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Re: [BCD396XT] Re: Antenna Options for my BCD396XT

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  • Tony Langdon
    ... If you need directionality and bandwidth, a TV antenna is a good choice. Still doesn t have the gain of a monoband antenna of the same number of elements,
    Message 1 of 46 , May 1, 2013
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      On 2/05/13 11:50 AM, Urkle wrote:
      > I have been using a directional multi-frequency Yagi-style TV antenna and it picks up fantastic and it's only 50 feet from ground to tip. I live about 60 miles from Madison, and over 75 miles from Chicago and I pick up quite a bit of their radio traffic. It's not crystal clear, but it's there, and I have no difficulty understanding what they're saying. You can pick them up on eBay for around $65. Cheaper alternative perhaps, and gives you the option for directional reception....
      If you need directionality and bandwidth, a TV antenna is a good
      choice. Still doesn't have the gain of a monoband antenna of the same
      number of elements, but there is useful gain from VHF through to 800 MHz
      (assuming a VHF/UHF antenna).

      --
      73 de Tony VK3JED
      http://vkradio.com
    • MICHAEL BENNETT
      How did your discone perform across all the bands? I bought an AUSTIN Ferrett for wideband reception but that was a total waste of money. ... [Non-text
      Message 46 of 46 , May 9, 2013
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        How did your discone perform across all the bands? I bought an AUSTIN
        Ferrett for wideband reception but that was a total waste of money.

        On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 8:53 PM, John Stark <johnstark@...> wrote:

        > **
        >
        >
        > I do not have a lot of $$ but I still manage to have a really good setup
        > of scanners and antenna's. But I shop around and get the best possible
        > price as well. One 800mhz yagi I paid $10 for at a hamfest. Another I paid
        > $35 new. The only antenna I splurged on was the discone for $149. my setup
        > uses LMR400 for all antennas except one and it uses hard line that a Ham
        > gave to me. Each coax has lightning arrestors and multiple ground rods.
        > From the time I buy an antenna to the time it goes up it could be six
        > months before its working due to financial issues. Point being anyone can
        > have a nice antenna farm if they plan it out and do it as they can afford
        > to.
        > Oh and a tip for those cementing poles or towers in the ground. Make
        > certain you do not put the ground rod(s) too close to the concrete as it
        > can cause the concrete to explode! I have seen two so far that did explode
        > and the towers came crashing down.
        >
        > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID
        >
        > Mark Mitchell <mdmitchell65@...> wrote:
        >
        > >with all due respect, I seriously doubt it. but what do I know if you have
        > >a couple of extra dollars to spend you could try experimenting and then
        > >you wouldn't have to keep beating on yourself wondering if it was possible
        > >or not...after all that is how Edison discovered electricity.
        > > however, you want to keep in mind that when you get ready to sell the
        > >antenna not to expect the going price as most will want a bargain after
        > all
        > >it is used.
        > >Now what you could do is have the pro-96, 97, 95, 92 or what ever you have
        > >that is capable of receiving Springfield and carry it with when you come
        > >to town and when your at home you could stream it from radioreference.
        > >Theory is that you get better reception from a antenna tuned to the proper
        > >frequency but when you are scanning various bands it certainly wouldn't
        > pay
        > >to buy that many antennas so hence the all-band or multi-band antenna.
        > >another thing to consider when putting up a antenna is that a mast needs
        > to
        > >have guy wires every ten foot.
        > >
        > >
        > >On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Preston Ward <ppreston69@...>
        > wrote:
        > >
        > >> **
        > >>
        > >>
        > >> Joe,
        > >>
        > >> APCO-25 signals, for one... (I think)... which is what the city of
        > Joplin
        > >> runs, and the 400 & 800 mhz range too I believe. But I wouldn't swear to
        > >> it. I really don't know much about them either. That's why I'm here...
        > to
        > >> try to find out more about the 396XT. Because it's the only thing that
        > >> will get Joplin. At least AFAIK anyway.
        > >> Each time I got a scanner (Pro-34, 96 & 97) I was told they would pick
        > up
        > >> Joplin city. Now I finally have one that'll pick it up. Each time I got
        > >> one I took it to RS and they programmed it with all the local
        > frequencies
        > >> but they'd never work for me in picking up the local Joplin calls, just
        > the
        > >> local county sheriffs, highway patrol, and rural fire depts. And when
        > they
        > >> wouldn't work for what I wanted I just lost interest in them.
        > >>
        > >>
        > >>
        > >> --- On Mon, 5/6/13, MCH <mch@...> wrote:
        > >>
        > >> From: MCH <mch@...>
        > >> Subject: Re: [BCD396XT] Antenna Options for my BCD396XT
        > >> To: BCD396XT@yahoogroups.com
        > >> Date: Monday, May 6, 2013, 5:38 PM
        > >>
        > >>
        > >> The nulling would occur no matter where you combine the antennas - be it
        > >> at the base of them or at the end of the feedline. What are the types of
        > >> signals the 396 picks up that the 96 does not?
        > >>
        > >> Joe M.
        > >>
        > >> Preston Ward wrote:
        > >> > Hmm... very interesting about Polyphaser. I can disconnect the
        > >> antenna(s) when there's lightning around, but being that I'm in Tornado
        > >> Alley, we often have thunderstorms that will sneak up on us, sometimes
        > when
        > >> I'm asleep too. And those are the ones I wonder & worry about.
        > >> >
        > >> > I just realized something though... I'm thinking about running two
        > >> cables from an omnidirectional and a directional antenna, but I only
        > have
        > >> one scanner that picks up both the local AND Springfield signals (the
        > >> BCD396XT), which are in the 400 and 800mhz range. Although I could
        > attach
        > >> one cable to my Pro-96 or Pro-97, they're not going to pick up the local
        > >> city PD or Springfield PD or FD. So my only option would be to combine
        > >> both antennas into one line and plug it into my BCD396XT. But doing that
        > >> might cancel out the signals due to phasing issues(?). So now I'm
        > confused
        > >> and don't know what to do...
        > >> > Decisions decisions...
        > >> > Now I'm thinking what I may do it get an omnidirectional discone for
        > the
        > >> local city signals and a yagi to try to pick up the PD and FD from
        > >> Springfield. Or the other (maybe even better) option would be to get a
        > >> discone and a TV antenna like what I just posted a while ago and use
        > that
        > >> as a directional wideband antenna to Springfield...
        > >> >
        > >> > -pw
        > >> >
        > >> > P.S: I'm going through my message chronologically and am doing my best
        > >> to catch up, so apologies to everyone if I say something that's out of
        > >> phase in the flow of the conversation. Also, I have some memory issues
        > >> stemming from health probs, so I sincerely apologize in advance to
        > everyone
        > >> if I forget about something that's already been covered or said before.
        > If
        > >> you catch me doing this, just remind me rather than think I'm not paying
        > >> attention.
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > --- On Mon, 5/6/13, MCH <mch@...> wrote:
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > From: MCH <mch@...>
        > >> > Subject: Re: [BCD396XT] Antenna Options for my BCD396XT
        > >> > To: BCD396XT@yahoogroups.com
        > >> > Date: Monday, May 6, 2013, 8:54 AM
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > If you can't disconnect the antennas, Polyphaser makes some awesome
        > >> > lightning protection devices. I've used them at many installations
        > that
        > >> > have to remain on the air 24/7/365.
        > >> >
        > >> > Many years ago (pre-polyphaser) I had an installation on the air
        > about 1
        > >> > week before lightning did about $2000 worth of damage. At the same
        > >> > installation, post-Polyphaser, I haven't had more than about $20 in
        > >> > damage ever since that strike. (And the lightning hit counter has
        > >> > recorded several hundred strikes.)
        > >> >
        > >> > Joe M.
        > >> >
        > >> > Michael Hopkins wrote:
        > >> >> Antennas:
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Sounds to me like a fun experiment � I don�t think SWR or impedance
        > is
        > >> going
        > >> >> to be an issue�these don�t matter much for receiving � but what will
        > >> matter
        > >> >> is phasing. In other words, if the signal from both antennas gets to
        > the
        > >> >> radio being exactly out of phase and at the same amplitude, they will
        > >> cancel
        > >> >> and if the signal arrives at the radio in phase from both antennas,
        > they
        > >> >> will add and you�ll get a stronger signal. Lots of antenna designs
        > use
        > >> >> phasing to produce gain and/or directivity at certain frequencies and
        > >> it can
        > >> >> be achieved by feedline lengths, antenna element placement or both.
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >> You might find it works fine or you might find it doesn�t work well,
