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back! with shirt questions

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  • Marianne Perdomo Machin
    Hello! Long ago I had time to read and sometimes even participate on this list. Then I got too busy for it, changed to web-only and of course stopped reading
    Message 1 of 2 , Aug 6, 2008
      Hello!

      Long ago I had time to read and sometimes even participate on this list.
      Then I got too busy for it, changed to web-only and of course stopped
      reading much. However, my frustration on trying to improve certain
      things brings me back :)

      So... I'll reintroduce myself. I'm Marianne Perdomo and live in Spain.
      My persona's a 1470-1480 castillian woman, by the name of Leonor Martin.
      I like dancing, cooking period southern european food and dabble into
      embroidery and other stuff from time to time.

      And the question that brought me back is... I want to make myself a
      second pleated linen shirt, ca 1480. Basically I want to get as
      authentic as possible to the shirts being worn here:
      http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Pedro_Garcia_de_Benabarre_St_John_Retable.jpg

      Before I used flat-felled seams and a "cut my cote" pattern, as shown here:
      http://realmofvenus.renaissanceitaly.net/library/camiciahowto.htm
      The pleated neck is sewn into a thin strip of the same material, the
      sleeve ends hang loose, as that's expected in this style.

      So before I cut my precious linen and spend hours sewing and pleating...
      I'd like to know if there's anything faulty here or that could be improved.
      Any tips, hints or even wild ideas will be much appreciated! :)

      Cheers!


      Marianne / Leonor
    • sue_clemenger
      ... list. ... stopped ... Spain. ... Martin. ... into ... http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Pedro_Garcia_de_Benabarre_St_J ohn_Retable.jpg ... the ...
      Message 2 of 2 , Aug 10, 2008
        --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, Marianne Perdomo Machin
        <marianne@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello!
        >
        > Long ago I had time to read and sometimes even participate on this
        list.
        > Then I got too busy for it, changed to web-only and of course
        stopped
        > reading much. However, my frustration on trying to improve certain
        > things brings me back :)
        >
        > So... I'll reintroduce myself. I'm Marianne Perdomo and live in
        Spain.
        > My persona's a 1470-1480 castillian woman, by the name of Leonor
        Martin.
        > I like dancing, cooking period southern european food and dabble
        into
        > embroidery and other stuff from time to time.
        >
        > And the question that brought me back is... I want to make myself a
        > second pleated linen shirt, ca 1480. Basically I want to get as
        > authentic as possible to the shirts being worn here:
        >
        http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Pedro_Garcia_de_Benabarre_St_J
        ohn_Retable.jpg
        >
        > Before I used flat-felled seams and a "cut my cote" pattern, as
        shown here:
        > http://realmofvenus.renaissanceitaly.net/library/camiciahowto.htm
        > The pleated neck is sewn into a thin strip of the same material,
        the
        > sleeve ends hang loose, as that's expected in this style.
        >
        > So before I cut my precious linen and spend hours sewing and
        pleating...
        > I'd like to know if there's anything faulty here or that could be
        improved.
        > Any tips, hints or even wild ideas will be much appreciated! :)
        >
        > Cheers!
        >
        >
        > Marianne / Leonor

        Hi, Marianne!
        If you're working on portraying a late 15th century Castilian woman,
        I can think of a couple of things that would warn me off recommending
        this particular version of a shift.
        For one, the original shift itself dates from the 17th century.
        For another, the original shift is Italian, and the emphasis of the
        Realm of Venus is on Italian clothing as well.
        What difference should this make? Well, mostly, for me, it'd be a
        matter of using an undergarment intended for one type of silhouette
        underneath an outfit with a totally different silhouette. Kinda like
        using 1950s bullet-bras and girdles underneath a 1920s flapper dress.
        If you look at the clothing that the women are wearing in your wiki
        image, notice that they've got tight bodices, fairly tight, narrow
        sleeves, and squarish necklines. If you used a really full camicia
        under such a dress, you'd not only find the the camicia was showing
        at the neckline in ways that you didn't intend, but you'd have all
        kinds of extra fabric wadded up in your sleeves and your bodice.
        What I'd recommend, instead, is a shift based more along tee-tunic
        lines, such as this one:
        http://www.elizabethancostume.net/
        Sorry that I can't give you a direct link to the article, as she
        seems to have imbedded them in some way that I don't understand, but
        if you click on "Elizabethan Underpinnings," and then scroll down
        to "16th century Smocks and Chemises," and click on that, the first
        one, the "low-necked smock," is the one I'm talking about. They're
        very easy to make, and much more comfortable under closely-fitting
        late 15th/early 16th century clothing (think Spanish, or early
        Tudor). When I made mine, I used the "smock pattern generator" that
        Drea has on that site (you can find a link at the bottom of
        the "Smocks and Chemises" article.
        Hope this wasn't too wordy!
        --Maire, certified late period costuming geek ;o)
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