteran testers haven't gotten to test any
            sleeping bags yet, and there just aren't that many in the pipeline.
            Sleeping bags are a bit tougher to come by, and as a newbie you just aren't
            going to get one as your first test.

            In fact, as a newbie, you aren't likely to get any of the more expensive or
            popular gear. You are going to be competing with testers that have proven
            themselves with a large range of gear (from towels and notebooks to tents
            and trekking poles) and have written a number of Owner Reviews. The best
            way to compete with these testers for the popular gear is to improve your
            position by testing whatever you can, and doing a good job at it. Then
            spend some of your time during that 6 months writing more Owner Reviews.
            That would put you in a much better position when the gear flood happens in
            the spring. It will also help you out when we decide to make an exception
            to the newbie rule.

            You might want to consider checking out some of the tests we have done with
            some of the less expensive gear. Most of them really are fun, and the
            testers get to play with something that they probably would not have bought
            on their own. These are the tests where you can show that you are a great
            tester that can work with anything. If you can write a good review of a
            towel or a bucket, then we will know that a sleeping bag or a pack will not
            be too difficult for you.

            --
            David Anderson
            Moderator
            http://www.BackpackGearTest.org
          • Andy Mytys
            ... I don t know... I find that multi-use things are pretty easy to write reviews on. A camp bucket is certainly multi-use (at least it was in my review) and
            Message 5 of 21 , Sep 1, 2003
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              --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, David Anderson
              >
              > If you can write a good review of a towel or a bucket, then we will
              > know that a sleeping bag or a pack will not be too difficult for
              > you.
              >


              I don't know... I find that multi-use things are pretty easy to write
              reviews on. A camp bucket is certainly multi-use (at least it was in
              my review) and something like a towel is close enough to the fabled
              banada to have over 20 practical and common uses in the field, each
              of which can be tested on their own to result in a complete and well
              thought out test.

              I would also say that the more features an item is, the better the
              odds of posting good reports. For example, packs have lots of design
              features like extra pockets, position of pockets, size of pockets,
              etc, which can serve to really flesh out a review.

              When you get to utility items that don't have a lot of variety
              in "how" you use them, reports become more difficult to write in a
              manner that our readers would find useful. Predicting the result of
              a low-feature item on the quality of a bucket or towel review is not
              a good idea, IMO.

              Unless the applicant has already done a sleeping bag review or two,
              past reports can only be used for writing style and an idea of how
              thorough the writer can be. But, in terms of the main critieria I
              would look at in narrowing down the candidates for a sleeping bag, it
              would be, hands down, the field test and test plan - this is where
              the variety will be found.

              If you're basically going to take the sleeping bag out into the field
              and never take it out of the stuff sack save for when you're in the
              conforts of your tent, I would think that your chances of getting
              selected are nil. After all, what are you going to report? Temp
              rating, which tends to be rather subjective, and how it handles in
              tent condensation for 8-10 hours/night. Whoopee! Perhaps there is
              some usefulness to the condensation, but we most likely will only
              have 3 bags to test.

              I would think that, in terms of sleeping bags, testers who routinely
              spend nights outside of the safe confines of their tents would have
              an edge. There are key tests to sleeping bags that you just can't
              get in a tent... packing along a spray bottle of water isn't going to
              cut it! Of course, the best candidates will play musical chairs with
              their test conditions. Based on where they live, some testers around
              here have the benefit of, in a six month period of time, seeing
              desert and mountain conditions, dry and humid air, etc. Based on the
              conditions that they venture into, they might bivy, tarp, tent, AND
              hammock over the course of six months.

              Thinking about it even further, bags have to be some of the toughest
              things to get good testers for. For instance, a sleeping bag is
              really not something that dayhikers can test. You really have to go
              out on overnights in the field. There are only a few items around
              here (tents are another), where this is the case. Yes, dayhikers
              might argue that they can simply test in their backyards... or on
              their apartment balconies. While those might result in adequete test
              conditions, a credible report on backpacking equipment should have
              tests that were done outside of a 100 foot extension cords reach of
              electricity.

              In almost all other cases, dayhikers can report on test conditions
              just as good as traditional backpackers - maybe even better. The
              advantage of dayhikers is that they can jump outside and use the gear
              when bad weather moves in. A backpacker can go out for 10 days and
              not see a cloud. The backpacker might be in the field a few times
              during the course of a six-month test. The dayhiker can arguably be
              out testing on any given day.

