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Re: [BPQ32] Is John our single point of failure though?

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  • Ron Stordahl
    Yes I started worrying about this a year or so ago when John advised me of his sailing and where he did it! Being a land lubber and basically scared of big
    Message 1 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
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      Yes I started worrying about this a year or so ago when John advised me of his sailing and where he did it!  Being a land lubber and basically scared of big ocean waves I made this arrangement.  I appreciate that John is so rational!

      The point you make however, your reference to other widely used ham software, is well taken!  I am a satisfied user of DXBASE2007, with about 30,000 Q's in my log.  It came as a shock when the author announced just recently that he was closing his web site, stopping development and looking for a buyer for the project.  We have our fingers crossed that he will find someone!  We must realize that ham software won't keep food on the table, yet so many of us rely upon certain programs.

      Ron Stordahl, N5IN
       

      From: Bill V WA7NWP <wa7nwp@...>
      To: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Friday, August 7, 2009 2:23:56 PM
      Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Is John our single point of failure though?

       

      > John provides me with the source code for safekeeping, with the
      > understanding that it will kept secure, for the very reason you have noted!
      >
      > I hope I never need it!

      Amen!

      This is exactly the contingency plan we need. I wonder if any
      similar plans are in place for HRD, javaAprs and agwpe...

      Bill

    • Jerry - N9LYA
      Hi Jeff.. I was not implying anything about open sourcing it either.. Just used them as examples of a couple programs I saw go away or could go away with no
      Message 2 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
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        Hi Jeff.. I was not implying anything about open sourcing it either.. Just used them as examples of a couple programs I saw go away or could go away with no further development and one that could also go by the way side because they the WINLINK DEVELOPMENT Team keep it very very tight between the 4…

         

        Best 73 jerry n9lya

         

         

         

         


        From: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Thomas - WA4ZKO
        Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 12:52 PM
        To: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [BPQ32] Re: Is John our single point of failure though?

         

         

        I'm not advocating open sourcing it at all. I'm not an OS zealot at all. If someone wants to spend the time and effort to develope software and wish to be compensated for it...fine by me. If someone is altruistic enough to develop it and then open the source code up to the world...fine by me. Hope no one construed my message as going that route.

        You're right, most of the good stuff out there in ham radio software is written by one or a handful of individuals. The odds of loosing 4 developers at once is not nearly as high as loosing one. WinLink development doesn't bother me much, yeah there's other aspects of it's development that could be argued over, but that's not for here, grin.

        Guess I'm just looking at how popular BPQ32 is becoming and will become more so with a good modern BBS to run on top of it. Then I'm looking back at the history of so much of our packet networking software and how far to often that history plays out down the same path.

        Some like to say that packet radio is dead. I say baloney, it's just evolved over the years. Basically you have about 4 groups of folks in packet radio anymore:

        1. The experimenters just tinkering around. Some more serious than others. You could argue we need a lot more of this in our hobby.

        2. WinLink'ers - self explanatory.

        3. APRS - arguably the most successful facet of packet radio.

        4. the "networkers" that are building out what are essentially low speed, but useful networks with a focus on EmComm data needs.

        All 4 are perfectly legit pursuits and I'm not trying to glamorize one or dismiss another. They are what they are. Legit activity on our bands is a good thing, period.

        Group 1 probably doesn't worry about software longevity at all.

        Group 2 outside of the WinLink'ers that probably also fit into group #4, they probably don't worry either.

        Group 3 outside of maybe a few very special non-typical installations, I doubt they would worry about BPQ longevity.

        Group 4 are probably the folks that would have legit concerns about such stuff. They normally want to standardize upon one path and commit to it. They've seen what happened with TheNet, FlexNet, Texnet, Rose, and so on and have reasons to worry when looking out long term.

        Again, I'm not asking that the BPQ32 source be opened and public. I just figure we've got more than one programmer on this list. So maybe John would want to pick someone he trusts to help him out some and also be familiar enough with the BPQ32 source code and it's inherent development quirks that in his absence (for whatever the reason) there would be "plan b" in place to continue on.

