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Re: [Authentic_SCA] documentation suggestions?

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  • Folo Watkins
    Our society AO just made a recent ruling outlawing most lined cloaks, noting that fur-lined cloaks date to late in our period (11-12C) and are restricted to
    Message 1 of 12 , Mar 15, 2010
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      Our society AO just made a recent ruling outlawing most lined cloaks,
      noting that fur-lined cloaks date to late in our period (11-12C) and
      are restricted to posh impressions. On
      http://www.regia.org/members/basclot3.htm, RolandWilliamson writer
      notes "There are, however, a few vague references to a leather or fur
      lined 'Thorax' (chest covering) being worn." Ironically there is a
      Vikes document that refers to a 9C woman's grave find in Scandinavia
      that held a beaver-fur garment lined with whast they think is hemp
      cloth, but I doubt if that is of interest to your research :)

      At http://www.larsdatter.com/cloaks.htm, they note:
      "'ROYAL' CLOAK: I'm still deciding whether I want to include these as
      a category. Frequently has a fur capelet (cowl?) over a fur-lined
      cloak (with apparent opening on the right-hand side), usually also
      fur-lined. Fur is frequently ermine. Seems to appear only on men; in
      the 15th century, this evolves into a ceremonial-only garment for
      kings and noblemen. It may, in that way, be the men's equivalent of
      the sideless surcoat."
      but include no illustrations.

      Although there are a number of secondary references to fur-lined
      cloaks, The only example I can find with a quick search is an
      illustration of St. Michael fro the 15C, at
      http://www.claveringonline.org.uk/Local%20History/medieval_glass_in_clavering_chur.htm

      Hope this gives you at least some places to start looking. If you
      have ever decide to do an 8CV Quaker, I did find a great reference :)

      Cheers, Folo
      www.micelfol;cland.org
    • Catherine Olanich Raymond
      On Monday 15 March 2010 11:49:46 pm Folo Watkins wrote: On ... It s interesting to me, though. What document? Where was the grave located? Any citations you
      Message 2 of 12 , Mar 16, 2010
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        On Monday 15 March 2010 11:49:46 pm Folo Watkins wrote:
        On
        > http://www.regia.org/members/basclot3.htm, RolandWilliamson writer
        > notes "There are, however, a few vague references to a leather or fur
        > lined 'Thorax' (chest covering) being worn." Ironically there is a
        > Vikes document that refers to a 9C woman's grave find in Scandinavia
        > that held a beaver-fur garment lined with whast they think is hemp
        > cloth, but I doubt if that is of interest to your research :)

        It's interesting to me, though. What document? Where was the grave located?
        Any citations you may have would be useful. Thanks.


        --

        Cathy Raymond <cathy@...>

        "No one can make as disastrous a bad choice as a smart person, because they
        sell it to themselves really well."--Tobias Buckell
      • Folo Watkins
        ... That s about all there is. The site is http://www.vikingsonline.org.uk/resources/articles/as_textiles.htm, and there is a minimal documentation, but you
        Message 3 of 12 , Mar 16, 2010
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          >It's interesting to me, though. What document? Where was the grave located?
          >Any citations you may have would be useful. Thanks.

          That's about all there is. The site is
          http://www.vikingsonline.org.uk/resources/articles/as_textiles.htm,
          and there is a minimal documentation, but you might want to write the
          Vikes and see what they tell you back. I've always heard that it's
          nearly impossible to tell the difference between flax, nettle and
          hemp linen after a while, so I found this notation intriguing, though
          it's too early for me.

          Good luck!

          Cheers, Folo
        • Catherine Olanich Raymond
          ... Thanks! -- Cathy Raymond No one can make as disastrous a bad choice as a smart person, because they sell it to themselves really
          Message 4 of 12 , Mar 16, 2010
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            On Tuesday 16 March 2010 9:40:02 am Folo Watkins wrote:
            > >It's interesting to me, though. What document? Where was the grave
            > > located? Any citations you may have would be useful. Thanks.
            >
            > That's about all there is. The site is
            > http://www.vikingsonline.org.uk/resources/articles/as_textiles.htm,
            > and there is a minimal documentation, but you might want to write the
            > Vikes and see what they tell you back. I've always heard that it's
            > nearly impossible to tell the difference between flax, nettle and
            > hemp linen after a while, so I found this notation intriguing, though
            > it's too early for me


            Thanks!


            --

            Cathy Raymond <cathy@...>

            "No one can make as disastrous a bad choice as a smart person, because they
            sell it to themselves really well."--Tobias Buckell
          • lenastrid
            ... I m betting that it s from this article: Ågren, T. (1995) Fur in Birka. An examination of hair residue on penannular brooches , Laborativ Arkeologi, vol.
            Message 5 of 12 , Mar 18, 2010
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              --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, Catherine Olanich Raymond <cathy@...> wrote:
              >
              > On Monday 15 March 2010 11:49:46 pm Folo Watkins wrote:
              > On
              > > http://www.regia.org/members/basclot3.htm, RolandWilliamson writer
              > > notes "There are, however, a few vague references to a leather or fur
              > > lined 'Thorax' (chest covering) being worn." Ironically there is a
              > > Vikes document that refers to a 9C woman's grave find in Scandinavia
              > > that held a beaver-fur garment lined with whast they think is hemp
              > > cloth, but I doubt if that is of interest to your research :)
              >
              > It's interesting to me, though. What document? Where was the grave located?
              > Any citations you may have would be useful. Thanks.