              Now, I do realize that most of our backpackers are also dayhikers.
              But, in terms of things that really need time in the field, we really
              don't have that many testers that go on lots of overnight trips. We
              all have day jobs, many have families... obligations and priorities
              that just come before our beloved backpacking. This is why I say
              test cases and field conditions which are specified in the
              application will be paramount.

              A sleeping bag is just one of those unique items. It needs a lot of
              field testing in order to cover the range of weather and use
              conditions that are necessary for a comprehensive review.

              Keep this post in mind when thinking about whether to apply or not.
              Yes, it is good practice to apply often. But, getting selected for a
              sleeping bag test is hardly like winning the lottery. There is a
              fine line that will define true candidates and wanna-be's.
            • Shane Steinkamp
              ... Yes, the testers are: Carol Crooker Andrew Priest Coy Starnes Any one of these could back out at the last minute, but I wouldn t expect that... Shane
              Message 6 of 21 , Sep 1, 2003
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                > On the wisp, I just looked on the database and it said
                > waiting for shipment, does that mean the testers have
                > already been chosen?

                Yes, the testers are:

                Carol Crooker
                Andrew Priest
                Coy Starnes

                Any one of these could back out at the last minute, but I wouldn't expect
                that...

                Shane
                Acting List Moderator
              • Shane Steinkamp
                ... The major difference, for me, is that things like towels and buckets are FUN, and writing reviews on things like packs and sleeping bags is WORK. Shane
                Message 7 of 21 , Sep 1, 2003
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                  > If you can write a good review of a towel or a bucket, then
                  > we will know that a sleeping bag or a pack will not be too
                  > difficult for you.

                  The major difference, for me, is that things like towels and buckets are
                  FUN, and writing reviews on things like packs and sleeping bags is WORK.

                  Shane
                • Rebecca
                  Actually, Michael Wheiler took the place of Andrew when Andrew went on his long term OOP. ... From: Shane Steinkamp [mailto:shane@theplacewithnoname.com] Sent:
                  Message 8 of 21 , Sep 1, 2003
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                    Actually, Michael Wheiler took the place of Andrew when Andrew went on his
                    long term OOP.
                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: Shane Steinkamp [mailto:shane@...]
                    Sent: Monday, September 01, 2003 9:52 PM
                    To: BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: RE: [BackpackGearTest] Mountainsmith wisp


                    > On the wisp, I just looked on the database and it said
                    > waiting for shipment, does that mean the testers have
                    > already been chosen?

                    Yes, the testers are:

                    Carol Crooker
                    Andrew Priest
                    Coy Starnes

                    Any one of these could back out at the last minute, but I wouldn't expect
                    that...

                    Shane
                    Acting List Moderator


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                  • rcaffin
                    ... Ha! We should be so lucky, here in Oz. When it does stay dry that long, it means a drought is getting going and the bush fires will be coming over the
                    Message 9 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                      Andy Mytys wrote:

                      > A backpacker can go out for 10 days and not see a cloud.
                      Ha! We should be so lucky, here in Oz.
                      When it does stay dry that long, it means a drought is getting going
                      and the bush fires will be coming over the hill.

                      OK, an exaggeration - slightly. But only slightly. We can NOT assume
                      it will not rain here sometime in the next few days. Of course, in
                      the UK you can't assume it won't rain sometime in the next few
                      hours...

                      > But, in terms of things that really need time in the field,
                      > we really don't have that many testers that go on lots of
                      > overnight trips. We all have day jobs, many have families...
                      > obligations and priorities that just come before our beloved
                      > backpacking.
                      Priorities!
                      Do you really want to keep working 5 days a week until you are 65 and
                      get the shove? And are then a too old and too unfit for all the good
                      walks?
                      Priorities!
                      </endsermon>

                      OOP for the next 5 days. :-)

                      Cheers
                      Roger caffin
                    • Coy
                      ... wrote: . ... and ... good ... OK Rodger Dont give CB any encourgment. Whe have already decided he will work till he has one foot in the grave. He tried
                      Message 10 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                        --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, "rcaffin" <r.caffin@t...>
                        wrote:
                        .
                        > Priorities!
                        > Do you really want to keep working 5 days a week until you are 65
                        and
                        > get the shove? And are then a too old and too unfit for all the
                        good
                        > walks?
                        > Priorities!
                        > </endsermon>
                        >
                        > OOP for the next 5 days. :-)
                        >
                        > Cheers
                        > Roger caffin

                        OK Rodger

                        Dont give CB any encourgment. Whe have already decided he will work
                        till he has one foot in the grave. He tried those same arguments on
                        me.