        Just my thoughts. John obviously has the right to do as he pleases, not like he's being paid to do all this work ;-)

        We've got a lot of history and even recent events that (IMHO) makes this a great time to work this out or at least discuss it. Again, maybe it's already been taken care of.

        73
        Jeff
        WA4ZKO
        http://twitter. com/wa4zko

        --- In BPQ32@yahoogroups. com, "Jerry - N9LYA" <n9lya@...> wrote:

        >
        > Hi Jeff. I understand your concern. I also do not know what if any thing
        > John has done to that end.
        >
        >
        >
        > Same thing can be said of Most software. Winlink2k MSYS etc.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Winlink2k for example is maintained by 4 individuals. . It is
        proprietary and
        > if all 4 were in route to say an ARRL event and died in a fiery car/plane
        > crash. Winlink2K would be come outdated Immediately. .
        >
        >
        >
        > MSYS also proprietary, for example.. The Author has abandon it right after
        > the y2k fix.
        >
        >
        >
        > WL2K the question has been asked. But the answer was less then promising.
        >
        >
        >
        > MSYS the author made a decision to put it to bed.
        >
        >
        >
        > Neither of these were Open Source.. They both could continue in an
        > undeveloped unchanged unenhanced state for years as MSYS has.
        >
        >
        >
        > So a lot of things do depend on individuals hard core decisions..
        >
        >
        >
        > Again I do not know Johns thoughts on this subject.
        >
        >
        >
        > 73 jerry N9LYA
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > _____
        >
        > From: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com
        [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Jeff
        > Thomas
        > Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 10:41 AM
        > To: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com
        > Subject: [BPQ32] Is John our single point of failure though?
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Re: G8BPQ/GM8BPQ sailing and travels
        >
        > That's cool, I knew John spent a lot of time on the water/traveling.
        > Scotland is one of the places on my "bucket list" that I'd like
        to visit
        > someday, maybe when I retire (yeah right).
        >
        > No doubt, we're very lucky to have John. Where would packet radio networks
        > be today without his efforts. I think BPQ32 and one (maybe 2) of the DOS
        > TNOS/JNOS variants are the only packet node/switch software packages that
        > are still being developed/maintaine d today. God what I would give to
        have
        > FlexNet modernized and on Unix, grin. That said, this does bring up a
        > concern.
        >
        > Please don't misinterpret my intentions here...
        >
        > Is there anyone on here that is "programming savvy" and working
        alongside
        > John on all this BPQ stuff? If not, is John our potential single point of
        > failure? Has arrangements been made as to what will happen to the source
        > code if something happens to John?
        >
        > What, God forbid, if something happens to John? An accident? Or, as is
        > perfectly his right, he decides to move on from the BPQ stuff or ham radio
        > in general? It's only a hobby, yeah a hobby with a serious side to it at
        > times. That said, there is no guarantee that any of us will see the next
        > sunrise, grin.
        >
        > I guess that I worry that we might be too dependent upon one individual
        for
        > all these efforts and no "plan B" in place? The packet community
        in parts of
        > New England recently had to learn this lesson the hard way. There was a
        > single ham that many depended on for a lot of expertise and network (both
        IP
        > and RF) infrastructure over a pretty large area for several years. I'm not
        > going to go into details (it's personal stuff) but this lone ham suddenly
        > and without notice had to walk away from ham radio. The impact of his
        sudden
        > departure was felt far and wide (across states) and folks are still
        > scrambling around trying to rebuild or at least maintain things.
        >
        > Another good case in point, UI-View APRS software which hit a similar
        mess.
        > The software author passed away. If I recall correctly, the source code
        was
        > destroyed or was otherwise unavailable. The software remained available,
        but
        > all development/ maintenance hit the brick wall due no source code not
        being
        > available.
        >
        > Now do I offer up a fix, nope. You don't want me near a compiler, grin.
        >
        > Or has this already been thought of and addressed, thus a non-issue?
        >
        > Just a topic I felt worthy of touching upon while were on the topic of
        John
        > and how lucky we are to have him.
        >
        > 73
        > Jeff
        > WA4ZKO
        > http://twitter. <
        href="http://twitter.com/wa4zko">http://twitter. com/wa4zko> com/wa4zko
        >

