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ES-1A Quick Shot

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  • cfamalette
    I guess I jinked it with my Database post! My machine is now pulling a shot in 3-4 seconds, and the pressure gage is bouncing from high to low several times
    Message 1 of 7 , Feb 24, 2009
      I guess I jinked it with my Database post!

      My machine is now pulling a shot in 3-4 seconds, and the pressure gage
      is bouncing from high to low several times during the shot. Any ideas?


      Chris
    • Robert Harmon
      Just a guess Chris, but the OPV in the pump may have crapped out? You d have to check the group pressure with a portafilter pressure gauge to find out. Tex
      Message 2 of 7 , Feb 24, 2009
        Just a guess Chris, but the OPV in the pump may have crapped out?
        You'd have to check the group pressure with a portafilter pressure
        gauge to find out.

        Tex

        --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@...> wrote:
        >
        > I guess I jinked it with my Database post!
        >
        > My machine is now pulling a shot in 3-4 seconds, and the pressure gage
        > is bouncing from high to low several times during the shot. Any ideas?
        >
        >
        > Chris
        >
      • cfamalette
        Made an adjustment to the pump. If the input pressure is around 9Bar it vibrates really hard. I reduced the pump pressure to 7 then brought it back up to 8,
        Message 3 of 7 , Feb 26, 2009
          Made an adjustment to the pump. If the input pressure is around 9Bar
          it vibrates really hard. I reduced the pump pressure to 7 then
          brought it back up to 8, 8.5 and all is well now. Double shot pulls
          in about 18 - 20 seconds with pre-infusion on.

          Will post pictures and a video of the machine soon!

          Chris

          --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Harmon"
          <Texas_Coffee@...> wrote:
          >
          > Just a guess Chris, but the OPV in the pump may have crapped out?
          > You'd have to check the group pressure with a portafilter pressure
          > gauge to find out.
          >
          > Tex
          >
          > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@>
          wrote:
          > >
          > > I guess I jinked it with my Database post!
          > >
          > > My machine is now pulling a shot in 3-4 seconds, and the pressure
          gage
          > > is bouncing from high to low several times during the shot. Any
          ideas?
          > >
          > >
          > > Chris
          > >
          >
        • Robert Harmon
          Where is the vibration coming from? Pump or auto-fill solenoid or ?? I m beginning to think that the solenoids used in the auto-fill circuit aren t strong
          Message 4 of 7 , Feb 26, 2009
            Where is the vibration coming from? Pump or auto-fill solenoid or ??

            I'm beginning to think that the solenoids used in the auto-fill
            circuit aren't strong enough. I'm thinking that the coil isn't
            generating a strong enough magnetic field to lift the valve piston
            completely out of the way, causing a hammering as the water forces its
            way past the partially opened valve.

            I've got an ASCO Red Hat solenoid valve left over from another
            project, that I'm going to be putting into the next ES-1A I rebuild.
            Actually, I think I'll rig a manual valve that will let me swap the
            feed to one solenoid valve or the other. That way I can measure the
            water pressure after the valve and check for fluctuations that might
            be caused by a weak coil.

            I know that someone else had a hammering problem, but I can't recall
            if David's problems went away after he put his rebuilt pump in or not.

            Good luck,
            Tex

            --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@...> wrote:
            >
            > Made an adjustment to the pump. If the input pressure is around 9Bar
            > it vibrates really hard. I reduced the pump pressure to 7 then
            > brought it back up to 8, 8.5 and all is well now. Double shot pulls
            > in about 18 - 20 seconds with pre-infusion on.
            >
            > Will post pictures and a video of the machine soon!
            >
            > Chris
            >
            > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Harmon"
            > <Texas_Coffee@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Just a guess Chris, but the OPV in the pump may have crapped out?
            > > You'd have to check the group pressure with a portafilter pressure
            > > gauge to find out.
            > >
            > > Tex
            > >
            > > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@>
            > wrote:
            > > >
            > > > I guess I jinked it with my Database post!
            > > >
            > > > My machine is now pulling a shot in 3-4 seconds, and the pressure
            > gage
            > > > is bouncing from high to low several times during the shot. Any
            > ideas?
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Chris
            > > >
            > >
            >
          • cfamalette
            The vibration was happening during the auto-fill and also when I pulled a shot. So far so good this morning! We have pulled 9 drinks from the machine this
            Message 5 of 7 , Feb 27, 2009
              The vibration was happening during the auto-fill and also when I
              pulled a shot. So far so good this morning! We have pulled 9 drinks
              from the machine this morning. I have it sitting next to a Rancilio
              S27 just incase we have another issue.

              When do you think you will mod the new soleniod, I am interested. I
              need to purchase a PID kit as well.

              Chris
              27 second shot pre-infusion on
              I will post some pictures this morning.