              I'm betting that it's from this article: Ågren, T. (1995) "Fur in Birka. An examination of hair residue on penannular brooches", Laborativ Arkeologi, vol. 8. pp.50-58.

              Unfortunately my copy is in storage, so I can't check it for you. Perhaps you can find it via inter library loan?

              /Lena
            • Beth and Bob Matney
              Holdings are in various Scandinavian libraries. UCL (University College London) also has the issue. Try ILL (though I haven t found it in any US libraries or
              Message 6 of 12 , Mar 18, 2010
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                Holdings are in various Scandinavian libraries.
                UCL (University College London) also has the
                issue. Try ILL (though I haven't found it in any
                US libraries or journal collections). At worse
                case, Volume 8 (1995) is available for SEK 100 from the link below.

                Laborativ arkeologi ISSN 1101-7848

                "The journal Laborativ Arkeologi has been
                published under the auspices of the
                Archaeological Research Laboratory at Stockholm
                University since 1986. In 1995 the sub-title
                Journal of Nordic Archaeological Science was
                introduced. Starting with volume 13 (published in
                October 2002), the journal continues under the
                name of Journal of Nordic Archaeological Science,
                acronym JONAS (new ISSN: 1650-1519). "
                http://www.archaeology.su.se/pub/jsp/polopoly.jsp?d=1812

                Hope this helps.
                Beth Matney

                At 09:12 AM 3/18/2010, Lena wrote:
                >I'm betting that it's from this article: Ågren,
                >T. (1995) "Fur in Birka. An examination of hair
                >residue on penannular brooches", Laborativ Arkeologi, vol. 8. pp.50-58.
                >
                >Unfortunately my copy is in storage, so I can't
                >check it for you. Perhaps you can find it via inter library loan?
                >
                >/Lena
              • George A. Trosper
                ... That would be the Authenticity Officer of Regia Anglorum (to whom and which my admiration). ... Is Vikes here slang for Viking in a very general sense,
                Message 7 of 12 , Mar 18, 2010
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                  Folo Watkins wrote:
                  > Our society AO
                  That would be the Authenticity Officer of Regia Anglorum (to whom and
                  which my admiration).
                  > there is a Vikes document that refers . . .
                  Is "Vikes" here slang for 'Viking' in a very general sense, or am I
                  missing something?

                  Thanks!
                • Folo Watkins
                  ... The Vikes is a common referral to The Vikings!, the old Norse Film & Pageant Society and one of the oldest (maybe the oldest) and largest Viking Age
                  Message 8 of 12 , Mar 18, 2010
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                    >Is "Vikes" here slang for 'Viking' in a very general sense, or am I
                    >missing something?

                    "The Vikes" is a common referral to The Vikings!, the old Norse Film
                    & Pageant Society and one of the oldest (maybe the oldest) and
                    largest Viking Age reenactment groups.

                    Cheers, Folo
                    Micel Folcland, Regia Anglorum
                  • Catherine Olanich Raymond
                    MODERATOR NOTE: Please trim any portions of posts that do not require repetition. Thank you. Jehanne de Wodeford, Pacific Time Zone Moderator (MESSAGE EDITED)
                    Message 9 of 12 , Mar 18, 2010
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                      MODERATOR NOTE: Please trim any portions of posts that do not require repetition. Thank you. Jehanne de Wodeford, Pacific Time Zone Moderator

                      (MESSAGE EDITED)

                      On Thursday 18 March 2010 10:12:42 am lenastrid wrote:
                      > I'm betting that it's from this article: Ågren, T. (1995) "Fur in Birka. An
                      > examination of hair residue on penannular brooches", Laborativ Arkeologi,
                      > vol. 8. pp.50-58.
                      >
                      > Unfortunately my copy is in storage, so I can't check it for you. Perhaps
                      > you can find it via inter library loan?

                      I'll look for it. Thanks for the cite!

                      --

                      Cathy Raymond <cathy@...>

                      "No one can make as disastrous a bad choice as a smart person, because they
                      sell it to themselves really well."--Tobias Buckell
                    • Catherine Olanich Raymond
                      ... Even better. Thanks again! -- Cathy Raymond No one can make as disastrous a bad choice as a smart person, because they sell it to
                      Message 10 of 12 , Mar 18, 2010
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                        On Thursday 18 March 2010 11:02:31 am Beth and Bob Matney wrote:
                        > Holdings are in various Scandinavian libraries.
                        > UCL (University College London) also has the
                        > issue. Try ILL (though I haven't found it in any
                        > US libraries or journal collections). At worse
                        > case, Volume 8 (1995) is available for SEK 100 from the link below.
                        >
                        > Laborativ arkeologi ISSN 1101-7848

                        Even better. Thanks again!

                        --

                        Cathy Raymond <cathy@...>

                        "No one can make as disastrous a bad choice as a smart person, because they
                        sell it to themselves really well."--Tobias Buckell
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