        > but
        > >> >> likely it will be good as some frequencies and lousy on others �
        > >> impossible
        > >> >> to predict without analysis of exact placements, feedline lengths,
        > etc�
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Lightning suppression:
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Having evaluated lightning protection devices and schemes for 30
        > years,
        > >> I
        > >> >> can tell you the best solution is to disconnect the feedline into the
        > >> >> building during thunderstorms. My antennas all come down to a
        > connector
        > >> >> block mounted on my garage wall so that I can easily disconnect the
        > >> feedline
        > >> >> inside. The plate where the connectors come in is grounded to an 8
        > foot
        > >> >> ground rod via a � inch braid (available at radio shack or on-line).
        > Be
        > >> >> careful to make sure this ground is also connected to you
        > house/building
        > >> >> ground so that you don�t have two separate grounds (during a
        > lightning
        > >> >> strike you can get significant voltages between two grounds). You
        > could
        > >> use
        > >> >> #10 or bigger wire but since lightning currents will only flow on the
        > >> >> surface of the wire, solid or stranded won�t matter.
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Good luck --- love to know how the experiment works out..
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Mike Hopkins K1VLB
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Mhopkins735@...
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >> From: BCD396XT@yahoogroups.com [mailto:BCD396XT@yahoogroups.com] On
        > >> Behalf
        > >> >> Of Preston Ward
        > >> >> Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 3:28 PM
        > >> >> To: BCD396XT@yahoogroups.com
        > >> >> Subject: Re: [BCD396XT] Antenna Options for my BCD396XT
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Great info... thanks a bunch! (and to everyone who replied to me)
        > >> >> I guess what I'm thinking now is maybe I should put up a discone for
        > >> local
        > >> >> wiseband scanning and a directional TV antenna or narrowband
        > >> directional(s)
        > >> >> for those signals that are 70-75 miles away which I believe are in
        > 154
        > >> and
        > >> >> 460 mhz ranges. I think log periodic antennas may be out of my price
        > >> range
        > >> >> though. Is there any reason I couldn't wire two or more antennas
        > >> together
        > >> >> in a splitter and have the signals combine into one cable? Or would
        > it
        > >> be
        > >> >> better to set up two scanners and use two cable runs from the mast?
        > >> >>
        > >> >> And then there's the issue of lightning suppression too... like what
        > >> type of
        > >> >> wire to get for a ground wire?, where it's supposed to attach to the
        > >> >> antenna(s)?, and if this would be sufficient for in-line protection?
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Also, for a 50-60' cable run, is the thicker cable going to be all
        > that
        > >> >> noticeable? (I think what I'm talking about is LMR400 vs RG58 -- but
        > >> don't
        > >> >> hold me to it because don't know what I'm talking about here - LOL.
        > >> It's
        > >> >> been over 35 years since I've been into radio stuff and I'm
        > overwhelmed
        > >> with
        > >> >> all the changes. Which brings me to the BCD396XT. Talk about being
        > >> >> overwhelmed... I had no idea how complicated this is. Last time I was
        > >> >> really in to scanners I was using crystals. The antenna thing I think
        > >> I can
        > >> >> figure out what to do... the Uniden on the other hand, that may be a
        > >> >> different story. A lot of the stuff in the manual is like a different
        > >> >> language to me...
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Thanks again for all the help.
        > >> >>
        > >> >> --- On Wed, 5/1/13, Tony Langdon <vk3jed@...
        > >> >> <mailto:vk3jed%40vkradio.com> > wrote:
        > >> >>
        > >> >> From: Tony Langdon <vk3jed@... <mailto:vk3jed%40vkradio.com>
        > >
        > >> >> Subject: Re: [BCD396XT] Antenna Options for my BCD396XT
        > >> >> To: BCD396XT@yahoogroups.com <mailto:BCD396XT%40yahoogroups.com>
        > >> >> Date: Wednesday, May 1, 2013, 7:39 PM
        > >> >>
        > >> >> On 2/05/13 7:30 AM, Preston Ward wrote:
        > >> >>> I'm looking to get a wideband omnidirectional base antenna too. I'm
        > >> going
        > >> >> to put it 30-35' up. Anyway, I'm considering 4 models... does anyone
        > >> have
        > >> >> any opinions on which one of these might be better?:
        > >> >> Normally I'd say one of the better discones, unless your interests
        > are
        > >> >> limited to a specific band. I can comment on your suggestions, as I
        > >> >> don't know those antennas.
        > >> >>>
        > >> >>> Ideally, I'd like to be able to pick up one city 75 miles away, but
        > I
        > >> >> still want to go with an omnidirectional at least for now.
        > >> >> Unless you're on a decent hill or mountain, your goals may be in
        > >> >> conflict. There is generally a tradeoff between gain, bandwidth (as
        > >> >> whether it covers a single band or is wideband) and directionality.
        > >> >> You're demanding at least 2 of those, if not all 3.
        > >> >>
        > >> >> The most likely antenna to get those signals from 75 miles away is a
        > >> >> directional antenna cut for a specific band. This focuses the signals
        > >> >> from one direction, and utilises all of the elements to contribute to
        > >> >> the gain.
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Omnidirectional antennas have to try to form a radiation pattern that
        > >> >> looks like a pancake, which means it focuses all of its attention on
        > >> the
        > >> >> horizon. But even then, that volume of space is larger than the
        > >> >> directional case above, so the maximum possible gain is lower.
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Finally, a lot of broadband antennas don't use all of their radiating
        > >> >> elements on any given frequency, so these have even less ability to
        > >> >> focus the signals. However, that is compensated for by their
        > extremely
        > >> >> wide bandwidth. You can get directional wideband antennas (e.g. a log
        > >> >> periodic), but their gain is a lot less than a Yagi or other
        > narrowband
        > >> >> antenna cut for a specific frequency in the range covered.
        > >> >>
        > >> >> It may be that you either have to install 2 antennas and switch
        > between
        > >> >> them, or run 2 scanners (maybe one of them can be a cheap scanner).
        > >> >>
        > >> >> Or move to a mountain midway between your target areas! ;)
        > >> >>
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > ------------------------------------
        > >> >
        > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > ------------------------------------
        > >> >
        > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > ----------------------------------------------------------
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > No virus found in this incoming message.
        > >> > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
        > >> > Version: 9.0.932 / Virus Database: 3164.1.1/5802 - Release Date:
        > >> 05/06/13 02:10:00
        > >> >
        > >>
        > >> ------------------------------------
        > >>
        > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
        > >>
        > >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >>
        > >>
        > >>
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >--
        > >Mark ~
        > >
        > >
        > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >------------------------------------
        > >
        > >Yahoo! Groups Links
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >


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