      • Jerry - N9LYA
        Ron/John we all appreciate everything you guys and the group does here for BPQ32 and the Ham Radio World.. Got to be the best software I have ever seen for
        Message 3 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
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          Ron/John we all appreciate everything you guys  and the group does here for BPQ32 and the Ham Radio World.… Got to be the best software I have ever seen for these applications in Ham Radio and to see it still being developed is grand…..

           

           

          73 Jerry N9LYA

           

           


          From: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ron Stordahl
          Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 3:36 PM
          To: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Is John our single point of failure though?

           

           

          Yes I started worrying about this a year or so ago when John advised me of his sailing and where he did it!  Being a land lubber and basically scared of big ocean waves I made this arrangement.  I appreciate that John is so rational!

          The point you make however, your reference to other widely used ham software, is well taken!  I am a satisfied user of DXBASE2007, with about 30,000 Q's in my log.  It came as a shock when the author announced just recently that he was closing his web site, stopping development and looking for a buyer for the project.  We have our fingers crossed that he will find someone!  We must realize that ham software won't keep food on the table, yet so many of us rely upon certain programs.

          Ron Stordahl, N5IN
           

           

          From: Bill V WA7NWP <wa7nwp@gmail. com>
          To: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com
          Sent: Friday, August 7, 2009 2:23:56 PM
          Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Is John our single point of failure though?

           

          > John provides me with the source code for safekeeping, with the
          > understanding that it will kept secure, for the very reason you have noted!
          >
          > I hope I never need it!

          Amen!

          This is exactly the contingency plan we need. I wonder if any
          similar plans are in place for HRD, javaAprs and agwpe...

          Bill

        • Bill V WA7NWP
          ... Didn t they promise to put the wl2k code in escrow as part of the agreement to use it as the standard for ARES? Bill
          Message 4 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
          • 0 Attachment
            > one that could also go by the way side
            > because they the WINLINK DEVELOPMENT Team keep it very very tight between
            > the 4…
            >
            > Best 73 jerry n9lya

            Didn't they promise to put the wl2k code in escrow as part of the
            agreement to use it as the standard for ARES?

            Bill
          • Jerry - N9LYA
            Hi Bill.. They very well may have... My information is from back in 2004 or so... When it was clearly stated that they felt such a thing could not possibly
            Message 5 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
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              Hi Bill.. They very well may have... My information is from back in 2004 or
              so... When it was clearly stated that they felt such a thing could not
              possibly happen to all 4 at the same time... And there was no need to
              worry..
              Yes that very well could have changed since then..





              73 Jerry N9LYA

              -----Original Message-----
              From: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bill
              V WA7NWP
              Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 3:56 PM
              To: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Re: Is John our single point of failure though?

              > one that could also go by the way side
              > because they the WINLINK DEVELOPMENT Team keep it very very tight between
              > the 4.
              >
              > Best 73 jerry n9lya

              Didn't they promise to put the wl2k code in escrow as part of the
              agreement to use it as the standard for ARES?

              Bill


              ------------------------------------

              Yahoo! Groups Links
            • Jerry - N9LYA
              Let me be clear no ill will meant towards the WL2K dev team.. It is again their decision to deal with such as they see fit and I was only going on what I was
              Message 6 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
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                Let me be clear no ill will meant towards the WL2K dev team.. It is again
                their decision to deal with such as they see fit and I was only going on
                what I was told directly several years ago.. When questioning what would we
                do in the event the Proprietary software was to no longer have developers..
                for any reason..
                73 jerry n9lya

                -----Original Message-----
                From: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bill
                V WA7NWP
                Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 3:56 PM
                To: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Re: Is John our single point of failure though?

