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Re: [BPQ32] Re: 9600 baud packet instability

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  • Bill Vodall
    ... What numbers would a good radio have? 1x10-6? Thanks, Bill
    Message 1 of 23 , Nov 16, 2012
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      > (DR-235 BER data per ARRL Lab results)
      >
      > Receiver:
      > BER at 12-dB SINAD, 3.8×10–3
      > BER at 16 dB SINAD, 1.4×10–4
      > BER at –50 dBm, 2.4×10–5
      > transmitter:
      > BER at 12-dB SINAD + 30 dB, 3.4×10–4

      What numbers would a good radio have? 1x10-6?

      Thanks,
      Bill
    • PE1RDW
      ... probably 0 but the only radio I ever found that has that is a converted analog cell phone like nokia morbia -- 73 Andre PE1RDW
      Message 2 of 23 , Nov 16, 2012
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        On Fri, 16 Nov 2012 21:15:32 +0100, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:

        >> (DR-235 BER data per ARRL Lab results)
        >>
        >> Receiver:
        >> BER at 12-dB SINAD, 3.8×10–3
        >> BER at 16 dB SINAD, 1.4×10–4
        >> BER at –50 dBm, 2.4×10–5
        >> transmitter:
        >> BER at 12-dB SINAD + 30 dB, 3.4×10–4
        >
        > What numbers would a good radio have? 1x10-6?
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Bill
        >
        probably 0 but the only radio I ever found that has that is a converted
        analog cell phone like nokia morbia

        --
        73 Andre PE1RDW
      • Jeff - WA4ZKO
        1.0x10-5 (or better) is good benchmark to look for on the RX BER at –50 dBm test and the TX BER at 12-dB SINAD+30 dB test. If a radio can t perform well at
        Message 3 of 23 , Nov 16, 2012
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          1.0x10-5 (or better) is good benchmark to look for on the RX BER at –50 dBm test and the TX "BER at 12-dB SINAD+30 dB" test. If a radio can't perform well at those levels then good luck with it on the 9.6k airwaves.

          http://wx4j.com/Radio-TNC9600bInfoC.htm

          A really good article by KE3Z in the May 1995 QST goes into BER testing details and what makes a good 9600 baud radio (or not). Unfortunately I don't think it's openly available on the internet.
          I might check to see if the ARRL would allow me to PDF it and post it publicly if there is enough interest.


          73
          Jeff
          WA4ZKO
          "Packet Radio never died, it just evolved."
          http://twitter.com/wa4zko

          --- In BPQ32@yahoogroups.com, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:
          >
          > > (DR-235 BER data per ARRL Lab results)
          > >
          > > Receiver:
          > > BER at 12-dB SINAD, 3.8×10–3
          > > BER at 16 dB SINAD, 1.4×10–4
          > > BER at –50 dBm, 2.4×10–5
          > > transmitter:
          > > BER at 12-dB SINAD + 30 dB, 3.4×10–4
          >
          > What numbers would a good radio have? 1x10-6?
          >
          > Thanks,
          > Bill
          >
        • Bill Vodall
          Thank you Jeff.. That s good info to keep on had. Bill
          Message 4 of 23 , Nov 16, 2012
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            Thank you Jeff.. That's good info to keep on had.

            Bill

            > 1.0x10-5 (or better) is good benchmark to look for on the RX BER at –50
            > dBm test and the TX "BER at 12-dB SINAD+30 dB" test. If a radio can't
            > perform well at those levels then good luck with it on the 9.6k airwaves.
            >
            > http://wx4j.com/Radio-TNC9600bInfoC.htm
          • Rick Nicholson
            That was with a Kantronics KPC-9612 and on a Timewave DSP-232USB. Rick/n9umj Sent from my iPhone
            Message 5 of 23 , Nov 16, 2012
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              That was with a Kantronics KPC-9612 and on a Timewave DSP-232USB. 

              Rick/n9umj


              Sent from my iPhone

              On Nov 16, 2012, at 11:31 AM, Bill Vodall <wa7nwp@...> wrote:

               

              > I agree totally, I've had the Dr235t in operation for a year and found its
              > performance on 9.6k nominal and unreliable as a backbone,
              > During heavy use the dr235t will distort the packets to the points they
              > cannot be decoded even at short distances.

              Is that with the built in 9k6 TNC or a "good" external TNC like the PK96?

              Thanks,
              Bill - WA7NWP

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