                        Mrs Coy Boy
                      • llenrocnave
                        See, with me, I m still in middle school and I don t do anything, hardly on the weekends, so I can go on weekend trips with my dad almost every weekend and I
                        Message 11 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                          See, with me, I'm still in middle school and I don't do anything,
                          hardly on the weekends, so I can go on weekend trips with my dad
                          almost every weekend and I can go to state parks, and almost anywhere
                          I want.
                        • Fuzzy
                          ... anywhere ... To Shane, Stephanie, etc., This kid s got test fever something bad. I have a feeling you re gonna get more apps from him than you do from me,
                          Message 12 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                            --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, "llenrocnave"
                            <llenrocnave@b...> wrote:
                            > See, with me, I'm still in middle school and I don't do anything,
                            > hardly on the weekends, so I can go on weekend trips with my dad
                            > almost every weekend and I can go to state parks, and almost
                            anywhere
                            > I want.

                            To Shane, Stephanie, etc.,

                            This kid's got test fever something bad. I have a feeling you're
                            gonna get more apps from him than you do from me, which means lots
                            (right?), but it will at least give him some practice.

                            To Evan,

                            Enthusiasm is good... just be careful not to go overboard. I think
                            it is fabulous that someone your age is so interested in the
                            outdoors, but you've gotta be careful about hounding the group to
                            test items that may not be available at all. As we like to say
                            around here (it's been said to me, believe me), "Patience,
                            Grasshopper" You will get your chance to test. When you do, work
                            with your monitor, write good reports, and polish up your application
                            skills - your chances wil come. Trust me.

                            Fuzzy
                          • Andy Mytys
                            ... Right - absolutely nothing wrong with enthusiasm. That said, looking at the BGT.org site, I see only one review from Evan - the Gregory Shasta backpack.
                            Message 13 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                              --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, "Fuzzy" <ckime@n...> wrote:
                              >
                              > To Evan,
                              >
                              > Enthusiasm is good... just be careful not to go overboard. I think
                              > it is fabulous that someone your age is so interested in the
                              > outdoors, but you've gotta be careful about hounding the group to
                              > test items that may not be available at all. As we like to say
                              > around here (it's been said to me, believe me), "Patience,
                              > Grasshopper" You will get your chance to test. When you do, work
                              > with your monitor, write good reports, and polish up your
                              > application skills - your chances wil come. Trust me.
                              >

                              Right - absolutely nothing wrong with enthusiasm. That said, looking
                              at the BGT.org site, I see only one review from Evan - the Gregory
                              Shasta backpack.

                              Someone's getting WAY ahead of themselves here.

                              First, there needs to be two owner reviews on record. That's the
                              minimum needed to participate in "official" tests. Now, something
                              like a sleeping bag or tent is what's considered a "high ticket"
                              item. They go to people who have proven themselves though Owner
                              Reviews, group participation, and a rock solid track record of other,
                              official, reviews.

                              So, after you get your two ORs in, you then need to get at least one
                              official test under your belt before you have a prayer at a "high
                              ticket" item.

                              That means you're at least 8 months away from being eligable. 6-
                              months of testing, plus a 2 month padding (MINIMUM) for that first
                              test to even begin (getting your second review in, seeing a test
                              call, applying for the test, being selected, receiving the product).

                              In this eight month period, if you think you can simply finish that
                              one test and have your next test be a high-ticket item, that's also a
                              LONG SHOT. You should be continuing to bulk up your credentials
                              during the probation period of your first official test by publishing
                              MORE Owner Reviews.

                              If you are applying and applying, but just not getting selected for
                              that first official test, by all means keep those Owner Reviews
                              coming. They do nothing but help your position!!!

                              I've been around for almost three years (Dec will be my
                              anniversary... start shopping :) and consider myself a successful BGT
                              participant. I still crank out the Owner Reviews, and continuously
                              have something in the works on my PC in addition to my official BGT
                              committments.

                              You can test just about anything you take into the woods with you.
                              It doesn't have to be EXPENSIVE. So, if you're lacking in ideas
                              think about items like a multi-tool, cup, bowl, pot, matches,
                              lighter, clothes, water bottle, sunscreen, soap, bandana, bandaids
                              (how well does your favorite stick when wet... when used over days
                              straight?)... you get the idea.

                              Patience is indeed key here! However, it still takes some work on
                              your part to use that key and unlock the door.

                              As you can see, if you want to get in on a sleeping bag test, it's
                              time to get cracking. There will be a lot of competition from other
                              testers... testers that have been around a long time and have a long
                              list of published work here. You too can join these ranks, but you
                              have to plan well in advance and be prepared for when that test call
                              eventually hits.