                > one that could also go by the way side
                > because they the WINLINK DEVELOPMENT Team keep it very very tight between
                > the 4.
                >
                > Best 73 jerry n9lya

                Didn't they promise to put the wl2k code in escrow as part of the
                agreement to use it as the standard for ARES?

                Bill


                ------------------------------------

                Yahoo! Groups Links
              • David Wagner WA2DXQ
                The WL2K team made a deal with the ARRL to hold the source code in case the team decides to stop.. There has been no announcement that it changed. Dave
                Message 7 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
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                  The WL2K team made a deal with the ARRL to hold  the source code in case the team decides to stop..   There has been no
                  announcement that it changed.
                   
                  Dave
                   
                   
                   
                  Original Message -----
                  Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 4:16 PM
                  Subject: RE: [BPQ32] Re: Is John our single point of failure though?

                   

                  Hi Bill.. They very well may have... My information is from back in 2004 or
                  so... When it was clearly stated that they felt such a thing could not
                  possibly happen to all 4 at the same time... And there was no need to
                  worry..
                  Yes that very well could have changed since then..

                  73 Jerry N9LYA

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Bill
                  V WA7NWP
                  Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 3:56 PM
                  To: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com
                  Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Re: Is John our single point of failure though?

                  > one that could also go by the way side
                  > because they the WINLINK DEVELOPMENT Team keep it very very tight between
                  > the 4.
                  >
                  > Best 73 jerry n9lya

                  Didn't they promise to put the wl2k code in escrow as part of the
                  agreement to use it as the standard for ARES?

                  Bill

                  ------------ --------- --------- ------

                  Yahoo! Groups Links

                • Jerry - N9LYA
                  Hi David.. That is wonderful.. I also know in the beginning there was no input requested by the WL2K team and none accepted, No Alpha testing no beta testing
                  Message 8 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
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                    Hi David.. That is wonderful.. I also know in the beginning there was no input requested by the WL2K team and none accepted, No Alpha testing no beta testing outside of the team.  … Glad to see that the original stance ie 2004 was changed..

                     

                    I see they beta tested some recent releases over the last year or so.…  That is good to see…

                     

                    73 jerry

                     


                    From: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of David Wagner WA2DXQ
                    Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 4:25 PM
                    To: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Re: Is John our single point of failure though?

                     

                     

                    The WL2K team made a deal with the ARRL to hold  the source code in case the team decides to stop..   There has been no

                    announcement that it changed.

                     

                    Dave

                     

                     

                     

                    Original Message -----

                    Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 4:16 PM

                    Subject: RE: [BPQ32] Re: Is John our single point of failure though?

                     

                     

                    Hi Bill.. They very well may have... My information is from back in 2004 or
                    so... When it was clearly stated that they felt such a thing could not
                    possibly happen to all 4 at the same time... And there was no need to
                    worry..
                    Yes that very well could have changed since then..

                    73 Jerry N9LYA

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Bill
                    V WA7NWP
                    Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 3:56 PM
                    To: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com
                    Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Re: Is John our single point of failure though?

                    > one that could also go by the way side
                    > because they the WINLINK DEVELOPMENT Team keep it very very tight between
                    > the 4.
                    >
                    > Best 73 jerry n9lya

                    Didn't they promise to put the wl2k code in escrow as part of the
                    agreement to use it as the standard for ARES?

                    Bill

                    ------------ --------- --------- ------

                    Yahoo! Groups Links

                  • JJ
                    ... And there is Maiko, ve4klm, who is doing stellar work with jnos, both windows and linux (64-bit version not prime-time yet), and has done some work towards
                    Message 9 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Jerry - N9LYA wrote:
                       

                      Hi Jeff… I understand your concern… I also do not know what if any thing John has done to that end…

                       

                      Same thing can be said of Most software… Winlink2k MSYS etc…

                       

                       

                      Winlink2k for example is maintained by 4 individuals. . It is proprietary and if all 4 were in route to say an ARRL event and died in a fiery car/plane crash… Winlink2K would be come outdated Immediately. .

