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Working on Persona and Garb

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  • ctr2961
    Recently my new wife and I got married by doing a renaissance wedding and my wife wants to renew out vows next year by doing a the same (create a family
    Message 1 of 12 , Nov 28, 2007
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      Recently my new wife and I got married by doing a renaissance wedding
      and my wife wants to renew out vows next year by doing a the same
      (create a family tradition). She knows that the garb we created for
      our wedding is not authentic because patterns(MCALL's)

      She wants to make an authentic celtic overdress for herself and an
      authentic doublet for myself. Her dress is exactly like:
      http://www.mccallpattern.com/item/M4997.htm?tab=costumes&page=3

      Where is a good period patten for a doublet?

      Can both be used in the same time period? Or do we have to create
      different time period?

      I know this is confusing, but I don't know how to start on this project?
    • wodeford
      ... I hate to be the one to tell you this, but that is not an authentic anything. Whether or not that matters to you is up to you. If you ARE looking for
      Message 2 of 12 , Nov 28, 2007
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        --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "ctr2961" <rcrisco@...> wrote:
        >
        > Recently my new wife and I got married by doing a renaissance wedding
        > and my wife wants to renew out vows next year by doing a the same
        > (create a family tradition). She knows that the garb we created for
        > our wedding is not authentic because patterns(MCALL's)
        >
        > She wants to make an authentic celtic overdress for herself and an
        > authentic doublet for myself.

        I hate to be the one to tell you this, but that is not an authentic
        anything. Whether or not that matters to you is up to you.

        If you ARE looking for authentic Irish 16th century patterns, go here:
        http://www.reconstructinghistory.com/index.php?c=22&d=35&w=24&r=Y

        Jehanne de Wodeford
        West Kingdom.
      • Heather Rose Jones
        ... Without meaning to be obtuse, it would help if she could define what she means by celtic and by authentic . In terms of costuming, Celtic really
        Message 3 of 12 , Nov 28, 2007
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          On Nov 28, 2007, at 7:31 AM, ctr2961 wrote:

          > Recently my new wife and I got married by doing a renaissance wedding
          > and my wife wants to renew out vows next year by doing a the same
          > (create a family tradition). She knows that the garb we created for
          > our wedding is not authentic because patterns(MCALL's)
          >
          > She wants to make an authentic celtic overdress for herself and an
          > authentic doublet for myself. Her dress is exactly like:
          > http://www.mccallpattern.com/item/M4997.htm?tab=costumes&page=3

          Without meaning to be obtuse, it would help if she could define what
          she means by "celtic" and by "authentic". In terms of costuming,
          "Celtic" really doesn't have a specific, clear, agreed-upon
          definition -- people use it to mean a wide variety of different
          things. Similarly, people use the word "authentic" to express a
          pretty wide variety of approaches to costuming. On this particular
          list, the default interpretation would be "historically accurate to
          the specified time and culture", but that brings us back to needing
          to know what time and culture she's aiming for. And, as previously
          noted, she's going to have to choose between having an outfit closely
          similar to the one on that web site and having an outfit that is
          historically accurate for pretty much any historic context (other
          than modern ren fairs).

          Tangwystyl
        • ctr2961
          {MODERATOR NOTE: please sign all posts to this list. Thank you, Despina} Well, can anyone point me to a starting point on period garb? We really like a
          Message 4 of 12 , Dec 3, 2007
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            {MODERATOR NOTE: please sign all posts to this list. Thank you, Despina}

            Well, can anyone point me to a starting point on period garb? We
            really like a reference to start from so we have an idea what we are
            getting into.
          • cathal@mindspring.com
            ... Define starting pont if you will. IF you mean that in a chronological sense, then there is none...officially. The SCA s governing documents at present
            Message 5 of 12 , Dec 3, 2007
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              -----Original Message-----
              >From: ctr2961 <rcrisco@...>
              >Sent: Dec 3, 2007 9:31 AM
              >To: Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com
              >Subject: [Authentic_SCA] Re: Working on Persona and Garb
              >
              >{MODERATOR NOTE: please sign all posts to this list. Thank you, Despina}
              >
              >Well, can anyone point me to a starting point on period garb? We
              >really like a reference to start from so we have an idea what we are
              >getting into.


              Define 'starting pont' if you will.

              IF you mean that in a chronological sense, then there is none...officially. The SCA's governing documents at present simply specify 'pre-17th century western culture'.

              Cathal.
            • Amy Heilveil
              ... It would help the group to help you if you were to give us a date and country/region. The clothing of 8th century England is very different from the
              Message 6 of 12 , Dec 3, 2007
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                > Well, can anyone point me to a starting point on period garb?

                It would help the group to help you if you were to give us a date and
                country/region. The clothing of 8th century England is very different
                from the clothing of 15th century Flanders, but resources for both can
                be given.