                              Make no mistake - you are in competition with your fellow testers.

                              In that respect, you can look at all of this as a game of chess...
                              but one where you start out with no pieces. It's kind of hard to
                              play without any pieces, let alone do well. So, you need to get
                              cracking and get some pieces. The first and second owner reports get
                              you a King. Great - you can move in any direction you want, but
                              often you can't move at all because, with only two ORs going up
                              against all your opponents (the other test applicants) pieces, you're
                              vulnerable. Any move against an opponent with just a few pieces will
                              result in check and mate!

                              At this lowly stage, you yourself can declare checkmate (get
                              selected) with just a king, to be sure, but you have to select your
                              opponents carefully. Look for the tests will few applicants, where a
                              high percentage of those applicants are newbies like you. King -vs-
                              King is better than King -vs- King, rook, and bishop, with four pawns
                              on the side.

                              Each official test you get in on AND COMPLETE is an upper level
                              piece - rook, knight, bishop... a high-level test (tent/sleeping bag)
                              is a queen.

                              Each OR that you publish is a pawn.

                              How many chess pieces will you need to aquire before you are ready to
                              play the BGT game effectively, playing against old-time testers who
                              have a large number of pieces?

                              Think about it...
                            • David Anderson
                              ... Not really. Evan has two, check the therm-a-rest ultralite. The search index only updates once a week, and sometimes the update process dies for various
                              Message 14 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                                At 06:43 PM 9/2/2003 +0000, you wrote:
                                >--- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, "Fuzzy" <ckime@n...> wrote:
                                > >
                                > > To Evan,
                                > >
                                > > Enthusiasm is good... just be careful not to go overboard. I think
                                > > it is fabulous that someone your age is so interested in the
                                > > outdoors, but you've gotta be careful about hounding the group to
                                > > test items that may not be available at all. As we like to say
                                > > around here (it's been said to me, believe me), "Patience,
                                > > Grasshopper" You will get your chance to test. When you do, work
                                > > with your monitor, write good reports, and polish up your
                                > > application skills - your chances wil come. Trust me.
                                > >
                                >
                                >Right - absolutely nothing wrong with enthusiasm. That said, looking
                                >at the BGT.org site, I see only one review from Evan - the Gregory
                                >Shasta backpack.
                                >
                                >Someone's getting WAY ahead of themselves here.

                                Not really. Evan has two, check the therm-a-rest ultralite.

                                The search index only updates once a week, and sometimes the update process
                                dies for various reasons, and it looks like it died on sunday. So it is not
                                uncommon for it to end up 2 weeks out of date.


                                --
                                David Anderson
                                Moderator
                                http://www.BackpackGearTest.org
                              • Andy Mytys
                                ... Well... that would explain things then. Thanks. Is the frequency of DB updates regulated by us or our service provider? Is there any incremental costs
                                Message 15 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                                  --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, David Anderson >
                                  >
                                  > Not really. Evan has two, check the therm-a-rest ultralite.
                                  >
                                  > The search index only updates once a week, and sometimes the update
                                  > process dies for various reasons, and it looks like it died on
                                  > sunday. So it is not uncommon for it to end up 2 weeks out of date.
                                  >

                                  Well... that would explain things then. Thanks.

                                  Is the frequency of DB updates regulated by us or our service
                                  provider? Is there any incremental costs for daily updates? How
                                  long does a DB update take?

                                  As for Evan... he's got a king then. Let the games begin! :)
                                • David Anderson
                                  ... Both. I set the frequency, but since we are on a shared host, the best way to get booted is to be a system resource hog. ... Only if we get booted. ... The
                                  Message 16 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                                    At 07:01 PM 9/2/2003 +0000, you wrote:
                                    >Is the frequency of DB updates regulated by us or our service
                                    >provider?

                                    Both. I set the frequency, but since we are on a shared host, the best way
                                    to get booted is to be a system resource hog.

                                    >Is there any incremental costs for daily updates?

                                    Only if we get booted.

                                    >How
                                    >long does a DB update take?

                                    The last time I ran one manually it took around 18 minutes and it greatly
                                    increased the amount of time it took the web server to serve up pages.

                                    If we were on our own server, there would be no problem. But we are not,
                                    and we need to be a good neighbor. In this case I run a cron job to di the
                                    update early Sunday morning.