                       

                      MSYS also proprietary,  for example.. The Author has abandon it right after the y2k fix…

                       

                      WL2K the question has been asked… But the answer was less then promising…

                       

                      MSYS the author made a decision to put it to bed…

                       

                      Neither of these were Open Source.. They both could continue in an undeveloped unchanged unenhanced state for years as MSYS has…

                       

                      So a lot of things do depend on individuals hard core decisions..

                       

                      Again I do not know Johns thoughts on this subject…

                       

                      73 jerry N9LYA

                       

                       


                      From: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com [mailto:BPQ32@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Jeff Thomas
                      Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 10:41 AM
                      To: BPQ32@yahoogroups. com
                      Subject: [BPQ32] Is John our single point of failure though?

                       

                       

                      Re: G8BPQ/GM8BPQ sailing and travels

                      That's cool, I knew John spent a lot of time on the water/traveling. Scotland is one of the places on my "bucket list" that I'd like to visit someday, maybe when I retire (yeah right).

                      No doubt, we're very lucky to have John. Where would packet radio networks be today without his efforts. I think BPQ32 and one (maybe 2) of the DOS TNOS/JNOS variants are the only packet node/switch software packages that are still being developed/maintaine d today. God what I would give to have FlexNet modernized and on Unix, grin. That said, this does bring up a concern.

                      Please don't misinterpret my intentions here...

                      Is there anyone on here that is "programming savvy" and working alongside John on all this BPQ stuff? If not, is John our potential single point of failure? Has arrangements been made as to what will happen to the source code if something happens to John?

                      What, God forbid, if something happens to John? An accident? Or, as is perfectly his right, he decides to move on from the BPQ stuff or ham radio in general? It's only a hobby, yeah a hobby with a serious side to it at times. That said, there is no guarantee that any of us will see the next sunrise, grin.

                      I guess that I worry that we might be too dependent upon one individual for all these efforts and no "plan B" in place? The packet community in parts of New England recently had to learn this lesson the hard way. There was a single ham that many depended on for a lot of expertise and network (both IP and RF) infrastructure over a pretty large area for several years. I'm not going to go into details (it's personal stuff) but this lone ham suddenly and without notice had to walk away from ham radio. The impact of his sudden departure was felt far and wide (across states) and folks are still scrambling around trying to rebuild or at least maintain things.

                      Another good case in point, UI-View APRS software which hit a similar mess. The software author passed away. If I recall correctly, the source code was destroyed or was otherwise unavailable. The software remained available, but all development/ maintenance hit the brick wall due no source code not being available.

                      Now do I offer up a fix, nope. You don't want me near a compiler, grin.

                      Or has this already been thought of and addressed, thus a non-issue?

                      Just a topic I felt worthy of touching upon while were on the topic of John and how lucky we are to have him.

                      73
                      Jeff
                      WA4ZKO
                      http://twitter. com/wa4zko

                      And there is Maiko, ve4klm, who is doing stellar work with jnos, both windows and linux (64-bit version not prime-time yet), and has done some work towards a gui for jnos too...//j
                      Cheers,
                      John

                    • Mike Melnik
                      Hello Guy s Ron N5IN has the source code for the BPQ32 Switch and BPQ-MAILCHAT Server The BPQ-BBS will be fully compatible with WL2K Programs Like RMS, I have
                      Message 10 of 16 , Aug 7, 2009
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Hello Guy's

                        Ron N5IN has the source code for the BPQ32 Switch
                        and BPQ-MAILCHAT Server The BPQ-BBS will be fully compatible
                        with WL2K Programs Like RMS, I have already tested It with
                        RMS, works Fine.