              --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Harmon"
              <Texas_Coffee@...> wrote:
              >
              > Where is the vibration coming from? Pump or auto-fill solenoid or ??
              >
              > I'm beginning to think that the solenoids used in the auto-fill
              > circuit aren't strong enough. I'm thinking that the coil isn't
              > generating a strong enough magnetic field to lift the valve piston
              > completely out of the way, causing a hammering as the water forces
              its
              > way past the partially opened valve.
              >
              > I've got an ASCO Red Hat solenoid valve left over from another
              > project, that I'm going to be putting into the next ES-1A I rebuild.
              > Actually, I think I'll rig a manual valve that will let me swap the
              > feed to one solenoid valve or the other. That way I can measure the
              > water pressure after the valve and check for fluctuations that might
              > be caused by a weak coil.
              >
              > I know that someone else had a hammering problem, but I can't recall
              > if David's problems went away after he put his rebuilt pump in or
              not.
              >
              > Good luck,
              > Tex
              >
              > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@>
              wrote:
              > >
              > > Made an adjustment to the pump. If the input pressure is around
              9Bar
              > > it vibrates really hard. I reduced the pump pressure to 7 then
              > > brought it back up to 8, 8.5 and all is well now. Double shot
              pulls
              > > in about 18 - 20 seconds with pre-infusion on.
              > >
              > > Will post pictures and a video of the machine soon!
              > >
              > > Chris
              > >
              > > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Harmon"
              > > <Texas_Coffee@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Just a guess Chris, but the OPV in the pump may have crapped
              out?
              > > > You'd have to check the group pressure with a portafilter
              pressure
              > > > gauge to find out.
              > > >
              > > > Tex
              > > >
              > > > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@>
              > > wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > I guess I jinked it with my Database post!
              > > > >
              > > > > My machine is now pulling a shot in 3-4 seconds, and the
              pressure
              > > gage
              > > > > is bouncing from high to low several times during the shot.
              Any
              > > ideas?
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Chris
              > > > >
              > > >
              > >
              >
            • Robert Harmon
              Howdy Chris! The rebuild of machine #2 (actually it s #3, but I only count those I still own) is on the slow but steady path. I wouldn t wait for the results
              Message 6 of 7 , Feb 27, 2009
                Howdy Chris!
                The rebuild of machine #2 (actually it's #3, but I only count those I
                still own) is on the slow but steady path. I wouldn't wait for the
                results to be posted - I was just tossing out some thoughts on the
                topic in passing. It just seemed to me that a lot of the noise from
                the machines had to be the result of restricted water flow, and the
                solenoid valve is the most logical culprit. Those coils are *very*
                small compared to ones I've seen in other applications.

                If you decide to PID your machine shoot me an email. Right now I've
                got a pretty big backlog for Bunn & Gaggia PID's (probably five week
                lead time is needed), so the sooner you add your name to the list the
                better!

                Tex

                --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@...> wrote:
                >
                > When do you think you will mod the new soleniod, I am interested. I
                > need to purchase a PID kit as well.
                >
                > Chris
              • dmankin
                Tex/Chris, Yes - as Tex reported, my ES-1A likes to do its jackhammer imitation from time to time. I replaced (rebuild) the pump a few months back, and it DID
                Message 7 of 7 , Feb 27, 2009
                  Tex/Chris,

                  Yes - as Tex reported, my ES-1A likes to do its jackhammer imitation
                  from time to time. I replaced (rebuild) the pump a few months back,
                  and it DID NOT solve the problem. Tex & I discussed this at length,
                  and both feel that the issue is with my refill solenoid. Perhaps
                  scale, old/worn internal spring... or maybe a beefier one should have
                  been built into the design in the 1st place. Not sure. It is ALWAYS
                  on a refill cycle, and is very sporadic - sometimes I don't hear it
                  for weeks. When this happens, I shut the machine off for a minute &
                  turn it back on - the refill will restart if the boiler still needs
                  water, and it usually will no longer make the noise.

                  It's on my list of things to do, but I haven't gotten there yet. Any
                  findings you guys come up with will definitely be appreciated!

                  Cheers,

                  David
                  +++++++++++++++++++++++++++

                  --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Harmon" <Texas_Coffee@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > Where is the vibration coming from? Pump or auto-fill solenoid or ??
                  >
                  > I'm beginning to think that the solenoids used in the auto-fill
                  > circuit aren't strong enough. I'm thinking that the coil isn't
                  > generating a strong enough magnetic field to lift the valve piston
                  > completely out of the way, causing a hammering as the water forces its
                  > way past the partially opened valve.
                  >
                  > I've got an ASCO Red Hat solenoid valve left over from another
                  > project, that I'm going to be putting into the next ES-1A I rebuild.
                  > Actually, I think I'll rig a manual valve that will let me swap the
                  > feed to one solenoid valve or the other. That way I can measure the
                  > water pressure after the valve and check for fluctuations that might
                  > be caused by a weak coil.
                  >
                  > I know that someone else had a hammering problem, but I can't recall
                  > if David's problems went away after he put his rebuilt pump in or not.
                  >
                  > Good luck,
                  > Tex
                  >
                  > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Made an adjustment to the pump. If the input pressure is around 9Bar
                  > > it vibrates really hard. I reduced the pump pressure to 7 then
                  > > brought it back up to 8, 8.5 and all is well now. Double shot pulls
                  > > in about 18 - 20 seconds with pre-infusion on.
                  > >
                  > > Will post pictures and a video of the machine soon!
                  > >
                  > > Chris
                  > >
                  > > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Harmon"
                  > > <Texas_Coffee@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > Just a guess Chris, but the OPV in the pump may have crapped out?
                  > > > You'd have to check the group pressure with a portafilter pressure
                  > > > gauge to find out.
                  > > >
                  > > > Tex
                  > > >
                  > > > --- In BUG-is-Bunn@yahoogroups.com, "cfamalette" <cfamalette@>
                  > > wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I guess I jinked it with my Database post!
                  > > > >
                  > > > > My machine is now pulling a shot in 3-4 seconds, and the pressure
                  > > gage
                  > > > > is bouncing from high to low several times during the shot. Any
                  > > ideas?
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Chris
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >
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