                Smiles,
                Despina
              • Kathleen Keeler
                ... The true beginning starting points I d recommend are historical overviews: a general history of clothing book at the library or, history of costume online
                Message 7 of 12 , Dec 3, 2007
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                  ctr2961 wrote:

                  > <>
                  >
                  > Well, can anyone point me to a starting point on period garb? We
                  > really like a reference to start from so we have an idea what we are
                  > getting into.
                  >
                  The true beginning starting points I'd recommend are historical overviews:
                  a general history of clothing book at the library
                  or, history of costume online sites such as
                  http://www.costumes.org/History/100pages/medievalinks.htm
                  http://www.costumes.org/History/100pages/timelinepages/timeline.htm
                  (can other people suggest other sites? and ones with broader geographic
                  range?)
                  to get a general look at what people wore. I'm sure you'll quickly
                  eliminate a lot of times and places!

                  From there, you can narrow the search--and the people on this list can
                  give you lots of information.

                  Agnes


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Chris Laning
                  You ask ... If you re asking for information on clothing worn in the Middle Ages by members of the cultures we now call celtic -- which is what I think
                  Message 8 of 12 , Dec 3, 2007
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                    You ask
                    >Well, can anyone point me to a starting point on period garb? We
                    >really like a reference to start from so we have an idea what we are
                    >getting into.

                    If you're asking for information on clothing worn in the Middle Ages by members of the cultures we now call "celtic" -- which is what I think you're asking -- one place to start might be this site, which has a good list of links:
                    http://medievalscotland.org/clothing/

                    I'm sure others can chime in with more recommendations -- this isn't an area I specialize in, so I'm probably not the best person to give you definite answers.

                    Unfortunately for us, these particular cultures haven't left us nearly as much information about what they wore as we might like to have -- far less than, for instance, 16th century England. So it's quite understandable that interested and enthusiastic people have taken what scraps of information they can turn up and come up with outfits like the ones you've seen elsewhere. But I'll think you will find that a lot more information has turned up just in the last twenty years or so that enables us to do a lot better at attempting to re-create something authentic. And I know there are people here who can put you in touch with that.

                    By the way, Medievalscotland.org has some good resources on Scottish and Irish names and history as well :)
                    http://medievalscotland.org/scotnames/scotnames101.shtml

                    Christian de Holacombe

                    ____________________________________________________________
                    0 Chris Laning
                    | <claning@...>
                    + Davis, California
                    http://paternoster-row.org - http://paternosters.blogspot.com
                    ____________________________________________________________
                  • ctr2961
                    My wife and I are confused about the time period and what is period and not. So my wife suggest we work on my garb first since it is closer to period. I would
                    Message 9 of 12 , Dec 4, 2007
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                      My wife and I are confused about the time period and what is period
                      and not. So my wife suggest we work on my garb first since it is
                      closer to period.

                      I would like to find any picture of doublets that comes with half
                      capes(cloaks). I am unsure if the half cape(cloak) is period. If
                      so, what time period or area comes from?

                      I am looking for plates(period pictures) of doublets and fencers of
                      the time period.

                      Robert
                    • squire009
                      ... You can find half capes in late 16thC Spain. I ll look for the reference later tonight, since the book is at home. ;) Alcyoneus
                      Message 10 of 12 , Dec 5, 2007
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                        --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "ctr2961" <rcrisco@...> wrote:
                        > I would like to find any picture of doublets that comes with half
                        > capes(cloaks). I am unsure if the half cape(cloak) is period. If
                        > so, what time period or area comes from?
                        >
                        > I am looking for plates(period pictures) of doublets and fencers of
                        > the time period.
                        >
                        > Robert
                        >
                        You can find half capes in late 16thC Spain. I'll look for the
                        reference later tonight, since the book is at home. ;)

                        Alcyoneus
                      • squire009
                        ... You can find half capes in late 16thC Spain. I ll look for the reference later tonight, since the book is at home. ;) Alcyoneus
                        Message 11 of 12 , Dec 5, 2007
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                          --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "ctr2961" <rcrisco@...> wrote:
                          > I would like to find any picture of doublets that comes with half
                          > capes(cloaks). I am unsure if the half cape(cloak) is period. If
                          > so, what time period or area comes from?
                          >
                          > I am looking for plates(period pictures) of doublets and fencers of
                          > the time period.
                          >
                          > Robert
                          >
                          You can find half capes in late 16thC Spain. I'll look for the
                          reference later tonight, since the book is at home. ;)

                          Alcyoneus
                        • chimeralife
                          ... I know whenever I think of the half-cape late 16th century French comes to mind. Also the Italians at the same time, I believe.
                          Message 12 of 12 , Dec 23, 2007
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                            > I would like to find any picture of doublets that comes with half
                            > capes(cloaks). I am unsure if the half cape(cloak) is period. If
                            > so, what time period or area comes from?
                            >

                            I know whenever I think of the half-cape late 16th century French comes
                            to mind. Also the Italians at the same time, I believe.

                            http://www.siue.edu/COSTUMES/history.html

                            That is the history of costume online site. I find it a great 'first-
                            look' at different styles and different times. Which helps me point in
                            the right direction for further study.

                            Tiece
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