                        Mike Melnik N9PMO
                        Web Site: www.n9pmo.com
                        Moderator: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BPQ32
                         
                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of JJ
                        Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 11:44 PM
                        To: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [BPQ32] Is John our single point of failure though?

                         
                        Jerry - N9LYA wrote:
                         
                        Hi Jeff… I understand your concern… I also do not know what if any thing
                        John has done to that end…
                         
                        Same thing can be said of Most software… Winlink2k MSYS etc…
                         
                         
                        Winlink2k for example is maintained by 4 individuals.. It is proprietary and
                        if all 4 were in route to say an ARRL event and died in a fiery car/plane
                        crash… Winlink2K would be come outdated Immediately..
                         
                        MSYS also proprietary,  for example.. The Author has abandon it right after
                        the y2k fix…
                         
                        WL2K the question has been asked… But the answer was less then promising…
                         
                        MSYS the author made a decision to put it to bed…
                         
                        Neither of these were Open Source.. They both could continue in an
                        undeveloped unchanged unenhanced state for years as MSYS has…
                         
                        So a lot of things do depend on individuals hard core decisions..
                         
                        Again I do not know Johns thoughts on this subject…
                         
                        73 jerry N9LYA
                         
                         

                        From: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com [mailto:BPQ32@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jeff
                        Thomas
                        Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 10:41 AM
                        To: BPQ32@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: [BPQ32] Is John our single point of failure though?
                         
                         
                        Re: G8BPQ/GM8BPQ sailing and travels

                        That's cool, I knew John spent a lot of time on the water/traveling.
                        Scotland is one of the places on my "bucket list" that I'd like to visit
                        someday, maybe when I retire (yeah right).

                        No doubt, we're very lucky to have John. Where would packet radio networks
                        be today without his efforts. I think BPQ32 and one (maybe 2) of the DOS
                        TNOS/JNOS variants are the only packet node/switch software packages that
                        are still being developed/maintained today. God what I would give to have
                        FlexNet modernized and on Unix, grin. That said, this does bring up a
                        concern.

                        Please don't misinterpret my intentions here...

                        Is there anyone on here that is "programming savvy" and working alongside
                        John on all this BPQ stuff? If not, is John our potential single point of
                        failure? Has arrangements been made as to what will happen to the source
                        code if something happens to John?


                        What, God forbid, if something happens to John? An accident? Or, as is
                        perfectly his right, he decides to move on from the BPQ stuff or ham radio
                        in general? It's only a hobby, yeah a hobby with a serious side to it at
                        times. That said, there is no guarantee that any of us will see the next
                        sunrise, grin.

                        I guess that I worry that we might be too dependent upon one individual for
                        all these efforts and no "plan B" in place? The packet community in parts of
                        New England recently had to learn this lesson the hard way. There was a
                        single ham that many depended on for a lot of expertise and network (both IP
                        and RF) infrastructure over a pretty large area for several years. I'm not
                        going to go into details (it's personal stuff) but this lone ham suddenly
                        and without notice had to walk away from ham radio. The impact of his sudden
                        departure was felt far and wide (across states) and folks are still
                        scrambling around trying to rebuild or at least maintain things.

                        Another good case in point, UI-View APRS software which hit a similar mess.
                        The software author passed away. If I recall correctly, the source code was
                        destroyed or was otherwise unavailable. The software remained available, but
                        all development/maintenance hit the brick wall due no source code not being
                        available.

                        Now do I offer up a fix, nope. You don't want me near a compiler, grin.

                        Or has this already been thought of and addressed, thus a non-issue?

                        Just a topic I felt worthy of touching upon while were on the topic of John
                        and how lucky we are to have him.

                        73
                        Jeff
                        WA4ZKO
                        http://twitter.com/wa4zko
                        And there is Maiko, ve4klm, who is doing stellar work with jnos, both
                        windows and linux (64-bit version not prime-time yet), and has done some
                        work towards a gui for jnos too...//j
                        Cheers,
                        John
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