                                    The truth is that once a week, or even once a month is often enough for
                                    99.99% of the cases. The only people that ever notice otherwise are the
                                    producers of the data that is not in the index. Before Google introduced
                                    freshbot, it would take 3-8 weeks or more for your web pages to make it in
                                    to Google, and Google made it to the top of the search engine ladder with
                                    such old data. The reason is that most data doesn't change that fast. Daily
                                    updates for the 0-5 uploaded reviews is just a waste of processor cycles.

                                    --
                                    David Anderson
                                    Moderator
                                    http://www.BackpackGearTest.org
                                  • Andy Mytys
                                    ... OK. It needs to be redone. There are two links at the bottom of the document, both pointing to accessories for the Therm-A-Rest on the CD website. We
                                    Message 17 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                                      --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, David Anderson
                                      <danderson@b...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Not really. Evan has two, check the therm-a-rest ultralite.
                                      >

                                      OK. It needs to be redone.

                                      There are two links at the bottom of the document, both pointing to
                                      accessories for the Therm-A-Rest on the CD website.

                                      We allow only top-level links at BGT!

                                      While Evan's got the hood open, I've got a few comments:

                                      "Sleeping on the Ultralite during this time, I got hot during the
                                      night, but I assume that was because I was using a twenty-five degree
                                      Fahrenheit (-3.8 degree Celsius) sleeping bag."

                                      I don't see how this statement adds any value to the report. If
                                      anything, it's an unresolved question that needs further analysis.
                                      I'd leave it out.


                                      "I have used the Ultralite a few times in the winter, and it kept me
                                      warm and comfortable"

                                      OK... I have to ask. What's "Winter"? There's not reference to
                                      temperature, nor is it stated if this was used on snow or not. I see
                                      you're in Ohio. If the "winter" described here were conditions along
                                      the Kentucky border, that would translate to "Fall" for me. You can
                                      see why it's important to have solid information as to the field
                                      conditions that are present with any statement you make. "Winter" in
                                      this case is good only as a calendar time reference... it gives me no
                                      idea of conditions.

                                      I'm not trying to pick on you here, just trying to iron out the
                                      wrinkles in your report. Hopefully, this will be a learning
                                      experience and your future reports will be filled with relavent data
                                      to give the reader an idea of your actual field experiences.

                                      Solid reports in turn give you better odds at getting selected as a
                                      tester.

                                      Looking at your first two submissions, I'm certainly excited to have
                                      you on board. Your work is definitely in the right direction - it
                                      just needs a bit of polishing.
                                    • Andy Mytys
                                      ... hmmm... this one s interesting too. Although the Survival Guide doesn t mention it, I feel that all our text representations of links should reflect what
                                      Message 18 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                                        --- In BackpackGearTest@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Mytys" <amytys@h...>
                                        wrote:

                                        > Manufacturers Website: http://www.thermarest.com

                                        hmmm... this one's interesting too.

                                        Although the Survival Guide doesn't mention it, I feel that all our
                                        text representations of links should reflect what actually comes out,
                                        not an alias.

                                        Yes, www.thermarest.com does work. However, the resulting address is
                                        actually "http://www.cascadedesigns.com/thermarest".

                                        IMO, that's what should be listed in the report. You never know what
                                        a manufacturer will do with their other aliases.

                                        What do the other "Net Weenies" around here think of this issue?

                                        Moving the BGTWeb!
                                      • AsABat
                                        ... is ... what a manufacturer will do with their other aliases. ... I think a little leeway might be needed. For example, Black Diamond has
                                        Message 19 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                                          > Yes, www.thermarest.com does work. However, the resulting address
                                          is
                                          > actually "http://www.cascadedesigns.com/thermarest".
                                          >
                                          > IMO, that's what should be listed in the report. You never know
                                          what a manufacturer will do with their other aliases.
                                          >
                                          > What do the other "Net Weenies" around here think of this issue?


                                          I think a little leeway might be needed. For example, Black Diamond
                                          has www.blackdiamondequipment.com and www.bdel.com . Their contact
                                          page shows email addresses with bdel.com but I've seen the longer URL
                                          on other documents. Second, anyone with a domain really needs to keep
                                          their addresses FOREVER or they'll become a sleaze site the day after
                                          the registration expires. Most businesses understand this and want to
                                          protect their trademarks.

                                          Bill
                                        • Shane Steinkamp
                                          ... Thank you, ma am. So noted. Shane Acting List Moderator
                                          Message 20 of 21 , Sep 2, 2003
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                                            > Actually, Michael Wheiler took the place of Andrew when
                                            > Andrew went on his long term OOP.

                                            Thank you, ma'am. So noted.

                                            Shane
                                            Acting List Moderator
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